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Was Ian Fleming gay?


232 replies to this topic

#61 doublenoughtspy

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Posted 28 March 2007 - 01:29 PM

Can I point out that sleeping with mountains of women does not then preclude also sleeping with men.


I didn't claim otherwise.

I agree that a man having sex with a single woman, or a great number does not "make" one a heterosexual.

But by that same token, if Fleming was used by another boy for gratification against his will, it does "make" him a homosexual.

Throughout his life, Fleming slept with a number of women, and that was his pattern of behaviour.

There is no evidence that he slept with men.

#62 dee-bee-five

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Posted 12 April 2007 - 03:17 PM

I'd add plagarist and liar, or embellisher of the truth, to that list too.


Think you're mixing Fleming up with the late and very much UNlamented Kevin McClory there, my friend... McClory was such a stranger to the truth it wouldn't surprise me now if it came out he was lying about being dead.

#63 dee-bee-five

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Posted 12 April 2007 - 03:23 PM

I don't say this bit to purposely cause arguments (believe it or not) and I happen to think he wasn't gay but there is a strange presumption being made here. Can I point out that sleeping with mountains of women does not then preclude also sleeping with men. My brother has a charming expression :cooltongue: 'Any hole's a goal' (sorry, really) and I know plenty who are simply not that fussy or are just plain greedy. Sleeping with men and sleeping with women, the two are not mutually exclusive. Evidence to say specifically that he was not gay I'd be happy with, but tossing in the amount of women he supposedly slept with as if it answers the question 'is he gay?' is not adequate. Again, I personally don't think he was but I just thought I'd mention it. Oh, and as for "He was married" - ahhhhh, bless your heart. :lol:



Well, you know what we say in our team... :angry: ? The only difference between a straight man and a gay man is six pints of beer... (PS "Any hole's a goal" is a good one.)

#64 bond_girl_double07

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Posted 12 April 2007 - 05:13 PM

I guess I don't know where the idea that he was gay is even coming from? I mean there were some subtle hints (usually associated to sadism) from some of the villains and then the point on Honeychile's backside that even Noel Coward called him on... but Fleming was a womanizer. All his biographies will tell you about all the women (usually referred to as 'tarts') he picked up - including VD or whatever the hell it was :lol:


Wait, Noel Coward was gay? :cooltongue:

What was that bit about Honey's back again??? I came in late to this thing :angry:


Ohhh my two cents:

Did he have sex with a man at some point? Yes (probably the Eton thing)
Was he gay? No
Did he love sex enough to probably not split hairs anyway? Uhhh yeah..

Any hole is a goal is a good way to think about this one I think :D

#65 doublenoughtspy

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Posted 12 April 2007 - 05:15 PM

Wait, Noel Coward was gay? :cooltongue:


Flaming actually.

What was that bit about Honey's back again??? I came in late to this thing :angry:


Her bottom is compared to a young boy's in the book.

#66 Zorin Industries

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Posted 12 April 2007 - 05:16 PM

I guess I don't know where the idea that he was gay is even coming from? I mean there were some subtle hints (usually associated to sadism) from some of the villains and then the point on Honeychile's backside that even Noel Coward called him on... but Fleming was a womanizer. All his biographies will tell you about all the women (usually referred to as 'tarts') he picked up - including VD or whatever the hell it was :lol:


Wait, Noel Coward was gay? :cooltongue:

What was that bit about Honey's back again??? I came in late to this thing :angry:


Ohhh my two cents:

Did he have sex with a man at some point? Yes (probably the Eton thing)
Was he gay? No
Did he love sex enough to probably not split hairs anyway? Uhhh yeah..

Any hole is a goal is a good way to think about this one I think :D


Here here!!

I doubt very much that Ian Fleming putted from the rough! His golf swing was far better suited to the links of Stoke Poges with one eye on the ladies.

Any whether or not Fleming had "experiences" at Eton is a useless argument. You are not gay simply because of what you get up to at school.

#67 Santa

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Posted 12 April 2007 - 05:16 PM

I'd love to have a bottom like a young boy's.

#68 Zorin Industries

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Posted 12 April 2007 - 05:19 PM

I'd love to have a bottom like a young boy's.


"Next.....!"

#69 Gri007

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Posted 12 April 2007 - 05:29 PM

I have just recently finished reading 'The Life Of Ian Fleming' by John Peerson. It is interesting to note that he was difficult child and that he did have a complicated/complexed attitude towards women. I wouldn't be at least one bit surprised if he did recieve it.

It isn't mentioned in the biography about him being gay, but then again it never mentioned the time when he got an STD. Perhaps Peerson knew what the boundries were when it came to getting to personal.

#70 bond_girl_double07

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Posted 12 April 2007 - 05:31 PM

Ouch.. quit google search showed exactly how gay Noel Coward was :cooltongue:

in my defense, I've only seen him in The Italian Job and knew nothing about him before or since..

#71 doublenoughtspy

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Posted 12 April 2007 - 05:38 PM

Perhaps Peerson knew what the boundries were when it came to getting to personal.


Fleming's widow and son were still alive when Pearson wrote his biography. He held back.

Lycett didn't have anyone's feelings to worry about - so the juicier details came out.

#72 Zorin Industries

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Posted 12 April 2007 - 05:41 PM

It isn't mentioned in the biography about him being gay, but then again it never mentioned the time when he got an STD.


Not sure getting a STD automatically implies your sexual orientation one way or the other.....

#73 Red Barchetta

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Posted 12 April 2007 - 05:59 PM

No, not gay...English. :angry: :cooltongue:



Brilliant!!

Ian was not gay, but there are rumors about him dabbling, but then there are rumors that George W. Bush is intelligent, so who really knows?

Edited by Red Barchetta, 12 April 2007 - 06:03 PM.


#74 David_M

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Posted 12 April 2007 - 06:09 PM

Funny, my take on Fleming was that not only was he not gay, but he wasn't even especially tolerant of gays. My memory of the books is that they're full of bizarre rants on how all the world's problems are the fault of people "confused about their sexuality," which includes not only men who like men and women who like women, but even women intent on voting, wearing slacks and driving cars. I mean, I love Fleming but sometimes his writings come off like Grandpa Simpson's angry letters to the government or the networks. He may have been a hedonist but I'd never call him "progressive" in the social sense.

#75 Gri007

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Posted 12 April 2007 - 07:46 PM

It isn't mentioned in the biography about him being gay, but then again it never mentioned the time when he got an STD.


Not sure getting a STD automatically implies your sexual orientation one way or the other.....


He allegedly got an STD from some swiss girl.

And thanks Doublenoughtspy. I've always wanted to know the difference between the Peerson and Lycett biographys were. I'll have to read Lycetts soon.

#76 Trey

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Posted 12 April 2007 - 10:04 PM

Ian Fleming wrote 13 books about a womanizer who killed, gambled, ate good food, and slept with dozens of women.

NO

#77 parp

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Posted 13 April 2007 - 03:05 AM

Surely the next big question is...


Is it true that gay people can't whistle?

#78 dee-bee-five

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Posted 19 April 2007 - 06:13 AM

Funny, my take on Fleming was that not only was he not gay, but he wasn't even especially tolerant of gays. My memory of the books is that they're full of bizarre rants on how all the world's problems are the fault of people "confused about their sexuality," which includes not only men who like men and women who like women, but even women intent on voting, wearing slacks and driving cars. I mean, I love Fleming but sometimes his writings come off like Grandpa Simpson's angry letters to the government or the networks. He may have been a hedonist but I'd never call him "progressive" in the social sense.


I think you are so wrong on this one. When homosexuality was - shamefully - illegal, he was one of very few popular writers who even dared to air the subject. To our eyes, his writings may come across as patronising and unenlightened. But it is always a mistake to judge novels written 50 years ago based on our prevailing social mores.

In Noel Coward's diaries - a fabulous read, btw - there are countless passages where Coward and his boyfriend stay with Ann and Ian at Goldeneye; that, to me, does not suggest someone who actively disliked gays.



Surely the next big question is...


Is it true that gay people can't whistle?


It isn't because I can...

Ian Fleming wrote 13 books about a womanizer who killed, gambled, ate good food, and slept with dozens of women.


How this would preclude his being gay remains a mystery to me, I'm afraid. Are you suggesting I would be incapable of writing about such a character simply because of which gender I sleep with...?

#79 Zorin Industries

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Posted 19 April 2007 - 08:23 AM

Surely the next big question is...


Is it true that gay people can't whistle?


What, in a put your lips together and blow sort of way....? (!).

"Ian Fleming wrote 13 books about a womanizer who killed, gambled, ate good food, and slept with dozens of women"

To a degree, so did Christopher Marlowe, Virginia Woolf, Noel Coward and Oscar Wilde...and they were certainly on the lavender side of the church...

Apparently gay guys will always tie their left shoelace first....

Edited by Zorin Industries, 19 April 2007 - 08:24 AM.


#80 dee-bee-five

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Posted 19 April 2007 - 07:37 PM

Apparently gay guys will always tie their left shoelace first....


Only if he's a top... :cooltongue:

Edited by dee-bee-five, 19 April 2007 - 07:38 PM.


#81 Zorin Industries

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Posted 19 April 2007 - 08:08 PM

Apparently gay guys will always tie their left shoelace first....


Only if he's a top... :cooltongue:


Don't say words like 'top' round these parts. Some are liable to get out their 'George W' BB guns and tan our hides. Which in hindsight....you know what I mean...

Anyway, what happens if a guy has velcro strips on his shoes? (!)

#82 spynovelfan

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Posted 19 April 2007 - 08:10 PM

"Ian Fleming wrote 13 books about a womanizer who killed, gambled, ate good food, and slept with dozens of women"

To a degree, so did Christopher Marlowe, Virginia Woolf, Noel Coward and Oscar Wilde...and they were certainly on the lavender side of the church...


'The name's Gray. Dorian Gray.' I must have missed some of these books, to a degree. :cooltongue:

#83 doublenoughtspy

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Posted 19 April 2007 - 08:11 PM

Zorin, your Bush bashing continues with the tedious inevitability of an unloved season....

#84 dee-bee-five

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Posted 19 April 2007 - 08:19 PM

Zorin, your Bush bashing continues with the tedious inevitability of an unloved season....


And yet each of his comments hits the mark. Team Bush and Blair have been a global disaster.

#85 Zorin Industries

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Posted 19 April 2007 - 08:22 PM

Zorin, your Bush bashing continues with the tedious inevitability of an unloved season....


Que? As I've been neither unloved or had a season I haven't the faintest idea why this is relevant to the debate about homosexuality, Fleming and Bond.

Do divulge...

Edited by Zorin Industries, 19 April 2007 - 08:22 PM.


#86 Jim

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Posted 19 April 2007 - 08:23 PM

Zorin, your Bush bashing continues with the tedious inevitability of an unloved season....


And yet each of his comments hits the mark. Team Bush and Blair have been a global disaster.


But they must be someboy's sons.

Having met Mr Blair, in person he is a lovely chap. Abhorrent ideas, but a splendid fellow. I expect the same of the other bod.

#87 dee-bee-five

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Posted 19 April 2007 - 08:23 PM

Apparently gay guys will always tie their left shoelace first....


Only if he's a top... :cooltongue:


Don't say words like 'top' round these parts. Some are liable to get out their 'George W' BB guns and tan our hides. Which in hindsight....you know what I mean...

Anyway, what happens if a guy has velcro strips on his shoes? (!)


He'd be drummed out of the brotherhood for a critical lack of style. Velcro strips? How common... :angry:

#88 Zorin Industries

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Posted 19 April 2007 - 08:26 PM

Zorin, your Bush bashing continues with the tedious inevitability of an unloved season....


And why are the Bush lovers so concerned about one person's opinions? If he is as Godly, devout and generally as indicative of the second coming as his supporters think, then - like God himself, it won't touch him. What's the worry?



Anyway, is Fleming gay....?

Edited by Zorin Industries, 19 April 2007 - 09:13 PM.


#89 doublenoughtspy

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Posted 19 April 2007 - 08:26 PM

I haven't the faintest idea why this is relevant to the debate about homosexuality, Fleming and Bond.


So someone else typed the "George W" BB Gun hide tanning bon mot - not you?

Multiple admins admonished you regarding your anti-Bush tirade in another thread - and yet here you are - bringing it in to an unrelated conversation and have the nerve to ask me what Bush bashing has to do with Fleming.

No, you tell me. Please.

#90 dee-bee-five

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Posted 19 April 2007 - 08:27 PM

Zorin, your Bush bashing continues with the tedious inevitability of an unloved season....


And yet each of his comments hits the mark. Team Bush and Blair have been a global disaster.


But they must be someboy's sons.

Having met Mr Blair, in person he is a lovely chap. Abhorrent ideas, but a splendid fellow.


Alas I haven't had the dubious pleasure of meeting Mr. Blair, so I maintain my regret that there's never a Lee Harvey Oswald around when one needs him whenever I see the grinning ninny on the TV. That said, I suppose I can find it within myself to afford him a crumb of sympathy for having to share his bed with that dreadful rapacious witch every night.