537 replies to this topic

[bryonalston]

I never said that he was, I just said that he's well suited for the role. I wouldn't get my hopes up on Clive Owen either, he WAS my first choice, but since EoN allowed that ship to sail, I moved on to someone else who would do a great job...Visnjic.

[Martin Mystery]

We agree on Owen, but not Visnjic. I saw an interview with him today on the telly - he has a really thick accent. -And, IMO he looks like a hairdresser's model.

Since we're not getting Owen, I hope Butler, Purefoy or McMahon will take the part.

MM

[Bon-san]

I never said that he was, I just said that he's well suited for the role. I wouldn't get my hopes up on Clive Owen either, he WAS my first choice, but since EoN allowed that ship to sail, I moved on to someone else who would do a great job...Visnjic.

My sense is that Clive is more likely to star as 007 in CR than Goran.

[bryonalston]

Is that necessarily true? If Clive had been offered the role in 2003/2004, he probably would have accepted and then we'd have our perfect 007, but since EoN waited until Clive became too big, I doubt that they would make that same mistake twice by missing out on Visnjic before he becomes too famous. Jackman, Butler etc. are already famous, so their salary demands are probably a lot more than Visnjic's would be. Clive's must be astronomical compared to Visnjic's.

[Bon-san]

I have no idea what's "true" in this regard. There's been such a vast amount and array of reportage on Bond #6 and Casino Royale, with so much of it contradictory, that culling any bit of "fact" out of the morass is a feat fit for a shaman.

I've noticed that with each new round of gossip spew, the rabid fandom membership tends to attribute to these more recent bits a level of reliability exceeding the older "news", rumour, gossip, et. al.

I guess that's understandable, but I tend to put the whole mass of reportage in the MAYBE file. Some bits of info seem more likely to be true than others to me, but I have no reason to necessarily believe or disbelieve any of it. Something that was reported 2 years ago may turn out to be the Rosetta Stone of Bond #6 and CR, whilst all the info put out in the past 6 months may be absolute trash. Or vice versa. Only time (and EON) will tell the true tale.

[It's kind of how I approach the reportage of national politics]

[bryonalston]

I have no idea what's "true" in this regard.  There's been such a vast amount and array of reportage on Bond #6 and Casino Royale, with so much of it contradictory, that culling any bit of "fact" out of the morass is a feat fit for a shaman.

I've noticed that with each new round of gossip spew, the rabid fandom membership tends to attribute to these more recent bits a level of reliability exceeding the older "news", rumour, gossip, et. al.   

I guess that's understandable, but I tend to put the whole mass of reportage in the MAYBE file.  Some bits of info seem more likely to be true than others to me, but I have no reason to necessarily believe or disbelieve any of it.  Something that was reported 2 years ago may turn out to be the Rosetta Stone of Bond #6 and CR, whilst all the info put out in the past 6 months may be absolute trash.  Or vice versa.  Only time (and EON) will tell the true tale.

[It's kind of how I approach the reportage of national politics]

I agree with you 100% about how to handle news/gossip, but it was you who said that you feel that Owen is more likely to be cast than Visnjic. That's fine, but right now it seems like anyone can be cast in the role (with the exception of the obvious, such as Ewan Stewart, et.al) Visnjic is most likely a candidate (and a rather good one at that. The accent issue can be resolved) and in another thread, I read that Visnjic is one of Campbell's top picks. I don't think that it's fair to count out Visnjic as a possibility just yet.

[Bon-san]

Well, given my post above, I don't count anyone out if choosing them would be grounded in any sort of reality (this Ewan Stewart is OUT in my book). I do hope Goran is not cast as Bond, and my gut says he won't be. But I couldn't say it's absolutely not going to happen. Any more than I would say that Owen is DEFINITELY out of the running. Perhaps I just hope (more than anything in the world!) that Owen has a better shot than Goran.

I was thinking earlier today that the Owen, Jackman, Brosnan, and Butler camps have been awfully quiet for a good while now. Hmm....

[hcmv007]

Look, I think Goran Visnjic is a good actor. If he gets cast, hey, hooray for him. However, I think Ian Fleming would do cartwheels in his grave if of all people a Croation would be cast in thw role of HIS 007. I still belive 007 should be a Brit, but if one can't be found, go to an Australian, even an American before Goran. I also in an earlier post misjudged his height, saying he was too short, my apologies for that, my bad. He does fit the criteria for Bond, but if he can't pull off a British accent and ends up sounding like Ahnuld instead, I dread CR if he is cast. If he is cast, I will give him the benefit of the doubt, and hope he has a long successful stint as 007.

[bryonalston]

Do you think that Fleming did a cartwheel in his grave when a strong Bond girl was finally created for TSWLM instead of the standard bimbo from the novels? Did he do one when Jaws was blatantly inspired from a story Fleming expressed he did not want adapted? Or how about when his masterpiece, YOLT, was thrown out and recreated for the space age with Volcano lairs and the like? Or how about when the black characters in LALD weren't referred to as n----rs in every scene?

I agree that James Bond is a British man and that it would be great if the actor who plays him is British, but being born and raised in the UK shouldn't be the main criteria for picking an actor. If a Croatian actor is just as good as any of the British ones, then he should be given the same chance as all of them. A few years ago, I remember the Brits being up in arms because Renee Zellweger, who was born and raised in Texas, was cast as Bridget Jones. Look how that turned out. If Visnjic ends up sounding like Ahnuld (which he probably won't), then the producers will probably give him voice lessons or simply have him dubbed. Besides the accent and the nationality, he fits all of the other criteria for Bond, and two relatively small issues.

[Bon-san]

I agree that James Bond is a British man and that it would be great if the actor who plays him is British, but being born and raised in the UK shouldn't be the main criteria for picking an actor. If a Croatian actor is just as good as any of the British ones, then he should be given the same chance as all of them.

By the same token, however, if there are viable candidates who are British, why go with someone who's not from the Commonwealth?

Personally, Brosnan, Owen, Jackman and Butler are all top-notch IMO. And there are many others who I would deem at least as suitable (and in many cases, more suitable) than Goran. [Gruffudd, Craig, Davenport, Purefoy, McMahon, spy's beloved Dancy , hell even Bloom and Magregor] So, he falls far down my list. And I think that as to the resistance a lot of folks feel toward him, it's not just his name and his accent. He looks like he's from Southern/Eastern Europe.

[hcmv007]

Do you think that Fleming did a cartwheel in his grave when a strong Bond girl was finally created for TSWLM instead of the standard bimbo from the novels? Did he do one when Jaws was blatantly inspired from a story Fleming expressed he did not want adapted? Or how about when his masterpiece, YOLT, was thrown out and recreated for the space age with Volcano lairs and the like? Or how about when the black characters in LALD weren't referred to as n----rs in every scene?

I agree that James Bond is a British man and that it would be great if the actor who plays him is British, but being born and raised in the UK shouldn't be the main criteria for picking an actor. If a Croatian actor is just as good as any of the British ones, then he should be given the same chance as all of them. A few years ago, I remember the Brits being up in arms because Renee Zellweger, who was born and raised in Texas, was cast as Bridget Jones. Look how that turned out. If Visnjic ends up sounding like Ahnuld (which he probably won't), then the producers will probably give him voice lessons or simply have him dubbed. Besides the accent and the nationality, he fits all of the other criteria for Bond, and two relatively small issues.

I just meant that Fleming, if alive today would be shocked to find an actor playing his character being from a former Communist country, that's all. Yes, I know actors have played different nationalities in other films, Connery in Red October, Ford in darn for got the title, he was a Russian sub captain too, and as you mention, Zellweger in Bridget Jones. I really don't have a problem IF Goran is cast as Bond, bit do I think he is the best, no. But would I ignore the movie altogether if he is cast, NO. If you are offended by my prvious post, that was not my intention. As far as the other parts, hard to say. LALD could never have been made the way Fleming wrote it, and I had to admit reading it I was a little uncomfortable with the language. I think that YOLT was better than the novel, I think Fleming rushed his novel, and prefer the movie version to the book. Of course I doubt goran is or ever was a communist, but like I said in conclision, if he IS castm, then I will support huim all the way and hope he has a long and successful career as Bond. I may not agree with the choice, but that is no reason to hate the man, which I don't. Hope that clears it all up, everyone.

[Loeffelholz]

An Eastern-European James Bond would certainly make headlines...and if he can actually DO it, that would be just fine.

The voice and accent is CRUCIAL, IMHO. There must not be even a hint of Croatian in any delivery of "Bond, James Bond," or any other number of less important, but far more difficult scenes/monologues.

Sure, it's not impossible. If I were GV, I'd have a dialect/elocution coach on a '24-7' retainer, and make him earn his large salary.

It is possible? Absolutely. Should it happen? Arguable---by honest, good-willed fans who disagree. Will it happen? Fascinating.

[Bondesque]

With Butler, Jackman, Owen EON couldn't go wrong. With Goran it's a huge risk. He is handsome but just doesn't remotely look british IMHO.

The second tier of Bonds would be preferable: I even think Jude Law would be a better Bond. Now if GV gets the role I will be supportive however I will always feel that EON has not repsected the role by not selecting one of the top candidates. Bond deserves better! Why not give the role the serious attention it warrants? If EON is really taking a more serious back to the basics Bond, then take the casting to the highest level.

Any of the big three could serve well!

[bryonalston]

It definitely will make headlines if Visnjic is Bond. i think that if he is, the first thing that he should do is say "Bond, James Bond" with a British accent, that way it will ease some of the more pessimistic fans' tensions and worries. I can imagine him saying it just fine, but since I'm not British, I'm pretty sure there are a lot of touches to the accent that Americans won't be able to pick up on like a Brit will.

[Slaezenger]

[quote name='Bondian' date='29 July 2005 - 02:43']
Hey Slaezenger.

It strikes me odd how a good Bond fan could ever Pooh-Pooh a classic like you have.

On Her Majesty’s Secret Service is a turning point in the series of James Bond films. OK, We all know Bond gets all luvvy-duvvy in this one, but that's not how you should assess this movie. It Is a down-to-earth no nonesense movie. OK, it has it's faults, but they do not come from Lazenby.

Lazenby did a fine job in this very tricky movie.

Cheers,


Ian

----------


Ian,

I don't want to steer too far afield in this thread, so I will try and keep it in context. OHMSS could/should have been the _best_ of the Connery Bonds. Its success would have likely kept the producers from bailing on the straight thriller format for the next one. Imagine a DAF and LALD without the goofy bits. But no, they failed to cut a deal with Connery, made the generic Bond character the star, hired an Aussie with little or no acting experience -- and the film bombed.

So here we are today. Should they hire a Croation to play an English spy? Will any tall dark and handsome guy do? Imo NO with a capital NO. Don't tell me that out of all of the actors in England -- there isn't one he-man pro -- who can act -- fit for the job.

Skoal,

Slaezenger

[bryonalston]

The Bond films have many facets, and the actor is only a small one. Sure the actor who plays Bond matters, but the screenplay is much more important. You're forgetting that Lazenby was a complete unknown at the time, and had no fanbase or role that he could be identified by. Visnjic has a fanbase from 'ER' and a current role that he is famous for. OHMSS also flopped because this was the first time that there was a new Bond, and to the 60's audience, Connery WAS Bond. That might be the case now with the generation adapted to Pierce Brosnan, but the transition now will be a lot smoother than in 1968. There might be plenty British actors who could play Bond, but there are many actors who can't. Even though certain candidates might seem perfect, there has to be some reason other than EoN's incompetence as to why they haven't been cast in the role. Visnjic is a favorite of Martin Campbell and I understand why: Visnjic has every qualification that you would expect a Bond actor, or Bond himself as a matter of fact, to have, which the small detail being that this actor isn't British. SO WHAT! If the ACTor is capable of ACTing like a Brit, then so-be-it. If a British actor had the same credentials as Visnjic, people would be jumping all over him. Visnjic's ethicity is a minor issue that can, should and needs to be overlooked my the Bond fan community.

[Seannery]

Is that necessarily true? If Clive had been offered the role in 2003/2004, he probably would have accepted and then we'd have our perfect 007, but since EoN waited until Clive became too big, I doubt that they would make that same mistake twice by missing out on Visnjic before he becomes too famous. Jackman, Butler etc. are already famous, so their salary demands are probably a lot more than Visnjic's would be. Clive's must be astronomical compared to Visnjic's.

Firstly Butler isn't very big or famous and won't necessarily become so and also there is no certainty at all that Visnjic will get much bigger than his ER fame--his movie career isn't going anywhere at present and most likely won't.

[Seannery]

It definitely will make headlines if Visnjic is Bond. i think that if he is, the first thing that he should do is say "Bond, James Bond" with a British accent, that way it will ease some of the more pessimistic fans' tensions and worries. I can imagine him saying it just fine, but since I'm not British, I'm pretty sure there are a lot of touches to the accent that Americans won't be able to pick up on like a Brit will.

Well whoever gets Bond will get tons of headlines. Also think if Goran gets Bond(and this is lets pretend because I don't think he ever will)and then promotes the film in his real accent in the UK and USA--it will be jarring to hear his americanized Croation accented English promoting the ultimate English hero. It would be a promotional disadvantage and would just underlined how far he is from being naturally well cast for Bond. At least the australian accent is in the same ballpark and comes from the English who originally settled Australia.

[ACE]

Perhaps the producers could provide Goran with, ahem, electrocution lessons!

Bad, I know.

But it Sunday mornin' and I have a hangover!

ACE

[Seannery]

Perhaps the producers could provide Goran with, ahem, electrocution lessons!

  Bad, I know.

But it Sunday mornin' and I have a hangover!

ACE

I hope they electrocute his chances.

[Loeffelholz]

Perhaps the producers could provide Goran with, ahem, electrocution lessons!

If he gets the role---whatever it takes to get it right.

[Bondian]

Sorry I missed this one Slaezenger.

I like the Bond films better when I look back at them.

I agree, at the time of On Her Majesty’s Secret Service it was probably frowned upon to cast Lazenby in the part. But now, when looking back, it was a one-off masterpiece.

Cheers Mate,


Ian



[quote name='Slaezenger' date='31 July 2005 - 04:42']Ian,

I don't want to steer too far afield in this thread, so I will try and keep it in context.

[fatima]

Without seeing the screen tests none of us can comment on Goran's Bond performance. But if he wasn't very, very good I doubt if he (a Croatian actor) would be Martin Cambell's number one choice for the part or even have made it as far as the screen tests - they aren't stupid and they ain't going to risk their precious money cow on an unsuitable actor.

BTW didn't Ian Fleming suggest John Wayne for Bond????

[Seannery]

Without seeing the screen tests none of us can comment on Goran's Bond performance. But if he wasn't very, very good I doubt if he (a Croatian actor) would be Martin Cambell's number one choice for the part or even have made it as far as the screen tests - they aren't stupid and they ain't going to risk their precious money cow on an unsuitable actor.

BTW didn't Ian Fleming suggest John Wayne for Bond????

James Brolin and John Gavin got very far--not a good precedent. And of course we can judge on previous work and the physical attributes including voice of an actor. To me Goran falls very short with a ton of candidates ahead of him in the Bond line.

[fatima]

John Gavin could have been good IMO

[bryonalston]

Without seeing the screen tests none of us can comment on Goran's Bond performance. But if he wasn't very, very good I doubt if he (a Croatian actor) would be Martin Cambell's number one choice for the part or even have made it as far as the screen tests - they aren't stupid and they ain't going to risk their precious money cow on an unsuitable actor.

BTW didn't Ian Fleming suggest John Wayne for Bond????

James Brolin and John Gavin got very far--not a good precedent. And of course we can judge on previous work and the physical attributes including voice of an actor. To me Goran falls very short with a ton of candidates ahead of him in the Bond line.

A ton of candidates like whom? Like Adrian Paul? I think that he has as much of a chance of getting cast as I do. At least Visnjic's fame is current. Also, Adrian Paul is half eastern-European, Brolin is American (did he even do a British accent on his screentest? I don't recall one,) and John Gavin was half Mexican. All three of these actors don't have the same racial makeup as Bond, but people are hung up on Visnjic. Martin Campbell wouldn't think so highly of Visnjic (which he does) if he wasn't any good. It's clear that his accent isn't a problem, or else he wouldn't have made it this far in the competition.

[Pussycat]

Without seeing the screen tests none of us can comment on Goran's Bond performance. But if he wasn't very, very good I doubt if he (a Croatian actor) would be Martin Cambell's number one choice for the part or even have made it as far as the screen tests - they aren't stupid and they ain't going to risk their precious money cow on an unsuitable actor.

BTW didn't Ian Fleming suggest John Wayne for Bond????

James Brolin and John Gavin got very far--not a good precedent. And of course we can judge on previous work and the physical attributes including voice of an actor. To me Goran falls very short with a ton of candidates ahead of him in the Bond line.

A ton of candidates like whom? Like Adrian Paul? I think that he has as much of a chance of getting cast as I do. At least Visnjic's fame is current. Also, Adrian Paul is half eastern-European, Brolin is American (did he even do a British accent on his screentest? I don't recall one,) and John Gavin was half Mexican. All three of these actors don't have the same racial makeup as Bond, but people are hung up on Visnjic. Martin Campbell wouldn't think so highly of Visnjic (which he does) if he wasn't any good. It's clear that his accent isn't a problem, or else he wouldn't have made it this far in the competition.

You seem to be hung up on Adrian's Mama being Italian. His father was English, his mother is from Florence and cooks great pasta from Adrian's accounts. But...let's not forget, he was born in England to an English father, grew up in London, went to schools in London, played semi-pro soccer for England and spent his entire childhood there, until he started traveling in Europe in his 20's. That's a pretty English upbringing there. Granted, he has multi-cultural roots but then...didn't 007 as well?

By the way, he speaks English, Italian, French and Spanish fluently.

[Seannery]

Well i'm not going to make this an Adrian thread--this is Goran's place. I'll just add Bryonalston that that we simply strongly disagree--i'd hate for goran to be Bond and you Adrian. Such is life. Everyone has critics and everyone has opinions. Would be boring otherwise.

[bryonalston]

Interesting idea, but daring. As for Orlando Bloom, he does look vaguely like a young Visnjic, although his nose is blunter.





Remember, however, that the last time two actors played Bond in the same movie was in the 1967 spoof version of Casino Royale! If a flashback were inserted into the PTS of the new film, it might draw unfavourable comparisons with the campy 60's farce. Then again, it might be interpreted as a subtle homage to Charles K. Feldman's version. It would have to be done with the utmost skill, or it would look ridiculous and cast a pall over the entire film.

I doubt that many people would draw comparisons, especially here in America (most people wouldn't have seen or heard of the 1967 version. I don't really know where I got the idea for Bloom/Visnjic, but I guess it just came to me. Even though they don't look identical, their faces do look similar.

[Seannery]

Interesting idea, but daring. As for Orlando Bloom, he does look vaguely like a young Visnjic, although his nose is blunter.





Remember, however, that the last time two actors played Bond in the same movie was in the 1967 spoof version of Casino Royale! If a flashback were inserted into the PTS of the new film, it might draw unfavourable comparisons with the campy 60's farce. Then again, it might be interpreted as a subtle homage to Charles K. Feldman's version. It would have to be done with the utmost skill, or it would look ridiculous and cast a pall over the entire film.

I doubt that many people would draw comparisons, especially here in America (most people wouldn't have seen or heard of the 1967 version. I don't really know where I got the idea for Bloom/Visnjic, but I guess it just came to me. Even though they don't look identical, their faces do look similar.

Well this goes back to the two Bond theory--one young and one mature. That scenario most likely is false--anyway Bloom and Goran are too close in age for that to work.