317 replies to this topic

[AgenttiNollaNollaSeitsemän]

All right Jim, I understand. I don't want to endanger the site. Better for me to stay clear of this thread from now on.

 

 

After all, it's just a movie.

Edited by AgenttiNollaNollaSeitsemän, 11 December 2014 - 10:02 AM.

[SkyfallCraig]

It isn't possesion at all. These are public images. I didn't read them, but I don't see any risk to link them.
But still, if the that's the rule, it's ok.

[Jim]

It isn't possesion at all. These are public images. I didn't read them, but I don't see any risk to link them.
But still, if the that's the rule, it's ok.

 

Thank you for your endorsement.

 

As for public images - they've been made public in highly dubious circumstances. We might not agree on the possession point but a high level of caution avoids that debate, probably for the best.

[Royal Dalton]

Agreed. We are getting our "knickers in a twist", to use a quaint old expression, about a set of emails, some of them months old, which may or may not be genuine, about a script which we have been told underwent a significant rewrite, to the extent that writers who were told their services were not required, suddenly were required after all!

 

About the villain's motives - if this stuff is to be believed - one of these emails makes clear there's got to be more to it - and SPECTRE - than that. If the motive is as described in earlier correspondence one doesn't need to head a major crime syndicate simply to pursue what we're told this villain wants to pursue. It might simply be, to borrow a couple of words from Kronsteen in FRWL, an "added refinement" to a big affair.

 

Well, l do have a certain amount of faith in Purvis and Wade's ability to fix this thing. They know the original Fleming stories and characters probably better than anyone else working on it. And since Mendes supposedly begged them to come back, I'd like to think they've had a bit more control over the plot this time, and were able to ditch that extremely bad idea. If not, the Craig era is going to disappear up its own bum.

[thecasinoroyale]

I don't want to know where they are, or what they are or what stage they were from.

 

I'm not having leaks or anything like this dubious hacking/what-not ruin the build up of 'Spectre' for me, and letting old ideas or drafts turn my opinion.

 

Set photos and things, yeah ok maybe, but not like this.

[KM16]

I don't want to know where they are, or what they are or what stage they were from.

 

I'm not having leaks or anything like this dubious hacking/what-not ruin the build up of 'Spectre' for me, and letting old ideas or drafts turn my opinion.

 

Set photos and things, yeah ok maybe, but not like this.

Though it's worrying, I quite enjoy seeing the creative process in its whole. I get a kick out of things like that with this franchise, seeing where things began compared to how they end. It's intriguing.

[Marcin]

Though it's worrying, I quite enjoy seeing the creative process in its whole. I get a kick out of things like that with this franchise, seeing where things began compared to how they end. It's intriguing.

 

True.. Intriguing indeed..

[Dustin]

Fact is, the material only came out in the open by means of breaking into SONY's network. None of it, as far as we can tell, was ever meant to reach eyes other than the ones involved in production of SPECTRE. Look at it like this, if somebody made your private mails public you wouldn't be very happy about it either. So obviously is SONY and they may at any stage decide to get back at whoever helps spreading this material. So once more, no links. Nada.

That said my advice would be to not read the stuff. By what I hear it's mainly notes to early stages, so there is really no telling how relevant these still are to the actual script, nor how any of it will end up looking in the finished film.

As for the budget story, it's a bit pointless for MGM - which is actually little more than Bond nowadays - to bemoan a budget that will earn them their paycheques for the better part of the next few years. Either number is likewise astronomic, but I can't imagine the higher sum will prove any real problem for MGM to come up with their share. In the end they will earn good money with it. Which cannot be said for all films in production these days. They should be thankful to have such a bank as Bond on their books.

[Vauxhall]

Right, I've done a lot of digging and calling in favours.

I've confirmed that these emails and apparent complaints about the script are from much earlier this year. The plot has changed substantially since then through six months of rewrites by four writers.

Issues have been solved to the satisfaction of the Bond team and the studios.

Of course, it's all down to personal taste about what they've kept, but trust me that it can't be as bad as feared!

[sharpshooter]

Yeah, I'm genuinely not worried about this. We are aware Mendes and the team weren't exactly happy with the original template, and set out to improve things. I do think there's a general base which will remain, and I'm fine with that. There's some interesting ideas. 

[Harmsway]

I've confirmed that these emails and apparent complaints about the script are from much earlier this year. The plot has changed substantially since then through six months of rewrites by four writers.

I'm not surprised.

FWIW, the leaks refer to at least two very, very different drafts.

Of the pages of comments that leaked, two refer to what is clearly a *very* early version, where the locations and characters don't seem to resemble what the finished product is at all.

But the other two pages refer to a substantially rewritten draft (perhaps by P&W) with the character names and locations lining up with what we currently have (and it's notable that the studio commentary--which is surprisingly insightful, I'd say--is favorable to this version). I suspect that the general shape of the story as well as its central concerns can be correctly deduced here, even if details have changed.

All four sets of pages indicate that there were still significant rewrites to be done (which have been occurring over the past year). I'm not sure this material refers to *only* John Logan stuff, even though I'm sure changes were made after the fact as other writers were brought on. With the arc they've got, it's not surprising that this needed a lot of fine-tuning. This story will require a very delicate balance (much like Skyfall).

[seawolfnyy]

As we've already stated, these emails point to early drafts, possibly before P&W came back. I don't believe these leaks give away much about the movie now and I'm not going to worry. I think Mendes knows what he's doing. The problems in the pre-production for the film are welll-known and I think Mendes has gone to great lengths to address them. I think everyone needs to a deep breath and CALM DOWN.

[Royal Dalton]

 (and it's notable that the studio commentary--which is surprisingly insightful, I'd say--is favorable to this version). 

 

They're still going along with that central conceit there, though. Which is terrible.

[JohnnyWalker]

 

 (and it's notable that the studio commentary--which is surprisingly insightful, I'd say--is favorable to this version). 

 

They're still going along with that central conceit there, though. Which is terrible.

 

I have no idea what this central conceit is but you don't actually know they're still going along with it do you?

[Royal Dalton]

I have no idea what this central conceit is but you don't actually know they're still going along with it do you?

 

No. And I don't know that they're not, either.

[Harmsway]

(and it's notable that the studio commentary--which is surprisingly insightful, I'd say--is favorable to this version).

They're still going along with that central conceit there, though. Which is terrible.

The central conceit is pretty clearly here to stay, given how the press conference and other reports confirmed certain story elements. I sort of understand why they went this route (they reverse engineered the villain's motivation from the character arc they want to give Bond).

The other stuff might have shifted, but it's clear that the big picture has more or less stayed the same.

[x007AceOfSpades]

 

 

(and it's notable that the studio commentary--which is surprisingly insightful, I'd say--is favorable to this version).

They're still going along with that central conceit there, though. Which is terrible.

The central conceit is pretty clearly here to stay, given how the press conference and other reports confirmed certain story elements. I sort of understand why they went this route (they reverse engineered the villain's motivation from the character arc they want to give Bond).

The other stuff that might have shifted, but it's clear that the big picture has more or less stayed the same.

 

Well said, Harmsway.

[SecretAgentFan]

I´m okay with the big picture.  In fact, I am happy that it´s there.  The Craig era deserved that.

[Royal Dalton]

Crikey...

[Harmsway]

I´m okay with the big picture.  In fact, I am happy that it´s there.  The Craig era deserved that.

It's certainly very big. It's so big, in fact, that I'm not sure how there can possibly be another Craig Bond flick to follow this one. It would be like seeing another Bale Batman flick after The Dark Knight Rises. I wonder if EON is waiting to reveal that Craig won't be returning for another installment. Otherwise they have something planned for Bond 25 that I can't possibly guess at.

 

Also, does the central conceit reminds anyone else of the Metal Gear Solid franchise? This seems exactly like the kind of narrative maneuver that has been employed by that series time and time again.

[Vauxhall]

Agreed with Harms. From what I've read, this certainly sounds like Craig's last film. Not sure where they'd go from here.

[AgenttiNollaNollaSeitsemän]

Agreed with Harms. From what I've read, this certainly sounds like Craig's last film. Not sure where they'd go from here.

Perhaps some plot threads will left wide open and loose in the wind...

Edited by AgenttiNollaNollaSeitsemän, 11 December 2014 - 03:09 PM.

[Harmsway]

 

Agreed with Harms. From what I've read, this certainly sounds like Craig's last film. Not sure where they'd go from here.

Perhaps some plot threads will left wide open and loose in the wind...

 

Sure doesn't sound like it.

[Call Billy Bob]

It may sound like Dan's last film, but perhaps part of P&W's contributions was to split the film in two?

[thecasinoroyale]

These last few posts have REALLY intrigued me now....more than I wish they had.....whatever it being discussed sounds pretty intense...

[AgenttiNollaNollaSeitsemän]

 

 

Agreed with Harms. From what I've read, this certainly sounds like Craig's last film. Not sure where they'd go from here.

Perhaps some plot threads will left wide open and loose in the wind...

 

Sure doesn't sound like it.

 

Yes, from what we can gather it does not.

[thecasinoroyale]

Just seen some punk on MI6 post this (I'm not a member but I see what they are up to);

 

PanchitoPistoles

3:09AMedited 3:21AM Posts: 1,829

Have any of you read how completely ridiculous the people over the commanderbond forums are about the leaks? =)) They are saying things like the plot is a mess and are whining about how terrible the film will be! Have they even realised that half the stuff is about very early drafts and even the other half contains characters that have been since then eliminated from the story? In other words, none of the leaked pages were about the final draft. What a bunch of morons...

My message to debrief.commanderbond: DIAL IT DOWN!

 

 

 

 

How DARE he....!

 

Morons? *mumble*  We don't whine, we debate...
 

[Harmsway]

It may sound like Dan's last film, but perhaps part of P&W's contributions was to split the film in two?

Mendes said that one of the conditions of his coming back on board was that they turned a two-film plan into a single film. I'm beginning to get an idea of what that entailed.

[Royal Dalton]

Morons?

 

I'd rather be a moron than a sheep.

[Call Billy Bob]

You're right, Harmsway. I recall that now. Thanks for the heads-up!