164 replies to this topic

[bogard]

A role in a Bond movie is a fitting reward for bringing the awesomeness that is Hector Barbossa back to life. Arr.

Edited by bogard, 15 June 2011 - 02:08 PM.

[double o ego]

That's why to me, it's necessary to introduce new characters. As I said a few posts before, Harris would be the perfect actress for Loelia Ponsonby. I may be a bit too stubborn, but it would be fantastic to start again from scratch and make James Bond movies more Bondian and "Flemingnian" than they are now, even though they are yet.

I think your suggestion is perfect. We've always seen M's secretary but we've never seen Bond's secretary. Would be nice to get a glimpse inside MI6 a bit more and view Bond's office and the interoffice politics that go on.

As for 'everyone being a person of color'...racial politics in America are just that: politics. It's an ugly game that gets played by all sides in this country and it unfortunately influences way too much of our decision making in the U.S. in entertainment, government policy, sports, etc...and people who have lived in Britain their whole life will have a vastly different viewpoint on race relations than Americans, and rightly so. But the people who are the harshest critics about interracial pairings in American movies and television the past decade have been black Americans. Did any of you read the criticism leveled at the show UNDERCOVERS last season on NBC? In that instance you had two black actors basically portraying a sort of television version of MR.AND MRS.SMITH and black media critics *HATED* it with the burning intensity of a 1,000 white-hot suns! Why? Because the two leads "weren't black enough", that the show was "too white" and didn't accurately reflect the real-life problems taking place in the Black American community, etc.... What should have been a great example of color-blind casting (the roles could have been performed by actors of any ethnicity) instead turned into a Rorschach test of race relations within the black community and the lack of support resulted in the show being cancelled (it wasn't all that great either, but that's another topic).

Inevitably, if Harris is cast, we're going to get the same sort of complaints about her from the very people who complain that Tyler Perry's movies demean and degrade black women: black women! Harris won't be black enough...she won't be "down with the struggle"...her character will 'exist strictly to fulfill a white, patriarchal male's fantasy of subjugating a black woman' (a time honored tradition since at least Thomas Jefferson and Sally Hemmings)...that Bond will be the symbolic stand-in for a British society wistfully looking back on its years as a colonial occupier of Africa...her character will be written and directed by white men who have no idea what it's like to be a black woman (though apparently Daniel Craig is now qualified to discuss what it's like being a woman, having put on a dress, heels, and a wig and all)....and blah blah blah blah blah.

I just think it's very important to point out that the loudest criticism of Harris' potential casting will come not from white separatists, but from black Americans themselves, and that just because there's some criticism of Harris being cast in the movie that it's not always based upon skin color.

That's just some black people never being happy. The same one's crying that a movie or tv series isn't depicting the "struggle" are the same ones crying that the "struggle" is being exploited and that the media needs to convey that black people are just as capable as doing what ever anyone else of another race can do. Now, as a young british black man myself I know what I'm talking about in this regard because I see it all the time.
The world is a very different place and obviously there are racial frictions that still go on but that doesn't take away from the fact that there are black men and women working in all kinds of different professional levels. Moneypenny is traditionally a white woman but her race and impact as a character is really of no consequence what so ever. Moneypenny could be white, black, brown, yellow, albino whatever, her race is of no concern.

Here in Britain, specifically in London, the culture, the multi ethnic society is just so rich that casting a black Moneypenny isn't even going to be an issue. All this looking at such casting from a perspective of throwbacks to imperialist tendancies is just looking way too deep into the matter. Lets just get on with the casting and let the cameras roll.

[DR76]

That's why to me, it's necessary to introduce new characters. As I said a few posts before, Harris would be the perfect actress for Loelia Ponsonby. I may be a bit too stubborn, but it would be fantastic to start again from scratch and make James Bond movies more Bondian and "Flemingnian" than they are now, even though they are yet.

Here in Britain, specifically in London, the culture, the multi ethnic society is just so rich that casting a black Moneypenny isn't even going to be an issue. All this looking at such casting from a perspective of throwbacks to imperialist tendancies is just looking way too deep into the matter. Lets just get on with the casting and let the cameras roll.

Why are many of you guys still discussing the possibility of Naomie Harris being Miss Moneypenny or Bond's personal secretary? What's wrong with her being the leading lady in the next film? She's got the looks, the presence and talent to be just that.

[blueman]

Yeah, I'm hoping she's a main character.

[TCK]

That's why to me, it's necessary to introduce new characters. As I said a few posts before, Harris would be the perfect actress for Loelia Ponsonby. I may be a bit too stubborn, but it would be fantastic to start again from scratch and make James Bond movies more Bondian and "Flemingnian" than they are now, even though they are yet.

Here in Britain, specifically in London, the culture, the multi ethnic society is just so rich that casting a black Moneypenny isn't even going to be an issue. All this looking at such casting from a perspective of throwbacks to imperialist tendancies is just looking way too deep into the matter. Lets just get on with the casting and let the cameras roll.

Why are many of you guys still discussing the possibility of Naomie Harris being Miss Moneypenny or Bond's personal secretary? What's wrong with her being the leading lady in the next film? She's got the looks, the presence and talent to be just that.

I agree, but I want to see her not only in Bond23, but also in a few next movies. Except Sylvia Trench, any Bond girl appeared twice, so that's why I'd prefer see her as Ponsonby. In this way, we'll be able to see her twice or three times perhaps. And if she plays Ponsonby, we'll remember as the Loelia Ponsonby, just like people remember Maxwell as the Miss Moneypenny. I don't want her to be the Xth Bond girl, but the first Ponsonby.

[DR76]

That's why to me, it's necessary to introduce new characters. As I said a few posts before, Harris would be the perfect actress for Loelia Ponsonby. I may be a bit too stubborn, but it would be fantastic to start again from scratch and make James Bond movies more Bondian and "Flemingnian" than they are now, even though they are yet.

Here in Britain, specifically in London, the culture, the multi ethnic society is just so rich that casting a black Moneypenny isn't even going to be an issue. All this looking at such casting from a perspective of throwbacks to imperialist tendancies is just looking way too deep into the matter. Lets just get on with the casting and let the cameras roll.

Why are many of you guys still discussing the possibility of Naomie Harris being Miss Moneypenny or Bond's personal secretary? What's wrong with her being the leading lady in the next film? She's got the looks, the presence and talent to be just that.

I agree, but I want to see her not only in Bond23, but also in a few next movies. Except Sylvia Trench, any Bond girl appeared twice, so that's why I'd prefer see her as Ponsonby. In this way, we'll be able to see her twice or three times perhaps. And if she plays Ponsonby, we'll remember as the Loelia Ponsonby, just like people remember Maxwell as the Miss Moneypenny. I don't want her to be the Xth Bond girl, but the first Ponsonby.

Harris would be wasting her time playing Moneypenny or Bond's personal secretary. She could do better than that as the leading lady in Bond 23. Frankly, I would prefer her as the leading lady in the next film.

I don't get you guys. For the first time I can recall, the media is pronouncing the possibility of a new Bond leading lady, and all you can do is express a desire to see her in a minor role. And I cannot fathom this desire to see Harris only in a minor role, when she could do better in a major role.

[Bucky]

That's why to me, it's necessary to introduce new characters. As I said a few posts before, Harris would be the perfect actress for Loelia Ponsonby. I may be a bit too stubborn, but it would be fantastic to start again from scratch and make James Bond movies more Bondian and "Flemingnian" than they are now, even though they are yet.

Here in Britain, specifically in London, the culture, the multi ethnic society is just so rich that casting a black Moneypenny isn't even going to be an issue. All this looking at such casting from a perspective of throwbacks to imperialist tendancies is just looking way too deep into the matter. Lets just get on with the casting and let the cameras roll.

Why are many of you guys still discussing the possibility of Naomie Harris being Miss Moneypenny or Bond's personal secretary? What's wrong with her being the leading lady in the next film? She's got the looks, the presence and talent to be just that.

I agree, but I want to see her not only in Bond23, but also in a few next movies. Except Sylvia Trench, any Bond girl appeared twice, so that's why I'd prefer see her as Ponsonby. In this way, we'll be able to see her twice or three times perhaps. And if she plays Ponsonby, we'll remember as the Loelia Ponsonby, just like people remember Maxwell as the Miss Moneypenny. I don't want her to be the Xth Bond girl, but the first Ponsonby.

Harris would be wasting her time playing Moneypenny or Bond's personal secretary. She could do better than that as the leading lady in Bond 23. Frankly, I would prefer her as the leading lady in the next film.

I don't get you guys. For the first time I can recall, the media is pronouncing the possibility of a new Bond leading lady, and all you can do is express a desire to see her in a minor role. And I cannot fathom this desire to see Harris only in a minor role, when she could do better in a major role.

Perhaps I do not want Moneypenny to have a minor role.

[DR76]

Perhaps I do not want Moneypenny to have a minor role.

Moneypenny is always a minor role and you know it.

[TCK]

Perhaps I do not want Moneypenny to have a minor role.

Moneypenny is always a minor role and you know it.

We have never seen Ponsonby in a Bond movie, so you can't say it's a minor role. And you know Ponsonby may be the leading lady of Bond23 besides Bond's secretary. I let you imagine some scenes between them... Bond in love with his secretary, M will be furious ! Anyway, it will be a new kind of relationship between Bond, the women and his job.

[blueman]

Ponsonby could end up like Goodnight in TMWTGG, sure. Whatever they call her character, "leading lady" would be nice.

[Mr. Blofeld]

Ponsonby could end up like Goodnight in TMWTGG

Well, hopefully, it's not that bad...

[DR76]

We have never seen Ponsonby in a Bond movie, so you can't say it's a minor role. And you know Ponsonby may be the leading lady of Bond23 besides Bond's secretary. I let you imagine some scenes between them... Bond in love with his secretary, M will be furious ! Anyway, it will be a new kind of relationship between Bond, the women and his job.

You know that this will never happen. You know it.

What is it about Naomie Harris that makes you guys so reluctant to see her cast as the leading lady in BOND 23? And please, no bull. You keep claiming that she would be wonderful as a MI6 secretary. But for some reason you don't want to consider her as the next leading lady. Why?

[TCK]

Ponsonby could end up like Goodnight in TMWTGG, sure. Whatever they call her character, "leading lady" would be nice.

The man with the golden gun doesn't have anything to do with Casino Royale and Quantum of Solace, the atmosphere is very different, so I don't think Ponsonby would be a Goodnight 2. I prefer imagine a character inspired by Moneypenny in On her Majesty's secret service for instance, but in a more present and influential role towards Bond.

[blueman]

We have never seen Ponsonby in a Bond movie, so you can't say it's a minor role. And you know Ponsonby may be the leading lady of Bond23 besides Bond's secretary. I let you imagine some scenes between them... Bond in love with his secretary, M will be furious ! Anyway, it will be a new kind of relationship between Bond, the women and his job.

You know that this will never happen. You know it.

What is it about Naomie Harris that makes you guys so reluctant to see her cast as the leading lady in BOND 23? And please, no bull. You keep claiming that she would be wonderful as a MI6 secretary. But for some reason you don't want to consider her as the next leading lady. Why?

I want her to be the leading lady! I do, I do! (don't really care what they cal her...)

[TCK]

You know that this will never happen. You know it.

What will never happen ? Bond falling in love with Ponsonby in a movie and a plot which integrate this situation ? Of course I know, I was joking with the "M'll be furious". Or did you mean that Ponsonby will never be in a Bond movie ? For this idea, I'm a bit more torn. I would like to see her, you know it, I don't know why they never used her by the way. Perhaps she'll be here one day, who knows. But the subject we discuss is "Harris for leading lady or Ponsonby ?", not Ponsonby only.

What is it about Naomie Harris that makes you guys so reluctant to see her cast as the leading lady in BOND 23? And please, no bull. You keep claiming that she would be wonderful as a MI6 secretary. But for some reason you don't want to consider her as the next leading lady. Why?

You're wrong. First, if she plays in Bond23, I'll be delighted, whatever the character (Ponsonby, leading lady, Quantum agent...). She's a good actress and she'll surely have a wonderful career.

Well. I know I know, I'm bloody stubborn about Ponsonby. It's a character I do want to see one day in a Bond movie. I explained on the one-hundred-and-eighteenth post of this topic why I think it would be preferable to introduce Fleming's characters who never appeared in a Bond movie instead wanting a Q or a Moneypenny come back. Ponsonby is part of those characters. And playing Ponsonby would allow her to appear on several occasions.

Don't get me wrong, for I think you did (perhaps I misexplained what I think I don't know), I don't think she can't be the next leading lady, I've never say that (quite the contrary, I've said many times that I consider her as a good actress, and a good actor/actress can act everything), I did say that she could be great as Ponsonby, but never that she couldn't be the next leading lady. If the character is interesting and well-built, it would be wonderful for she's a pretty good actress.

In the end, we agree. She's a good actress and it'll be wonderful to see her in the next movie. You would enjoy her acting the leading lady, so would I, although I consider that as there was probably about fifty Bond girls until now, the role must be very very original, unusual, well-built and interesting to stand out from the group.

But I might ask you the same thing. You've said that she would be wasting her time playing a minor role, but if the leading lady role is missed, so she would, what do you think ?

[double o ego]

I for one think Harris has all the qualities to be a leading lady and I guess my response was in direct response to the poster I was responding to, however, the principle theme of my argument isn't just resigned to the role of Moneypenny.

[univex]

What is it about Naomie Harris that makes you guys so reluctant to see her cast as the leading lady in BOND 23? And please, no bull. You keep claiming that she would be wonderful as a MI6 secretary. But for some reason you don't want to consider her as the next leading lady. Why?

Personally, I don't think she's hot enough to be a Bond Girl. She's an attractive woman, but being a Bond Girl is a special privilege; they are supposed to be insanely beautiful, not merely pleasant to look at. And don't give me the argument that she's a very talented actress; if acting talent were the dominant criteria for being a Bond Girl, we would have had Shelley Winters as Pussy Galore and not Honor Blackman.

The best girls were in CR, I mean there´s no way you can beat Vesper and Solange - tha´s what I call insanely beautiful. We need another Ursula or Claudine. Naomie is very beautiful, just not insanely gorgeous. So I guess I actually agree with you Grav. Today. Tomorrow...who knows ?

[Robinson]

Erm... Naomie Harris is British, dear boy.

And? So? Ms.Gugu Mbatha-Raw, who co-starred on UNDERCOVERS, was British, and her male lead, Boris Kodjoe, was born in Austria, but for the purposes of lazy reporting or pushing an agenda, they were both conveniently "African-American" to American television critics and race-based activists. And so will be Ms. Harris if she gets a role in the 007 film.

I call BS on this one. Kodjoe already had a following thanks to his role on the cable TV series "Soul Food." His bi-racial heritage was reported on and discussed years ago and no one batted an eyelid. Except for the sisters who batted several because they think he's fine as hell.

Most people (including African-Americans) didn't know Ms. Raw was British because she's a relatively new face to American audiences. Like Idris Elba and Chiwtiel Ejiofor, most mainstream folk didn't know these were British actors plying their trade in American productions until they had breakout roles (THE WIRE for Elba and SERENITY for Chewie).

Mainstream folk may not know Harris is a Brit but if she's cast AND if it's to be a Bond Girl, you can best believe folks will know then.

if acting talent were the dominant criteria for being a Bond Girl, we would have had Shelley Winters as Pussy Galore and not Honor Blackman.

Not insanely beautiful but tell me you wouldn't kick Ms. Winters out of bed for eating crackers.

[DR76]

I mean, after all, Charlize Theron *IS* African-American, but you never hear about her being the second African-American woman to win the Oscar for Best Actress (after Halle Berry of course), or it's why Allen West isn't a real black person but instead a "sellout" (because he's conservative and a Republican), yet Maxine Waters is (because she's a liberal and a Democrat)

Has Charlize Theron become an American citizen recently? Because as far as I know, she was born and raised in South Africa.

In regard to Allen West, most African-Americans are leery of conservatives and Republicans, considering their contentious past history with that political affiliation during the past 50 years or so . . . which continues, by the way.

I'll reiterate: if Naomie Harris is cast in the movie, it should be as a Bond Girl. I'd rather have her playing a Bond Girl than playing Moneypenny or Q. But I will also say that if it's the express intention of EON to cast an "ethnic actress" in at least one of the two Bond Girl roles, there are far prettier black, Asian, or Latina actresses that come to mind than Ms. Harris.

Unlike you, I have no problems with Ms. Harris. To me, she's not some dog or mildly attractive woman. She is extremely good looking, as far as I'm concerned. And I've seen her in the flesh at a POTC movie premiere. Even the other bystanders were amazed at how good looking she was. She is just as good looking as many of the other Bond women in the past, as far as I'm concerned.

Well. I know I know, I'm bloody stubborn about Ponsonby. It's a character I do want to see one day in a Bond movie. I explained on the one-hundred-and-eighteenth post of this topic why I think it would be preferable to introduce Fleming's characters who never appeared in a Bond movie instead wanting a Q or a Moneypenny come back. Ponsonby is part of those characters. And playing Ponsonby would allow her to appear on several occasions.

Don't get me wrong, for I think you did (perhaps I misexplained what I think I don't know), I don't think she can't be the next leading lady, I've never say that (quite the contrary, I've said many times that I consider her as a good actress, and a good actor/actress can act everything), I did say that she could be great as Ponsonby, but never that she couldn't be the next leading lady. If the character is interesting and well-built, it would be wonderful for she's a pretty good actress.

If you want Ms. Ponsonby featured in BOND 23, why not consider some minor actress, instead of Harris, who is a lot more well known?

And don't give me the argument that she's a very talented actress; if acting talent were the dominant criteria for being a Bond Girl, we would have had Shelley Winters as Pussy Galore and not Honor Blackman.

Before she had gained weight, Shelley Winters was known for being a sexy Hollywood starlet in her youth. And as I had stated before, I don't understand this opinion that Naomie Harris is some mildly attractive woman. It sounds like an excuse on your part that doesn't strike me as very convincing, especially since I have seen her in person.

What will never happen ? Bond falling in love with Ponsonby in a movie and a plot which integrate this situation ? Of course I know, I was joking with the "M'll be furious". Or did you mean that Ponsonby will never be in a Bond movie ? For this idea, I'm a bit more torn. I would like to see her, you know it, I don't know why they never used her by the way. Perhaps she'll be here one day, who knows. But the subject we discuss is "Harris for leading lady or Ponsonby ?", not Ponsonby only.

I don't think I can even take this discussion about Ponsonby serious any more.


I wonder . . . if Naomie Harris had been white, would I be reading these comments about how she would be more suited in a Moneypenny/Ponsonby role, or criticisms of her looks?

[TCK]

I wonder . . . if Naomie Harris had been white, would I be reading these comments about how she would be more suited in a Moneypenny/Ponsonby role, or criticisms of her looks?

Yes you would. It seems that we can't disapprove an opinion without being half-accused of racıalısm, it's a bit disconcerting.

[Jim]

I wonder . . . if Naomie Harris had been white, would I be reading these comments about how she would be more suited in a Moneypenny/Ponsonby role, or criticisms of her looks?

Ah, the sweet old song.

I expect you would be reading them, yes.

[dinovelvet]

I wonder . . . if Naomie Harris had been white, would I be reading these comments about how she would be more suited in a Moneypenny/Ponsonby role, or criticisms of her looks?

Ah, the sweet old song.

I expect you would be reading them, yes.

Well I wouldn't be reading these comments if she had been green. Can't stand greenies. Send 'em back where they came from, I say.

[blueman]

I wonder . . . if Naomie Harris had been white, would I be reading these comments about how she would be more suited in a Moneypenny/Ponsonby role, or criticisms of her looks?

Well the stunt-casting comment wouldn't have been made.

[Royal Dalton]

Naomie was on BBC Breakfast this morning. She said she's met with Sam Mendes, hasn't been offered a role yet, and doesn't know anything at all about the film, including what character she'd be playing if she was offered it.

She seems like a really lovely person. Sign her up, I say.

[Pierce - Daniel]

Video interview with Harris. The most interesting part is when she says she met with Mendes, Barbara and Debbie McWilliams
http://filmonic.com/...-23-speculation

[Pierce - Daniel]

In an interview with Jason Solomons, Naomie Harris confirmed that she is definently involved in a very 'secret' project though she would not elaborate much further
http://www.guardian....t-naomie-harris

[Dustin]

She met Mendes but doesn't know what role they consider her for? Somewhat unusual, isn't it? Would have thought they give at least a hint.

[Pierce - Daniel]

I think with Bond there is always an element of having to be very passive with the press, if she told the press everything about her role then its likely she wont end up in the film.

[Quantumofsolace007]

In an interview with Jason Solomons, Naomie Harris confirmed that she is definently involved in a very 'secret' project though she would not elaborate much further
http://www.guardian....t-naomie-harris

so i think it's a safe assumption she is in bond 23. I'm glad.

[Chief of SIS]

That's not what was said at all. 'Involved' and 'in' are two separate things. She just talked to Digital Spy and said, and I quote, "Nothing is confirmed as yet." Hold your horses.

Link if you want it but really you don't need it

Also loved how she said that people like to run with the rumor...

Edited by Chief of SIS, 20 June 2011 - 07:37 PM.