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SPOILER: "The game is..."


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#31 The Dove

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:19 PM

This is the perfect opportunity to use that james bond Simpsons scene that was cut out of the Casino episode in Season 5;

Blofeld: " Your move, Mr. Bond!"
Bond: (Dan Castellaneta does a great Connery accent by the way) " I'll take a hit dealer...Joker? You were supposed to take those out of the deck!!"
Homer: " Oh sorry! Here's another one!'
Bond: " What is this card? Rules for Draw and Stud Poker??!!"
Blofeld: " What a pity, Mr. Bond!! " (Jaws and Oddjob rush to grab Bond)
Bond: "But it was Homer's fault!! I didn't lose! I never lose!! Well at least tell me the details of your plot for world domination!!"
Blofeld: " Ha, Ha, Ha, i'm not going to fall for that one again!! "

#32 ComplimentsOfSharky

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:20 PM

Poker on the other hand has the ability to have a great confrontation between Bond and Le Chiffre.


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That is a really good point Mr *.

This news doesn't make me happy, but I'm not really willing to give up hope yet.

#33 whiteskwirl

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:23 PM

Baccarat isn't complicated. And it's way more interesting than poker. And why would these fancy high rollers, during this time period, in France, play poker? yuck.

#34 doublenoughtspy

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:27 PM

SecretAgentFan,

Should Bond's Aston Martin have a sign on it that says "Really Expensive Car" - his tuxedo have a sign that says "Fine tailoring"?

How far will you go to pander to the audience and help them understand Bond's world without requiring any effort on their part?

Poker might be easy to follow, but as all the other people posting here point out - it has a lot of cowboy and joe sixpack connotations.

You can play it with your buddies anywhere with a card table.

Can you say the same for baccarat? No.

If they must have the game in there, I would hope that it would be a duel type scenario, where Bond beats the pants off Le Chiffre at Baccarat, and then Le Chiffre suggests a different game such as poker and Bond beats him at that too.

#35 HellIsHere

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:30 PM

Nowadays, I guess it's more plausible a mob agent or a KGB agent like Le Chiffre playing poker than baccarat. That

Edited by HellIsHere, 26 September 2005 - 04:31 PM.


#36 onthetracksof007

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:30 PM

Contrary to most others, I AM very surprised by EON's poker choice...
Looking at the strange decisions surrounding the making of this film, made so far, I had expected this whole CR story would revolve around a very exciting game of Pacman... :)

#37 whiteskwirl

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:33 PM

Poker is so out of character, they might as well be playing hearts or spades. Or perhaps a competitve game of Uno

#38 zencat

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:36 PM

his is a really big scoop. Glad to know it. But who was the source?

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When we say "CBn has learned", that implies we got this info from our own sources. Our own "Deep Throats." If we found this news somewhere online or in a magazine, etc., we would name the source and provide a link.

#39 trumanlodge89

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:37 PM

you know what, it makes sense. there hasnt been a prominant poker movie in the last 5 years, so its not like theyre copying anyone; just playing off the popularity of hold 'em. so what. EoN has done it before, and they will continue to do it. then again, some of you complain at any announcement. poker is easy for the average movie-goer to follow, and baccara has been played a million times in the bond films. how many of you dislike "LTK" for the sole reason that bond plays blackjack?


or are some of you whining just to whine?

#40 vosne

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:37 PM

In the novel Bond goes to great lengths to explain the rules of Baccarat to Vesper and Mathis, so if this were followed in the film the audience should 'get it'.
The problem with this decision [if it's true] is that it'll lock the film in a time period, which in my view is one of the weaknesses of some of the Moore films [snowboarding to a Beach Boys song]. I hope they reconsider...or maybe have Bond battle LeChiffre at a bowling alley.

#41 whiteskwirl

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:41 PM

I don't think Bond playing poker will increase the popularity of the game. And people aren't going to see the movie just to watch some guys play poker. Are they going to advertise the movie, pointing out that they're playing poker? That would be ridiculous. So why make the change?

#42 ComicalJames

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:42 PM

SecretAgentFan,



If they must have the game in there, I would hope that it would be a duel type scenario, where Bond beats the pants off Le Chiffre at Baccarat, and then Le Chiffre suggests a different game such as poker and Bond beats him at that too.

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That would remind me too much of Bill and Ted.

"Sorry le Chiffre you lose! It was PROFESSOR PLUM!"

#43 Mister Asterix

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:43 PM

The problem with this decision [if it's true] is that it'll lock the film in a time period...

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Maybe. But perhaps in the future Poker will be considered nostalgic.

#44 zencat

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:44 PM

Isn't it great to be talking about something other than who will play Bond? :)

#45 stromberg

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:44 PM

....
If they must have the game in there, I would hope that it would be a duel type scenario, where Bond beats the pants off Le Chiffre at Baccarat, and then Le Chiffre suggests a different game such as poker and Bond beats him at that too.

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That would be a nice twist indeed and my preference

Mixed feelings about this one. I'd love to have a game of Baccarat in the movie, but I don't have a real problem with it being changed to Poker. I guess that at the end of the day, we'll still get to see an exciting card game, and that's what matters.

And a good point by Mr. Asterix: we've had Baccarat many times in a Bond movie, whereas he never played Poker

#46 tdalton

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:46 PM

POSSIBLE SPOILER



I've always found watching Poker on TV to be boring, and that's when I don't know who the winner is. Just think how boring it will be to watch knowing who wins the game.

#47 Spoon

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:46 PM

Reeling off a long winning streak in poker is far more plausible to me than doing it in baccarat. In poker, you could combine betting well on good hands with artful bluffing on poor hands, and keep winning in that fashion for a long time. (Sure, it'd take immense skill to pull it off, but this is Bond, right? :) However, in baccarat, like blackjack, you will lose at some point because you simply get dealt worse cards than the dealer. And there is really nothing that Bond or any other gambler in the world could do about that.

Edited by Spoon, 26 September 2005 - 04:50 PM.


#48 Jim

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:47 PM

Dear oh dear.

How vulgar (in every meaning of the word).

Perhaps they will play online - 22 year old rookie agent Jim Bond plays online poker all night and ends up at the end of the film, at 4 am, looking like 50ish year old Pierce Brosnan. During a lull in the game he downloads a pretty picture of Sienna Thing with her head pasted onto a pørnstar's body.

Uggy ugyy ugh ugh.

Perhaps there's a reason he never played poker so far in the films; it's a bit, well, common, frankly. He never played bridge in the films either but I suspect they'd never show that...

Thought the point of it being Baccarat was exactly that it was fluke, chance, no method, just fate.

What happened to making Bond aspirational? This is just far too...

...tangible.

#49 zencat

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:49 PM

[quote name='Spoon' date='26 September 2005 - 09:46']Reeling off a long winning streak in poker is far more plausible to me than doing it in baccarat.

#50 Kingdom Come

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:49 PM

Well that will be an interesting sequence. I'm very sure it will have millions riveted to their seats . . . they'll need to be. . . literally.

#51 Mister Asterix

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:51 PM

Reeling off a long winning streak in poker is far more plausible to me than doing it in baccarat.  In poker, you could combine betting well on good hands with artful bluffing on poor hands, and keep winning in that fashion for a long time.  (Sure, it'd take immense skill to pull it off, but this is Bond, right?  :)  However, in baccarat, like blackjack, you will lose at some point because you simply get dealt worse cards than the dealer.  And there is really nothing that Bond or any other gambler in the world could do about that.

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Excellent point, Spoon. When broken down Baccarat is just an advanced version of High Card. Not a terrible amount of skill needed.

#52 Jim

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 04:52 PM

[quote name='Mister Asterix' date='26 September 2005 - 16:51'][quote name='Spoon' date='26 September 2005 - 11:46']Reeling off a long winning streak in poker is far more plausible to me than doing it in baccarat.

#53 Bon-san

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 05:01 PM

Nice scoop, CBn! :)

My knee jerk reaction for one second was, "no, you can't change it."

But a few moments reflection, and I realize Hold 'em is a much more exciting game that takes guts, instinct and strategy. It's a hell of a lot of fun to play. BTW, it's not a new game, at all. Been around for eons.

I'm all in. :)

#54 Turn

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 05:12 PM

Perhaps they will play online - 22 year old rookie agent Jim Bond plays online poker all night and ends up at the end of the film, at 4 am, looking like 50ish year old Pierce Brosnan. During a lull in the game he downloads a pretty picture of Sienna Thing with her head pasted onto a pørnstar's body.

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Or if we're really lucky, they'll show how young Jim Bond is discovered by MI6 by being a brilliant card player online and will be recruited by the motherly M to defeat the notorious LeChiffre.

#55 ianfleming1

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 05:13 PM

Hold'em and weep. Casino Royale not so Royale.

#56 tdalton

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 05:15 PM

Hold'em and weep. Casino Royale not so Royale.

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How very true. This film is going to be Casino Royale in name only.

#57 Bryce (003)

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 05:17 PM

Actually, being no stranger to the VIP sections in Vegas, high stakes poker has as much style and elegance as baccarat. I've seen it played and played it and the tension and player vs. player aspect is far more demanding than wondering what cards have been played in a five deck shoe.

The trick will be to make sure the mass audience understands the basics of the game. Hopefully, we'll get a good but not long-winded explanation of it in the film. Much like the novel with Bond explaining it to Vesper and Mathis.

I think for a contemporary casino based thriller, the game makes sense. Bond likes baccarat, roulette and craps but we've seen it enough. DN, TB, OHMSS, FYEO, GE all have had Bond playing and winning. Hold'em would be something new. Not so much by trying to gain the younger crowd, but it's the hot game these days. I've been in Vegas five times this year and the action was all at the poker tables both on the casino floor and behind the velvet ropes and mostly being played by a black-tie crowd.

#58 zencat

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 05:19 PM

Actually, being no stranger to the VIP sections in Vegas, high stakes poker has as much style and elegance as baccarat. I've seen it played and played it and the tension and player vs. player aspect is far more demanding than wondering what cards have been played in a five deck shoe.

The trick will be to make sure the mass audience understands the basics of the game. Hopefully, we'll get a good but not long-winded explanation of it in the film. Much like the novel with Bond explaining it to Vesper and Mathis.

I think for a contemporary casino based thriller, the game makes sense. Bond likes baccarat, roulette and craps but we've seen it enough. DN, TB, OHMSS, FYEO, GE all have had Bond playing and winning. Hold'em would be something new. Not so much by trying to gain the younger crowd, but it's the hot game these days. I've been in Vegas five times this year and the action was all at the poker tables both on the casino floor and behind the velvet ropes and mostly being played by a black-tie crowd.

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There you go. What Bryce said. :)

And I think purists should at least be happy that this news confirms that a gambling scene is the major set-piece of Casino Royale. I mean, with the way some of the books have been adapted, it was possible we may not have even had that. YOLT without a Garden of Death? Can you imagine fan reaction to that if we had forums back in 67?

#59 ComplimentsOfSharky

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 05:25 PM

Actually, being no stranger to the VIP sections in Vegas, high stakes poker has as much style and elegance as baccarat. I've seen it played and played it and the tension and player vs. player aspect is far more demanding than wondering what cards have been played in a five deck shoe.

The trick will be to make sure the mass audience understands the basics of the game. Hopefully, we'll get a good but not long-winded explanation of it in the film. Much like the novel with Bond explaining it to Vesper and Mathis.

I think for a contemporary casino based thriller, the game makes sense. Bond likes baccarat, roulette and craps but we've seen it enough. DN, TB, OHMSS, FYEO, GE all have had Bond playing and winning. Hold'em would be something new. Not so much by trying to gain the younger crowd, but it's the hot game these days. I've been in Vegas five times this year and the action was all at the poker tables both on the casino floor and behind the velvet ropes and mostly being played by a black-tie crowd.

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Well, I guess coming from someone first hand, it seems a bit better. I'll take your word for it.

#60 Tarl_Cabot

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 05:27 PM

Very trendy.I'm not all that dissapointed I guess but...Bacarat is the classier less everyman game.Poker is more accessable.Looks like pandering or dumbing down...*sigh* Let's see the film and judge.