1894 replies to this topic

[Vauxhall]

It was probably something I should have picked up on before this point, but I really like the similar themes of "Voluntary Retirement" and "Mother". Nice bookends to the main body of the movie.

[The Shark]

It was probably something I should have picked up on before this point, but I really like the similar themes of "Voluntary Retirement" and "Mother". Nice bookends to the main body of the movie.

There's also one other variation in the film for the funeral scene, that might have been strengthened the album's thematic narrative.

With regards to the end credits music

Spoiler

Have to be honest and say I wasn't really a fan of this quickly mashed together suite. I would have preferred to hear the Adele song again somewhere in there - if only for nostalgia (yes, remember when the main-titles and end-titles used the same theme song? Would have been a nice nod). I personally feel they could have capitalised more on this track - but I suspect that's just me...

Agreed! or maybe an Adele remix, or an instrumental mixing JBT and Skyfall

Spoiler

It would have been great to hear part of an instrumental version of Let the Sky Fall when they arrive at the Skyfall.

Spoiler

Might have been a bit on-the-nose. I like what get. Hints of John Barry's LION IN WINTER (synth choir, solo oboe and English horn) submerged under frozen water.

[Vesper And Tracy]

Hate to say this but, other than some Barry (James Bond Theme) and Adele (Skyfall melody), there's little that's memorable here.

Arnorld may not be a Barry...but Newman does not trump Martin or Hamlish or even Kamen. Heck, he doesn't even trump the work done by Arnold for Tomorrow Never Dies, Casino Royale or Quantum Of Solace!

The Shanghai sequence, for instance, could have been way, WAY more flavourful than it was. Even 'Welcome To Baku' in TWINE was infinitely more enjoyable and memorable in it's ethnicity.

What a wasted opportunity!

I'm seeing the film again tonight (and tomorrow night too)...so, perhaps, Newman's non-Barry, non-Adele work will "grow on me".

Edited by Vesper And Tracy, 07 November 2012 - 01:40 PM.

[DamnCoffee]

I've got to say, that I absolutely love the Bond theme at the end of 'Someone Usually Dies' and 'Breadcrumbs'.

Edited by DamnCoffee, 07 November 2012 - 01:59 PM.

[Vesper And Tracy]

I've got to say, that I absolutely love the Bond theme at the end of 'Someone Usually Dies' and 'Breadcrumbs'.

But...but...Newman has nothing to do with the James Bond Theme, other than merely adding it where it's supposed to be added or where he's instructed/advised to add it.

I'm wondering or asking what's actually memorable about what Newman himself wrote for this James Bond film?

Ok, fine...I'm not looking for another On Her Majesty's Secret Service or You Only Live Twice ... but I don't even think Newman out-does Arnold in any way, shape or form.

Newman does an "ok job" only.

An "Ok Job" is fine for other movies...but it's simply not good enough for a series with such fine pedigree!

Edited by Vesper And Tracy, 07 November 2012 - 02:19 PM.

[DamnCoffee]

My comment was merely a statement and completely unrelated to your post.

[SecretAgentFan]

It´s very difficult for me to understand why people cannot appreciate the delicate awesomeness of Newman´s score.

[MattofSteel]

14 hours. I cannot wait to be able to chime in on this discussion more relevantly.

[Vesper And Tracy]

It´s very difficult for me to understand why people cannot appreciate the delicate awesomeness of Newman´s score.

My dear, fine fellow...

...Kindly enlighten me as i'm seeing it again tonite and tomorrow night.

I found it very difficult to find any non-Adele/non-Barry related melody or theme last night...so, could you please share with me which precise delicate awesomeness you're refering to.

Which scenes precisely should I be waiting with bated breath for where the score is any match for the delicate awesomeness of Roger Deakins' visuals or Sam Mendes' direction?

Question:

Do you honestly think Newman did Intro To Shanghai justice, for instance?

Edited by Vesper And Tracy, 07 November 2012 - 03:17 PM.

[DamnCoffee]

If you're referring to 'Shanghai Drive', I find it one of the best tracks on the soundtrack. Has a Tomorrow Never Dies/Resident Evil vibe to it, which i really like.

[Vesper And Tracy]

If you're referring to 'Shanghai Drive', I find it one of the best tracks on the soundtrack. Has a Tomorrow Never Dies/Resident Evil vibe to it, which i really like.

But is it a truly great or memorable track? It ought to have been.

(And if it's "one of the best" tracks but not truly "great", then what does that say about the rest of Newman's own contribution?)

I mean we're all entitled to our opinions so yours is no less valid than mine or anyone else's.

All I can say is i'll see the film twice more in less than 48 hours and give Shanghai Drive and everything else a keener listen with an open mind.

[SecretAgentFan]

It´s very difficult for me to understand why people cannot appreciate the delicate awesomeness of Newman´s score.

My dear, fine fellow...

...Kindly enlighten me as i'm seeing it again tonite and tomorrow night.

I found it very difficult to find any non-Adele/non-Barry related melody or theme last night...so, could you please share with me which precise delicate awesomeness you're refering to.

Which scenes precisely should I be waiting with bated breath for where the score is any match for the delicate awesomeness of Roger Deakins' visuals or Sam Mendes' direction?

Every scene, IMO.

Question:

Do you honestly think Newman did Intro To Shanghai justice, for instance?

Yes.

But it seems to me that you expect a traditional approach, the John Barry-sound.

[marktmurphy]

It´s very difficult for me to understand why people cannot appreciate the delicate awesomeness of Newman´s score.

My dear, fine fellow...

...Kindly enlighten me as i'm seeing it again tonite and tomorrow night.

I found it very difficult to find any non-Adele/non-Barry related melody or theme last night...so, could you please share with me which precise delicate awesomeness you're refering to.

Which scenes precisely should I be waiting with bated breath for where the score is any match for the delicate awesomeness of Roger Deakins' visuals or Sam Mendes' direction?

Question:

Do you honestly think Newman did Intro To Shanghai justice, for instance?

I did.
You seem to think that only melody works as a good soundtrack...?

[SecretAgentFan]

And the wonderful thing is: Newman´s score has so many great melodies!

[TheHouseholdCat]

But...but...Newman has nothing to do with the James Bond Theme, other than merely adding it where it's supposed to be added or where he's instructed/advised to add it.

I'm wondering or asking what's actually memorable about what Newman himself wrote for this James Bond film?

Ok, fine...I'm not looking for another On Her Majesty's Secret Service or You Only Live Twice ... but I don't even think Newman out-does Arnold in any way, shape or form.

Newman does an "ok job" only.

An "Ok Job" is fine for other movies...but it's simply not good enough for a series with such fine pedigree!

"Grand Bazaar, Istanbul" is absolutely fine by me. Same goes for the lush strings in "Komodo Dragon". The strings are the strongest part of the score. Great brass work, too. Not enough woodwinds, which usually are his thing.

It´s very difficult for me to understand why people cannot appreciate the delicate awesomeness of Newman´s score.

It´s very difficult for me to understand why people cannot appreciate the delicate awesomeness of Newman´s score.

Or how well it works in the film, because that's his job! The score worked so well on screen, I'm only able to listen to it now because it was so immersed with the images that I had no chance of giving them a good first listen. If that makes sense... The score does not distract from the images, which is the best a composer can achieve, but also adds some great emotions to particular scenes in the film.

Overall, the score is full of Newman's usual melancholy and this desire to get to a certain point musically, but somehow keeping itself back for the sake of the film. i.e. "Shawshank Redemption", which is one of the best things he has ever written. But surely this approach is not appropriate for Bond because only a small minority of old fans know what is "Bond" and what is not. Because they think they've got it all figured out and surely their expectations are what matters. I never expected much from Bond and I would have been very disappointed by most newer Bond films because they didn't capture the right Bond spirit.

"Severine" is also great, it's short but effective.

My dear, fine fellow...

...Kindly enlighten me as i'm seeing it again tonite and tomorrow night.

I found it very difficult to find any non-Adele/non-Barry related melody or theme last night...so, could you please share with me which precise delicate awesomeness you're refering to.

Which scenes precisely should I be waiting with bated breath for where the score is any match for the delicate awesomeness of Roger Deakins' visuals or Sam Mendes' direction?

Question:

Do you honestly think Newman did Intro To Shanghai justice, for instance?

I'm sorry to point this out, but Mendes' films wouldn't be as effective without Newman's scores. Not because he's such a bad director, but because Newman's music does what is needed for Mendes' films.

I love Barry's Bond scores, no doubt, but that doesn't mean I can't appreciate Newman's or Arnold's takes on Bond.

Edited by TheHouseholdCat, 07 November 2012 - 05:30 PM.

[marktmurphy]

And the wonderful thing is: Newman´s score has so many great melodies!

Yes, I think it does. They're subtler than yer usual Barry soundtrack, and some are more motifs or rhythms, but they all work. It's a lusher and actually quite Barry-like soundtrack in feel than I thought at first listen. It's big and brassy in a very Bond way.

[TheHouseholdCat]

And the wonderful thing is: Newman´s score has so many great melodies!

Yes, I think it does. They're subtler than yer usual Barry soundtrack, and some are more motifs or rhythms, but they all work. It's a lusher and actually quite Barry-like soundtrack in feel than I thought at first listen. It's big and brassy in a very Bond way.

He totally is the motifs guy. That's his strength. And the score definitely grows on you.

[x007AceOfSpades]

I was listening to it again last night, and it's definitely number 2, behind Michael Kamen's score for LTK. I love it, Newman did such a fantastic job on it.

[QuantumOfRoyale]

My thoughts on the score:

- "Grand Bazaar, Istanbul" and "The Bloody Shot" are both excellent action tracks, reminding me very much of John Powell's "Bourne Ultimatum" score. The Bond theme is used to perfection, and, as opposed to being overused as in Arnold's scores, it's used sparingly, but has a real presence and is chill-inducing when it is used.

- I love that M gets her own theme, and its used great in "Voluntary Retirement" and "Mother", the latter of which is extremely haunting, and invokes a level of emotion that was present in none of Arnold's scores, say, maybe Vesper's theme in CR.

- "Severine" is pretty good, not one of my favorites, but definitely very Barry-esque as many others have pointed out. It's alright, but as far as Bond girl themes go, it's not a touch on Vesper's theme from CR. I hear faint touches of ADELE's "Skyfall" as well, which leads me to wonder as to why Severine's theme couldn't have just been the instrumental version of "Skyfall", as hard at the beginning of "Komodo Dragon". That would've at least been more memorable.

- "Brave New World" is another awesome track, with the Bond theme used wonderfully at the beginning, and then leading into some brilliantly exotic fanfare, which could've possibly benefitted from the Bond theme as well, sort of like this soundtrack's "Blunt Instrument" from CR.

-The cue from "Shanghai Drive" and "Adrenaline" (Bond theme electronica?) is great, and is totally what I was expecting from Newman judging by the teaser trailer music. I almost wish we had gotten more of it. It also reminds me of Newman's score for "The Debt".

- "Jellyfish" is great. Brilliantly haunting after the initial action dies down, and the tension starts building.

- "Quartermaster" is a fun track. Reminds me of Newman's entertaining score for "WALL-E".

- "Komodo Dragon" is a real standout track on the soundtrack. Newman said in an interview that he had to be reminded to include an instrumental of ADELE's "Skyfall", and thank goodness he did. Evokes powerful imagery.

- "Tennyson" is beautiful.

- "Breadcrumbs" is better than "The Name's Bond...James Bond". Reminds me of FRWL's "James Bond With Bongos".

- "She's Mine", "The Moors", and "Deep Water", are arguably the most intense tracks in any Bond soundtrack ever. I haven't heard a Bond track this intense since DAF's "Slumber, Inc." Brilliant climax.

- "Old Dog, New Tricks" is another fun track, feeling like a callback to classic Barry.

Soundtrack Rating: A-

[The Shark]

- "Severine" is pretty good, not one of my favorites, but definitely very Barry-esque as many others have pointed out. It's alright, but as far as Bond girl themes go, it's not a touch on Vesper's theme from CR. I

Can't agree there. Vesper is childish, sentimental, depressing, leaden, and soul destroying. More suitable to TWILIGHT than Bond. If hell exists and it has a waiting room, that's what they play on the speakers.

[QuantumOfRoyale]

- "Severine" is pretty good, not one of my favorites, but definitely very Barry-esque as many others have pointed out. It's alright, but as far as Bond girl themes go, it's not a touch on Vesper's theme from CR. I

Can't agree there. Vesper is childish, sentimental, depressing, leaden, and soul destroying. More suitable to TWILIGHT than Bond. If hell exists and it has a waiting room, that's what they play on the speakers.

To each his own. I thought it worked very well on a thematic level, especially in "City of Lovers", "Death of Vesper", "What's Keeping You Awake", and "I Never Left". It was certainly the best Arnold Bond love theme. Although I understand that Arnold's stuff seems to be a touchy subject on here.

"Severine" was not bad by any stretch of the imagination , I just thought it was a little too subtle for my tastes. Like, I couldn't hum it or anything. With all that was great and memorable on the "Skyfall" soundtrack, it just didnt hold up as well.

And make no mistake, my friend, I've heard the Twilight scores. They are far worse than any Bond score yet BY FAR.

[The Shark]

To each his own. I thought it worked very well on a thematic level, especially in "City of Lovers", "Death of Vesper", "What's Keeping You Awake", and "I Never Left". It was certainly the best Arnold Bond love theme. Although I understand that Arnold's stuff seems to be a touchy subject on here.

Don't get my wrong. I like some of Arnold's love themes (Peaceful Fountains of Desire from DAD is probably favourite), it's just I think Vesper's theme is all wrong for Bond, let alone a Bond love story. Way too sappy and chick-flickish for my tastes.

Even Barry's most tender romantic cues had a masculinity that Vesper completely lacks.

"Severine" was not bad by any stretch of the imagination , I just thought it was a little too subtle for my tastes. Like, I couldn't hum it or anything. With all that was great and memorable on the "Skyfall" soundtrack, it just didnt hold up as well.

I guess its subtlety and harmonic complexity is why I liked it. It's ambiguous, sensual, erotic and doesn't hit you over the head like much of Arnold's (even non-action) stuff tends to do.

[QuantumOfRoyale]

To each his own. I thought it worked very well on a thematic level, especially in "City of Lovers", "Death of Vesper", "What's Keeping You Awake", and "I Never Left". It was certainly the best Arnold Bond love theme. Although I understand that Arnold's stuff seems to be a touchy subject on here.

Don't get my wrong. I like some of Arnold's love themes (Peaceful Fountains of Desire from DAD is probably favourite), it's just I think Vesper's theme is all wrong for Bond, let alone a Bond love story. Way too sappy and chick-flickish for my tastes.

Even Barry's most tender romantic cues had a masculinity that Vesper completely lacks.

"Severine" was not bad by any stretch of the imagination , I just thought it was a little too subtle for my tastes. Like, I couldn't hum it or anything. With all that was great and memorable on the "Skyfall" soundtrack, it just didnt hold up as well.

I guess its subtlety and harmonic complexity is why I liked it. It's ambiguous, sensual, erotic and doesn't hit you over the head like much of Arnold's (even non-action) stuff tends to do.

True. Although for the most part, I thought that Barry love themes were just more sweeping, romanticized versions of the title songs.

And I do agree with all of the reasons you do like it, I guess I just don't feel as strongly about it. Although, despite the complements I have paid Vesper's theme, much of Arnold's CR and QoS stuff (especially the action stuff) has gotten FAR worse to me in repeat viewings. Like, "Stairwell Fight" for example. At least, Arnold's earlier Bond work like TND was more focused.

But, bringing things back to topic, I'm certainly glad that others are enthusiastic about Newman's score as I am (:

[SecretAgentFan]

I must admit: I love Vesper´s theme, and it worked perfectly for me (am I a sappy old bastard, or what?) because it really sounds as if Barry could have written it (IMO).

But for Severine that approach would not have worked at all. Newman hits all the right notes for this film.

Edited by SecretAgentFan, 08 November 2012 - 06:17 AM.

[MattofSteel]

Just came out of the midnight screening.

Wow.

I'm going to dive into this in more detail, but Thomas Newman absolutely knocked that out of the park. Was it what I wanted? No. Was it still great, anyways?

Absolutely.

Every moment that needs to hit, hits. Every bit of classical 'Newman' sound that you wouldn't think works, works. It's a James Bond film, and it's a James Bond score. Hands down, in my opinion, one of the best non-Barry and non-Arnold works in the franchise.

[occhile007]

This might have already been answered, but was that David Arnold's Bond Theme at the end?

[x007AceOfSpades]

I thought Monty Norman theme was being used in the end.

[thecasinoroyale]

It sounded very David Arnold to me, the final theme.

I like the soundtrack but it doesn't sit that highly for me at the moment - I think I need to listen to it isolated, as it compliments the film well by blending in and not being too obvious.

My favourite part is still the rooftop battle on the Turkish train - those final few tense moments are fantastic.

Don't think I'm going to buy this one just yet.

[x007AceOfSpades]

Shame, thought I heard Norman's arrangement was used. Guess not.

[thecasinoroyale]

It may be, it just sounded very similar - the brass, the pace, the percussion - very similar to 'Casino Royale', but why would they use David Arnold's arrangement for the final scene and not Newman?

It must be Newman's, just sounds very similar in the style they have done it.