1894 replies to this topic

[MattofSteel]

Ah, cheers. That is indeed an odd choice.

Nevertheless, Newman says all the right things. Should put to rest any worries he's afraid of using the Bond theme or that it's not there in its usual capacity. Perhaps even more so than any other usage in the Craig era. Tony Lewis has said in recent Tweets it's most certainly present, and more 'ingrained' in Newman's score than given its own, definitive rendition.

I'm cool with that.

[The Shark]

Great to see the composer conducting his own score.

[junkanoo]

And listen to the cue itself after the buildup, when Bond charges through St. Mark's square. The music's vaguely Italian sounding, with not a hint of mental turmoil.

Well, if a track supported by a large orchestral with a lot of strings sounds Italian to you ... wait ... I know the problem you're got your tracks missed up. Here's your Italian strings.

Listen to some 19th Century Italian Opera (Puccini, Rossini, Bellini, Donizetti, Mascagni, Cherubini, Verdi etc.) and you'll hear what I mean.

It's a classic example of scoring the location but not the character. Something Barry deliberately avoided when it came to real drama.

Sorry, I was just listening to the YOLT soundtrack. What you saying about not scoring the location?

Read that last sentence again. I said real drama, which aside from the one moment with the death of Aki, is utterly absent from YOLT.

Oh, I read it correctly the first time and it's "utterly" not true. Besides The Death of Aki ... what exactly is Capsule In Space if not a really dramatic and location inspired track?

[JCRendle]

Well, this proves he does record the Bond theme.

[junkanoo]

Nevertheless, Newman says all the right things. Should put to rest any worries he's afraid of using the Bond theme or that it's not there in its usual capacity. Perhaps even more so than any other usage in the Craig era. Tony Lewis has said in recent Tweets it's most certainly present, and more 'ingrained' in Newman's score than given its own, definitive rendition.

I'm cool with that.

Would I like each composer to bring his own arrangement to the "James Bond Theme" ... sure. But, it's about the result. It's about supporting the film, first and foremost. So, yeah, I'm cool with that too.

[iexpectu2die]

Well, this proves he does record the Bond theme.

Does it? I'm just hearing David Arnold's version.

[delfloria]

Like I said before, it's as if they are establishing the Bond theme heard in CR as Craig's official verion of the theme. One that we might hear in all the upcoming Craig films. That would be fine with me because I like this arrangement.

[The Shark]

And listen to the cue itself after the buildup, when Bond charges through St. Mark's square. The music's vaguely Italian sounding, with not a hint of mental turmoil.

Well, if a track supported by a large orchestral with a lot of strings sounds Italian to you ... wait ... I know the problem you're got your tracks missed up. Here's your Italian strings.

Listen to some 19th Century Italian Opera (Puccini, Rossini, Bellini, Donizetti, Mascagni, Cherubini, Verdi etc.) and you'll hear what I mean.

It's a classic example of scoring the location but not the character. Something Barry deliberately avoided when it came to real drama.

Sorry, I was just listening to the YOLT soundtrack. What you saying about not scoring the location?

Read that last sentence again. I said real drama, which aside from the one moment with the death of Aki, is utterly absent from YOLT.

Oh, I read it correctly the first time and it's "utterly" not true. Besides The Death of Aki ... what exactly is Capsule In Space if not a really dramatic and location inspired track?

Dramatic yes like most of John Barry's Bond music, but it's not scoring anything as tragic as Aki's death, or Tracey's, Kerim Bey's, Mathis's, Vesper's, or even Ferrara's. I also can't hear how it's influenced by Japan.

[MattofSteel]

Like I said before, it's as if they are establishing the Bond theme heard in CR as Craig's official verion of the theme. One that we might hear in all the upcoming Craig films. That would be fine with me because I like this arrangement.

This.

[Mr_Wint]

Well, this proves he does record the Bond theme.

Really? I don't think the music they play is what you hear in this clip. It is just edited to look like that.

Very odd.

[junkanoo]

Dramatic yes like most of John Barry's Bond music, but it's not scoring anything as tragic as Aki's death, or Tracey's, Kerim Bey's, Mathis's, Vesper's, or even Ferrara's. I also can't hear how it's influenced by Japan.

It's not influenced by Japan, it's influenced by another location, that being space.

First, you say "real drama" is something Barry avoided, then it's only Aki's Death, now Capsule in Space is real drama but doesn't count because the astronaut's death isn't tragic enough of a death for you. Back-pedal much?

Edited by junkanoo, 16 October 2012 - 08:24 PM.

[marktmurphy]

Why didn´t the movies deserve Barry´s treatment?

C´mon, don´t be a snob.

I love the Bond films, but they're very nicely done adventure movies. They were lucky to get him for so long (and there's an argument of course that he was a very big key in their success) because he was so hugely talented. They're very high quality fluff; it's sort of like getting Sam Mendes to make eleven Bond movies!

[marktmurphy]

Dramatic yes like most of John Barry's Bond music, but it's not scoring anything as tragic as Aki's death, or Tracey's, Kerim Bey's, Mathis's, Vesper's, or even Ferrara's. I also can't hear how it's influenced by Japan.

It's not influenced by Japan, it's influenced by another location, that being space.

First, you say "real drama" is something Barry avoided, then it's only Aki's Death, now Capsule in Space is real drama but doesn't count because the astronaut's death isn't tragic enough of a death for you. Back-pedal much?

Capsule In Space builds to a big powerful, scary crescendo: but we don't know the astronaut. It's not an emotional moment for the audience. It's kind of scary for the viewer but we don't really shed a tear because we've barely even seen his face.
This is pretty straightforward stuff.

Real back-pedalling is when someone can't reply to a response to their comments about Bond films containing no drama; and yet then claim that YOLT is full of it

[PeteNeon]

Tony Lewis has said in recent Tweets it's most certainly present, and more 'ingrained' in Newman's score than given its own, definitive rendition.

Mmm, I don't think he was being specific about that. I read that as just "it's definitely in there throughout" rather than "it's subtler than previous scores."

[The Shark]

First, you say "real drama" is something Barry avoided, then it's only Aki's Death, now Capsule in Space is real drama but doesn't count because the astronaut's death isn't tragic enough of a death for you. Back-pedal much?

Thanks for that. I'm now reminded of the hilarious scenes in the first Austin Powers film where the wives of jumpsuited redshirts are informed of their husband's death.

As Mark said, they're anonymous NASA astronauts we've known for about 4 minutes of screentime. One of them gets his oxygen supply bitten off by Blofeld's SpacePenis. Big deal.

[gkgyver]

Well, this proves he does record the Bond theme.

Really? I don't think the music they play is what you hear in this clip. It is just edited to look like that.

Very odd.

Of course it's the Arnold recording over edited footage of Newman conducting.

[TheSilhouette]

Not surprising since apparently he had David Arnold's version licensed and used it the movie.

[SecretAgentFan]

Why didn´t the movies deserve Barry´s treatment?

C´mon, don´t be a snob.

I love the Bond films, but they're very nicely done adventure movies. They were lucky to get him for so long (and there's an argument of course that he was a very big key in their success) because he was so hugely talented. They're very high quality fluff; it's sort of like getting Sam Mendes to make eleven Bond movies!

No question about it: John Barry was a huge talent. But at the time he got the chance to do Bond his career had not reached those heights yet. Barry was lucky to get Bond - and vice versa. None is better than the other, IMO. They were just the perfect combination and went on to get even bigger.

And IMO it´s always just about a good film. The genre is not important. A good drama is not better than a good comedy or a good adventure film.

Also, a bad drama with a worthy theme is not better IMO than a great Bond film.

[The Shark]

And IMO it´s always just about a good film. The genre is not important. A good drama is not better than a good comedy or a good adventure film.

Also, a bad drama with a worthy theme is not better IMO than a great Bond film.

This.

[marktmurphy]

Why didn´t the movies deserve Barry´s treatment?

C´mon, don´t be a snob.

I love the Bond films, but they're very nicely done adventure movies. They were lucky to get him for so long (and there's an argument of course that he was a very big key in their success) because he was so hugely talented. They're very high quality fluff; it's sort of like getting Sam Mendes to make eleven Bond movies!

No question about it: John Barry was a huge talent. But at the time he got the chance to do Bond his career had not reached those heights yet. Barry was lucky to get Bond - and vice versa. None is better than the other, IMO. They were just the perfect combination and went on to get even bigger.

Yeah but they were very lucky that he wanted to stay onboard for so long. A few crew members may have been around from 62-87 but no other enormously important creatives (not including Cubby as he was the company!). He's as important as any director or lead actor, and they didn't hang around for twenty five years.

[SecretAgentFan]

But they did not force him to stay. Barry knew that his association with Bond would bring him continued fame and money - something other projects not necessarily would offer.

Let´s face it: film composers are at the bottom of the business´s food chain.

[marktmurphy]

But they did not force him to stay.

Ugh; I know- hence they were lucky.

Barry knew that his association with Bond would bring him continued fame and money - something other projects not necessarily would offer.

So did Sean Connery.

Let´s face it: film composers are at the bottom of the business´s food chain.

?

[The Shark]

Let´s face it: film composers are at the bottom of the business´s food chain.

You know this how?

[SecretAgentFan]

Experience - I'm a screenwriter and I know how composers are treated. Even worse than writers...

[MattofSteel]

Being a writer myself, I can't imagine that's possible...

[junkanoo]

Experience - I'm a screenwriter and I know how composers are treated. Even worse than writers...

Yes and no. Certainly, some have had 3 weeks (or less) to pull a full score together. Even Hitch made fun of the composer's task 'under the gun' so to speak in his film Rear Window. However, while some composers may have been slighted in the process, it sure beats a lot of occupations. I remember Randy Newman comparing film composition to working in a coal mine. He's got some nerve.

[SecretAgentFan]

It might be safer and physically less strenuous. But psychologically composers (like writers) constantly live on the edge (of being fired and screamed at and being treated like an idiot while having to listen to idiotic ideas).

[QOS4EVER]

Have you taken being a screenwriter as a profession, or just as a hobby ?

[The Shark]

You're either a screenwriter or you're not. I'm dead sure SAF is.

[MattofSteel]

It might be safer and physically less strenuous. But psychologically composers (like writers) constantly live on the edge (of being fired and screamed at and being treated like an idiot while having to listen to idiotic ideas).

It's true. And then you think, "Wait, what makes me so special that I can deem someone else's perspective idiotic?" And then they illustrate their perspective. And then you think, "Nope, I was right the first time. This is going to suck."