772 replies to this topic

[dinovelvet]

In response to being PM-ed, I must declare that I don't have a lot of spare time for this at the moment. If anyone wants to pick up where I left off, be my guest. But don't touch my booze.

[coco1997]

Fair enough. It's happened to all of us at some point in time.

Did you have at least an idea of how to finish the chase sequence?

[coco1997]

All right, guys. I talked to dino and decided that instead of picking up where he left off with "YOLT", we will move on to "TMWTGG" with the hopes that dino will be able to return to "YOLT" some time in the foreseeable future.

That being said, what kinds of ideas does everyone have for "TMWTGG"?

- Casting ideas?
- New locations?
- Action sequences?

Here are a few ideas I've had for a while regarding two of the bigger parts:


Javier Bardem as Francisco Scaramanga


Yvonne Strahovski as Mary Goodnight

[tdalton]

I think we're pretty much on the same wavelength regarding those two roles. Bardem was going to be my suggestion for Scaramanga as well, and, as we've discussed several times before for several different stories over the course of the project, Strahovski is perfect as Mary Goodnight.

[dinovelvet]

All right, guys. I talked to dino and decided that instead of picking up where he left off with "YOLT", we will move on to "TMWTGG" with the hopes that dino will be able to return to "YOLT" some time in the foreseeable future.

That being said, what kinds of ideas does everyone have for "TMWTGG"?

- Casting ideas?
- New locations?
- Action sequences?

I figured the main locations would be around the Caribbean, like the book. The main story of Scaramanga cornering the sugar market is pretty uninspiring as far as cinematic plots go. The obvious substitution would be to have him running a drug empire, but then again that's probably too obvious and cliche, and Bond has taken on a latino drug lord before. One notion I had was, if using a Caribbean setting, Scaramanga could be participating in human trafficking (in the novel we first see Scaramanga in a brothel, this could be one of the places he does business with!)

My other suggestion would be to give Scaramanga a girlfriend, perhaps with the same love slave motif as the film, and she should be played by Eva Mendes (she's Cuban!)

[coco1997]

Human trafficking is an interesting concept.

And regarding Scaramanga's girlfriend, SamKevlar had the idea that we could take the subtext of the book and make Scaramanga gay. So perhaps Mendes' character could simply be Scaramanga's "beard", something which Bond would learn from his interaction with her.

[tdalton]

[edit]

[coco1997]

Another couple ideas to throw out there:

The PTS: Following the events of "YOLT", Bond is captured by the North Koreans during a huge tsunami that strikes Japan and sent to kill M. The film opens parallel to the PTS of "CR" (an even more poignant parallel if this is to be Craig's last film--assuming we recast for the next few) with Bond, brainwashed, having broken into M's flat, and waiting to kill her. Rather than cutting to flashbacks of Bond's first kill a la "CR", the standoff is intercut with flashbacks of Bond's torture and brainwashing at the hands of Colonel Sun & the North Koreans. The PTS ends with some sort of SWAT team, having been alerted by M, storming M's flat and subduing Bond before he can do any harm to his superior. Cut to titles.

Speaking of titles, who should sing the theme tune? Is it too late to give old Alice Cooper another shot?

[tdalton]

Another couple ideas to throw out there:

The PTS: Following the events of "YOLT", Bond is captured by the North Koreans during a huge tsunami that strikes Japan and sent to kill M. The film opens parallel to the PTS of "CR" (an even more poignant parallel if this is to be Craig's last film--assuming we recast for the next few) with Bond, brainwashed, having broken into M's flat, and waiting to kill her. Rather than cutting to flashbacks of Bond's first kill a la "CR", the standoff is intercut with flashbacks of Bond's torture and brainwashing at the hands of Colonel Sun & the North Koreans. The PTS ends with some sort of SWAT team, having been alerted by M, storming M's flat and subduing Bond before he can do any harm to his superior. Cut to titles.

Speaking of titles, who should sing the theme tune? Is it too late to give old Alice Cooper another shot?

Assuming that we're going to follow this up at some point with at least parts of the version of TSWLM that we've been working on, I think that we should keep Craig at least through that particular story since the relationship between Goodnight and Bond gets its beginnings in TMWTGG. It might be a bit jarring to begin that relationship here with Craig and then finish it off a film or two later with a different actor in the role.

I like the idea of having the room swarmed by some kind of team of agents and relocating it to M's flat, but I think that Bond should take a shot at M and have her saved by some kind of gadgetry built into her home office, kind of like how they had the glass barrier in the novel that saved M. I also think that Moneypenny should be there as well so she can play into the "something's not quite right" feel that the scene should possess.

[coco1997]

Good point. It had slipped my mind that Goodnight would carry over to the next one, and that it wouldn't feel right to have a new Bond in the part for that exact reason.

What does everyone think about using Nick Nack? I figured he might be too silly of a henchman to try to reimagine, but you never know...

This is what the cast looks like so far:

James Bond 007...Daniel Craig
Francisco Scaramanga...Javier Bardem
Mary Goodnight...Yvonne Strahovski
Andrea Anders...Eva Mendes
Felix Leiter...Jeffrey Wright
M...Judi Dench
Sir James Moloney...Benedict Cumberbatch
Moneypenny...Anna Friel
Bill Tanner...Rory Kinnear (possibly to replace Dench as M by the film's end?)

[Mr. Blofeld]

This isn't terminus's game; this is dino's -- the former runs the regular UBs, while the latter runs the Remakes.

[coco1997]

Does anyone know what happened to terminus ??

Just so you guys know, this is one of my favorite threads to read. Even though I don't always comment on it. It shows the spirit of entrepeneurism in it, and I like that. I can't get into those novel writers......so full of themselves.....

Now, now, Pamela, don't put down the novelists. There is a true intensity involved in their craft and this is simply a different style of writing. We're not doing fully detailed stories or scripts here, but rather trying to produce treatments that give a satisfying account of what these stories would be like were they ever realized on the big screen.

And big kudos to tdalton for assembling most of the treatments for this project thus far.

A few more ideas:

* At some point we could use the Terrafugia flying car. It's less ridiculous-looking than the one from the original film and hey, it actually flies.
* The film ends with an offer of knighthood for 007 by the Royal Family. Could this be an opportunity for a cameo by Prince William and Kate Middleton?

Something else to consider: Is there anything (besides the inclusion of Andrea Anders) from the original film that we want to hold over to our modern-day remake?

Matt, do you have any ideas of your own?

[dinovelvet]

Something else to consider: Is there anything (besides the inclusion of Andrea Anders) from the original film that we want to hold over to our modern-day remake?

[coco1997]

I was hoping no one would say that, dino.

We also need to nail down the locations we want to use. Here's a list I've compiled:

Cuba
Mexico
Jamaica
Spain
Portugal
Iran (it was originally scouted as a location for TMWTGG, although I'm not sure if it was meant to stand in as another country)

Though if anyone has any off-the-wall, out of left field choices for locations, feel free to toss them out there.

[tdalton]

I think we should keep Jamaica at least for the ending. One change I would suggest for the ending would be to not have Scaramanga injure himself on the escape from the train so that he and Bond can have a truly intense showdown in the swamp.

[coco1997]

I think we should keep Jamaica at least for the ending. One change I would suggest for the ending would be to not have Scaramanga injure himself on the escape from the train so that he and Bond can have a truly intense showdown in the swamp.

Works for me. I get chills picturing how downright awesome Craig and Bardem would be in the climax of their characters' showdown, with Scaramanga begging Bond mercy long enough to mutter one last Catholic prayer and then double-crossing Bond before 007 kills him unflinchingly.

I'll provide some of the more memorable lines from the book to stay somewhat true to the Fleming novel, although we don't have to go overboard with dialogue.

Another idea SamKevlar suggested would be that Bond and Scaramanga have some sort of history together prior to the events of the film. Initially Scaramanga and Bond would be assigned to a case together, but Scaramanga either already has plans of his own or sees the opportunity in taking control of the scheme of the minor villain they're sent to stop. And perhaps Bond and Scaramanga knew each other at Eton, Fettes, or university?

And if Bardem does end up getting cast in B23, we could always go back and change the casting when we're through.

[dinovelvet]

Another idea SamKevlar suggested would be that Bond and Scaramanga have some sort of history together prior to the events of the film. Initially Scaramanga and Bond would be assigned to a case together, but Scaramanga either already has plans of his own or sees the opportunity in taking control of the scheme of the minor villain they're sent to stop. And perhaps Bond and Scaramanga knew each other at Eton, Fettes, or university?

Ehh I don't like it. Why should they have history together? What does it add? There's already a connection between the two men, they're both assassins but S. is living life on his terms whereas Bond is doing it on someone else's orders. That's enough of an angle to explore without turning it into Goldeneye part deux.

Cuba
Mexico
Jamaica
Spain
Portugal
Iran (it was originally scouted as a location for TMWTGG, although I'm not sure if it was meant to stand in as another country)

What part would Spain and Portugal play in this?

[coco1997]

Ehh I don't like it. Why should they have history together? What does it add? There's already a connection between the two men, they're both assassins but S. is living life on his terms whereas Bond is doing it on someone else's orders. That's enough of an angle to explore without turning it into Goldeneye part deux.

Fair enough. Although, if we are to make Scaramanga gay, the idea of them having a history together and Bond being quite aware of Scaramanga's proclivities could add an interesting dimension to their relationship, making it a mix of physical attraction, professional admiration and simple jealousy.

What part would Spain and Portugal play in this?

No idea. I was just throwing out random locations to spark some ideas since we've had a history of relocating parts of the films in the past (South Africa and Bouvet Island in "DN", China in "FRWL", Dubai in "GF", etc.).

[dinovelvet]

What part would Spain and Portugal play in this?

No idea. I was just throwing out random locations to spark some ideas since we've had a history of relocating parts of the films in the past (South Africa and Bouvet Island in "DN", China in "FRWL", Dubai in "GF", etc.).

I see. Well if the bulk of the film is to take place in the Caribbean, then maybe things should start off post-credits with a colder/non-sunny place. Spain and Portugal are pretty Caribbean-looking places (indeed, DAD used Cadiz as a substitute for Cuba).

[coco1997]

Any ideas?

[dinovelvet]

Any ideas?

Well I don't know what the story is all about, yet...though if the post-credits scenes involve Bond being deprogrammed or un-brainwashed, maybe that can happen at the good old MI6 evaluation center in The Falkands.

[Mr. Blofeld]

Rather than starting with Bond being abducted, why not intercut it, at first, with Bond in M's flat? It'd be sort of a mixture of QOS and CR...

[coco1997]

Rather than starting with Bond being abducted, why not intercut it, at first, with Bond in M's flat? It'd be sort of a mixture of QOS and CR...

That's the plan. The abduction will (presumably) be the last scene of "YOLT", and the opening of "TMWTGG" would have Bond waiting to assassinate M in her flat.

Speaking of M, what's the consensus on whether or not to replace her at the end of the film?

[tdalton]

Rather than starting with Bond being abducted, why not intercut it, at first, with Bond in M's flat? It'd be sort of a mixture of QOS and CR...

That's the plan. The abduction will (presumably) be the last scene of "YOLT", and the opening of "TMWTGG" would have Bond waiting to assassinate M in her flat.

Speaking of M, what's the consensus on whether or not to replace her at the end of the film?

I agree that we should operate as though the kidnapping would be the ending of YOLT and that the beginning of TMWTGG would be Bond's assassination attempt on M. I think that just leaving the beginning of the film entirely taking place within M's flat would be the way to go, rather than cutting away to more shots of Bond's kidnapping. Keeping it as one continuous scene would help to give it the sense of "something's not right here" that the scene should possess. I think that if we cut away to shots of Bond being kidnapped, it takes away from that a bit.

I do think, however, that the scenes after the fact, perhaps when M is interrogating Bond as to what has happened to him, that that would be the time for some cutaway shots to Bond's kidnapping and incarceration.

[SamuelKevlar]

Hey all. Haven't checked in in a while, thought I'd wait to read the completed YOLT, now I see we're straight into TMWTGG.

coco1997's already been kind enough to bring up some of my ideas, but I'll post what I PM'd here in full:

What ideas I have for TMWTGG pretty much centre around the character of Scaramanga himself. So that shouldn't influence your ideas on how Bond gets into enemy hands, brainwashed etc. Basically my concept of him is two-fold.

One, he's a government assassin. Maybe Spanish, maybe Cuban, maybe some other nation (probably Latin American). He's the same age as Bond, maybe a little younger (as in the book), in some ways as good as him, probably a better marksman. As with 007, the reputation of 'the man with the golden gun' preceeds him. Initially he and Bond are assigned to a case together, but Scaramanga either already has plans of his own or sees the opportunity in taking control of the scheme of the minor villain they're sent to stop. I don't see him as the evil-lair type.

And two, he's undeniably, unapologetically gay. Let's make the (debated) subtext of the novel text. Scaramanga may have a 'kept boy' stashed away somewhere a la Andrea Anders, or a whole string of male conquests a la the Bond girls. It also adds a different element to his relationship with Bond, a mix of physical attraction, professional admiration and simple jealousy. Apparently Fleming got the name Scaramanga from a George Ambrose Scaramanga, with whom he maintained a rivalry at Eton. Perhaps Bond and Scaramanga knew each other at Eton, Fettes, or university?

I can understand the 006 comparison but I think that they're different enough, especially if we drop the childhood familiarity angle. They work for different secret services from different countries (maybe if it is Cuba or Venezuela, not the friendliest of countries), and for the first third or half of the film Bond is working with the villain instead of thinking him dead after the PTS.

I introduce the idea of a minor villain/issue (although it won't feel minor in the briefing) in the vein of Hai Fat/the Solex. I got the impression that these films are at least partly remakes of the original films rather than the books. As a bridge between the two, the actual plot of this minor villain could involve sugar/drug running. The concept of a criminal syndicate consisting of disparate groups as in the novel puts me in mind of Quantum/SPECTRE, maybe left-overs after the fall of Blofeld? Perhaps Scaramanga sees the opportunity to consolidate these criminal elements under his own leadership (think LA Confidential), or he's just out for a quick buck and a foreign agent like Bond who's recently been proven unstable to blame his actions on (and conveniently kill off, naturally) is like mana from heaven for him.

Javier Bardem is an excellent choice for Scaramanga, although he is increasingly likely to feature in Bond 23 so that might be a bit weird. Alternatively I'd suggest Antonio Banderas or, if we go younger than Bond as in the book, Rodrigo Santoro or Gael Garcia Bernal.

Edited by SamuelKevlar, 13 April 2011 - 01:17 AM.

[coco1997]

All very interesting ideas. I support them, so long as everyone else gives the green light.

Sam, do you have any other ideas for different locations we could use?

Perhaps the 'minor villain' could be Colonel Sun, who dino suggested could be the one to orchestrate Bond's kidnapping and brainwashing? Rather than tackling that story in a whole separate treatment, we could try to work in elements of that story into this one.

And what are some action scenes we could try to work into the story? I'm currently re-reading the book and it's fairly slow.

[SamuelKevlar]

I approve of the Colonel Sun idea, although I'm not too familiar with the novel. Bond and Scaramanga could be assigned to the same case because the Cuban/Venezuelan/whatever head of intelligence has similarly been attacked, perhaps this time succesfully. Scaramanga could be introduced straight after the titles, pursuing and killing the brainwashed agent who's just killed their boss. The guy is escaping over rooftops, disappearing fast, but Scaramanga takes careful aim with his golden gun and delivers a headshot. Alternatively it could be a more down-to-earth sequence, a la Casino Royale - two agents suiting up, preparing to investigate who's killed their boss last night. Scaramanga finishes putting his golden gun together, turns and promptly shoots the other guy. He's already figured out it was him.

Action sequences, well, I think that depends largely on locations. I do like the idea of it culminating in a drawn-out shoot-out/hand-to-hand fight between Bond and Scaramanga - what we wanted but didn't get in the original film. This could be on the train, in the swamp, first one then the other, or somewhere else entirely.

In the novel Scaramanga's background is in the circus. This doesn't have to be the case here but we could feature one as a reference. It could be a Cirque du Soleil type affair - a surreal environment, people in masks, ideal place for a meeting/assassination (like the kickboxing match in the original film where Andrea is killed). Or it could be a more traditional circus where someone is locked in a cage with a lion.

In the book the young Scaramanga was close to a circus elephant - when it rampaged and was shot by a policeman, he killed the cop in retaliation with a single bullet to the eye. Maybe our Scaramanga can't stand animals being hurt - like Sanchez, he's a man with his own code of honour. Perhaps he hurts or kills a minor bad guy who shoots a bird for fun - as Fleming villains were wont to do. It's also a 'respect the gun' sort of thing, never waste a bullet, only kill when necessary.

Edited by SamuelKevlar, 13 April 2011 - 02:16 AM.

[coco1997]

I love your idea of a post-credits scene with Scaramanga killing the turncoat who attacked their boss. The lower-key action scene is what I'd choose.

And the idea of a suspenseful scene centered around the Cirque du Soleil would fight right in in a Bond film!

Human trafficking is also a big problem in China. Maybe we could tie this into Sun's character somehow.

EDIT: Also, since we're making Scaramanga gay (I presume), we'd have to think of a role for Andrea. Perhaps we could combine hers and Nick Nack's roles and have her simply be Scaramanga's servant?

[SamuelKevlar]

Cheers for the support! I like both versions of the scene. If we got with the latter, I would like to showcase Scaramanga's expert marksmanship at some other point in the film. And I really like the idea of Colonel Sun dabbling in human trafficking. That in itself wouldn't be enough for Scaramanga to 'turn' though. I reckon there has to be some grand, one-off payday that takes his fancy.

Well, I figured the Andrea character would just be turned into a guy (maybe played by Diego Luna - unless Scaramanga is played by Gael Garcia Bernal because they've already been there, done that), complete with having it off before a kill/mission and such. He could be killed at some point because he flipped for Bond as in the original film, but I'm not sure if that would work because the dynamic is different (not least because Bond wouldn't be seducing him). He could be a henchman/guard/trainee of Scaramanga as well as his lover. Some of Scaramanga's ideas on what a gun is and how it should be used - his philosophy - could come out in a conversation between them as part of training/foreplay. Then at the end this guy (let's call him Julio) could face off with Mary Goodnight while Bond and Scaramanga have their final fight.

If we want to have Eva Mendez in the film she could indeed be an associate of Scaramanga's, perhaps a fellow agent. Bond can assume initially that they're together - depending on how repressive the country they're from is he may use her, as already suggested, as a 'beard'. She (we could still call her Andrea, though Anders is a bit Scandinavian) could do the required flipping and be killed in the circus.

[coco1997]

Sounds good. If we decide to not cast Bardem as Scaramanga, then one of the leftover casting choices could fill the part of Scaramanga's henchman.

So as I see it, here's what we have so far:

London
* M's flat - Bond attempts to kill M in her flat but is thwarted by some sort of gadget/defense system built into M's home.

TITLES:

Unknown location
* Francisco Scaramanga and another Cuban (?) agent team up to go after the man who recently perpetrated an attack on their superior, but Scaramanga knows it's the other agent and promptly shoots him.

Falkland Islands
* Bond is 'deprogrammed' by Sir James Molony and as a test to prove himself, is teamed up with Cuban agent Francisco Scaramanga to go after a human trafficking ring linked to the Chinese Colonel Sun.

Jamaica/Cuba
* Over the course of the film, we are introduced to Double-0 in training Mary Goodnight (Yvonne Strahovski) who develops an affection for Bond, as well as Scaramanga's right-hand man, Julio (Diego Luna), and a colleague of Scaramanga's, Andrea Anders (Eva Mendes--and let's think of a more Cuban surname). Andrea is eventually killed in a Cirque du Soleil-styled meeting place because she's 'turned' for Bond. Eventually, Scaramanga hatches nefarious plans to take out Colonel Sun and seize control of the trafficking ring.

Finale
* Following a sequence aboard a train, Bond and Scaramanga hunt each other through swamplands while Goodnight takes on Julo.

Granted, these are very rough ideas, but they give a general idea of the direction the story seems to be taking.