'Another Way To Die' or 'No Good About Goodbye'?
#31
Posted 14 November 2009 - 02:52 AM
I'm really shocked at how well the cut version fits the title sequence.
#32
Posted 14 November 2009 - 03:50 AM
#33
Posted 14 November 2009 - 05:41 AM
#34
Posted 14 November 2009 - 08:28 AM
but I loved YKMN and would choose it even over, say, All Time High. So I don't think the age thing really works.
I think there's a certain amount of 'loyalty', for want of a better word, among some fans for the existing film (Quantum) and for DC, whom they perhaps associate with the W/K song. That's the only way I can explain this tragic poll result. Honestly, that anyone actually likes the White mess is currently the greatest mystery to me. Bar none.
#35
Posted 14 November 2009 - 08:29 AM
#36
Posted 14 November 2009 - 08:41 AM
AWTD for me as well. It's nice and refreshing, and in my opinion a really great rock song. While I have nothing against NGAG, it's just too generic for my liking.
#37
Posted 14 November 2009 - 08:52 AM
I don't know how much it has to do with age. I would like Winehouse to do the next theme and her sound is very retro.
I would say Another Way To Die is pretty retro itself. But using something along the lines of No Good About Goodbye wouldn't have been merely retro but retrogressive.
#38
Posted 14 November 2009 - 01:53 PM
Jack White and Keys warbling represents everything that is wrong with QOS....Absolute Garbarge....The best thing about QOS is the track that never made the film.....says alot really
#39
Posted 14 November 2009 - 02:28 PM
I'm still waiting for the inevitable mash-up of "No Good About Goodbye" with the QUANTUM OF SOLACE title sequence.
I did actully try it, and it does kind of work. You would have to edit the song to make if fit into the time legnth of the title sequence.
I am 23 and I prefere NGAG. Mainly becuase I so much wanted Dame Bassey to sing the title song for QOS. It seems to fit the TS wonderfully and most of all its got that 'Bond Sound' more than AWTD ever had. The producers should really let Arnold be in control of the title songs. He knows how to capture the Bond sound that Barry had established and he does a fantastic job on weaving the title song into the score of the film. If only Bassey had perfomed 'I Will Return'
#40
Posted 14 November 2009 - 03:04 PM
Thanks for this. As I thought, it actually makes the titles much, much better (though they're still relatively c**p compared to Kleinman's work).
Try listening NGAG with the titles of CR, I think it's even better fit than this.
#41
Posted 14 November 2009 - 03:19 PM
#42
Posted 14 November 2009 - 03:30 PM
Best post on this thread. Couldn't of said it better myselfAWTD easily, this Bassey thing is ok but it's just generic Bond soundalike, which I suspect some would be quite happy with.
It's not the 60's you know!
#43
Posted 14 November 2009 - 04:47 PM
#44
Posted 14 November 2009 - 06:51 PM
I've actually always preferred Barry's instrumental versions, I don't dislike Bassey but alongside Tom Jones the tunes without their warbling always sound better, to me at least.
I will say I am a big Jack White fan and that may swing me a little biased but there you go!
#45
Posted 14 November 2009 - 07:13 PM
It sure is, in its own way, and it nicely approaches retro without going the whole hog to period piece. I imagine Winehouse's almost-was song would have attempted a similar kind of balance (like her song "Love is a Losing Game," which would have been a nice title song for a Bond film, if you ask me). It's certainly not run-of-the-mill contemporary, that's for sure.Do you not think AWTD is itself a bit retro though?
Shame that it's not any good.
#46
Posted 14 November 2009 - 07:44 PM
Nowadays Bond producers don't need to give a about the financial success of a Bond film. Being risky is hot at the moment with famous movie franchises. And especially the most well-known movie franchises have big...VERY big marketing machines under their belt. I saw this with 'Quantum Of Solace'. While many fans at first ALWAYS show big support for whatever Bond film is premiering (they...usually lack a certain critical objective perspective), the more ordinary cinema go-ers want a bit more of the nostalgic Bond feel that made the franchise big. In all honesty...my best friends who are no fans were quite disappointed in the film.
This could be a pivotal problem of the current approach for producing Bond films. So far, films like 'Quantum Of Solace' can thrive on these big marketing efforts. But ordinary cinema-go-ers are not crazy. And the Bond franchise can not survive solely on marketing efforts and trendfollowing risks. In the end the Bond franchise is also succesful because cinema go-ers EXPECT something from a Bond film! They don't go to a Bond film to expect something completely new and original....
So the most wise thing to do for Bond 23 is stepping away from the so called 'QOS-approach'. Inject the franchise with some more recognizable Bond vibe, and stop copying other succesful franchises like Jason Bourne. The alternative theme song 'No Good About Goodbye', while not fitting perfectly in 'Quantum Of Solace', should be the driving force for the music for Bond 23. It's time to throw away all these rockers and their ghastly attempts...time to bring some romancy and jazz back in the Bond music department...
And THAT'S the reason why I voted for 'No Good About Goodbye'. Sure it doesn't fit the newest Bond film, but it sure is a better composed song, with lots more unforgettable melody in it. And THAT'S Bond for me...when talking about Bond music.
PS: Watch the main titles for 'Moonraker' while playing the song 'No Good About Goodbye'. Perfect! And here's another discussion topic! Bring back Daniel Kleinman and let him make main titles that have a slow-tempo pace in it. I....don't like the 'QOS' titles....way too fuzzy and unclear...
Edited by Gustav Graves, 14 November 2009 - 08:04 PM.
#47
Posted 14 November 2009 - 07:46 PM
Age 51 - Bassey (of course)
but I loved YKMN and would choose it even over, say, All Time High. So I don't think the age thing really works.
I think there's a certain amount of 'loyalty', for want of a better word, among some fans for the existing film (Quantum) and for DC, whom they perhaps associate with the W/K song. That's the only way I can explain this tragic poll result. Honestly, that anyone actually likes the White mess is currently the greatest mystery to me. Bar none.
How anyone can like a bland Bassey tune simply because Bassey is singing it Baffles me.
we all have our preferences. i love Bassey i think history repeating is just a killer song. this one is just so blah and bland it just. It's almost like "well we don;'t know how to write a bond theme song for today's time so we're just gonna though every Bond theme Cliche into a vat and see what happens."
#48
Posted 14 November 2009 - 08:24 PM
AWTD fits better with the titles but the titles (IMO) suck, so I really prefer NGAG: I choose SHIRLEY BASSEY and DON BLACK over Alicia Keys & Jack White. They have made History with capital letter in Bond's onscreen life.
I've liked AWTD, but I really prefer NGAG over it.
#49
Posted 14 November 2009 - 09:12 PM
BTW I'm 37.
#50
Posted 14 November 2009 - 09:23 PM
You spineless bastard! You must choose a side now, and you must defend that side to the death!Any way that I can vote for both? Because I really like both of them...
1. Yes, lets make the films fit the title songs. That sounds like a good idea.The Bond franchise should dance for us, not we for them! I do agree with everyone here that 'No Good About Goodbye' doesn't fit in the style of the actual film. That's a fact. But there in lies the problem of the entire film IMO. 'Quantum Of Solace' as a film should fit in the style of Bassey's song 'No Good About Goodbye', NOT the other way around. Just read the reactions on this forum, but also the reactions on YouTube.
Nowadays Bond producers don't need to give a about the financial success of a Bond film. Being risky is hot at the moment with famous movie franchises. And especially the most well-known movie franchises have big...VERY big marketing machines under their belt. I saw this with 'Quantum Of Solace'. While many fans at first ALWAYS show big support for whatever Bond film is premiering (they...usually lack a certain critical objective perspective), the more ordinary cinema go-ers want a bit more of the nostalgic Bond feel that made the franchise big. In all honesty...my best friends who are no fans were quite disappointed in the film.
This could be a pivotal problem of the current approach for producing Bond films. So far, films like 'Quantum Of Solace' can thrive on these big marketing efforts. But ordinary cinema-go-ers are not crazy. And the Bond franchise can not survive solely on marketing efforts and trendfollowing risks. In the end the Bond franchise is also succesful because cinema go-ers EXPECT something from a Bond film! They don't go to a Bond film to expect something completely new and original....
So the most wise thing to do for Bond 23 is stepping away from the so called 'QOS-approach'. Inject the franchise with some more recognizable Bond vibe, and stop copying other succesful franchises like Jason Bourne. The alternative theme song 'No Good About Goodbye', while not fitting perfectly in 'Quantum Of Solace', should be the driving force for the music for Bond 23. It's time to throw away all these rockers and their ghastly attempts...time to bring some romancy and jazz back in the Bond music department...
And THAT'S the reason why I voted for 'No Good About Goodbye'. Sure it doesn't fit the newest Bond film, but it sure is a better composed song, with lots more unforgettable melody in it. And THAT'S Bond for me...when talking about Bond music.
PS: Watch the main titles for 'Moonraker' while playing the song 'No Good About Goodbye'. Perfect! And here's another discussion topic! Bring back Daniel Kleinman and let him make main titles that have a slow-tempo pace in it. I....don't like the 'QOS' titles....way too fuzzy and unclear...
2. Am I crazy or have the Craig films grossed more (including inflation) than any two of Brosnan? Of course you might just explain that away as the result of good marketing, but that is an unprovable (and undisprovable) assertion, so it's not really fair to bring up.
3. Again with the fit-the-films-to-the-title-song approach. It really mystifies me. Suffice it to say that a lot of fans aren't going to agree with you. Just look at the numbers of people suggesting rockers in the 'who should do the next theme' threads.
4. I wonder why the Moonraker titles fit with this Bassey song?
#51
Posted 14 November 2009 - 09:45 PM
I voted for AWTD. The Bassey song as, like someone said, just so generic and forgettable. It's like they were trying their damnedest to make something that fit into a very small box called the 'Bond song.'I'm biased by the fact that I love Jack White's other work.
That's the interesting thing, I think. White's stuff seems to be really polarising: either you like it or you really hate it. There's a DJ on radio 1 who just doesn't get any of his stuff and always goes on about how the White Stripes just make a noise etc. People who don't like his stuff really don't like it.
I love forward to hearing more of Bassey's new album.
You can listen to the whole thing [url="http://"%20<a%20href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2009/nov/05/shirley-bassey-the-performance""%20target="_blank">http://www.guardian....v/0...rformance"</a>"]here.[/url]
Yes, but much like the film itself, it's only successful in representing something interesting, rather than being something interesting.Another Way to Die; it represents something interesting.
Anyway, in my mind this discussion all boils down to this:
Would you rather have a reheated hamburger ("No Good About Goodbye"; generic, not too interesting, but doesn't go down too badly), or an experimental dish that tries for a refreshing and bold combination of flavors but ends up being a complete mess ("Another Way to Die"; interesting in intent, but failed--if not outright irritating--in its finished form)? If I was just going off of the menu, I'd take the latter. But if I was allowed to sample the finished dishes before choosing, I'd go with the former.
Well, hypothetically, I'd say I still prefer the latter option because it gives us something fresh and the producers are attempting something reasonably forward-looking; and that feels better in the tasting as well as on the menu. As it turns out I don't agree with your assessment because, although it's not one of White's greatest songs, it works perfectly well in the movie and it as least a proper rock song with a bit of soul to it (and some frankly brilliant drumming).
NGAG is growing on me and has a nice little hook, and in the youtube thing there it does make sense just because that motif is all the way through the film. It still wouldn't be my choice for the movie though.
Age 51 - Bassey (of course)
but I loved YKMN and would choose it even over, say, All Time High. So I don't think the age thing really works.
Yeah but, no offence: YKMN is sort of a 50 year old's idea of a rock song. AWTD is a rock song.
#52
Posted 15 November 2009 - 02:06 AM
#53
Posted 15 November 2009 - 02:26 AM
I guess i am too. I want to like it so I can be considered cool with bond fans. but it's bland and cliched.I suppose I'm missing something but, uh, the Bassey song it not very good... at all.
#54
Posted 15 November 2009 - 02:37 AM
Not if you're in the US of A, you can't. It'll only let us Yanks listen to samples.You can listen to the whole thing [url="http://"%20%3Ca%20href=%22http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2009/nov/05/shirley-bassey-the-performance"%22%20target=%22_blank%22%3Ehttp://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2009/nov/0...rformance"%3C/a%3E"]here.[/url]I love forward to hearing more of Bassey's new album.
I find AWTD grating whenever I watch QUANTUM OF SOLACE. The song always makes me want to skip the title sequence, which is unusual for me; I never want to skip any of the other Bond titles, even the most lackluster efforts. And personally, I have no concern for whether it's a proper rock song or not. I just want it to be good. And as far as I'm concerned, it's not. The melodic line is forgettable (to say the least), the instrumentation is somewhat dull, the vocals are often ugly, the lyrics are mush (but admittedly nicely funky if you can actually catch what they're singing), and the song's structure is a mess. It's by far the sloppiest Bond song ever produced.As it turns out I don't agree with your assessment because, although it's not one of White's greatest songs, it works perfectly well in the movie and it as least a proper rock song with a bit of soul to it (and some frankly brilliant drumming).
#55
Posted 15 November 2009 - 09:25 AM
Yeah but, no offence: YKMN is sort of a 50 year old's idea of a rock song. AWTD is a rock song.
[/quote]
Offence taken! lol
It comes down to whether it's a GOOD song or not. Whatever it's meant to be or is taken to be by various age groups. YKMN is Good. AWTD is not. That's just my opinion, but I think you'll find plenty of 20somethings who agree.... and maybe even some 50somethings who won't!
And who - of any age - would say that Goldfinger is not a good song? I rest my case.
quote]
How anyone can like a bland Bassey tune simply because Bassey is singing it Baffles me.
[/quote]
Um.. maybe because Bassey can SING? Unlike some people.
#56
Posted 15 November 2009 - 09:41 AM
At 46, I am one of the older fans and between the two songs--prefer the Bassey one. However, in seeing the way the series has been rebooted, and with Craig as Bond, AWTD fits the mood of the film more.
How does a sleazy, funky, aggressive, 70s blaxpoitation-esque meteorite of a song in any way reflect the tone of the film?
I'm not a really a big fan of this song for being too dirge like and generic, but still it reflects the solemn introspective nature of the film, and Forster's sensitive direction more than AWTD does. For that reason along with Bassey's vocals I rate it over the blood-curdling cacophony of AWTD.
Yeah but, no offence: YKMN is sort of a 50 year old's idea of a rock song. AWTD is a rock song.
Really? Then what about the synth beat, Memphis horns and rap-like vocals?
Edited by The Shark, 15 November 2009 - 09:43 AM.
#57
Posted 15 November 2009 - 09:52 AM
#58
Posted 15 November 2009 - 10:01 AM
we will never know what this song might have been should it have been written for the movie and who would have ended up singin it.you may as well speculate about any arnold song that sounds a bit 'bondy' and like wise any bassey song that treads the same path.its not a bond song,so its pointless arguing as if it is.it may not be as good as goldfinger,but its also not as a day in the life,god only knows or moon river...
#59
Posted 15 November 2009 - 11:05 AM
this arguement is a little dubious Considering DAvid arnold has said that NGAG wasnt written for QOS and wasnt produced/arranged for the film, it was started as an early idea when he was working on the film,and then finished and written for bassey.it was then arranged for her album not for a film.i can understand the speculation but really its a bit pointless,as arnold said ,why cant people accept it for what it is rather than what it isnt.
we will never know what this song might have been should it have been written for the movie and who would have ended up singin it.you may as well speculate about any arnold song that sounds a bit 'bondy' and like wise any bassey song that treads the same path.its not a bond song,so its pointless arguing as if it is.it may not be as good as goldfinger,but its also not as a day in the life,god only knows or moon river...
Sorry, this doesn't cut it. We have to remember that there are many, many reasons why a composer would say what they would say. And the 'truth' will probably never be known. So we have to draw our own conclusions from the end product, and from that fact that those involved are the people they are. Also the 'evidence' that Arnold (or Black, I can't remember) has stated that they submitted a track for consideration. Sure, it may be tailored for Bassey (though Black has said Bassey should sing all Bond songs!) and the arrangement tailored also for the album, but neither is a million miles away from Surrender. And that's NOT a bad thing, trust me!
#60
Posted 15 November 2009 - 12:26 PM
this arguement is a little dubious Considering DAvid arnold has said that NGAG wasnt written for QOS and wasnt produced/arranged for the film, it was started as an early idea when he was working on the film,and then finished and written for bassey.it was then arranged for her album not for a film.i can understand the speculation but really its a bit pointless,as arnold said ,why cant people accept it for what it is rather than what it isnt.
we will never know what this song might have been should it have been written for the movie and who would have ended up singin it.you may as well speculate about any arnold song that sounds a bit 'bondy' and like wise any bassey song that treads the same path.its not a bond song,so its pointless arguing as if it is.it may not be as good as goldfinger,but its also not as a day in the life,god only knows or moon river...
Sorry, this doesn't cut it. We have to remember that there are many, many reasons why a composer would say what they would say. And the 'truth' will probably never be known. So we have to draw our own conclusions from the end product, and from that fact that those involved are the people they are. Also the 'evidence' that Arnold (or Black, I can't remember) has stated that they submitted a track for consideration. Sure, it may be tailored for Bassey (though Black has said Bassey should sing all Bond songs!) and the arrangement tailored also for the album, but neither is a million miles away from Surrender. And that's NOT a bad thing, trust me!
So what youre saying is ...when the composer of the song and the person who knows what happened says what happened,you decide its not the truth?
Arnold hasnt stated he submitted the track for consideration...only that he had begun work on some ideas...he also stated that MArc Forster had him working on ideas really early this time,so he may have had many ideas, only some of which ended up in the film.
in the past Arnold appears to have been honest about the songs he has submitted ie DAD( I will return),TND(surrender),so why change tack now?
For me, its a Bond style song that reflects shirley basseys past and having heard 'The performance', i think it sits really nicely with the other songs on the record.
also,arnolds other songwriting contributions to basseys album include songs written with both david mcalmont and the manic street preachers,neither of which sound remotely like bond songs.