2519 replies to this topic

[HildebrandRarity]

Another thing, some of you guys must be just gutted to have put so much time and energy (45 pages worth of posts on a James Bond site) into a project that not only delivered so little but also was only going to line the already well-lined pockets of a couple or three individuals who were well, well past their prime. Good show.

Guessing you're hoping that QoS delivers then otherwise there will be countless pages and time and energy similarly devoted...

If you look at my post count, they're relatively small and primarily geared towards things like watches, cars, music, and the like. And at least I havent been waiting years (and years (and years)) for one moment in time. There's a new Bond movie in production and that's fun and all...but it's not like my life and hopes revolves around Quantum. There have been several Bond movies over the last 19 years and there'll probably be several more over the next 19 years. So it's not be all, end all, etcetera.

Lastly, I love the fact that we have a young producer, young director and young actor involved in this latest project...and their hunger to deliver quality is impressive and encouraging. In the end, though, i'm not "hoping" for anything. I'm merely an observer of the proceedings and whatever they deliver is 'what they deliver'. So far looking good. Very good.

No skin, old boy. No skin.

[Mr_Wint]

I'm not a big DAD-fan, but DAD was better than IJ4. Not as visually good, but still far more enjoyable.

[Loomis]

And worse than Lethal Weapon 4? Seriously? Nah- that is a terrible film, much more self-indulgent.

Whoa there! You're knocking one of my all-time favourites!

Not sure I'd say Die Another Day is better either, although I don't despise DAD. I'd put them on a par also: they're both very entertaining. Crystal Skull has a bit more charm and flair, though.

I'd say that CRYSTAL has more charm, but not more flair. CRYSTAL works best as a showcase for Ford's charisma and as a warm nostalgic wallow. But DAD has better action scenes and more energy. (See my longwinded post about POINT BREAK a few posts up where I talk about charm versus energy.)

And at least I havent been waiting years (and years (and years)) for one moment in time.

To be fair, I don't think anyone posting here has done absolutely nothing but wait for INDY JONES 4 for years on end, either. I guess there may have been a few very sad bastardish Indy fans in this world who did do that, but by the same token there must also be a few people who have zero in their lives but QUANTUM OF SOLACE.

[marktmurphy]

And worse than Lethal Weapon 4? Seriously? Nah- that is a terrible film, much more self-indulgent.

Whoa there! You're knocking one of my all-time favourites!

Fair enough- I tried to watch it when it was on the other week and it's all so smarmy and thinks that I love these people enough to watch them allhavingalovelytimetogether when I really don't. I enjoyed a couple of the movies but I wasn't in love with the characters, and by no.4 they'd lost touch with reality in the action department, and it wasn't even that good action, even if it was unrealistic.

Not sure I'd say Die Another Day is better either, although I don't despise DAD. I'd put them on a par also: they're both very entertaining. Crystal Skull has a bit more charm and flair, though.

I'd say that CRYSTAL has more charm, but not more flair. CRYSTAL works best as a showcase for Ford's charisma and as a warm nostalgic wallow. But DAD has better action scenes and more energy. (See my longwinded post about POINT BREAK a few posts up where I talk about charm versus energy.)

Yeah, Crystal Skull is low energy, I'll give you that. There's not much in the way of tension or energy- half the time you expect Indy and the Commies to call lunch break and have some sandwiches together. But I can't think of better action in DAD (the hovercraft chase is very dull, the Aston stuff is all shot from a mile away and is just thrust/parry over and again. The sword fight is good, though)- the motorcycle stuff in Indy is good fun and has good jokes, the jungle chase is over CGI-ed and goes on too long, but I enjoy the concept of a chase between at least three cars with the occupants constantly swapping between them: there's more flair in that than two gadget cars shooting at each other and not getting anywhere. And Indy getting off a motorbike into a car and fighting his way out the other side of the car- that's funny and has wit. There's not as much wit in there as in previous Indys, but you can tell that it is an Indy movie.

[YOLT]

It just proves that there is only one film series that can go forever:

JAMES BOND. 007.

[Harmsway]

It just proves that there is only one film series that can go forever:

JAMES BOND. 007.

Well, I do think the time will come for Bond to go away, at least in the sense that the EON franchise will conclude. And, besides, the Bond franchise has had its share of mediocre entries.

[YOLT]

It just proves that there is only one film series that can go forever:

JAMES BOND. 007.

Well, I do think the time will come for Bond to go away, at least in the sense that the EON franchise will conclude. And, besides, the Bond franchise has had its share of mediocre entries.

Of course but not in my life time It has still a loonng way to go. And nobody can compare with a 22+ franchise with a 4. Yes Bond had medicore entries too but it always came up again. I dont think that we will have another Indy. Its over. Like Starwars, like Star Trek, like Harry Potter (it will in the near future ) etc.

[Bondian]

The TV series is dreadful. Huge production values don't make up for being boring. It's appallingly written and doesn't appear to be directed at all. I just watched one called 'Treasure of the Peacock's Eye' and it's absolutely shocking. No wit, terrible action (who is this karate-kicking, snake-loving man with no sense of humour? It certainly ain't Indiana Jones) a stupid story, idiotic cameos from real famous people for no other reason than the sake of it ("Here's EM Forster...") and a story which peters away on a desert island where nothing happens until Indy decides to go home without finding the treasure. Yes, an Indiana Jones story where Indy decides to go home rather than have an adventure. Terrible.

Maybe you miss the the point that the series is about Indy's 'formative' years on growing up, facing death, being kidnapped, joining an army, falling in love etc etc etc.

[dodge]

I'm on my way to see the film wearing white with the exception of one or two eensie-teensie splotches (tidbits from posts I've read).

Sorry, Dino, I love you to pieces--you're the hippiest cat in all LA...but I don't buy Eon's 'cutting edge' advantage of Lucas and his fellow geezers Spielberg and Ford.

I'll return to post "The Dodge Supremacy/Or: How I Loved The Crystal Skull Before I Even Saw It...and Was Absolutely Right!"

At least I hope to God, I will.

If not, I'll stand beside Loomis, as he's promised to do with QoS, and let loose with both lips blazing.

[marktmurphy]

The TV series is dreadful. Huge production values don't make up for being boring. It's appallingly written and doesn't appear to be directed at all. I just watched one called 'Treasure of the Peacock's Eye' and it's absolutely shocking. No wit, terrible action (who is this karate-kicking, snake-loving man with no sense of humour? It certainly ain't Indiana Jones) a stupid story, idiotic cameos from real famous people for no other reason than the sake of it ("Here's EM Forster...") and a story which peters away on a desert island where nothing happens until Indy decides to go home without finding the treasure. Yes, an Indiana Jones story where Indy decides to go home rather than have an adventure. Terrible.

Maybe you miss the the point that the series is about Indy's 'formative' years on growing up, facing death, being kidnapped, joining an army, falling in love etc etc etc.

No, the point of it is to entertain with some education of history along the way- the content is Indy's formative years. However, it is massively, incredibly boring and badly-written and has nothing to do with the spirit of Indiana Jones.

It just proves that there is only one film series that can go forever:

JAMES BOND. 007.

Well, I do think the time will come for Bond to go away, at least in the sense that the EON franchise will conclude. And, besides, the Bond franchise has had its share of mediocre entries.

Of course but not in my life time It has still a loonng way to go. And nobody can compare with a 22+ franchise with a 4. Yes Bond had medicore entries too but it always came up again. I dont think that we will have another Indy. Its over. Like Starwars, like Star Trek, like Harry Potter (it will in the near future ) etc.

And yet Harry Potter has taken more at the box office than Bond.

[DamnCoffee]

Yeah well, he would.

[byline]

Mind you, I remember people telling me that STAR WARS EPISODE I would be one of the greatest films ever, and I guess there must also have been a time when GODFATHER III looked like something to get really excited about.

You know, when the third "Godfather" film came out, I loved it. Can't explain why; I just did. (Though Andy Garcia was pretty hot, LOL!) But as time has passed, it's lost its luster and just hasn't held up as well as its predecessors. Some people saw that immediately; for others like myself, that realization came later on.

[YOLT]

And yet Harry Potter has taken more at the box office than Bond.

Inflation adjusted ??? Dont think so. You cant compare Dr.No's 50.000.000 $ with todays 50.000.000 $ can you ???

[byline]

The time will come to put Bond out to pasture.

Uh-oh, them's fightin' words! (Funny, though, I was having those same thoughts around the time of "Licence to Kill.")

[marktmurphy]

And yet Harry Potter has taken more at the box office than Bond.

Inflation adjusted ??? Dont think so. You cant compare Dr.No's 50.000.000 $ with todays 50.000.000 $ can you ???

I don't know exactly how they worked it out, but for 5 films to beat 21, they've got to be doing something right. There's only been two since the Potters started, I know, but you'd think that the 19 before that would add a bit of cash to the pot.

[byline]

The first rule of screenwriting is SHOW DON'T TELL. Well, this script is all tell, and no show. It was very sloppily and lazily written with no respect for the audience's intelligence.

Ow, ow, ow. Writer chiming in here. That will be the thing that gets me. Films that forget they are visual media and chatter on, endlessly explaining things, just don't go over well with me. That, and forgetting how to have fun, were what made Lucas's "prequels" so unengaging to me. It was like, "Oh, but we have to tie every last detail together, and we have to do it with heaps of CGI to impress the audience." ("Or myself." I was never sure which.) You forgot the essentials: Give us a story, and tell it well. But don't tell us everything; show us why we need to care about these characters.

To bring it back to another contemporary film, that, IMO, was what "Casino Royale" did so extraordinarily well. It did not rely on heaping servings of CGI, gadgetry and long, drawn-out speeches to explain every last detail. It left quite a bit to our imagination, letting us fill in many blanks, but also giving us a satisfying story and characters worth caring about. I realize that catching that lightning in a bottle is no easy feat, but it seems to me that George Lucas has forgotten everything he ever learned about good storytelling. Or, as you note, he focused too much on that word, "tell," and forgot that the most important thing any writer can do is show.

Edited by byline, 23 May 2008 - 04:40 PM.

[YOLT]

And yet Harry Potter has taken more at the box office than Bond.

Inflation adjusted ??? Dont think so. You cant compare Dr.No's 50.000.000 $ with todays 50.000.000 $ can you ???

I don't know exactly how they worked it out, but for 5 films to beat 21, they've got to be doing something right. There's only been two since the Potters started, I know, but you'd think that the 19 before that would add a bit of cash to the pot.

Its just about inflation adjustment. There is no way that they can beat Bond in total. However they can beat Bond per/film ratio.

[Royal Dalton]

I've just got back from seeing it. I'm sorry to say it, but this film is an absolute abomination.

Spielberg and Lucas (particularly Lucas, since he was hellbent on pushing forward with the sci-fi idea, which doesn't work at all) should hang their heads in shame.

Goodbye, Indy.

[DamnCoffee]

I think Lucas' involvment made the film OTT, Isn't he a history teacher. I'm sorry but he is really starting to piss me off!

[Harmsway]

I've just got back from seeing it. I'm sorry to say it, but this film is an absolute abomination.

Spielberg and Lucas (particularly Lucas, since he was hellbent on pushing forward with the sci-fi idea, which doesn't work at all) should hang their heads in shame.

Goodbye, Indy.

Funny, the sci-fi angle is the one thing about the movie I absolutely love.

[Loomis]

For those interested in what the experts have to say:

http://raven.theraid...isplay.php?f=37

[DamnCoffee]

I dont understand what all the fuss is about, its a fun movie. Here's my review:

Well... all I can say is... WOW! This Indiana Jones Film is easily one of the best in the franchise. I love it from start to finish. Harrison Ford still proves that he is the right man for the job, certainly he's a little older, a little wiser... but he is still the same kick action hero he always was and always will be! Firstly. I love Indys introduction, its absoloultly perfect as he has been greatly missed for 19 years. The only problem I have with Harrison is that his line delivery sounds like that of a video game character, though., I'm glad to say, his presence and charm pulls it off. I really do not think the writing is weak at all, yeah it has its moments but who cares, this is not meant to have a deep meaning, this is meant to be a light hearted, action adventure movie, and it certainly lives up to expectations. For Example. In CRUSADE. I didn't care about the quest for the holy grail, I just watched it for the entertainment and how Indy got to it. The same goes for this SKULL.. I'm going to be completely honest here, i just watch Indiana Jones to be entertained, its not like Bond where I think the character should have real emotional depth, but I have to admit that I did love the moments in the previous three when Indy did show some humanity. Nothing else I can say really. Great Music... I love how Williams reused the 'Flight from Peru' Track from Raiders. I'm beginning to warm greatly to the score since I have seen it in action. Great moments of humour, most notably Indy tripping over the dummys in the Nuclear Test Centre and his quip "Yeahh sure dont wait for me!!" as he is running after the jeep. I loved the whole Fridge scene, though it did look like an out of control TARDIS flying through the sky, The Quicksand Scene was rather amusing as was the whole call the snake a rope sherade. The Only problem I had with it was that I felt that it was over to soon, It needed to be longer.
Anywhay...Great Action and Supporting Actors, nothing else I can say really - I Loved INDY IV. I give it a 8/10, seriosuly, its fantastic entertainment! all I can say is... Roll On Indiana Jones 5.



1. Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade
2. Indiana Jones and the Raiders of the Lost Ark
3. Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull
4. Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom

[Andrew]

Haven't you posted that about three times?

[marktmurphy]

I've just got back from seeing it. I'm sorry to say it, but this film is an absolute abomination.

Spielberg and Lucas (particularly Lucas, since he was hellbent on pushing forward with the sci-fi idea, which doesn't work at all) should hang their heads in shame.

Goodbye, Indy.

Funny, the sci-fi angle is the one thing about the movie I absolutely love.

Yeah, works for me. Just because Indy's had three adventures with religious artefacts doesn't mean that's all he has to ever contend with: it's on the same believability scale as the previous plots (although was missing that shiver-down-the-spine spookiness which the Ark and the Grail had: did they confirm the existence of aliens a bit too early/casually in this?). And I always liked the idea of the alien thing- runways of the Gods and all that. And he even says 'Saucermen from Mars'!

[DamnCoffee]

I loved the nod to The Last Crusade in which Mutt laughed after doing something clever on the Bike and Indy just gave him the same pityfull look as his father gave him on the bike chase in The Last Crusade.

[Kilroy6644]

I liked it. It wasn't as good as the other three, but it was fun, and that's all I ask from Indy. I was never keen on the idea of aliens, and I was right. They just weren't as awe-inspiring as the supernatural forces in the other movies.

[DamnCoffee]

but it was fun, and that's all I ask from Indy.

Exactly! It was a fun, popcorn movie... and since it's Indy, It will probably do well at the box office, considering the 19 year gap.

I see an Indy 5 on the horizon.

[Loomis]

Just saw it.

Don't read on if you don't want to know.

It's fine. I enjoyed myself. My expectations were in check, and that was good. I was expecting a somewhat creaky movie, and it was definitely creaky (in parts). Script was filled with unswept cobwebs from 20 years of development. But I loved the whole opening on the Nevada base and Cate was great. Also enjoyed Shia. And I really liked all the alien stuff. They went further than I thought they would, to the point of genre mixing, but my Moonraker-lovin' self was fine with that.

Nostalgia carried me along for much of it. But for whatever reason, my feeling right now after seeing it is...sadness.

Interesting that you mention MOONRAKER, because the impression I'm getting from reading Indy fans' posts is they're reacting like ultraconservative, traditionalist, Fleming-loving Bond fans might have reacted had the Eon series gone straight to MOONRAKER (well, when I say "straight to" I actually mean straight to right after that 19-year hiatus!) after beginning with FROM RUSSIA WITH LOVE, GOLDFINGER and THUNDERBALL.

Some vicious stuff here. Hell hath no fury like a fanboy disappointed by Lucas:

http://raven.theraid...ead.php?t=14743

[Tarl_Cabot]

Just saw it.

Don't read on if you don't want to know.

It's fine. I enjoyed myself. My expectations were in check, and that was good. I was expecting a somewhat creaky movie, and it was definitely creaky (in parts). Script was filled with unswept cobwebs from 20 years of development. But I loved the whole opening on the Nevada base and Cate was great. Also enjoyed Shia. And I really liked all the alien stuff. They went further than I thought they would, to the point of genre mixing, but my Moonraker-lovin' self was fine with that.

Nostalgia carried me along for much of it. But for whatever reason, my feeling right now after seeing it is...sadness.

Interesting that you mention MOONRAKER, because the impression I'm getting from reading Indy fans' posts is they're reacting like ultraconservative, traditionalist, Fleming-loving Bond fans might have reacted had the Eon series gone straight to MOONRAKER (well, when I say "straight to" I actually mean straight to right after that 19-year hiatus!) after beginning with FROM RUSSIA WITH LOVE, GOLDFINGER and THUNDERBALL.

Some vicious stuff here. Hell hath no fury like a fanboy disappointed by Lucas:

http://raven.theraid...ead.php?t=14743

Lucas should golf with George W Bush when he's retired. They can exchange hatred stories.

[The Dove]

*weaps tears of joy* OH MY GOD!!! The movie was INCREDIBLE!! My grade for Indiana Jones and The Kingdom of The Crystal Skull: A (all the way!!)

I enjoyed it SO much that it has overtaken Last Crusade as my second favorite Indy film.. Last Crusade pales compared with Crystal Skull. No doubt about it, Harrison Ford still has it at 65 and I am glad that they didn't try and make him the same Indiana Jones age in the last three films.. It was wise to make him older and perhaps a wee bit slower than his younger years...after all this new film takes place 19 years after Last Crusade. I'm definitely going to catch this again next week! I am certainly scratching my head at all the negative naysayers about this movie.. For God's sake if you go into this movie expecting it to pick up exactly in the style of the last three films, then i can see how you might tend to be disappointed. But this is 2008..not 1981, 1984 or 1989..Of course Indy 4 is going to be different.. And how anyone could say this does not have the Indy feel to it is beyond me.. I felt the good ol' Indy charm come flowing back the minute Indy appears on the screen.

Loved Shia LeBouf as Mutt and the whole 50's setting was just great.. It was also very nice to have Karen Allen back as Marion and there were some touching tributes to the late Denholm Elliot and Sean Connery's characters.. but I won't spoil them for those who have yet to see the film.

Bravo Mr. Spielberg and Mr. Lucas.. Indy 5? Yes.. I would love to see it!!