1182 replies to this topic

[Tybre]

Watched the Russian adaptation of The Final Problem earlier and am now watching the Russian adaptation of A Study in Scarlet. Vasili Livanov is on the fast track to becoming my favorite Holmes, first off. Secondly, I dare say the Russians were best at adapting Holmes. Like the Brett series, it's very faithful to the source, but at the same time, the Russian version has a bit of fun with it. There are some slight changes to Watson's breakfast which bring just a tiny click of humor, and I think it works perfectly, especially the immensely confused face Watson makes when Holmes tells him his visitor has left and yet the man appears to have never left Holmes' room. And that score! So beautiful, especially the theme music. It's just really brilliant, the way everything is handled. Honestly I think I prefer the Russian versions to Granada, BBC, what have you. Next time I have $115 I'm totally buying the complete DVD set.

Anyone else seen the Russian versions?

[Brisco]

First pic I've seen from Steven Moffat's new series for the BBC with a modern take. I bet this is going to be pretty awesome.

http://www.sherlockn...-by-steven.html

I CANNOT WAIT FOR THIS! I'm looking forward to this show even more than the movie. I really hope BBC America picks it up (or PBS or SOMEBODY) so we get it here sooner rather than later...

[zencat]

Anyone else seen the Russian versions?

I don't know anything about these. Are they on DVD?

Been in a Holmes mood lately... Was just looking through old clippings and here's a clipping of a play I saw in 1981 when Charlton Heston played Holmes. Not a great Holmes. But check out who played his second billed Dr. Watson.

I think it's so cool that I saw this. I remember thinking the actor who played Watson stole the show. But that he was also too young and thin.

Attached Files

•  blood100.jpg   149.11KB   12 downloads

[Tybre]

Anyone else seen the Russian versions?

I don't know anything about these. Are they on DVD?

Yeah. There's a DVD set of all 6 on amazon, subtitled, for $100-$130 depending who you buy it from. There are a few individual ones as well, but the individuals only have to episodes on them, but all of the episodes are of good length. There are a few subtitled episodes on youtube as well. There's one person who uploaded the first episode, the episode concerning Milverton, and about half to 3/4 of The Final Problem on their channel, and if you don't mind the occasional grammatical or spelling error, they can be watched here. There's also a subbed version of the Hound of the Baskervilles somewhere on youtube, saw it in a search but didn't actually watch it yet.

Russian versions have, for me, completely blown every other adaptation out of the water. I still enjoy all the others, certainly, but whereas before if I felt like watching Sherlock Holmes I would drift towards Jeremy Brett 9/10 and Peter Cushing most of that remaining 1, I'm now much more inclined to watch the Russian series than anything else. Like, 99% chance I'd go for that above any other. The only real issues with it are the occasional shot. In The Final Problem, when Watson is outside, it's very clearly a modern street and not the sort one would expect to find in Victorian England; and in The Beginning, instead of a real manor they use a dacha, but it's a very minor quibble that, for me at least, doesn't drag down the experience any.

[zencat]

Anyone else seen the Russian versions?

I don't know anything about these. Are they on DVD?

Yeah. There's a DVD set of all 6 on amazon, subtitled, for $100-$130 depending who you buy it from.

Would like to see these, but I don't see spending that much. I'm not that hardcore a Sherlockian.

[Tybre]

There are the aforementioned links, and you might be able to find the full 6-disc set for cheaper somewhere else, I was know amazon carries it thanks to some YT comments and searching of my own *shrug* Could also buy one of the individual discs, or see if somewhere offers it for rent.

[Arbogast777]

Nice new trailer HERE.

[Arbogast777]

New poster HERE.

[Tybre]

I must say I really don't care for any of the posters they've been coming out with. The black teaser poster with an obscured Holmes face smoking was good, but the rest...no thank you.

[zencat]

Poster is just ok. Not great.

[The Ghost Who Walks]

"Holmes for the holiday". Could this be the single worst tagline in film history?

[Tybre]

"Holmes for the holiday". Could this be the single worst tagline in film history?

I'm sure I could find/think of worse if you give me time.

[The Ghost Who Walks]

I challenge you to do so. I doubt you'll manage it ("From the director of Swept Away" doesn't count).

[Jackanaples]

Considering the movie is being released on Christmas Day and they want to draw in families with this poster I really don't think the tagline is that bad. Here are some that are worse:

JAWS: THE REVENGE - "This time it's personal."

GODZILLA - "Size Does Matter."

A KNIGHT'S TALE - "He Will Rock You." and "He didn't make the rules. He was born to break them."

ROCKY IV - "He Could Have Stopped The Fight. He Could Have Saved His Best Friend's Life. But Now, The Only Thing He Can't Do Is Walk Away..."

G.I. JOE: THE RISE OF COBRA - "When All Else Fails, They Don't."

STRIKING DISTANCE - "They shouldn't have put him in the water, if they didn't want him to make waves."

RAMBO III - "The first was for himself. The second for his country. This time it's to save his friend."

THE PATRIOT - "What would you do if they destroyed your home, threatened your family. Where would you draw the line?"

DIE HARD WITH A VENGEANCE - "This time it's personal."

See? Not so bad. Who knows what another five minutes on IMDB would turn up.

[The Ghost Who Walks]

Don't forget the one for "The Phantom":

"SLAM EVIL!"

No wonder the film flopped.

Also, the English tagline for a very low-key Norwegian World War II-drama about a member of the resistance called "Max Manus" makes it sound like a Schwarzenegger-movie:

"They took his country. Now he wants it back!"

[TheREAL008]

First pic I've seen from Steven Moffat's new series for the BBC with a modern take. I bet this is going to be pretty awesome.

http://www.sherlockn...-by-steven.html

I CANNOT WAIT FOR THIS! I'm looking forward to this show even more than the movie. I really hope BBC America picks it up (or PBS or SOMEBODY) so we get it here sooner rather than later...

I am definitely more excited about this show than the upcoming movie.

[Tybre]

Is it sad that I'm not really all that excited for either? Don't get me wrong, I'll definitely watch the show and no doubt enjoy it, but at this early stage there's nothing to excite me. Even the fact that the generally brilliant Steven Moffat and Mark Gatiss are writing doesn't excite me for some odd reason. Hoping this changes soon.

[Arbogast777]

Another new Holmes trailer... HERE

[Trident]

Another new Holmes trailer... HERE

Phew, my first trailer of SH. Frankly, not too close to Conan Doyle, is it? Looks like a nice action flick, set in Victoriana London, which I really adore a lot. But Holmes? Must have taken a break. I daresay the Barry Levinson film of '85 was closer.

What really surprised me though was Jude Law; didn't recognise him at all. He gives a decent Lewis Collins interpretation here I can't stop thinking.

[Tybre]

Another new Holmes trailer... HERE

Phew, my first trailer of SH. Frankly, not too close to Conan Doyle, is it? Looks like a nice action flick, set in Victoriana London, which I really adore a lot. But Holmes? Must have taken a break. I daresay the Barry Levinson film of '85 was closer.

Indeed, it's not very Holmes. Just from these trailers though, it has come miles from the first draft I read; and yet at the same time it's much the same. Apparently Sherlock Holmes doesn't have enough action for modern audiences Do I need to get out the Sidney Paget? Still, like I said a bit back, as a film, it's probably going to be pretty great. As a Holmes film, not so much. Not terrible, but between the trailers and the first draft script...there have been a lot better, and a little worse.

And I'm going to spoiler what follows, even though I really don't give anything away. Don't click if you don't want the tiny, tiny mention I give of a very small piece of what's in the first draft.

Spoiler

My biggest issue, honestly, is that there's word about saying Warner have already ordered a sequel, just based around the hype, and that the sequel will see Holmes go up against Moriarty, and, again between the script (which does in fact include a nod to Moriarty near the end, thus setting up a potential Moriarty sequel) and the trailers, I can't help but think Moriarty will be some cackling supervillain madman. Holmes' powers of deduction, which are in fact quite realistic although most people don't use such a degree of skill, are played up to almost superhuman lengths in the script, and let us not forget that Moriarty is meant to be even more intelligent than Holmes. Thus if we have Holmes, who I have opted to dub Captain Fisticuffs for this film, being almost superhuman, it is only logical to assume Moriarty shall be almost superhuman.

Still, quite looking forward to it. Probably go the week after Christmas.

[Trident]

Another new Holmes trailer... HERE

Phew, my first trailer of SH. Frankly, not too close to Conan Doyle, is it? Looks like a nice action flick, set in Victoriana London, which I really adore a lot. But Holmes? Must have taken a break. I daresay the Barry Levinson film of '85 was closer.

Indeed, it's not very Holmes. Just from these trailers though, it has come miles from the first draft I read; and yet at the same time it's much the same. Apparently Sherlock Holmes doesn't have enough action for modern audiences Do I need to get out the Sidney Paget? Still, like I said a bit back, as a film, it's probably going to be pretty great. As a Holmes film, not so much. Not terrible, but between the trailers and the first draft script...there have been a lot better, and a little worse.

And I'm going to spoiler what follows, even though I really don't give anything away. Don't click if you don't want the tiny, tiny mention I give of a very small piece of what's in the first draft.

Spoiler

My biggest issue, honestly, is that there's word about saying Warner have already ordered a sequel, just based around the hype, and that the sequel will see Holmes go up against Moriarty, and, again between the script (which does in fact include a nod to Moriarty near the end, thus setting up a potential Moriarty sequel) and the trailers, I can't help but think Moriarty will be some cackling supervillain madman. Holmes' powers of deduction, which are in fact quite realistic although most people don't use such a degree of skill, are played up to almost superhuman lengths in the script, and let us not forget that Moriarty is meant to be even more intelligent than Holmes. Thus if we have Holmes, who I have opted to dub Captain Fisticuffs for this film, being almost superhuman, it is only logical to assume Moriarty shall be almost superhuman.

Still, quite looking forward to it. Probably go the week after Christmas.

Most interesting, thanks for sharing. Of course I will also see it, it still looks like some fun, although mostly not because of the depiction of Holmes and Watson. The action elements would seem to be mostly injected by force into material the executive floor thinks will not be able to stand on its own. Still, a bit Marvel Holmes the whole affair.

[zencat]

Andrew Lane's first "Young Sherlock Holmes" book has appeared on Amazon. Looks like it's not going to be called The Colossal Schemes of Baron Maupertuis as first announced, but Young Sherlock Holmes: The Death Cloud.

http://www.amazon.co...98X/ref=ed_oe_p

I'm really looking forward to this series.

[Tybre]

^_^

My six-disc set of all the Russian Sherlock Holmes films arrived today. It's a beautiful box. Will take pictures if I can ever find my confounded camera.

Andrew Lane's first "Young Sherlock Holmes" book has appeared on Amazon. Looks like it's not going to be called The Colossal Schemes of Baron Maupertuis as first announced, but Young Sherlock Holmes: The Death Cloud.

http://www.amazon.co...98X/ref=ed_oe_p

I'm really looking forward to this series.

I have mixed feelings. Probs going to buy at some point, but I'm almost certain it will hold the same problem as the Young Bond series. Entertaining, but I dunno, I just have issues with the "little lad doing the same shiz he does as an adult". Especially when they try to bring in characters the person doesn't meet until adulthood. Although at least with Holmes, it's more plausible than Young Bond.

[Della Leiter]

HEY EVERYBODY! :]

I know a while ago I said that I was back in full swing on the forum, but life has been absolutely crazy lately... Bond got pushed to the back burner, which is never a good thing :[ But, with my holiday breaks arriving, I'll be on much more often!

Anyway, I'm so glad to see that there's a post for Sherlock Holmes on here! Just finished The Hound Of The Baskervilles, actually. Such a great novel. I cannot wait to see Robert Downey Jr. as Holmes. I'm skipping Christmas this year for it ;]

[zencat]

I have several books about Holmes in film, TV, stage, etc., but most are now outdated. Figured it was time for a new one. This just shipped from Amazon. Looking forward to it.

The Sherlock Holmes Companion: An Elementary Guide

[zencat]

I have several books about Holmes in film, TV, stage, etc., but most are now outdated. Figured it was time for a new one. This just shipped from Amazon. Looking forward to it.

The Sherlock Holmes Companion: An Elementary Guide

Just got this and it's actually different from what I expected. It's really a companion to the literary/canonical Holmes, with a chapter devoted to each and every Doyle story. Still lots of photos and references to film, stage, and TV adaptations, and there are chapters interspersed throughout on Holmes specifics -- Baker street, etc. Overall a nice surprise as I don't have a book like this in my Holmes library.

[Tybre]

My Holmes library is bare in the way of literature at the moment. I used to have a few compendiums -- one which had The Adventures of Sherlock Holmes and A Study in Scarlet together, another which had The Sign of the Four and the Case-Book of Sherlock Holmes, etc. but those have since been gotten rid of. Borders has a nice collection of all of the novels and short stories in one set of eight or nine books, though, for only about $15, at least of last time I was in there, so I may be picking up that sometime in the near future. And my video library is a bit scant at the moment as well. The Complete Russian Sherlock Holmes, the 1959 Hound of the Baskervilles, and Sherlock Holmes and the Case of the Silk Stocking are the only pieces to it at the moment. Probably be adding the Granada series next. Or Rathbone. We'll see how the mood strikes when I have the change for it. Unemployment, she is a double-edged sword. Time to do as I please, but no money to do it with. Anywho, what do you folks reckon I ought to buy next in the way of film? Plan to buy them all eventually anyway.

[dodge]

Coverage for the new film is looking better and better. Downeyman cuts a dashing, very trim figure on the cover of Esquire mag. $300 million bucks, Lord, please--to give him the clout he needs to star in Sly's film about Poe.

[Brisco]

My six-disc set of all the Russian Sherlock Holmes films arrived today. It's a beautiful box. Will take pictures if I can ever find my confounded camera.

I just got these, too, Tybre, after reading so many good things about them here and elsewhere. My girlfriend and I watched the first one this weekend, and we were blown away. It really does live up to the hype. It's a little bit weird watching Holmes and Watson speak in Russian at first (and the subtitles can be a little dodgy, like "The Motley Ribbon!" instead of "The speckled band!"), but the actors are so good in the parts that that immediately stops being a factor. You just believe them. Watson especially is excellent. He's really the main character of the first one, which is a great approach. I also watched the very beginning of "The 20th Century Approaches" and it brought tears to my eyes it was so cool and right.

I'm more positive about the Downey film these days. I'm still not sold on his Holmes, but I like that they seem to have found humor in his relationship with Watson. I think that's a key to a good Holmes movie. Watson doesn't need to be a blundering idiot like Nigel Bruce (though I do like Bruce, unfaithful as he is to Doyle), but there has to be some sort of comedy out of the pairing. The Russian series gets that JUST RIGHT I think, with Watson as intelligent and capable as ever. It looks like Downey Jr. and Law have a good, humorous repartee as well, from the trailers. Some adaptations miss that in their efforts to be as slavishly faithful to the text as possible. And I think in those cases it's a matter of seeing but not observing: no, Watson is NOT a dolt, but YES, there IS humor between the two characters in the books!

That Elementary Guide you got looks cool, Zencat. Let us know how it is. My favorite movie guide is "Sherlock Holmes On Screen" by Alan Barnes. I refer to it all the time!

[Tybre]

My six-disc set of all the Russian Sherlock Holmes films arrived today. It's a beautiful box. Will take pictures if I can ever find my confounded camera.

I just got these, too, Tybre, after reading so many good things about them here and elsewhere. My girlfriend and I watched the first one this weekend, and we were blown away. It really does live up to the hype. It's a little bit weird watching Holmes and Watson speak in Russian at first (and the subtitles can be a little dodgy, like "The Motley Ribbon!" instead of "The speckled band!"), but the actors are so good in the parts that that immediately stops being a factor. You just believe them. Watson especially is excellent. He's really the main character of the first one, which is a great approach. I also watched the very beginning of "The 20th Century Approaches" and it brought tears to my eyes it was so cool and right.

I know! I'd been reading in various places that the Russian films were great, better than Brett, perfect, etc. And I figured, "Well, I'm sure it'll be good, maybe even better than Brett, but all this seems a bit like fangasming". And then I found a few episodes on Youtube and Google Video and I was completely blown away. The subtitles are dodgy at times (especially when watching them on youtube, since the person who uploaded those episodes is a native Russian, which resulted in the occasional grammatical or spelling error) and sure, at first listening to Russian coming out of their mouths at first is a bit odd, but you settle in and accept it and it's brilliant. Just brilliant. Especially in the case of Solomin's Watson, Livanov's Holmes, and Zelyonaya's Mrs Hudson, it feels entirely natural, like you're really just watching Holmes and Watson go about their business. Livanov's raspy/gravelly voice isn't exactly what one would normal expect of Holmes either, but I admit it's in my head now. Every time I re-read Doyle, Livanov's voice.

I'm more positive about the Downey film these days.

Honestly my opinion's been drooping. I'm still very much looking forward to it, but the script kind of did it in for me. Sure, from the trailers it's obvious things have changed, but it's also obvious the overarching storyline is still intact. And, frankly, I'm not too fond of it, though if the rewrites were handled well I would like it much more. The original screen writer (forget his name) clearly did not understand Holmes and was only chucking in references like Watson's impending marriage to Mary Morstan in attempt to appease fans. However, I still must agree with a point I raised in my original rambles regarding the script (posted elsewhere), which was thus:

"A little note about Blackwood's plan."

But despite my gripes I'm still very interested and excited.

The Russian series gets that JUST RIGHT I think, with Watson as intelligent and capable as ever.

Agreed. And the Russian series plays up the humor sometimes, like when Holmes disguises himself as a beggar and goes up Holmes' room, then comes down out of his room a little while later and Watson is trying to figure out what happened to the old man; or in the case of one episode where Watson tries to be inconspicuous by reading a newspaper, but he does it by stopping in the middle of the street. But it doesn't feel jokey when the Russian series plays it up. And I think that's key. If you're going to play it for laughs, don't make it all one big wink-wink nudge-nudge at the audience. From the trailers, it seems for the most part the film has that, though some moments, like the hotel bed scene, which admittedly I still laugh at, are definitely taking the wrong approach. But them's just my thoughts.

And I feel I must quote this youtube comment, though it's very probably common knowledge to everyone in this thread:

Watson isn't stupid. Medicine isn't easy to graduate from. He has brains, but he doesn't have the insight and the lateral thinking which Holmes has. He's rather a bit like a horse with blinkers.