654 replies to this topic

[DanMan]

Best Bond film since... ever!

[iceberg]

Zencat, dude, I am with you on this one. I used to be a TWINE freak (Sophie Marceua and DENISE DENISE DENISE -- how can you beat that?) but I have to say I walked out of the theatre after watching DAD ready to see it again if they were having another showing. I felt that with TWINE, but not as strongly. TND, not really. GE, yeah, but not like DAD.

So, yeah, DAD may not be the best of the 20 Bond flicks, but it sure is the best of the Brosnan 007 sagas...

Okay, this is where I duck and run behind the nearest piece of furniture...

[zencat]

Thanks Iceberg. But now that I've come down from my opening night high I've returned to GE as my favorite Brosnan Bond, but DAD is close behind!

[Qwerty]

Die Another Day- certainly not the best Bond ever, but one of the most glamorous. I enjoyed DAD alot. In my opinion, it is the Moonraker of Roger Moore. It goes overboard on glamour, but it still enjoyable. I love Moonraker and I love Die Another Day. They are not my top five favorites, but they're still great!

[Genrewriter]

I loved the film. No offense intended, but anybody going to a Bond film expecting Tom Clancy level realism in the technology really needs to get their fun tank checked. I think that the Bond films are supposed to go overboard on glamour, its merely a matter of balancing it out with other elements, soemthing Die Another Day does quite well.

[Jmart007]

Before I start let me just say one thing about CGI. Why does it seem like the CGI quality has gone down and has become more lazy since 1993's Jurassic Park? Yes, there are a few exceptions like The Lord of the Ring's movies, and The Matrix movies, but other than that, I haven't been impressed by any movie that has had big CGI effects in it. Spiderman was one of those dissapointments. I never believed for one moment that the character who was flying all over the place was real, not for one minute, and yet I still liked the film. However, maybe its just me, but I think the type of effects used in a movie like Superman for example are much better than the CGI of today (unless it doesn't look cheesy or non believeable). In Superman, you got close ups on Christopher Reeve, and even though it looked kind of cheesy, it was nowhere near as cheesy as what Spiderman looked like.

This leads me to Die Another Day. Seeing as it was the 20th movie of a very famous series that has now lasted over 40 years, (even though when I first saw the movie it did) it doesn't surprise me that the filmmakers went the CGI route. You know, they just wanted to try something different, and in my opinion it failed miserably, however I can accept it seeing one or two times (TWINE and DAD). If they plan on using CGI again for a sequence similar to the glacier surfing sequence, I think the series will start to lose its quality, and turn into XXX kind of movies.

As for the movie itself, when I first saw it, I thought it was pretty good. Then there was a time when I thought the movie wasn't that good at all. This leads me to today, where I think it's in the top 10 list of my favorite Bond films. However, I think they need a new spin to the series plot wise. Bond being captured at the begining of DAD was a step in the right direction. But, we still had the same old bad guy. Yes I know, these types of bad guys make a James Bond film, besides James Bond himself and the girls, but I would just like to see something different for once.

The one thing that ruined the movie for me however was Halle Berry and her character Jinx. She seemed to take the spotlight away from James Bond, and that shouldn't happen seeing as its a James Bond movie. You can't hire a film star who is more popular than the actor who is playing the main character. You know, I think its great that the female characters can now hold their own, but what happened to the damsile (sp?) in distress? I wouldn't mind seeing that kind of character again, just for another change of pace.

As for the character of Miranda Frost, I liked her very much. I like sexy yet lethal women in movies, especially Bond movies.

And as for the bad guy, there isn't really that much to say about him. He isn't really different than any of the other Bond villians, except for the whole face thing.

So the overall grade I give this movie is a B. It's good, it's special only in the sense of it being the 40th anniversary film, but it's not really close to being the best James Bond film.

So I guess I agree with you Zencat in a way, but I wasn't blown away by the film, but its still very fun to watch. Btw, sorry this was kind of long and that I wrote a review of the movie as well, but this was the only way I knew how to respond .

[Double-0-7]

Here is why I dusted this old chestnut off:
I saw CR twice during its opening week and it is such a departure from 'The Formula' that I wanted to see how it compares to its Brosnan's last outing DAD.

I watched DAD tonight along with someone who managed to never see it before, and they liked it! Other than the awful CGI and the story bogging down generally from the ice palace on, I enjoyed it also. I think the personal power afforded by DVD allows issues that seemed minor in the theater to be magnified until they can overshadow an pretty good movie.

I know DAD gets panned here regularly - and there are some weak parts to it. I wanted to go back in the time machine to 4 years ago, immediately after its big opening weekend and see what the CBn reviews were. Alot of people seemed very happy with the movie, just like we are now with CR. If you page through this thread you'll see that it gets revisited about 9 months after the opening, and the 'Best Bond ever' feeling has faded some, but most still liked the first half of the movie.

Do you think the opinions of CR will have cooled 9 months from now, after the luster of opening night has worn off, and the DVD has allowed a much closer inspection?

[K1Bond007]

Dude, we're Bond fans. There is something inherently wrong if we walk out of a Bond film not thinking it's one of the best Bond films we've seen. That day and probably week we're all on a high. It all changes after that week though. This is why I refrained from reviewing Casino Royale.

Also, that said, I walked out of Die Another Day embarrassed. The only Bond film I saw in the theater that I was not happy with when I left the theater. Of course the first Bond film I recall seeing in the theater was GoldenEye so clearly I don't have a long track record, but I'm 4 for 5 now.

[right idea, wrong pussy]

Here is why I dusted this old chestnut off:
I saw CR twice during its opening week and it is such a departure from 'The Formula' that I wanted to see how it compares to its Brosnan's last outing DAD.

I watched DAD tonight along with someone who managed to never see it before, and they liked it! Other than the awful CGI and the story bogging down generally from the ice palace on, I enjoyed it also. I think the personal power afforded by DVD allows issues that seemed minor in the theater to be magnified until they can overshadow an pretty good movie.

I know DAD gets panned here regularly - and there are some weak parts to it. I wanted to go back in the time machine to 4 years ago, immediately after its big opening weekend and see what the CBn reviews were. Alot of people seemed very happy with the movie, just like we are now with CR. If you page through this thread you'll see that it gets revisited about 9 months after the opening, and the 'Best Bond ever' feeling has faded some, but most still liked the first half of the movie.

Do you think the opinions of CR will have cooled 9 months from now, after the luster of opening night has worn off, and the DVD has allowed a much closer inspection?

I think you've hit the nail squarely and sharply on the head, Double-0-7. I have seen members on these forums give DAD good reviews when it first came out and then pan it as horrible a year or so later. The main lesson here is that most people are very inconstant. They flip and turn with the wind. Thus, because CR is being lauded by the media and other Bond fans, everyone (except the occasional contrarian who gains pleasure from being "difficult") feels the need to praise the movie. I think that CR is indeed a good movie and won't fall to earth quite as precipitously as DAD did, but all of this "Craig is so wonderful, I want to have his baby!!" stuff will (hopefully) cool a bit as time goes on. Craig might become the greatest Bond ever and CR might stay firmly in most fan's top 5, but only time, and introspection, will tell.

[JimmyBond]

Here is why I dusted this old chestnut off:
I saw CR twice during its opening week and it is such a departure from 'The Formula' that I wanted to see how it compares to its Brosnan's last outing DAD.

I watched DAD tonight along with someone who managed to never see it before, and they liked it! Other than the awful CGI and the story bogging down generally from the ice palace on, I enjoyed it also. I think the personal power afforded by DVD allows issues that seemed minor in the theater to be magnified until they can overshadow an pretty good movie.

I know DAD gets panned here regularly - and there are some weak parts to it. I wanted to go back in the time machine to 4 years ago, immediately after its big opening weekend and see what the CBn reviews were. Alot of people seemed very happy with the movie, just like we are now with CR. If you page through this thread you'll see that it gets revisited about 9 months after the opening, and the 'Best Bond ever' feeling has faded some, but most still liked the first half of the movie.

Do you think the opinions of CR will have cooled 9 months from now, after the luster of opening night has worn off, and the DVD has allowed a much closer inspection?

I think you've hit the nail squarely and sharply on the head, Double-0-7. I have seen members on these forums give DAD good reviews when it first came out and then pan it as horrible a year or so later. The main lesson here is that most people are very inconstant. They flip and turn with the wind. Thus, because CR is being lauded by the media and other Bond fans, everyone (except the occasional contrarian who gains pleasure from being "difficult") feels the need to praise the movie. I think that CR is indeed a good movie and won't fall to earth quite as precipitously as DAD did, but all of this "Craig is so wonderful, I want to have his baby!!" stuff will (hopefully) cool a bit as time goes on. Craig might become the greatest Bond ever and CR might stay firmly in most fan's top 5, but only time, and introspection, will tell.

Interesting points, both of you, and not ones I entirely disagree with. However, I would like to point out, that I was at least one of the people "not" saying DAD was the best Bond film upon leaving the theater, in fact I had quite a few mixed feelings about it. I felt the finale was a bit sill and all over the place (I never cared for the emphasis placed on Jinx). To say I had mixed feelings leaving the theater would be more accurate, now I enjoy DAD for what it is. I also left TND with mixed feelings, and now it's my favorite Brosnan Bond film. Ironically though, I left TWINE proclaiming it to be the best Bond film ever, and now I place it very low on my list.

Will CR stay as high up as I consider it to be? Probably, it's on a whole different level than the Brosnan films, so I doubt I'll look at it in a different light later on, but I'm hesitant to call it the Best Bond ever without seeing it at least one more time in the theaters

[Jim]

Rubbish then, worse now.

[Double-0-7]

Rubbish then, worse now.

At least Jim is consistent!

[Loomis]

It's a better Bond movie than CASINO ROYALE.

Although CASINO ROYALE is the better Bond film.

[marktmurphy]

Best Bond film of all time? I've learned not to answer that until I've had a dozen or so viewings, but this movie definitely rates up toward the top.

Bit of a change of tune there! As John himself said:

Okay, maybe it wasn't "the best Bond film ever", but it was unquestionably the best Bond theater going experience I've ever had and maybe that had something to do with it. When I'm in the mood, I'm easily seduced.

But yes, at the time I must say I thought this thread was a bit ridiculous and even more so now.

[Roebuck]

Alot of people seemed very happy with the movie, just like we are now with CR. If you page through this thread you'll see that it gets revisited about 9 months after the opening, and the 'Best Bond ever' feeling has faded some, but most still liked the first half of the movie.

Doubt there will be the same drop off in terms of fan support for CR as there was for DAD, simply because CR is a much more balanced film.

For the first half of DAD it's shaping up to be the jewel of the Brosnan tenure, then cancels itself out with a second half that, although packed with spectacle and action, somehow manages to be tediously uninteresting.

Casino Royale sets out it's intentions (a harsher, more realistic Bond) early on and I think fans made up their minds very quickly whether or not it was the Bond for them.

[Mr_Wint]

Interesting points, both of you, and not ones I entirely disagree with. However, I would like to point out, that I was at least one of the people "not" saying DAD was the best Bond film upon leaving the theater, in fact I had quite a few mixed feelings about it. I felt the finale was a bit sill and all over the place (I never cared for the emphasis placed on Jinx). To say I had mixed feelings leaving the theater would be more accurate, now I enjoy DAD for what it is.

ROFL

I'm confused now. Is there two users on this forum that use the nick 'JimmyBond' or didn't we discussed this earlier.

http://debrief.comma...p...c=36544&hl=

Edited by Mr_Wint, 26 November 2006 - 04:21 PM.

[ComplimentsOfSharky]

It's a better Bond movie than CASINO ROYALE.

Although CASINO ROYALE is the better Bond film.

well said...

But the DAD finale is awful no matter how you slice it, I'll hold to that until the day I die.

[Double-0-7]

It's a better Bond movie than CASINO ROYALE.

Although CASINO ROYALE is the better Bond film.

well said...

But the DAD finale is awful no matter how you slice it, I'll hold to that until the day I die.

The finale was lame, a real CGI-fest. I enjoyed the first half of the movie and parts of the second. Being able to hit the 'skip' button on the DVD eliminates several bad scenes quickly and efficiently, leaving an overall enjoyable movie!

[ComplimentsOfSharky]

It's a better Bond movie than CASINO ROYALE.

Although CASINO ROYALE is the better Bond film.

well said...

But the DAD finale is awful no matter how you slice it, I'll hold to that until the day I die.

The finale was lame, a real CGI-fest. I enjoyed the first half of the movie and parts of the second. Being able to hit the 'skip' button on the DVD eliminates several bad scenes quickly and efficiently, leaving an overall enjoyable movie!

I always said if you spliced the best bits of TWINE and DAD, you'd have a top 5 Bond movie, but it still wouldn't have an ending...

[JimmyBond]

Interesting points, both of you, and not ones I entirely disagree with. However, I would like to point out, that I was at least one of the people "not" saying DAD was the best Bond film upon leaving the theater, in fact I had quite a few mixed feelings about it. I felt the finale was a bit sill and all over the place (I never cared for the emphasis placed on Jinx). To say I had mixed feelings leaving the theater would be more accurate, now I enjoy DAD for what it is.

ROFL

I'm confused now. Is there two users on this forum that use the nick 'JimmyBond' or didn't we discussed this earlier.

http://debrief.comma...p...c=36544&hl=

And I'm confused as well. Where does it say I can't change my opinion on a film four years after I've seen it? If you want to make sense, stop quoting posts I made four years ago, opinions change over time, you should know that.

[Taro Todoroki]

Rubbish then, worse now.

[zencat]

Gee, thanks for dusting this off.

I explained why I reacted this way to DAD in this thread (which is where we should be having this conversation, IMO.)

For the record, I still like DAD. It's my second fav Brosnan film. Everytime I watch this movie I think, "Why do fans trash this movie so much?" (Again, see the other thread for the reasons why.)

And people can change their opinions. My opinon of DAD really hasn't changed all that much, but my opinions of TWINE (like it much less than in '99) and LTK (like it much more than in '89) certainly have.

[B5Erik]

Where does it say I can't change my opinion on a film four years after I've seen it? If you want to make sense, stop quoting posts I made four years ago, opinions change over time, you should know that.

Absolutely true.

Even though I still feel EXACTLY the same way about DAD now that I did then (LOVE the first half, but found the 2nd half to be really, REALLY disappointing).

But my opinion of TLD changed. The first time I saw that one I thought, "This is a good movie, but that Dalton guy is WAY too serious." Then I read a Bond novel, and saw LTK and suddenly a light came on and I "got it."

Opinions do change over time in many cases.

Just not for me and that debacle that was the 2nd half of DAD....

(And, for the record, even the 2nd half of DAD was still somewhat entertaining and watchable - there are just moments that make me groan out loud in disbelief.)

[Mr_Wint]

There's nothing wrong with changing opinions. Absolutly not! But why is it so hard for Bondfans to admit it? Why cant they be honest?

[JimmyBond]

There's nothing wrong with changing opinions. Absolutly not! But why is it so hard for Bondfans to admit it? Why cant they be honest?

Admit what?

[Lazenby880]

It's a better Bond movie than CASINO ROYALE.

Although CASINO ROYALE is the better Bond film.

If by 'better Bond movie' you mean 'better' in the sense of slavish adherence to a bankrupt formula then you are probably correct.

Personally, by any standard Die Another Day is simply not good. It seemed at the time the ultimate triumph of the derivative over the daring, however the latter has been found at last. The dense thinking that produced Die Another Day has been buried, hopefully once and for all.

Edited by Lazenby880, 27 November 2006 - 07:04 AM.

[Double-0-7]

I didn't dig this review out of the archives for more DAD bashing - just the opposite!

Another thread asks "Can you watch the earlier Bond movies after seeing CR", which made me think a comparision was in order. After watching DAD - and enjoying it last night, I wanted to compare the early reviews of it to the current CR reviews.

It takes a little time to see the warts, and I'm sure some will appear on CR eventually, but regardless what those may be, it is a great movie that will be a milestone in the history of Bond movies.

[killkenny kid]

Rubbish then, worse now.

come on, Jim. How do you really feel about this movie?

[ACE]

For the record, I still like DAD. It's my second fav Brosnan film. Everytime I watch this movie I think, "Why do fans trash this movie so much?" (Again, see the other thread for the reasons why.)

And people can change their opinions. My opinon of DAD really hasn't changed all that much,

Yup, I really like DAD, for all it's flaws. And CR will be subject to nitpicking down the line. But as has already been pointed out on the reboot of this thread, as Bond fans it's hardly surprising we like, love, adore a Bond film upon initial release.

Personally, by any standard Die Another Day is simply not good. I

Ah, that's because you're not a Fleming fan. You cannot see Fleming's Bond run through Brosnan's performance like writing through rock candy!


DAD still holds up in my book. Brosnan and Berry are terrific.
And, it could be argued, CR built on what TWINE and DAD started.

[Vanish]

Back when DAD was released, I loved the first half and hated every second of the second half.

4 years later, save for the marvelous title sequence, I absolutely loathe the head, the tail, the whole damn thing.

And Berry is still the most annoying and poorly written Bond girl ever - That stylized closeup of her cocking her gun before infiltrating Graves' hideout makes me gag every time I see it.