78 replies to this topic

[Guy Haines]

There is an anecdote about STAR TREK - The Motion Picture, no idea whether there is any truth to it: Harlan Ellison sits with the executives of Paramount discussing possible story ideas for STTMP. The top suit calls for something BIG, Ellison pitches this: '...and after crossing the universe the Enterprise comes to this gigantic wall, there's no going around it so they try to break through and that wall starts coming apart and behind it is the face of God.'
...(silence for a few seconds)
'Fine, okay. Can't you think of something BIGGER?'

LOL! And of course five movies later in the Trek franchise they did come across the "Face of God" and Kirk asked this question - "If you're God, why do you need a starship?" Answers on a postcard please...... ;-)

[Harmsway]

 

 

I'm so glad they didn't make Tanner a Spectre mole. I would have hated that.

Me too. I was glad it didn't happen.

 

Same. They then even toyed with the idea of M as the mole, until Fiennes pushed back very strongly and apparently angrily, saying he wouldn't do it.

 

I wouldn't have minded Tanner being a mole. His character in the Craig era has been such a non-entity that you might as well take him in that direction. Additionally, having a pre-existing character turn out to be a SPECTRE team member would have had significantly more bite than anything they did with C.

[RMc2]

The two problems I have with Spectre - a film I mainly loved - was the Blofeld/Bond childhood thread but, most damningly, the whole last act.

 

1) We've already seen a helicopter in this film, we don't need to see another.

 

2) Who cares if Blofeld's program goes online at midnight when it can be easily taken offline again almost immediately?

 

If this act had been switched for a better one, the film would have been better. But I still think it's a good film and better, in my view, than Skyfall.

 

1) I put this down to, presumably, Mendes' need for a ring structure, where the ending reflects the beginning.

 

PTS: Bond follows a man (walking), chases him onto a helicopter to kill him, stops the helicopter from crashing and flies away

 

End: Bond shoots down a helicopter to not kill a man, and walks away

 

(also both decisions are affected by the orders of a woman: M to kill Sciarra, Madeleine to spare lives)

 

 

2) I agree! It should've ended at the Morocco base - 60 seconds to destroy the base and escape is far too short an action scene.

 

And since there's another helicopter there too, Mendes could still have got his ring structure.

[Tiin007]

I wouldn't have minded Tanner being a mole. His character in the Craig era has been such a non-entity that you might as well take him in that direction. Additionally, having a pre-existing character turn out to be a SPECTRE team member would have had significantly more bite than anything they did with C.

 

 

 

That's why I think it should have been Villiers whom Bond was chasing in Sienna right after the PTS of QoS. Think about it-- he had spent the entirety of CR by M's side, following her to the Bahamas, and essentially acting as her personal secretary in much the same way that Lois Maxwell  had followed Bernard Lee's M wherever he went. Villiers being a mole and freeing White would have had more emotional impact than the character of Mitchell being created solely for that purpose. And since Tanner ended up essentially taking the "Villier's role" for the remainder of QoS, it would have explained what happened to Villier's, and would have nicely paved the way for the return of the first familiar member of the MI6 team-- Tanner.

[Matt_13]

Man that would have been a great twist with Villiars, I'd never thought of that.

[DavidJones]

I'd have loved too! It would have made people notice Villiers too, as he was background in CR. I thought it was a neat choice, at the time, to have Moneypenny effectively replace by a man in his 20s. It's not an age you see a lot in Bond films.

[DaveBond21]

I didn't like Villiers.

[glidrose]

1) I put this down to, presumably, Mendes' need for a ring structure, where the ending reflects the beginning.

Also known as "bookends" or a bookend structure.

[RMc2]

 

1) I put this down to, presumably, Mendes' need for a ring structure, where the ending reflects the beginning.

Also known as "bookends" or a bookend structure.

 

 

Thank you

[Gobi-1]

I always thought that Villiers was intended to be the mole in Quantum of Solace but Tobias Menzies wasn't available for filming and so they had to create a new character.

[Professor Pi]

Isn't he kind of scrawny?  Bond would have beaten the crap out of him!

[DaveBond21]

Isn't he kind of scrawny?  Bond would have beaten the crap out of him!

 

Exactly. He actually looked like a real mole - the animal.

[Matt_13]

Probably won't be seeing the awesome cage fight idea any time soon. Looks like Paul Greengrass and co. are doing something similar for the next Bourne outing.

[MattofSteel]

Probably won't be seeing the awesome cage fight idea any time soon. Looks like Paul Greengrass and co. are doing something similar for the next Bourne outing.

 

Immediately thought the same thing. Fine with it. Suits Bourne better than Bond. 

[sharpshooter]

 

Probably won't be seeing the awesome cage fight idea any time soon. Looks like Paul Greengrass and co. are doing something similar for the next Bourne outing.

 

Immediately thought the same thing. Fine with it. Suits Bourne better than Bond. 

 

I agree with that. Craig's Bond spent his downtime playing drinking games with scorpions, becoming a hero at the local bar. Bourne gets in a cage and beats everyone up. 

[SecretAgentFan]

That´s the difference between Bond and Bourne.  Bond is not violent because he likes to.  Only if he has to be.

[Matt_13]

Good observations all.

[RMc2]

It'll be interesting to see how much, if at all, Bond 25 reacts to Bourne 5!

[trevanian]

There is an anecdote about STAR TREK - The Motion Picture, no idea whether there is any truth to it: Harlan Ellison sits with the executives of Paramount discussing possible story ideas for STTMP. The top suit calls for something BIG, Ellison pitches this: '...and after crossing the universe the Enterprise comes to this gigantic wall, there's no going around it so they try to break through and that wall starts coming apart and behind it is the face of God.'
...(silence for a few seconds)
'Fine, okay. Can't you think of something BIGGER?'

It's a gag; the real story of Ellison's main involvement on pitching a first TREK film is in a huge footnote in Stephen King's Danse Macabre, and involves dumbass producer (guy's major credit is I believe SUMMER SCHOOL with Mark Harmon) demanding Ellison work Mayans into a story that takes place in the 23rd century and millions of years earlier and Ellison of course not going for the okey-doke.

 

I did finally see SPECTRE a couple days ago on streaming and didn't hate it like I expected to; QUANTUM is still the only Craig pic I enjoy rewatching (mainly for Tosca and the Russia scene), but this would easily slot in above CR and SKYFALL, just because I don't find EVERYTHING about it objectionable. The stuff with Blofeld in the room full of computers actually works very well; if the other 2-1/2 hrs were anywhere near as engaging I'd have been over the moon about it.