612 replies to this topic

[Orion]

EDIT: Written something else, then changed my mind.

In it's place I shall reiterate that I think Christopher Nolan or Matthew Vaughn would be brilliant for Bond. Especially given the loving tributes made to Bond throughout their respective filmographies. I'd recommend Inception for the former or X-Men: First Class for the latter as both contain intentionally very Bondian Characters (Tom Hardy's Eames for Inception, Michael Fassbender's Magneto for X-Men: First Class)
 

[Jim]

 His entire career is predicated on Heath Ledger dying. 

 

 

Bit too fierce, that.

 

Also - not really entire career, is it?

[Simon]

I probably should've put Joe Wright in the "maybe" list since his name has never been mentioned officially.  Edited to change.

 

Forgot about Greengrass, although: would Bond want Bourne's director?  Seems like that would be chasing the tail of another successful franchise, not that one can't make a case for it having been done before (MR following "Star Wars", SF having villain / plot elements in common with "The Dark Knight", even QOS being stylistically similar to Bourne right down to the 2nd unit director).

 

Dave

 

JJ Abrahms moved smoothly from one Star (Trek) to another Star (Wars), maybe setting the precedent of same directors for like genres, and thus holding short the sniffiness over Greengrass's potential involvement.

 

Cue the onslaught of coomment; 'Wars is nuttin' like Trek, you moron.'  The shoulders are broad.

[Harmsway]

Christopher Nolan isn't very good at surrealism, exoticism, eroticism, action, or humor. That makes him a very poor match for Bond. That said, EON has reached out to him a few times, so we know he's on the list. If Mendes doesn't come back for the next one, Nolan will at least get a call.

[Dustin]

And Nolan may just say yes.

[Pierceuhhh]

Before Ledger died and gave his terrible movie a "mystique" it certainly didn't deserve, Nolan was a hack who'd made the dreadful INSOMNIA and the unwatchable BATMAN BEGINS, which got blah reviews, made about a quarter of what they were expecting, and barely, BARELY, got a sequel. I strongly suspect The Dark Knight would have gone down the same track.

If not for that fortuitous death, Nolan would be doing Katherine Heigl supernatural thrillers. He'd probably still be a contender for Bond, unfortunately!

But that would suck, because like Harmsway said above, Nolan can't do surreal, funny, glib, exotic, etc. The "love scenes" in Dark Knight Rises were like someone banging Barbie and Ken dolls together. He's a completely empty vessel, but without even the "he can at least shoot scenes in such a way as they make sense" of John Glen. JOHN GLEN!!!!!

[x007AceOfSpades]

Nolan was a hack who'd made the dreadful INSOMNIA and the unwatchable BATMAN BEGINS, which got blah reviews

You're right, they did get "blah" reviews.

 

[JohnnyWalker]

Nolan would be doing Katherine Heigl supernatural thrillers. 

I'd watch that.

[rubixcub]

One question nags: for the entire duration of the series, the producers have actively avoided using American directors.  Now Shane Black is on the long list, and some feel he's quite likely.  Why?  What separates him from the other Americans who've put their hand up and what propels him past the legacy?

 

Dave

[Pierceuhhh]

If you're going to suggest an American director, why not one that actually exhibits the Bond ethos? Why do we keep seeing ridiculous names like Black, Michael Mann, or god forbid Spielberg, who would not in a million years ever be able to handle a Bond movie, even in his prime?

I think it's because we live in a cyber-world where it's mainly obese shut-ins aged between 15 and 30 who post about movies, and their entire frame of reference for movies ranges from HEAT to INDIANA JONES. Nobody can appreciate the solid stodginess of someone like... I don't know... Martin Brest or David Koepp, because nobody watches those production line movies any more?

I'm not using "production line" as an insult! My favourite movies, i.e. the Bond movies for instance, are production line movies. There's a purity to them that makes them so much less insufferable than whatever Christopher Nolan's "vision" is.

[Jim]

Right, so cutting through all this, your suggestions are Martin Brest or David Koepp. Or their ilk, whatever it should be.

 

Fair enough.

 

Not sure it needed all the energetic abuse to have suggested that. Seems inefficient. The idea here is who would be, not who wouldn't be - that's a wholly different conversation, and one you appear to be having with yourself.

[tdalton]

Right, so cutting through all this, your suggestions are Martin Brest or David Koepp. Or their ilk, whatever it should be.

 

Fair enough.

 

Not sure it needed all the energetic abuse to have suggested that. Seems inefficient.

 

I guess you learn something new every day.  Liking Heat and Steven Spielberg's films make you a morbidly obese shut-in.  Who knew.  I guess I'll get on the treadmill tomorrow while watching a double-bill of Meet Joe Black  and Gigli to try to make up for all of those lost years.

[Jim]

Well, don't take it personally. We are none of these film director people. I suspect the nub of it is that most folks, out there, don't care or know who directs Bond films (I tend to think that's true) and the series has thrived well enough without having major names attached to it, at least for the majority of its existence. I think I've heard of this Martin Brest chap so he might not be as much of the John Glen ilk as seems to be being suggested.

 

I suppose it's whether one thinks John Glen's Bond films are any good and that is the sort of standard the Bond series needs to embrace once more. 

[SecretAgentFan]

I think it's because we live in a cyber-world where it's mainly obese shut-ins aged between 15 and 30 who post about movies, and their entire frame of reference for movies ranges from HEAT to INDIANA JONES. Nobody can appreciate the solid stodginess of someone like... I don't know... Martin Brest or David Koepp, because nobody watches those production line movies any more?

 

I apoligize for letting this drag on - but it´s too tempting.

 

Your frame of reference seems to lack a certain frame of reference, Pierceuhhh.  Martin Brest was considered an auteur during the high time of his career, and he would have felt very insulted if you had called his films "production line".  As for David Koepp - you surely know that he is mainly a script writer who rose to fame as Spielberg´s "closer" before attempting a second career as - you guessed it - an auteur as well.  Only he never had the success to be accepted as an auteur.

 

Personally, I would say Martin Brest´s films did suffer from a lack of editing, resulting in overlength, approaching the three hour mark.  I don´t think that´s beneficial for Bond.

 

And Koepp, strangely, since he is a writer, does have problems with making characters and plot gel, IMO.  Not a good fit for Bond either.

 

Yeah, yeah, yeah, you only mentioned those two names as examples for like-minded directors.  And that´s the old discussion about whether Bond directors should have more of a personal approach or be solid workmen.

 

Considering Christopher Nolan - well, nobody is liked by everyone.  You obviously hate him, also for his success.  I do like him.  It has been reported that he met with EON.  That might result in an actual offer some time down the line.  If he actually will direct a Bond film I hope he will show that he does have more humour than people think he has.

 

But, Pierceuhh, please consider this: preferring something and disliking something else always is absolutely subjective.  And to pour hate on people who like something you do not will not help your argument.  Discuss it by all means - but find solid   reasons for your thinking.

[Dustin]

I suspect the nub of it is that most folks, out there, don't care or know who directs Bond films (I tend to think that's true) and the series has thrived well enough without having major names attached to it, at least for the majority of its existence.

I can attest to that. I've been a fan since TSWLM; prior to TND I never used to care who directed the things, nor did I give the announcements of celebrated directors a second thought. To me it was Bond and that just meant its own genre. And I used to feel the story itself was more important than the director - though that is probably the wrong way to look at it. Ideally the film should make you forget about its parts and just let you enjoy the ride, for 90 per cent of the audience that's enough. The examination of script, cinematography, direction, composition - that's all stuff for the hardcore fans and cineastes. The audience of course notices all this. But rarely in a conscious manner.

[rubixcub]

Wasn't "suggesting" Shane Black, only noticing that he was apparently on EON's long list, which flies in the face of their own long-standing tradition.

 

My question was: why is Shane Black on EON's long list of potential Bond directors when they've actively avoided hiring American directors?  What separates him from any other American director who's put his hand up?

 

Dave

[Orion]

Wasn't "suggesting" Shane Black, only noticing that he was apparently on EON's long list, which flies in the face of their own long-standing tradition.

 

My question was: why is Shane Black on EON's long list of potential Bond directors when they've actively avoided hiring American directors?  What separates him from any other American director who's put his hand up?

 

Dave

Those long lists you see online that "top bond boses" (complete with the bad spelling) are apparently thinking of, are normally pulled out of the "journalists" arse using directors who currently have a popular film out.

However IF it was true, Shame Black is one of those directors who is very popular with actors because he's also a writer who has a tendency to give characters witty dialogue and clever monologues, I would imagine that he'd be considered for the job at Daniel Craig's behest, similar to how Roger Michell and Sam Mendes were immediate front runners due to their past collaborations with Daniel Craig (namely The Mother and Enduring Love for Michell, Road To Perdition for Mendes).


 

[Pierceuhhh]

Roger Michell would be perfect. Neil Marshall? Joel Hopkins?

I chose David Koepp because Mortdecai looked like exactly the type of movie that should have come out in 1968 with Roger Moore in it!

Every scene Nolan directs just dies a death on the screen. Every sub-Guy Hamilton joke falls flat. He's already made 8 hours of unwatchable Batman movies! He's already ruined one potentially great movie franchise for a generation! I'd take it personally if he ruined James Bond too! Worse, he doesn't even particularly seem to enjoy making movies.

No American director should go anywhere near Bond as a rule. The closest we had was Spottiswoode (Canadian?) and look what happened there.

[Jim]

Every scene Nolan directs just dies a death on the screen. Every sub-Guy Hamilton joke falls flat. He's already made 8 hours of unwatchable Batman movies! He's already ruined one potentially great movie franchise for a generation! I'd take it personally if he ruined James Bond too! Worse, he doesn't even particularly seem to enjoy making movies.
 

 

Did he hit your gran, or something? When you say his films are unwatchable, presumably you must have watched them in order to form this view? That's probably all he could ask of you, I suspect.

 

Not wholly convinced either that the argument that closer physical proximity of a place of birth to the USA = weaker Bond film, is absolutely watertight.

[Pierceuhhh]

Obviously someone's upbringing would kind of affect the way they see the world & make their movies. Richard Lester, probably the most British American director there is, still never made any movies that felt authentically British.

That said, Broccoli and Saltzman were each about as British as my gran that that Chrisdurrrrrpher Nolan beat up, and their vision for Bond works for me. Who knows? It's probably more a generational thing.

But imagine seriously for a moment that Spielberg had made a Bond movie in 1979. Think of the shouting, the babbling, the Godly light shining on everyone, the incessant music, the screaming kids, the unflatteringly filmed leading ladies who look like downtrodden single mothers. Bullet dodged there - THANK YOU CUBBY!

[SecretAgentFan]

You shouldn´t have brought up MORTDECAI.  It kind of implodes your whole argument.

[Jim]

Obviously someone's upbringing would kind of affect the way they see the world & make their movies. Richard Lester, probably the most British American director there is, still never made any movies that felt authentically British.

That said, Broccoli and Saltzman were each about as British as my gran that that Chrisdurrrrrpher Nolan beat up, and their vision for Bond works for me. Who knows? It's probably more a generational thing.

But imagine seriously for a moment that Spielberg had made a Bond movie in 1979. Think of the shouting, the babbling, the Godly light shining on everyone, the incessant music, the screaming kids, the unflatteringly filmed leading ladies who look like downtrodden single mothers. Bullet dodged there - THANK YOU CUBBY!

 

Not sure about the Lester thing - The Mouse on the Moon feels authentically British to me. Margaret Rutherford and Terry-Thomas? Fretfully British. As for A Hard Day's Night...

 

Yeah, the bloke what made Jaws would have been terrible.

[Pierceuhhh]

It's not like I said Mortdecai was any good or anything! I haven't even seen it! It just looks like a throwback to that sort of Michael Caine Euro co-production DVD bargain bin filler genre of movie. But let's not pretend that Mortdecai is any sillier or less worthy than, say, Moonraker. And I like Moonraker.

[Pierceuhhh]

Hard Day's Night doesn't have the clarity of a good British movie. Too much babbling and lumpenness. Honestly, I think Guy Hamilton could have done a good Beatles movie. And I think Ipcress File, directed by a Canadian, is definitely the clunkiest and least British Harry Palmer movie. Guy Hamilton & Ken Russell's are great! I would've loved to see a Ken Russell Bond movie, but maybe only one.

Spielberg can and has directed a good American suburbia shark movie. A Bond movie needs a glibness and lack of sincerity, and when Spielberg tries to do that, it's painful (Catch Me If You Can... Ugh....)

[Jim]

...or it's Raiders of the Lost Ark.

 

Struggling a bit in grasping all aspects of your definition of Britishness within a film. Perhaps it doesn't have clarity. Perhaps I don't. Perhaps I never will.

 

Clarity, then. Anything else?

 

The Spy who came in from the Cold is quite clear, I find. But then it was made by an American, so I'm not sure where we now are with that.

 

Bit of clarity? Do help.

[Pierceuhhh]

Apologies for incoherence. I'm on an iPhone and am not willing to die in a ditch over this. Cultural differences exist & movies reflect them. The Avengers has an identical premise to Get Smart, but you couldn't swap the countries of origin or the creative teams. The Dirty Dozen is essentially a character comedy set in the quaint English countryside, but you wouldn't confuse it with Dad's Army.

Raiders of the Lost Ark just gets more juvenile and noisy as I get older. Karen Allen & Paul Freeman are diabolical. And as I get older, Moonraker just gets funnier and more admirably detached. Go figure!

More food for thought: Goldeneye IMO feels British, and DAD feels American. The directors are New Zealanders. Maibaum was American and was almost irreplaceable. Obviously there are no rules, but there are trends.

Tom Hardy delivers a garbled speech to a blank wall after his audience leaves at one point in Dark Knight Rises. Nolan should have cameras confiscated from him.

[Orion]

Apologies for incoherence. I'm on an iPhone and am not willing to die in a ditch over this. Cultural differences exist & movies reflect them. The Avengers has an identical premise to Get Smart, but you couldn't swap the countries of origin or the creative teams. The Dirty Dozen is essentially a character comedy set in the quaint English countryside, but you wouldn't confuse it with Dad's Army.

Raiders of the Lost Ark just gets more juvenile and noisy as I get older. Karen Allen & Paul Freeman are diabolical. And as I get older, Moonraker just gets funnier and more admirably detached. Go figure!

More food for thought: Goldeneye IMO feels British, and DAD feels American. The directors are New Zealanders. Maibaum was American and was almost irreplaceable. Obviously there are no rules, but there are trends.

Tom Hardy delivers a garbled speech to a blank wall after his audience leaves at one point in Dark Knight Rises. Nolan should have cameras confiscated from him.

Did Nolan sleep with your mother whilst smoking your prize cigars?

[SecretAgentFan]

Please, don´t mention MORTDECAI and MOONRAKER in one sentence.

Please, don´t mention MORTDECAI and MOONRAKER in one sentence.

 

Apologies for incoherence. I'm on an iPhone and am not willing to die in a ditch over this. Cultural differences exist & movies reflect them. The Avengers has an identical premise to Get Smart, but you couldn't swap the countries of origin or the creative teams. The Dirty Dozen is essentially a character comedy set in the quaint English countryside, but you wouldn't confuse it with Dad's Army.

Raiders of the Lost Ark just gets more juvenile and noisy as I get older. Karen Allen & Paul Freeman are diabolical. And as I get older, Moonraker just gets funnier and more admirably detached. Go figure!

More food for thought: Goldeneye IMO feels British, and DAD feels American. The directors are New Zealanders. Maibaum was American and was almost irreplaceable. Obviously there are no rules, but there are trends.

Tom Hardy delivers a garbled speech to a blank wall after his audience leaves at one point in Dark Knight Rises. Nolan should have cameras confiscated from him.

Did Nolan sleep with your mother whilst smoking your prize cigars?

 

 

C´mon - that was uncalled for.

[Pierceuhhh]

Judging by his movies, Nolan's idea of sleeping with someone is making accidental eye contact while wearing pyjamas and sipping tea.

The perfect contender to direct a Bond, a franchise famous for its asexuality and lack of humour!

[Orion]

Please, don´t mention MORTDECAI and MOONRAKER in one sentence.

Please, don´t mention MORTDECAI and MOONRAKER in one sentence.

 

Apologies for incoherence. I'm on an iPhone and am not willing to die in a ditch over this. Cultural differences exist & movies reflect them. The Avengers has an identical premise to Get Smart, but you couldn't swap the countries of origin or the creative teams. The Dirty Dozen is essentially a character comedy set in the quaint English countryside, but you wouldn't confuse it with Dad's Army.

Raiders of the Lost Ark just gets more juvenile and noisy as I get older. Karen Allen & Paul Freeman are diabolical. And as I get older, Moonraker just gets funnier and more admirably detached. Go figure!

More food for thought: Goldeneye IMO feels British, and DAD feels American. The directors are New Zealanders. Maibaum was American and was almost irreplaceable. Obviously there are no rules, but there are trends.

Tom Hardy delivers a garbled speech to a blank wall after his audience leaves at one point in Dark Knight Rises. Nolan should have cameras confiscated from him.

Did Nolan sleep with your mother whilst smoking your prize cigars?

 

 

C´mon - that was uncalled for.

He started the conversation claiming Nolan launched his career off someone's death. The moral bar was very much dropped at that point.