935 replies to this topic

[dinovelvet]

I think we'll need to discuss whether Pepper is killed or not - it does seem a bit distasteful. Though I do like the idea of using him in West Germany.

I thought we had agreed on Pepper being in West Germany on a tour of German castles - as said above, not sure about killing him off.

I vote no on killing Pepper; killing a comic character does not fit the Rog era at all. If this were a Dalton or Craig film, maybe you could get away with it, but this is the era of fun and games, people!
We can keep him in Germany if that works better...but since he is an "ally", he has to do something to help Bond, not just stand there and get flattened by a suit of armour. We could move my proposed death trap sequence involving Bond and JW to the German castle instead (it seems a more likely place to have secret passages, etc!)

[Mr. Blofeld]

How about Double or Nothing?

[terminus]

We'll add it to the list - though if we're using an '- or Nothing' title, we may as well use 'Everything or Nothing'.

[coco1997]

I prefer the idea of using something with 'moon' or 'lunar' in the title.

[SamuelKevlar]

I like Everything Or Nothing, and it has the strongest Flemingian connection, but I'd have to keep from thinking of the game. Not so keen on anything with Moon in the title - Moonraker is only four years away, and from their 1975 perspective they would actually choose Moonraker over any other title.

With regards to death traps and caverns under Neuschwanstein, keep in mind that it's not an actual Medieval castle but a fairytale edifice built on the orders of Mad King Ludwig in the 19th Century. And John Barry should definitely pop in some Wagner during this sequence. Concerning killing off Pepper, seeing him flattened would give me more enjoyment than any contribution he's made in LALD and TMWTGG, but I'll go with group consensus.

As for the title sequence, if not moon imagery (which again is more Moonraker's field), how about Medieval iconography, chivalry, Bayeaux tapestry style but modernised, Bond's family crest, etc. For the religious element you can bring in the ancient symbols of mysterious orders like the All-Seeing Eye of the Illuminati.

Edited by SamuelKevlar, 07 December 2010 - 10:03 PM.

[Captain Tightpants]

The problem with that is that there's only really one character and one location connected with medieval times, so it's a bit obscure.

Personally, I'd go in for imagery of an eclipse, because that's kind of what the villains are going for. Remember, the plot is to detonate a nuclear device over the Terminator line so that the explosion is backlit by the sun and visible to everyone on earth. But instead of having the moon eclipsing the sun, I'd have a dancing girl do it, so that we'd only see a silhouette of her outlined by a bright white streak.

[terminus]

As for the title sequence, if not moon imagery (which again is more Moonraker's field), how about Medieval iconography, chivalry, Bayeaux tapestry style but modernised, Bond's family crest, etc. For the religious element you can bring in the ancient symbols of mysterious orders like the All-Seeing Eye of the Illuminati.

Personally, I'd go in for imagery of an eclipse, because that's kind of what the villains are going for. Remember, the plot is to detonate a nuclear device over the Terminator line so that the explosion is backlit by the sun and visible to everyone on earth. But instead of having the moon eclipsing the sun, I'd have a dancing girl do it, so that we'd only see a silhouette of her outlined by a bright white streak.

I'm sure we could do something with the eclipse imagery - maybe include women-shaped missiles being launched from canons into the moon, which would then morph into the curves of a woman and we'd get the eclipse imagery. This, mixed in with some mixed ancient religious symbols and icons like the All-Seeing Eye could make an interestingly traditional Moore-esque.

The one thing that Moore has more than the others is a good transition from PTS into the titles (the woman unzipping her top in AVTAK, the parachute in TSWLM and the circus tent in MR) and wondering what that would be for EON.

[Captain Tightpants]

I'm thinking maybe it should be some sort of fireworks display. The hotel could be celebrating its grand opening during the entire pre-title sequence (thus giving Bond a reason to be there). The sequence would end with a fireworks show (which covers up the sound of George falling to his death - though I think it's a little weird that he just opens a door and falls down ... it just seems a little strange that there is a luxury hotel with a door to nowhere in it). The fireworks fill the screen for the segue, with each spark lingering for a moment and then wiping the screen clear, kind of like the blood in the gun barrel.

[terminus]

I'm thinking maybe it should be some sort of fireworks display. The hotel could be celebrating its grand opening during the entire pre-title sequence (thus giving Bond a reason to be there). The sequence would end with a fireworks show (which covers up the sound of George falling to his death - though I think it's a little weird that he just opens a door and falls down ... it just seems a little strange that there is a luxury hotel with a door to nowhere in it). The fireworks fill the screen for the segue, with each spark lingering for a moment and then wiping the screen clear, kind of like the blood in the gun barrel.

The firework display is definitely a possibility - though not sure why Bond's presence would be any more necessary at the 'grand opening' of a hotel than at any other time.

Re: George just opening a door and falling down, I was merely working with what I had to work with - in the PTS it says that even Bond is stunned when the contact falls from a great height after being helped over a simple garden wall. This, I feel, made Bond look like an absolute idiot - there's no way he'd not know the garden was at a great height. I'm aware that there is a similar problem here - but at least it isn't Bond who's made to look like an idiot. Perhaps this is the reason the 'stunt' was dumped from LALD - because it didn't really work as described.

[Captain Tightpants]

The firework display is definitely a possibility - though not sure why Bond's presence would be any more necessary at the 'grand opening' of a hotel than at any other time.

The grand opening is really just an excuse to have the fireworks there. Bond can be at the grand opening under some kind of cover and is using the hotel's opening as a rendezvous point.

Re: George just opening a door and falling down, I was merely working with what I had to work with - in the PTS it says that even Bond is stunned when the contact falls from a great height after being helped over a simple garden wall. This, I feel, made Bond look like an absolute idiot - there's no way he'd not know the garden was at a great height. I'm aware that there is a similar problem here - but at least it isn't Bond who's made to look like an idiot. Perhaps this is the reason the 'stunt' was dumped from LALD - because it didn't really work as described.

Perhaps the fight between Bond and George can happen in a way that the walls of the hotel are weakened and George falls through one. Or George overpower Bond and then tries to escape by leaping from the balcony and running across the open ground to the hotel carpool, but is taken down by a lioness when he underestimes the drop and is dazed upon landing. It makes more sense than simply opening a door and falling to his death.

[dinovelvet]

Perhaps the fight between Bond and George can happen in a way that the walls of the hotel are weakened and George falls through one. Or George overpower Bond and then tries to escape by leaping from the balcony and running across the open ground to the hotel carpool, but is taken down by a lioness when he underestimes the drop and is dazed upon landing. It makes more sense than simply opening a door and falling to his death.

But the point of the door leading to a sheer drop is that it's a gsg. It's the Roger Moore era - Making sense is a low priority if it gets a laugh and Rog gets to make a quip afterwards. Speaking of which, might I get all Mankiewicz in here and suggest :

"Looks like he hit rock bottom"
"I always wanted some friends in low places"
"Think I'll take the stairs, myself"
"He always did like to take the plunge"
or a pithy "Look before you leap, George"

Edit - LOL ok terminus already did a quip. Well feel free to use one of mine anyway if you like them better

[Captain Tightpants]

You can have the gag by all means ... but I just don't get why Bond is in a hotel room two or three stories up and there is a door in the wall that leads to nowhere but a sheer drop without any explanation. While the Age of Moore had sight gags aplenty, there was always an explanation for it. When Jaws' parachute failed to deploy in MOONRAKER, he survived because he landed on a circuit tent that acted as a giant cushion. Implausible as it was, there was at least an attempt at an explanation. Having a door in the wall for no reason other than for George to step through to his death is completely pointless. How many buildings or hotels do you know that have a door opening onto a sheer drop like that?

That's why I like the idea of George overpowering or stunning Bond and then trying to make his escape by vaulting over the balcony attached to Bond's room, but misjudging the drop before being attacked. The geography of the scene makes sense, and you still have room for Bond's quip - he recovers from the fight and chaces George out onto the balcony as George jumps over the edge. He makes the quip about the cat having George's tongue, and then fireworks from behind him stain the screen and trickle down to become the segue into the main titles.

[terminus]

The only way I can make the original work is, perhaps, if there's an extension being built onto the hotel - but which hasn't been finished yet - and George tears through a door marked DO NOT ENTER or has a CAUTION cordon across it - and then falls to his death in the unfinished section of the hotel.

That said, CT's idea could work - or we could simply resort to him falling over the railing around the garden in a fight, a bit like the rooftop fight in Cairo in TSWLM.

I'm picturing George as a bit of a Dryden type - he could be Head of Station in Nairobi, in cahoots with the Soviets and Bond has lured him to the roof garden in order to finish him off. George hands over a folder with information in it (this information could then later be used to connect Vigeaux with a dangerous cult leader - revealed later as Lafiera) before Bond gives him the 'We don't appreciate you doing deals with the Soviets behind our back -' speech.

They fight, George falls from the building and gets eaten by a lion, 'cat got your tongue' - cue fireworks, missiles shaped like girls and eclipse imagery.

[Captain Tightpants]

The only way I can make the original work is, perhaps, if there's an extension being built onto the hotel - but which hasn't been finished yet - and George tears through a door marked DO NOT ENTER or has a CAUTION cordon across it - and then falls to his death in the unfinished section of the hotel.

That's fine. I was just bemused at the way George opened a door in the wall that served no purpose other than to drop onto nothing. It felt a little Abbott and Costello. So long as we explain the purpose of the door in some way (even if it is an unfinshed wing of the hotel), it should be fine.

George hands over a folder with information in it (this information could then later be used to connect Vigeaux with a dangerous cult leader - revealed later as Lafiera).

Or, it could connect Vigeaux to the sale/theft/acquisition of the nuclear missile they intend to launch at the moon.

[terminus]

George hands over a folder with information in it (this information could then later be used to connect Vigeaux with a dangerous cult leader - revealed later as Lafiera).

Or, it could connect Vigeaux to the sale/theft/acquisition of the nuclear missile they intend to launch at the moon.

It's possible - though in my scribbled outline, the discovery of the purchase of the nuclear missiles doesn't occur until the section in West Germany.

I am working on another draft of the pre-title sequence, will post it in an hour or so - along with the subsequent MI6 sequence and maybe some of the Canada segment too.

Also, mrblofeld - don't think I didn't notice your childish changing of Easy Phillips into Queasy Phillips on the proforma. I expected better of you.

2 Bond Girl 1 (Main ie Pussy Galore/Kissy): Vanessa Redgrave as Samantha Pole, descendant of the Plantagenet dynasty and fiancee of John Vigeaux.
3 Bond Girl 2 (Minor ie Tilly Masterson/Aki): Raquel Welch as Queasy Phillips, FBI Agent undercover in the Vigeaux/LaFiera 'cult' (to be introduced as "Hello, I'm Queasy". Cue raised eyebrow, and "But of course you are/ I never would have guessed/ There's no doubt you're making me", etc etc)

[terminus]

Here is how I'm picturing the PTS and the first scene afterwards -


GUN BARREL OPENS ON

An expansive wooden hotel somewhere in the Aberdare National Park in Kenya (modelled on the Treetops Hotel) where Bond is sat behind a canvas in a bedroom. He's painting the voluptuous curves of a beautiful blonde South African woman called Livia - LITERALLY painting her, running the paintbrush across her skin, down her firm stomach and across her thighs. It's very sensual - but done in an ever-so PG fashion.

MI6 Headquarters

M sits behind his desk in London and makes an inquiry (a la Moonraker and The Spy Who Loved Me) about Bond's location to Moneypenny. She, in turn, makes a pithy quip about his location - [any help on this quip appreciated] and we're back in -

Aberdare National Park

LATER - with Bond and the woman enjoying a cleansing shower together, the phone rings and a voice informs Bond that his guest will meet him in the garden. Bond dresses, heads to the garden - it is night, the moonlight filtering down through the branches of trees and illuminating the flowers. Beautiful. Bond meets with his contact, George (Michael Sheard). George is the Head of Station in Nairobi and, to make a bit of cash, he's been selling secrets to the Soviets. Bond takes a file from George, flicks through it - and then confronts George with the fact that MI6 know he's a double agent.

The two men fight in the garden - it's swift and brutal, with at least one Moore-esque quip thrown into the mix. George throws Bond to the ground, thinks he's got the advantage and flees. As Bond is near the door to the stairwell, George opens a door nearby - tearing through a 'DANGER: BUILDING SITE' banner across it ...

And PLUNGES TO HIS DEATH. Bond looks down through the open doorway as a lion advances on the contacts injured body, roars as it pounces - "What's the matter, George, cat got your tongue?" - the fireworks display commences and we move into another title sequence designed by Maurice Binder.

Each firework burns onto the screen as we begin the titles - a typical affair with silhouetted naked women dancing to the themetune. At one point, women-shaped missiles are loaded into canons and fired at a moon - which then morphs into the curves of a woman, glimpsed only like the moon during an eclipse, writhing to the music. This, mixed in with some religious-type symbols and icons.

CB.n PRESENTS

ROGER MOORE
as Ian Fleming's James Bond 007

in

CBN MEMBERS'
EVERYTHING OR NOTHING


Vanessa Redgrave
Raquel Welch

Marlon Brando
Armand Assante
Arnold Schwarzenegger

Sybil Danning

Clifton James
Michael Sheard

Lois Maxwell
Desmond Llewelyn

with

Bernard Lee as M

"Everything or Nothing" sung by Cher
"Everything or Nothing" written by John Barry, Cher and Johnny Durrell

Soundtrack by John Barry

Directed by Guy Hamilton

Titles Designed by Maurice Binder

MI6 Headquarters

Bond has returned from his mission in Africa - with a tan that he teases Moneypenny is an 'all over' tan - before he is called in to see M who is joined by an advisor from the Foreign Office. M has the file that Bond took from George in Kenya and opens it to a report that he explains is about a French-Canadian businessman John Vigeaux. M explains that the report suggests that Vigeaux has been trying to source a pair of nuclear missiles on the black market -

Nuclear missiles cannot be allowed to fall into the hands of a civilian and Bond is ordered by M to travel to Quebec, Canada, to look into the matter. After his meeting with M, Bond visits Q to recieve his equipment - and makes the usual quippy wordplay with the quartermaster.

Quebec

Bond travels to Canada where he eliminates a member of Vigeaux's racing team in order to gain entry to Vigeaux's inner circle by taking part in a catamaran race in Quebec (styled after the GOLDFINGER golf game, but Bond is partnered with VIgeau'x crew rather than competing against him). Bond, on the trapeze, ends up capsizing the catamaran into an icy river after a risky move for the lead fails and they crash into a pier. Bond and Vigeaux both end up in the river with the remains of the destroyed catamaran.

Vigeaux finds this outrageously funny, and invites Bond to join him at a black tie gala dinner that evening as he is impressed with Bond's willingness to take a risk even when the odds are heavily stacked against him; had Bond succeeded, their catamaran would have won the race. That night, Bond meets LaFiera for the first time at the ball - and isn't taken in by the mans charisma and religious spiel. Bond makes an excuse to dance with Samantha, Vigeaux's wife, using an energetic tango around the room to pick out the rest of Vigeaux's undercover security (including Schwartz) without arousing suspicion.

Later, Bond sneaks around Vigeaux's chateau, breaks into a safe - but is knocked out by an assailant that he does not see but we understand to be Schwartz (think the scene in Goldfinger where Bond is knocked out by Oddjob). He awakes in -

West Germany

- West Germany at a religious conclave in a forest. There, Lafiera tries to have Bond brainwashed using drugs and verbal suggestion, but the CIA have an agent undercover in the cult (Easy Phillips) and she puts white sound inducing ear-plugs into Bonds ears to stop the brainwashing process. As a result, Bond ends up just feeling a bit sick as a side effect of the drugs - but covers up the fact and plays the part of the dutiful cult member.

After discovering that Lafiera is the one who wants the two nuclear missiles (Vigeaux is just financing the operation) and the purchase will be undertaken in Iran, Bond and Easy escape - leading to a chase through a castle and a fight with Schwartz on the castles ramparts. Bond uses a sword to take on Schwartz and the henchman plummets to his death from the ramparts - cue "I think I'll take the stairs" (or some other such quip). During the escape, Bond runs past JW Pepper (who may have been seen during previous scenes when Bond is pretending to be a cult member) who has been convinced to go on a tour of German castles by his wife and is staying in a quaint B&B in the town under the castle and nearby the cult refuge - and is full of his regular pomposity and superiority.

When Schwartz takes a dive from the ramparts, he lands in front of the tour group that Pepper and his wife are part of - and Pepper makes his usual kind of retort.

Iran

Bond and Easy arrive in Iran -

[Mr. Blofeld]

What happened to the contact lenses coco wrote into the PTS that I made into a workable gadget?

[terminus]

Well - it didn't make sense for them to be handed over at that point. The missiles haven't yet been introduced, so they will be used at a later point and provided to Bond by Q in the Q Department scene.

And, are you going to explain yourself, re: changing Easy Phillips to Queasy Phillips in the proforma?

[Mr. Blofeld]

Are you going to explain yourself, re: changing Easy Phillips to Queasy Phillips in the proforma?

I just found it an absurd name; even worse than Plenty O'Toole, because it's not even a first name-last name pun -- why not have "Easy" be a nickname, for Elizabeth, or Eliza?

[terminus]

And that was the mature way in which to point that out, was it? There was a way to bring up concerns about a character name and THAT was not it.

I don't see how it's any more absurd than Pussy Galore or Domino Vitale or Holly Goodhead - or the name of an actress Busy Phillips or of the actor Easy Pickens (and yes, I'm aware that's not his real name). It could be a nickname - in the same way that Domino and Honey were both abbreviations of their real names.

[Mr. Blofeld]

And that was the mature way in which to point that out, was it? There was a way to bring up concerns about a character name and THAT was not it.

Point taken.

I don't see how it's any more absurd than Pussy Galore or Domino Vitale or Holly Goodhead - or the name of an actress Busy Phillips or of the actor Easy Pickens (and yes, I'm aware that's not his real name). It could be a nickname - in the same way that Domino and Honey were both abbreviations of their real names.

Well, let's make it a nickname, then... and, for the love of Zod, please don't bring up Holly Goodhead as a "successful example" of this trope!

[terminus]

Well, I did go to school with a name not entirely dissimilar that you'd probably chuck out the window as being too ridiculous.

Anyway - Quebec and West Germany obviously need some work. West Germany needs to a realtively well paced sequence - with Bond and Easy doing some sneaking around the cult camp and the nearby town whilst pretending to be cult members.

I could see Bond bumping into JW in a delicatessen, with Bond wearing the robes of the cult.

[SamuelKevlar]

How are we picturing this cult? Proselytizing with pamphlets on street corners, or turning up their noses at the doomed masses while keeping a psychological stranglehold on the flock? Talk of robes just makes me think of the Hare Krishnas, who aren't the most threatening of people. I feel a strict, somewhat fatalistic Scientology/Mormony sort of thing would be more effective.

Edited by SamuelKevlar, 09 December 2010 - 06:10 AM.

[terminus]

I'm easy on how the cult is pictured - I just thought it could be something a bit more doomsday cult, more fatalistic, smearing ashes on their faces and calling for redemption - eerie and slightly creepy.

[Mr. Blofeld]

What about their psychotropic drugs? That, alone, puts them in the "God is in the drugged mind" group, like certain native religions around the world...

[terminus]

I think that comment is slightly out of hand - we can't really pass comment on the veracity of any religions, whether they be native or global, nor how they may involve psychotropic drugs.

[Mr. Blofeld]

I think that comment is slightly out of hand - we can't really pass comment on the veracity of any religions, whether they be native or global, nor how they may involve psychotropic drugs.

Wasn't trying to pass comment, but I'll revise my statement: Perhaps it's like the "Heaven's Gate" cult, only everyone but the members are planned to die?

[terminus]

I think the envisagement that CT had was that the effect of the nuclear implosion on the moon would create a celestial event that Lafiera and his cult had predicted, thus increasing their influence over the world and making people more susceptible to their manipulations. Nothing to do with wanting the worlds population to die.

[Captain Tightpants]

Yeah, that's exactly what I had in mind. LaFiera kind of wants to be a new Jesus Christ. He's not really anybody of particular noteworthiness (which is why I rather like his complete lack of description), but he wants to be a leader of the world. In order to do that, he intends to gain influence by predicting what he calls a "global celestial event" and then making it happen.

[terminus]

It's a transition point between early-Moore and mid-Moore, from 'I've got an evil plot' to 'I've got an evil plot to kill everyone except those I deem worthy'. I think if we did a follow-up UB-Moore in 1976 - post 'Everything or Nothing' but pre 'The Spy Who Loved Me' - I'd expect the direction to be leaning much more towards the 'I've got an evil plot to kill everyone except those I deem worthy'.