146 replies to this topic

[CaptainPower]

Welcome to CBn, CaptainPowers.

Thank you

[RevolveR]

I wonder how many people on this forum are politicians? This group can take any subject and twist it to fit their personal agendas better than any group I've ever seen - and believe me I'm a veteran of several forums.

The purpose of this thread was to discuss if QoS could have the same blend of action and character development that early reviews of The Dark Knight have highlighted - it was not to discuss which film would be the best or about which actor's contribution to its impending success was more prevalent.

Does anyone have any thoughts about what we've seen in the QoS trailer and what we've read (where Forster defined his goal of reaching inside the "inner-Bond") and how that might compare to the same approach Nolan takes with Dark Knight?

To actually discuss this topic, I think that the two have many similar elements. While some may scoff at this, the character that is Daniel Craig's James Bond and the world he fights in is more grounded in reality that that of TDK's Batman. For that reason, the Bond character should be easier to study. That doesn't take into account audience biases and perceptions heading into the film so there aren't any guarantees it'll play out that way. Forster's approach is the same as Nolan's in my opinion. We have to take what he has said at face-value and trust that he will deliver on his promise. It seems reasonable to assume that the approach and scope of the two films will be very similar. Remember, we know most of the plot details about TDK and virtually nothing about the was QOS will play out (relations with the girls, villain, and so on).

[bond 16.05.72]

I'm looking forward to both immensely, alongside CR Begins gave us a tantalising cliffhangers both actually had 2.

CR's was what's gonna happen with this story it obvious this is gonna be a continuation as it has come to be but the biggest cliffhanger and the one which hopefully will be worth it's 2 year wait is... where will Daniel Craig take us with this character, getting to see the evolution for me is the most compelling aspect of QOS.

Begins was the obvious they are going to introduce the Joker teaser and how they going to do that but there was the fact Nolan had reintroduced Batman and bought him into a far more realistic world the possibilities are simply delicious. The cliffhanger of where is Nolan gonna take this next before seeing glimpses of Ledger's performance that was the biggest cliffhanger for me out of the 2.

I don't want to damn QOS before seeing it because it looks great and I think it will top CR but Dark Knight just looks the more exciting proposal to me. Yes they are in a similar place they are coming off the back of 2 sucessful reboots which bought a character back to the world when most thought it a joke. The scope will be bigger, the encompassing feel of DK is that it will be indeed be epic, Begins was only 10 or so minutes off the running time of DK but DK has no establishing or back story it can get down to it straight away. It seems DK will be having huge themes and stacks going on a complex twisting plot. The comparrisons to GF 2 & Heat make you wonder what the hell is this going to be like.

I have seen most of the spoilers and know the outcome of the film from the reviews and spoilers I've seen on here but I still cannnot wait for 25th July 2.45pm Imax.

Once the hype had died down and DK has sunk in it will be time to get excited about QOS big time, it will be just over 3 months away and when that Full theatrical trailer hits I'll be giddy as a school boy.

I think QOS looks great and I'm by no means down it at all but 2008 is going to be defined by one movie and I don't think it will be QOS

[HH007]

I think QOS looks great and I'm by no means down it at all but 2008 is going to be defined by one movie and I don't think it will be QOS

Well, for a lot of the people on these boards it probably will.

For the public at large, most definitely not.

[[dark]]

I think QOS looks great and I'm by no means down it at all but 2008 is going to be defined by one movie and I don't think it will be QOS

I, too, get the feeling 2008 will be the year of Batman. The hype is phenomenal, the reviews are glowing and the movie itself looks mind-blowing.

However, we're only 9 days out from the release of The Dark Knight and we have no idea how Quantum of Solace will shape up so near to its release date. So, it seems unfair to compare the two at this stage of the game.

Granted, The Dark Knight has had positive buzz from Day Dot, but - curse nonsense aside - so has Quantum of Solace. I remember how James Bond fever gripped England in the lead-up to Casino Royale in ways I could never have imagined and I have no doubt Quantum of Solace will have the same effect - but we're still four months from its release. Plenty of time to drum up (potentially) Dark Knight-sized hype.

[stamper]

I don't think it's fait to compare DK (which have about 18mn worth of footage online, officialy), with QOS, where all we have is like 1.50 worth of clips which don't convey anything except that there will be action, twice the action and double twice more three times the action action action action ? Come on, at least the DK viral marketing took it's time, whereas all QOS communicate about so far is action.

I don't care what the director says. It's not about talk it's about walk. Talk about character study all you want, all I see and all everyone sees so far in QOS is action, twice the action. Whereas DK is truly, from the looks of the marketing, a character study. With action. More like CR in fact !

EON should Release a new trailer that is about the story and characters and action. Really. There's no character in QOS, yet.

[Ace Roberts]

EON should Release a new trailer that is about the story and characters and action. Really. There's no character in QOS, yet.

Yeath - the Dark Knight trailers were filled with long character studies/scenes and light on action - he writes sarcastically.

Geeezzz....

[danslittlefinger]

http://news.yahoo.co...b8_e631a6db4a87

Not too sure abt the comparison but the ticket sales look outrageous on this already.

[Captain Tightpants]

While we're not getting that crazy sort of demand going on, I know that the first three days of screenings (kind of misleading; there's only two screenings on the first day) at my local cinema are booked out; I only just managed to get a ticket to the premiere next Wednesday (Australia's release is the 16th) and was told to show up 45 minutes early at the minimum to collect it. They even had to open pre-bookings a week early to cope with demand.

The reason I'm saying that is because I saw the premiere screening of Casino Royale at my local cinema as well, and while the cinema was packed, I didn't have to come in advance, and it certainly wasn't booked out for three days. I'm execting about the same for Quantum of Solace (though I may actually see that at the town my uni is in, which is a way better cinema even if the town is a fraction of the size of my own).

[honeyjes]

I think you can't really make any comparisons as there is the curiosity factor, a fair amount of people will be clammering to see Heaths last performance, and this also adds another dimension to the DK

[Invincible1958]

I hate to say it, but I think The Dark Knight is going to win here for one simple reason: a lot of people are going to see the film because it's Heath Ledger's final performance.

It's not.
"The Imaginarium of Doctor Parnassus" by Terry Gilliam is his last performance. And that movie will be released in 2009:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1054606/

It was shot AFTER "The Dark Knight".

[Ace Roberts]

I think you can't really make any comparisons as there is the curiosity factor, a fair amount of people will be clammering to see Heaths last performance, and this also adds another dimension to the DK

Again - not to belabor the point - the thread was created to discuss The Dark Knight's supposed successful blending of a large number of action scenes (something we seemed concerened about in QoS) with a powerful character study - something Forster alluded to when taking on the mantle of the Bond film.

[Invincible1958]

I'm looking forward to both movies.

But I can imagine that "The Dark Knight" will be the better movie in general, because with the Batman character and the world he lives in, you can do much more than with the Bond world.
You can make a big epic character movie out of Batman, and no one would say: oh, that's not Batman. But you can't do it with Bond. You have more rules to follow when you do a new Bond movie than you have when you do a Batman movie. That's why it's impossible for a Bond movie to become an epic like Titanic or Lord of the Rings. With Batman you can do that.

When you speak about James Bond, the former actors almost always come up. But when you speak about "The Dark Knight" no one is thinking about George Clooney or Arnold Schwarzenegger, not even about Michael Keaton.
But when you speak about Bond it's only a matter of time until the name of Connery is mentioned. Batman is a much more "free" franchise. That's the big difference. And that's why you can do much more with Batman than with Bond.

[RevolveR]

I don't think it's fait to compare DK (which have about 18mn worth of footage online, officialy), with QOS, where all we have is like 1.50 worth of clips which don't convey anything except that there will be action, twice the action and double twice more three times the action action action action ? Come on, at least the DK viral marketing took it's time, whereas all QOS communicate about so far is action.

I don't care what the director says. It's not about talk it's about walk. Talk about character study all you want, all I see and all everyone sees so far in QOS is action, twice the action. Whereas DK is truly, from the looks of the marketing, a character study. With action. More like CR in fact !

EON should Release a new trailer that is about the story and characters and action. Really. There's no character in QOS, yet.

You (and anyone else making these ridiculous comments) are unbelievable. Is this your first day on the job? Did you become a Bond fan because of Casino Royale and have no idea how this process works? I know that is not the case so please don't insult your own intelligence by harping on too much action in a 2 minute "teaser" trailer! The first trailer for TDK didn't get in to the depth of the plot or characters. Hell, the VERY first one didn't even show any actual footage!

Comparing these movies in any way (other than for the original point of this thread) is stupid. Batman has a much wider appeal, at least in the States, than Bond. Thusly, it will do better at the box office regardless of which is a better film.

[Blonde Bond]

When you speak about James Bond, the former actors almost always come up. But when you speak about "The Dark Knight" no one is thinking about George Clooney or Arnold Schwarzenegger, not even about Michael Keaton.

I'm thinking of Michael Keaton. He's so far my favorite batsy. Even if he doesn't quite fit in the mold. Sure, Bale is the Batman of the comic books come to life. But so far I prefer Tim Burton's vision of Batman. Returns being my favorite bat-movie. Although I feel change coming...later... this month *gulp!*

[Invincible1958]

When you speak about James Bond, the former actors almost always come up. But when you speak about "The Dark Knight" no one is thinking about George Clooney or Arnold Schwarzenegger, not even about Michael Keaton.

I'm thinking of Michael Keaton. He's so far my favorite batsy.

Okay. We do think about him.
But the general public and the media isn't mentioning him everywhere as they do it with Connery and Co whenever there is a new Bond movie coming out.

[Safari Suit]

Batman has a much wider appeal, at least in the States, than Bond.

Very much mostly in the States, I would say.

[stamper]

I just seen TDK and it's not a character study at all. More like a superhero mythology study.
I like it, but I suddenly get the feeling that if this movie wasn't what it sold itself to be, then perhaps QOS will be a real character study and not an action movie (ie reverse of what the teaser sells).

[deth]

I just seen TDK and it's not a character study at all. More like a superhero mythology study.
I like it, but I suddenly get the feeling that if this movie wasn't what it sold itself to be, then perhaps QOS will be a real character study and not an action movie (ie reverse of what the teaser sells).

gah! how is everyone managing to see TDK already!aaah!!

[Blonde Bond]

It pays to have people in high places.

That said, I wish I knew that kind of people...

[Invincible1958]

I like it, but I suddenly get the feeling that if this movie wasn't what it sold itself to be, then perhaps QOS will be a real character study and not an action movie (ie reverse of what the teaser sells).

It certainly won't be an action movie as TND is an action-movie.

Marc Forster named some movies that inspired him to do "Quantum of Solace":

The French Connection (1971)
The Parallax View (1974)
Three Days of the Condor (1975)

If you know those movies, then you know what to expect from "Quantum of Solace".
And he spoke about FRWL and bringing back the style of the 60's and 70's.

I don't think that he's just telling us things like that, when in fact he's doing a completely dull action-movie.

[Eddie Burns]

Didn't care much for Batman Begins, and I'm a huge Batman fan (a bigger Bond fan though). Didn't enjoy Bale's portrayal of Bruce Wayne, and found some scenes cringe worthy ('I gotta get me one of these!' is a line more akin to a Will Smith movie) plus was heavily disappointed with the Batmobil. I also didn't enjoy Michael Caine's 'in your face' Alfred. Scarecrow was disappointing and not scary at all and Katie Holmes' acting was blatantly wooden, as if she didn't buy into her material. And face it, any movie after Batman & Robin was definitely going to be good...its not that difficult. Hence why I think its an overrated movie, just because its 'dark'.

TDK though...thats another story. I'm anticipating this movie beyond imagination because it looks very very good. And by the looks of it so far, Heath's Joker steals the show.

As for comparisons with QoS, there is no comparison. TDK is simply going to be the better movie, because it just looks epic. They went all out for it, and Heath's death adds an aura to it. Plus the franchise, now at least, seems to cater to its fan-base, whereas Bond just caters to as many people as possible, without really caring about its fans. A perfect example of this was Martin Campbell's surprise when attending a Bond convention after GE and being pillared with all sorts of questions he wasn't ready to answer. Before that, he never took Bond seriously. It explains the improvement he made with CR, by at least capturing the essence of the book. I think everybody could see that he was serious about the project.

TDK is an epic, QoS is just another Bond movie. The action bit does worry me, but I believe there will be a perfect balance between character and action. Plus we have no idea what its really about, I take the fact that they've kept their cards close to their chest a very good thing. It must mean there's more to QoS story than action and revenge...at least I hope there is.

I believe the next truly epic Bond movie that will garner similar attention to TDK...will be the final one, because thats bound to be different to any other movie before it.

[DaveBond21]

The Batman movies have a successful Q character - Morgan Freeman's character, Lucius Fox. In fact they have 2, as Michael Caine's Alfred is also like a Q character to Bruce Wayne/Batman.

Somehow the Batman movies have realistic, dark tones and yet have managed to make comedic Q-like characters work.

Indeed the TV spot for TDK features more Michael Caine in a comedy scene about Wayne's choice of cars than anyone else!!

I thought that was interesting.

[AngryPolarBear]

Didn't care much for Batman Begins, and I'm a huge Batman fan (a bigger Bond fan though). Didn't enjoy Bale's portrayal of Bruce Wayne,

He was excellent as Bruce Wayne. Can't think of any better casting choices.

and found some scenes cringe worthy ('I gotta get me one of these!' is a line more akin to a Will Smith movie)

Agreed. A crappy line created by screenwriter Goyer I believe.

plus was heavily disappointed iith the Batmobil.

The tumbler isn't as stylished as the the one from Batman, but it was very cool to see it rampage through the city.

I also didn't enjoy Michael Caine's 'in your face' Alfred.

How can you not enjoy Alfred?

Scarecrow was disappointing and not scary at all

Cillian Murphy's performance was one of the big suprises for me. He didn't get much screen time, but practical owned the scenes he were in. Loved the one sequence where that little guy almost kill's the big Batman.

and Katie Holmes' acting was blatantly wooden, as if she didn't buy into her material.

Agreed. I hope Gyllenhaal will bring more to the table.

And face it, any movie after Batman & Robin was definitely going to be good...its not that difficult. Hence why I think its an overrated movie, just because its 'dark'.

Off course, but I think Nolan did almost everything right with Begins. I never though a superhero movie could make in my top 20, but this one proved me wrong.

Plus we have no idea what its really about, I take the fact that they've kept their cards close to their chest a very good thing. It must mean there's more to QoS story than action and revenge...at least I hope there is.

This is what I'm hoping for too. I think there is more to QoS than spectacular action scenes. Forster, Haggis and the rest are holding on to some secrets that we'll hopefully enjoy. Something that will make it more than just a classic revenge film.

Edited by AngryPolarBear, 11 July 2008 - 12:11 PM.

[Captain Tightpants]

I hate to say it, but I think The Dark Knight is going to win here for one simple reason: a lot of people are going to see the film because it's Heath Ledger's final performance.

It's not.
"The Imaginarium of Doctor Parnassus" by Terry Gilliam is his last performance. And that movie will be released in 2009:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1054606/

It was shot AFTER "The Dark Knight".

Technically ... no. While Imaginarium was originally intended to feature Ledger, his death prompted a minor re-write and three other actors (Johnny Depp, Jude Law and one other whos name escapes me) were re-cast in the role, kind of like Doctor Who changing bodies (though for different reasons). It will still stand out as an incomplete work by Ledger, and there's no real indication of how much of the final film will actually feature him. The Dark Knight will still be his final performance as it was originally intened.

[Melack]

Daniel Craig's Bond is a cooler character than Batman.

I'm one of them that think Batman Begins was a bit overrated.

It's a good movie no doubt about that, but I was not blown away by it in any way.

Batman Returns is equally good imo.

Still I'm looking forward to TDK really really much. Finally a more classic Batman villain´and I want more action from this one. Begins got a bit boring with a colorless villain and too much origin stuff.

CR handled that thing much better and faster and combined the storytelling with action to make it more enjoyable.

[001carus]

I know this may seem a little odd, but as some sort of compromise in hyping up both movies for the meantime, my wallpaper currently dons this image I edited:

http://img.photobuck...pg?t=1216038518

Hehe, hell, you can use it if you want. Just thought it was a bit of fun.

Edited by 001carus, 14 July 2008 - 12:29 PM.

[SecretAgentFan]

What "The Dark Knight" already has achieved is this: almost every major film critic is gushing about it and naming it the rare genre film that transcends its genre roots and becomes one of the best films of the year. "CR" came close to that buzz but didn´t get that far. Whether "QOS" will be reviewed as favorably is doubtful since right now it seems like it will be a superior Bond film but still thoroughly rooted in its genre.

Which is totally fine with me. I´m looking forward to it.

[Harmsway]

What "The Dark Knight" already has achieved is this: almost every major film critic is gushing about it and naming it the rare genre film that transcends its genre roots and becomes one of the best films of the year. "CR" came close to that buzz but didn´t get that far. Whether "QOS" will be reviewed as favorably is doubtful since right now it seems like it will be a superior Bond film but still thoroughly rooted in its genre.

Which is totally fine with me. I´m looking forward to it.

Well said.

[dodge]

I'm eager to see both films and to enjoy them both, to what degree I'll soon find out. But I can't see comparing the two with any fairness to QoS. TKD is an Event...at this point it's a juggernaut and I don't think it's stoppable. Too many factors contribute to its awesome power--and Ledger's death may turn out to be the smallest of those factors.