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Things that don't make sense in Casino Royale


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#31 LadySylvia

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Posted 12 June 2007 - 09:51 PM

Yes, I just think if I was in Demetrios shoes, I would have hired Carlos in his place straight up, a scarred & scary face is not a way to go invisible without hassle on such a mission.


A scarred and scary face? I agree that Mollaka has a scarred face, but scary? Without the scar, he looks rather handsome.


Also, Bond had spotted Le Chiffre receiving a private message from one of the latter's henchmen. Being a spy and nosy, he wanted to learn what was going on. He brought Vesper along as part of his cover - professional gambler with beautiful girlfriend. If someone had spotted him outside of Le Chiffre's suite, he needed Vesper to convey the idea of a couple snogging in the hallway to avoid suspicion. It almost worked except Steven Obanno's bodyguard spotted the earpiece in Bond's ear.

Edited by LadySylvia, 12 June 2007 - 09:56 PM.


#32 byline

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Posted 12 June 2007 - 11:44 PM

If Le Chiffre wanted to win so bad, couldn't he put the odds at the poker game in his favor? Using one of his own men as a dealer for example...

But he thought of himself as a math whiz. Didn't see any possibility of him losing. To have fixed the game would have ruined the challenge for him, regardless of the dire financial circumstances he found himself in.

#33 stamper

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Posted 13 June 2007 - 06:44 AM

There's one more thing : with Mollaka's dead, what is the point of Le Chiffre winning ? The guy whom he owns the money is gone, midgame !

#34 tdalton

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Posted 13 June 2007 - 07:25 AM

There's one more thing : with Mollaka's dead, what is the point of Le Chiffre winning ? The guy whom he owns the money is gone, midgame !


I think that Mr. White and his organization were pressuring him into recovering the money so that word wouldn't get out that they had set Obanno and his men up with someone who was not trustworthy.

#35 Santa

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Posted 13 June 2007 - 08:51 AM

There's one more thing : with Mollaka's dead, what is the point of Le Chiffre winning ? The guy whom he owns the money is gone, midgame !

Eh?? He owed the money to Obanno, not Mollaka.

#36 Vauxhall

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Posted 13 June 2007 - 09:29 AM

It did cross my mind for a while that Le Chiffre may not have known that Obanno had been killed by Bond, however this theory was shown to be incorrect when we see Le Chiffre looking out the window when his henchman is taken away by the police.

Therefore he keeps playing both out of pride and greed. The size and power of the organisation behind Mr White must be so great that Le Chiffre knows that there will be no escape.

#37 Stephenson

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Posted 13 June 2007 - 06:36 PM

Moving away from the financial and logistical aspects of the film:

When M gives Bond the big "take your ego out of the equation" speech in her apartment, she basically comes out and says that Bond gets himself too emotionally involved and it prevents him from thinking rationally.

But a couple of days later, as they stare at the body of Solange, she says, "I would ask you to remain emotionally detached, but I don't think that's your problem."

So which is it? Is Bond too emotional or too cold?

Edited by Stephenson, 13 June 2007 - 06:36 PM.


#38 Zographos

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Posted 13 June 2007 - 08:09 PM

There's one more thing : with Mollaka's dead, what is the point of Le Chiffre winning ? The guy whom he owns the money is gone, midgame !


I think that Mr. White and his organization were pressuring him into recovering the money so that word wouldn't get out that they had set Obanno and his men up with someone who was not trustworthy.

I think the simpler explanation is that Le Chiffre would be forced to rat out Mr. White's organization if he lost, and White has an obvious interest in making sure that doesn't happen.

#39 Flash1087

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Posted 14 June 2007 - 08:43 AM

Moving away from the financial and logistical aspects of the film:

When M gives Bond the big "take your ego out of the equation" speech in her apartment, she basically comes out and says that Bond gets himself too emotionally involved and it prevents him from thinking rationally.

But a couple of days later, as they stare at the body of Solange, she says, "I would ask you to remain emotionally detached, but I don't think that's your problem."

So which is it? Is Bond too emotional or too cold?


I felt she ment two different things. Sure, he's got an ego problem, but only about his own abilities as a 00 agent. She doesn't want another Madagascar happening, and that only went down the way it did, in her estimation, because Bond felt he had something to prove by not letting whatshisname escape. She also probably figured Solange was just another tool he was using to find information on Ellipsis, which means although he may be carrying a chip on his shoulder through the whole thing, he's still able to divide his personal attachments to others from his mission.

Or she could have re-evaluated Bond after the Solange debacle, having realized maybe he doesn't invest himself as personally into his missions as he first thought.

Or maybe it's just bad dialouge. Who knows, other than The Shadow?

#40 spynovelfan

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Posted 14 June 2007 - 02:12 PM

When would a terrorist network's bomb expert have the time to become an amazing free-runner?

It is a Bond film.

#41 Mister Asterix

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Posted 14 June 2007 - 02:41 PM

When would a terrorist network's bomb expert have the time to become an amazing free-runner?

It is a Bond film.



It’s not like Mad Terrorist Bomber is a 9 to 5 job. I’m sure there is plenty of downtime in a Mad Terrorist Bomber’s career.

It probably had something to do with his plans to plant the bomb in Miami. Mollaka probably planned on going into some other secure point in MIA using ‘Ellipsis’, scaling some impossible to scale building, jumping across some impossible to jump over gap between buildings, do some other free-running bit, and then plant his bomb on the aircraft.


#42 stamper

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Posted 14 June 2007 - 03:53 PM

Good point. Sorry if I crossed Mollaka and Obanno's names.

Now, at which point in the movie, does Vesper get involved in the blackmail thing ? Is that right from the beginning ? Or is there a turning point ?

#43 tdalton

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Posted 14 June 2007 - 04:18 PM

Good point. Sorry if I crossed Mollaka and Obanno's names.

Now, at which point in the movie, does Vesper get involved in the blackmail thing ? Is that right from the beginning ? Or is there a turning point ?


My impression of the Vesper situation was that she was in on it from the very beginning, and that the tone of her dialogue towards Bond at the beginning was a means to distance herself from him and to not allow any kind of friendship to develop between her and Bond so she wouldn't feel too bad about having done it later on.

#44 LadySylvia

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Posted 14 June 2007 - 04:33 PM

It did cross my mind for a while that Le Chiffre may not have known that Obanno had been killed by Bond, however this theory was shown to be incorrect when we see Le Chiffre looking out the window when his henchman is taken away by the police.

Therefore he keeps playing both out of pride and greed. The size and power of the organisation behind Mr White must be so great that Le Chiffre knows that there will be no escape.



Le Chiffre used the money of other clients, as well. When he finally got his hands on Obanno's money, he called his broker to announce that he finally had enough money to proceed with his plans regarding that airline.


My impression of the Vesper situation was that she was in on it from the very beginning, and that the tone of her dialogue towards Bond at the beginning was a means to distance herself from him and to not allow any kind of friendship to develop between her and Bond so she wouldn't feel too bad about having done it later on.


I believe that Vesper didn't allow any friendship toward Bond, because she was seriously involved with her French/Algerian boyfriend. Also, I don't think she was in it from the beginning. She had chided Bond for using his real name, insted of his alias to check in. And Le Chiffre did pick up on it. Besides, why would Le Chiffre need Vesper at that point? As far as he was concerned, Bond was some government agent who believed he was good enough to play opposite professional gamblers. I don't think he took Bond seriously as a threat against him during the tournament, until the end of the first night.

Edited by LadySylvia, 14 June 2007 - 04:43 PM.


#45 jgw007

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Posted 21 July 2007 - 05:25 AM

Okay - since no one bothered to answer my question about the Nambutu embassy guard already having papers in his hand when Mollaka runs up to him --- (how would he already have his ID if that is what he was looking at)

Heres a better one -

WHY is Phil Meheux (the cinemetographer) making a Cameo appearance at the Card Table in the Ocean Club with Demetrious AND then he reappears in M's office making a Cameo as the treasury offical of MI6 waiting for the money to be deposited???

Anyone?

#46 LadySylvia

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Posted 21 July 2007 - 05:36 AM

Moving away from the financial and logistical aspects of the film:

When M gives Bond the big "take your ego out of the equation" speech in her apartment, she basically comes out and says that Bond gets himself too emotionally involved and it prevents him from thinking rationally.

But a couple of days later, as they stare at the body of Solange, she says, "I would ask you to remain emotionally detached, but I don't think that's your problem."

So which is it? Is Bond too emotional or too cold?



I think she wanted to be assured that Bond was not getting emotional over Solange's death.

#47 hi-jinx

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Posted 22 July 2007 - 03:58 AM

Moving away from the financial and logistical aspects of the film:

When M gives Bond the big "take your ego out of the equation" speech in her apartment, she basically comes out and says that Bond gets himself too emotionally involved and it prevents him from thinking rationally.


I don't think so. I don't think she is drawing attention to the 'emotion' of Solange's death, but she is referring to Bond's ego in the sense that she doesn't want him going after Le Chife in a competative way, tit for tat like, because it would jeopordize their operation.


But a couple of days later, as they stare at the body of Solange, she says, "I would ask you to remain emotionally detached, but I don't think that's your problem."

So which is it? Is Bond too emotional or too cold?


This is my point, she means he is not 'emotional' but 'egotistical'. That is, she knows he is experiencing a sense of rivalry.


I think she wanted to be assured that Bond was not getting emotional over Solange's death.

I agree, but I think she knows he may feel a little guilty (if anything she lets him know he is responsible for Solange's death), but wants assurance he is not going to go after Le Chifre in an irrational tit for tat killing. Perhaps I am wrong, I am not explaining myself very well, but I know what I mean.


#48 LadySylvia

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Posted 22 July 2007 - 05:47 AM

WHY is Phil Meheux (the cinemetographer) making a Cameo appearance at the Card Table in the Ocean Club with Demetrious AND then he reappears in M's office making a Cameo as the treasury offical of MI6 waiting for the money to be deposited???



I believe that he had only portrayed the Treasury official. At least according to the IMDB site.

#49 Flash1087

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Posted 22 July 2007 - 07:11 AM

I agree, but I think she knows he may feel a little guilty (if anything she lets him know he is responsible for Solange's death), but wants assurance he is not going to go after Le Chifre in an irrational tit for tat killing. Perhaps I am wrong, I am not explaining myself very well, but I know what I mean.


I think I get what you mean. You mean that M wants Bond to take down Le Chiffre because it's his mission, not simply to get back at him for Solange, right?

#50 autquisest

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Posted 22 July 2007 - 08:00 AM

It

#51 the villain's architect

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Posted 22 July 2007 - 03:00 PM

I believe it does have a very negative effect on the stock price of an aircraft manufacturer to be the target of terrorists. People with information about soon falling stock prices can use this information to gain money, e.g. with put options (wikipedia article), which I think Le Chiffre did.
Don't know the profit margin if such a plan works or vise versa the loss if it fails, though.

#52 autquisest

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Posted 23 July 2007 - 07:02 AM

Far as I understood it Le Chiffre told his finance guy to simply sell Skyfleet stock and buy something in exchange a day or so before the attack. And whether or not he exercised any put option rights, he might have sold the stock for more money than it would have been worth some time in the future, and the further development of Skyfleet stock prices would be of no effect to him...of course I may have gotten that wiki article (thanks) all wrong here...I still don

#53 the villain's architect

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Posted 23 July 2007 - 10:41 AM

Sorry, that was my fault.

It's not only about a put option, but about shorting a stock. You can read it over at IMDB (link):

"Shorting a stock means you sell a stock you do not yet own (the stock is usually owned by one of the broker's other clients) in anticipation that the stock's price will fall. The aim is to sell the stock at the current price, then buy the stock in the future at a lower price. However, if the price of the stock actually goes up, you will lose money. [

#54 Germanlady

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Posted 23 July 2007 - 01:26 PM

Moving away from the financial and logistical aspects of the film:

When M gives Bond the big "take your ego out of the equation" speech in her apartment, she basically comes out and says that Bond gets himself too emotionally involved and it prevents him from thinking rationally.

But a couple of days later, as they stare at the body of Solange, she says, "I would ask you to remain emotionally detached, but I don't think that's your problem."

So which is it? Is Bond too emotional or too cold?


Ego doesn`t necessarely mean being emotional. Ego is what can make us too ambitious for example, wanting to win too much etc, etc. That`s what she meant IMO. Like think before you do things.

#55 byline

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Posted 23 July 2007 - 03:44 PM

But as you say, that doesn't really explain why he LOST so much. The price just didn't go down, but did it go up that much, just because the plane rolled out of that hangar?

Wouldn't stock normally skyrocket with the introduction of an innovative new model or brand? I would think especially in the aerospace industry, such a fluctuation would be normal with the introduction of a new prototype that, presumably, has innovations well beyond its competitors. In that case, I can see the Skyfleet stock jumping . . . which, of course, was the exact opposite of what Le Chiffre intended to have happen.

#56 The Richmond Spy

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Posted 23 July 2007 - 05:02 PM

[quote name='autquisest' post='756653' date='22 July 2007 - 04:00']Rival companies would gain some short term, ok...stocks would rise accordingly but c

#57 autquisest

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Posted 24 July 2007 - 04:47 PM

But as you say, that doesn't really explain why he LOST so much. The price just didn't go down, but did it go up that much, just because the plane rolled out of that hangar?

Wouldn't stock normally skyrocket with the introduction of an innovative new model or brand? I would think especially in the aerospace industry, such a fluctuation would be normal with the introduction of a new prototype that, presumably, has innovations well beyond its competitors. In that case, I can see the Skyfleet stock jumping . . . which, of course, was the exact opposite of what Le Chiffre intended to have happen.



But it

#58 vavu007

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Posted 24 July 2007 - 06:35 PM

The money issue is complicated to be sure. I think the producers were trying to make it seem like LeChiffre was placing a 100 million dollar bet on something (stock price falling) and when he lost the money went away. In the real world, LeChiffre simply had to buy back the stock he borrowed. While he would have lost money on the deal, he'd still be liquid enough to serve his clients. That is unless the orginal 100 million was really the profit margin he expected.

The book makes the money issue much simpler and (for some of us) more interesting. LeChiffre invests his clint's (SMERSH) money in a string of legal whore houses just as France makes such things illegal. The whore house thing also added to who (and what) LeChiffre is, as Fleming states that part of the reason for the investment is that it would give LeChiffre easy access to women.

#59 Gri007

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Posted 25 July 2007 - 04:53 PM

Theres not much in CR that I don't understand. There is a little thing that bugs me.

When M goes to the Bahamas to tell Bond about Solanges death and what Le Chiffres plan was with the Skyfleet prototype, she mentions the event of 9/11 and also 9/12. Was 9/12 just pure fiction or was there a terrorist event that happened

#60 The Richmond Spy

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Posted 25 July 2007 - 11:53 PM

That is unless the orginal 100 million was really the profit margin he expected.

Actually, I initially suspected that is what they meant. Just because it made more sense that way. If they had gotten into all of the jargon associated with the financial markets, then the casual viewer would've been confused. Looks like I'm confused anyway. :cooltongue: