90 replies to this topic

[SilencedPPK]

Did any US forum members have problems hearing the British term instead of the US one?

No.

Did it still register with them as to what Bond was talking about?

Yes it did register in my brain!

[DaveBond21]

So, does anyone think that Bond should use only British phrases?

[Major Tallon]

The middle USA has traditionally been highly resistant to British accents. In the early 1970's, one of our TV networks contemplated a series of Sherlock Holmes mysteries with Stewart Granger in the lead, but the project died because surveys showed that people were turned off by his accent, even though Granger hardly sounded British at all by that time.

For me, Bond's Britishness is critical to the character, and that should be reflected in the way the character speaks. Fleming was clear that he didn't want a stage-Englishman as his hero, always spouting "Cheerio" and "Pip pip," but the books are nevertheless written in a distinctly British idiom.

Here's Kingsley Amis: "the narrative style avoids Americanisms with unnatural studiousness. Bond does decide to have himself an old-fashioned ball, but so far as I know this is a unique lapse. *** The total effect is of refusal to assimilate American English, whether as a source of stylistic material or as a natural way for other people to talk. *** In impeccably British prose, then, Mr. Fleming goes to work on the Americans."

So, while EON needs to be concerned about the box office, my preference (as always) would be for Bond to prove true to his literary roots. If he refers to his mobile, we Yanks can sort it out, and most of us know what a lift is. So long as he doesn't drive a pantechnicon across a flyover on a dual carriageway, we'll be the better for hearing Bond in his author's voice.

[supernova]

Well being that the U.S. (with Canada) will only take in around 27% of Casino Royale box office, I don't really think its relevant whether or not English collaquialisms are understood in the U.S. If people in the U.S. don't get it - tough - 73% of the rest of the World market are managing just fine.

[DaveBond21]

Interesting point, supernova.

[DaveBond21]

If he refers to his mobile, we Yanks can sort it out, and most of us know what a lift is

Maybe the Bond producers should take heed. I am sure that Purvis & Wade would write the English words in the script.

[darkpath]

So, does anyone think that Bond should use only British phrases?

For my own self, I would persnally prefer that Bond only uses the British phrase variants, rather than the American variants.

On a tangent, can anyone recommend a proper reference source for an American looking to improve his English?

[Forward Look]

Well being that the U.S. (with Canada) will only take in around 27% of Casino Royale box office, I don't really think its relevant whether or not English collaquialisms are understood in the U.S. If people in the U.S. don't get it - tough - 73% of the rest of the World market are managing just fine.

Many of us in the USA have gotten some of it, but probably not all of it. I had no problem with lift for elevator and boot for trunk. And no problems with British-style spellings like "organisation" and "tyre" either. Now then, is a fortnight a holiday?

[DaveBond21]

Now then, is a fortnight a holiday?

Well it's 2 weeks. I think it's an abbreviation of "fourteen nights".

[darkpath]

Thank you!

[Sigma7]

"mmm thats not 'alf bad," grrrrrr that bit of dialogue in CR really pissed me off, it seemed so common, and not something i would have expected bond to say

[Forward Look]

Slapper - a tarty sort, usually oldish, sleeps with anything
Ginger - red headed persons
Minger - really ugly, smelly, dirty, slapper, and
therefore often goes with:
Ginger Minger - red headed ugly smelly dirty old slapper


Recognise yourselves anyone?? !!!!!!!

The actress/singer/personality formerly known as Ginger Spice

[Auric64]

British pronunciation
of Garage, (which, being British he would do

I'm British, and I don't say it like Bond did.

Well, there`s only two ways to say it, the US way and the way Brosnan did in GE. He pronounced it the way a British person would; by simply saying the word Garage, where there is no syllable.

How do you pronouce it, then?

Best

Andy

[RazorBlade]

A simple guide to UK usage of colloquialisms

A Radcliffe - public urination
A Sean Connery - a slap in the face
Tramp - hirsute homeless person with ragged clothes
Bum - Posterior, not a tramp
- Rear end, as in 'fell on my '
Horses - rubbish, as in gibberish
Rubbish - garbage
The rubbish - the garbage can
Talking rubbish - talking bollocks
Bollocks - testicular area
Ball bag - scrotumicol area housing bollocks
Talking Bollocks - talking out of ones
Meat 'n' veg - testicular area and appendage
John Thomas - the appendage
Barnet - head of hair, like a big fat hair hat on someone's bonce
Bonce - head
Purse - small container used by women for small change, notes and credit cards

Bag - an old slapper, or grumpy woman usually ugly
Bag - a container for a womans womanly items such as purse,
perfume, mobile, screwdriver set, kitchen sink etc ..
Loo - WC
WC - lavatory
Cow - derogatory term for horrible women - usually old
Bovine - derogatory term for cow like women, usually ginger
and usually Slappers ofen a bit fat
The Bovine - derogatory term for a cow like woman, ginger, old and
who is a bit of a slapper
Tart - a girl who will sleep with anything and anybody
Tarty sort - a girl who acts and dresses like she will sleep with
anything and anybody
An old tart - a bit of an old slapper/bag who will sleep with anything
Slapper - a tarty sort, usually oldish, sleeps with anything
Ginger - red headed persons
Minger - really ugly, smelly, dirty, slapper, and
therefore often goes with:
Ginger Minger - red headed ugly smelly dirty old slapper


Recognise yourselves anyone?? !!!!!!!

One of the many useful bennies of reading CBn.

[Keir]

I found it - in TND when Bond and Wai Lin fall down the side of the Carver building using the poster, Bond says "Next time I'll use the elevator" but he would have used the word "lift", being British.

Then why the hell does Charles say "De EM Zee" in DAD?
All this talk about mobile phones just reminds me of all the phones that went off in the Chinese theatre when I was trying to watch Casino Royale opening night in Beijing...

[Mister Asterix]

On a tangent, can anyone recommend a proper reference source for an American looking to improve his English?

A simple guide to UK usage of colloquialisms...

As useful as those are Bond is not about the colloquialisms.

Personally, since when I was writing fan fiction, I’ve always tried to simply use the Queen’s English. I use the Cambridge Online Dictionary and British English spell checkers. I probably annoy some of the Brits (and maybe some Americans) with my Mid-Atlantic English, but my goal over the last few years has been not to annoy Jim, who at times seems to take great offense— Oooo... sorry, I mean, offence at what we’ve done on this side of the world to his language.

[darkpath]

Thank you Mr. *. I'm well aware that my spelling is deluged with American spellings, so this is a splendid set of ideas! Thank you!

[Major Tallon]

The differences in our common language can sometimes be very amusing. I recall once encountering a very confused fellow Yank who was traipsing all over the ground floor of a London hotel in search of his first floor room.

For me, though, the prize winner goes to British then-sex kitten Susan George who, when making a film in Hollywood, gave an assistant director coughing spasms when she asked him to "come 'round at five thirty tomorrow and knock me up."

[DaveBond21]

I pronounce it 'ga ridge'

Me too, and I am from the North of England.

More Brits pronounce it this way than any other. I think Daniel Craig would have said it like that as a kid in Cheshire. There are some Northern words that don't get changed in Chester no matter how posh you are!

[Mister Asterix]

Indeed. However I don't even know what Mid-Atlantic means and isn't it Mid-atlantic?

As for Jim, he can be very pedantic - he would have made (could still be - maybe is already!!) a great lawyer !!!

Mid-Atlantic is half-way between Great Britain and the United States. Like Madonna speaks. The ‘A’ is definitely capitalised; the ‘M’ maybe not.

[morlandspecial]

I hate the over-use of mobile phones in Casino Royale. Love the film, but there are big niggles such as this. Ok, the odd use but they are used FAR too much.

In Fleming's books Bond sometimes had brand new gadgettry like a bleeper or whatever, or a phone hidden in his car. He used them like once in their respective books each. Not all the damn time.

Give it a rest with the mobile phones, it lends an air of tackyness to any film, in particular a James Bond film. Not to mention the fact they have to close-up on the Sony badge every time one is used. We got it that he uses Sony laptops, phones etc the first time we saw them, no need for 50 close-ups.

This has been the biggest criticism of the film I have seen in most reviews.

[Brock Samson]

Not to mention the fact they have to close-up on the Sony badge every time one is used. We got it that he uses Sony laptops, phones etc the first time we saw them, no need for 50 close-ups.

Sadly, it's something we'll all just have to get used to. Promotion is a major money-spinner.

[Brix Bond]

Americans are too busy invading the English language and are not making a very good job of it.

Wait...

[darkpath]

Americans are too busy invading the English language and are not making a very good job of it.

Wait...

Please forgive the impertinence; but what would you have us waiting for?

[Brock Samson]

I didn't even notice the word Sony and Ive seen the movie about 9 times now!! You two are a marketing man's dream!!!!

You don't have to have fantastic observation skills to notice the blatant product placement. It's part and parcel of modern big budget film-making. Half the time it's announced in the trades who's sponsoring what.

[doublenoughtspy]

I didn't even notice the word Sony and Ive seen the movie about 9 times now!! You two are a marketing man's dream!!!!

I think you need glasses. I must give you the name of my occulist.

It's shown a number of times more prominently than the device (phone/laptop/etc) itself.

[Brock Samson]

Must have been very subtly done this Sony thing and I suspect you are a great attentionpayer to detail. You must be a lawyer!!

You are incredibly lucky not to notice it. For example, the extreme close-up of a Blu-Ray Disc with it's prominent Sony logo in Bond's hand with the background out of focus. 'Very subtly'? Not even close.

[Brock Samson]

In truth, I'd seen a blurb about the Blu-ray and Sony wasn't exactly shy about publicising it's involvement. I imagine any hype is good, but I hate the way product placement is so ubiquitous. I can't help but notice it now. You're better off out of it. I wish I could not notice it but it's honestly got to the point where it's distracting.
DAD was pretty bad for it too. I know it's always been part and parcel of Bond, Fleming wasn't shy about chucking out the odd brand name, but I can remember more than one article mentioning how much of DAD's budget came from promotional partners.

Anyway, I can't talk about it anymore; it's giving me a headache.
Ah, Nuprin. Little. Yellow. Different.

[darkpath]

Generally, I don't notice product placement but I would rather that than concerted efforts to hide a brand like we had in the UK until recently, coke bottles had to be disguised or you would see car badges taken off or a character drinking out of a bottle that said 'tubdeiser' on it or some such, it was silly and unbelievable.

What? You don't love those circular stickers they put on the lids of Apple laptops?

[Brock Samson]

Anyway, I can't talk about it anymore; it's giving me a headache.
Ah, Nuprin. Little. Yellow. Different.

oooh dear, it's because you are probably subconsciously looking for it now!! And you clearly pay attention to details. Me? I don't even know what Nuprin is, in the UK we have various headache products but I couldn't tell you the 'hook' apart from ibuprofen.

It's a US painkiller, I believe. I've not seen it here (ex-pat). It's also a direct quote from Wayne's World when they're discussing artistic integrity and selling out all-the-while prominently displaying various brand name products.

Edit: Hey Presto! It's on Youtube

Edited by Brock Samson, 17 May 2007 - 02:23 PM.