740 replies to this topic

[zencat]

I like everything James Bond. At least I can see and enjoy the good in everything and not let the "bad" drag me down. That puts me outside the box (but it shouldn't).

[Arbogast777]

Glad to see some love for "Man with the Golden Gun" in this thread, definitely my most underrated Bond film.

[Guy Haines]

This might be going against the mainstream view, not only on this site but generally, but..... "Nobody Does It Better" doesn't cut the mustard for me as a Bond song. As a song it is fine, but it just doesn't come across to me as a Bond movie theme. And yet it was the one that won, or was nominated for, the awards, ahead of some of the classic John Barry tunes.

[Zorin Industries]

And Zorin I would be interested to hear why you think the first part of DAD paved an effective path for Craig.

Tonally and narratively it is very akin to what Craig's two films have achieved - i.e. not the all out comedy fest but a moody, breaking the mould direction.

So we have Bond in a Korean cell for 14 months and we have Craig's 007 being beaten naked. I don't mean the incarceration angle but the tone and creative statement of those motifs - the fact the first half of DIE ANOTHER DAY shows the nature of the job, the dirty and unfair politics at play, the fact M's hands are tied, the fact that Bond can bleed and get exhausted. There is also a hunting vibe about the first act of DIE ANOTHER DAY. BOND is on the prowl and he is a bit angry, which is a motif used throughout ROYALE and SOLACE.

[sthgilyadgnivileht]

And Zorin I would be interested to hear why you think the first part of DAD paved an effective path for Craig.

Tonally and narratively it is very akin to what Craig's two films have achieved - i.e. not the all out comedy fest but a moody, breaking the mould direction.

So we have Bond in a Korean cell for 14 months and we have Craig's 007 being beaten naked. I don't mean the incarceration angle but the tone and creative statement of those motifs - the fact the first half of DIE ANOTHER DAY shows the nature of the job, the dirty and unfair politics at play, the fact M's hands are tied, the fact that Bond can bleed and get exhausted. There is also a hunting vibe about the first act of DIE ANOTHER DAY. BOND is on the prowl and he is a bit angry, which is a motif used throughout ROYALE and SOLACE.

Makes sense. Then looking at it this way the DAD opening act may have given the producers the courage to leap forward with that kind of story telling for the duration of an entire Bond movie. It's harder to appreciate such elements in DAD because for me the extravaganza of the piece kind of overshadows the whole thing.

[jaguar007]

I like everything James Bond. At least I can see and enjoy the good in everything and not let the "bad" drag me down. That puts me outside the box (but it shouldn't).

Likewise. I will still take my least favorite Bond film over most other movies any day.

[Guy Haines]

And Zorin I would be interested to hear why you think the first part of DAD paved an effective path for Craig.

Tonally and narratively it is very akin to what Craig's two films have achieved - i.e. not the all out comedy fest but a moody, breaking the mould direction.

So we have Bond in a Korean cell for 14 months and we have Craig's 007 being beaten naked. I don't mean the incarceration angle but the tone and creative statement of those motifs - the fact the first half of DIE ANOTHER DAY shows the nature of the job, the dirty and unfair politics at play, the fact M's hands are tied, the fact that Bond can bleed and get exhausted. There is also a hunting vibe about the first act of DIE ANOTHER DAY. BOND is on the prowl and he is a bit angry, which is a motif used throughout ROYALE and SOLACE.

I agree. The first half of DAD is really rather serious, with Bond in a situation we've not seen before. It only gets its "Moonraker" reputation from the scenes in the second half, and even then it is nowhere near as far fetched.

[DaveBond21]

Just bumping this one up, as there is a repeat thread in the forum.

Cheers

[AMC Hornet]

Although I'va admitted this elsewhere, this seems to be the most welcome place to state my all-time favorites (In no particular order (as, like Peking Duck and Russian caviar, I love them all):

Thunderball
OHMSS
Diamonds are Forever
Live and Let Die
TMWTGG
TSWLM

plus, sharing second place:

Octopussy
The Living Daylights
Die Another Day
Casino Royale

(Nothing wrong with the rest, they're just not my favorites (although don't get me started on AVTAK...)

Favorite Bond: Roger Moore, followed by Sean Connery.

Favorite Villain: Francisco Scaramanga, followed by Mr. Big/Kananga and Telly Savalas' Blofeld

Favorite girl: Kara Milovy, followed by Mary Goodnight

(Please note: I did not use the word BEST anywhere to describe my favorites.)

I could go on to list my favorite cars (Lotus Esprit) and gadgets (Golden Gun), but I might slip up and mention the Aston Martin 'Vanish' and get myself lynched....

[DaveBond21]

Mods, can we merge this thread with the indentical one called 'Unorthodox opinions about Bond"?

Thanks

[sharpshooter]

Moonraker doesn't really need any help around these parts anymore.

But I can feel a growing Diamonds Are Forever appreciation trend. Which is music to my ears, because it's a brilliant film.

[jaguar007]

Moonraker doesn't really need any help around these parts anymore.

But I can feel a growing Diamonds Are Forever appreciation trend. Which is music to my ears, because it's a brilliant film.

yes, DAF is great fun (then again, all Bond movies are really)

[Rufus Ffolkes]

Here's one I suspect the vast majority will disagree with:

In my view, Roger Moore is closer to Fleming's conception of Bond than Daniel Craig.

[Baccarat]

New member today. Lurked for years. Always enjoy the discussions and thought it time I signed up. The first Bond I saw on the big screen was Moonraker, which should give an idea of how long I've followed the exploits of 007.

Some immediate thoughts for this topic:

G - Despite some of the best sequences in the series - the golf game, ejector seat, laser, briefing, etc. - the film always seems under-paced and rather dull to me.

DAF - Tired, boring, campy. Really, no redeeming features whatsoever.

TSWLM - Best theme song.

GE - The Eric Serra score is my favourite non-Barry and better than any Arnold (although the "song" over the end titles is awful). Good to see others here also like it.

TND - Least effective villain, over-played by an actor who really should have known better.

DAD - Utterly pointless, with so many "offences" (Cleese plays Fawlty plays Q, invisible Aston, para-surfing or whatever that was, Madonna, Halle Berry, CGI, etc., etc.) that it is an embarrassment to the franchise.

QOS - Top 5 Bond film, but only when viewed on DVD on a regular sized television. I said as much when leaving the cinema with my head in a spin from the quick-cut editing.

David Arnold - Has yet to produce anything close to a classic Bond score.

Lack of imagination from the writers/producers - Nuclear terrorism/explosion/war theme (TB, YOLT, TSWLM, OP, TWINE) and an outer-space "weapon" (DAF, MR, GE, TND, DAD) are good examples. Of course, some of the screenplays are based on the Fleming source material, but others are derivative.

Oh, and Daniel Craig is superb.

Edited by Baccarat, 06 October 2010 - 08:23 PM.

[PrinceKamalKhan]

There are many Bond fans that think alike. They hold the same views. Of course people tend to flock like sheep, think like one another, and ultimately lose their individuality. It is usually because people are afraid to think differently; maybe they don't want to be ridiculed or feel left out of a community. When certain views are held by too many persons like "Goldfinger is the greatest Bond movie," or "A View To A Kill is one of the worst Bond movies," than I just think that many of them are not being honest about their opinions. Furthermore, it gets boring reading the same views over and over and over again on the Internet like "Bond does not belong in space," "that slide whistle noise during the car jump in The Man With the Gold Gun is annoying and it ruined the stunt ," "the invisible car ruined Die Another Day," "Casino Royale is the best Bond movie ever," or "Diamonds Are Forever is the worst Connery Eon film and Fleming's worst novel."

Agree about it seeming like many fans just seem to go along to get along.

I am reminded of an example that Woody Allen gave about this mentality in an interview. He stated that when a person stands with a group of people that hated the new James Bond movie, they agree with that group and claim to hate it too. Then they walk away from that group and join another group of persons who loved the new Bond film. They all of a sudden change their opinion and agree with this group that the new Bond film is great. In other words, people don't think for themselves.

Great story! I definitely believe it happens in reality.

I have caught a few views on these boards that are radical and don't fit with many Bond fans; examples are the user Zencat being a Moonraker fan, the user Zorin Industries naming A View To A Kill as their favorite Bond film, or the user DLibrasnow naming Never Say Never Again as their favorite. I myself have a few radical views; I think The Man With the Golden Gun is one of the best Bond films, that Moonraker is superior to The Spy Who Loved Me, that Quantum of Solace is better than Casino Royale, and that GoldenEye is Pierce Brosnan's worst Bond film.

I think it's the diversity of fan opinions that makes these web forums so much fun to read and participate in.

So what views do you have that are radical and are not held by many or most Bond fans? Please share them.

Here's a few:

I think Mary Goodnight is hilarious and greatly enjoy Britt Ekland's performance as her.
I like Paris Carver and think she should've been the main girl in TND.
I think the first 2/3 of DAD makes for the best Brosnan film.
I find FYEO decent but overrated and not nearly as much fun of a Moore entry to watch as MR, OP or TMWTGG. I also think CR and both Dalton films do a better job as serious "back to Fleming" Bond than FYEO does.
I actually enjoy the fire truck chase in AVTAK.
I find Pam(LTK) and Wai Lin(TND) vastly overrated.
Holly(MR) is the best female agent in the series.
Brandt(YOLT) is a very underrated Bond villainess who had the misfortune of being the immediate successor to a very tough act to follow(Volpe in TB).
I detest the microchip in the arm bit in CR.
Tiger Tanaka is the coolest male ally in the series and is even cooler than Bond in YOLT.
I prefer Kissy Suzuki to Aki in YOLT although both are good.
I prefer Caroline Bliss' Miss Moneypenny to Samantha Bond's version.
I prefer Robert Brown's M to Dame Judi Dench's version.
Caroline Munro and Barbara Bach should've switched roles in TSWLM.

I think DIAMONDS ARE FOREVER has the best dialogue of any Bond film, TOMORROW NEVER DIES is easily Brosnan's better film, GOLDENEYE is badly shot and directed, MOONRAKER is more watchable than THE SPY WHO LOVED ME, OCTOPUSSY is a really tight Cold war caper, THUNDERBALL is a tad boring (in parts), the first half of DIE ANOTHER DAY paved an effective path for Daniel Craig, THE WORLD IS NOT ENOUGH is all over the place and not very good, YOU ONLY LIVE TWICE is Connery's best onscreen presence and performance and GOLDEN GUN is under-rated, but better for it.

All the ones in bold I agree with.

I think Dr. Christmas Jones is really cool.

Now that´s very courageous of you, Joyce!

Indeed it is courageous. I'm not a Christmas Jones fan myself but I like reading when some of the least loved characters, films, elements, etc. are praised and have defenders. Being a Paris Carver fan, I know what that's like.

And considering the P & W-hate around here. Yes, let me say it: they are probably some of the best writers the Bond films ever had.

Another courageous opinion. I will say I prefer Purvis & Wade to Bruce Feirstein and Paul Haggis.

This may be understandable as far as people on this website, but I find myself at odds with 'normal' people when I state that TLD is one of my top 5 favorite Bond films.

I also think that David Arnold has produced a couple of the best non-Barry Bond scores.

Agree with both of these. TLD is currently my #2 Bond film and I consider the best one made post-TB. I consider Arnold's scores for TND and CR the two best non-Barry scores in the series.

[DaveBond21]

Here are some of mine:-

- I really like TWINE

- FYEO is my joint-favourite along with FRWL

- I like all the actors who played James Bond

- I like all the Bond theme songs

- Even though I love Daniel Craig and his Bond movies, I find them just a bit too serious

- I miss Q and Moneypenny


________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

[Colossus]

Mods, can we merge this thread with the indentical one called 'Unorthodox opinions about Bond"?

Thanks

Much obliged to going to bat for this little thread Dave!

Good to see the TMWTGG love.

[Colossus]

YOU ONLY LIVE TWICE is Connery's best onscreen presence and performance

YOLT is a Bond phase that is unique, he is beyond the need to be the super swaggering one-up-manship which has been growing with each movie (where he reaches the zenith in Thunderball) that he's now at a zen-like state where he has no need for showing off that here and has a coolly detached manner.

Here's one I suspect the vast majority will disagree with:

In my view, Roger Moore is closer to Fleming's conception of Bond than Daniel Craig.

Moore might just by my favorite Bond, most professional when you get down to it.

[elizabeth]

DAF to me seems really psychadelic and mystical.

[glidrose]

Fleming's novels Moonraker and You Only Live Twice were unfilmable.

The films Moonraker, Octopussy, A View to a Kill and most of Tomorrow Never Dies are underrated.

Die Another Day is better than its reputation. Even the title song is good.

The movie The Living Daylights is terrible. Dalton is stiff and hammy.

All Time High is a fantastic song.

Goldeneye is a terrible, dull, talky, gloomy film though Brosnan is fantastic.

Brosnan got worse with each film. I hate the Brosnan bashing on this board, but will admit he became unbearable in the role. I remember cringing at his performance at the DAD premiere. Hoped the producers would get rid of him.

Connery in OHMSS would have resulted in a radically different film. And I'm not convinced one the fans think it would have been.

From Russia With Love may be the weakest of the first four films.

Goldfinger's title song has too much kitsch.

For many years OHMSS was underrated. Now it's overrated. Rigg and Savalas are miscast. Too much of the film is ugly to look at. This film needed a polished, glossy look.

Marvin Hamlisch did a fantastic job on TSWLM soundtrack. Better than most of John Barry's scores. The producers should have brought him back for FYEO.

John Gardner was the wrong man to write Bond. His books are no good.

Devil May Care is the best adult Bond novel since the early 1980's.

Too many Bond films are badly photographed: LALD, TMWTGG, TSWLM, GE, TWINE, CR '06. TLD, LTK and QOS aren't so hot.

TND and parts of DAD are the only two Bond films that properly showcase their locations since Roger Moore's era. GE looks and feels like it was shot on a soundstage.

I never liked Shirley Bassey's voice.

I don't like Paul McCartney's voice for LALD. The producers should have used B.J. Arnau for the title version.

Goldfinger is the best Bond film although half a dozen Bond films are more fun.

Jaws flapping his arms after the freefall fight is fantastic. I'm glad the producers included it. Get a sense of humor, all of you.

Moore gives a terrible performance in FYEO. He looks ill at ease, in pain and has none of his usual charisma. It's like he doesn't even want to be there.

Moonraker has an excellent story that features much smart, integrated plotting. FYEO has a terrible story that lists all over the place.

Christopher Walken is bland in AVTAK. The producers should have cast a character actor, not a method actor. Tanya Roberts is much better than people give her credit, despite those "James, Jameses".

Michael Lonsdale is stiff and dull in Moonraker. He sleepwalks through the film.

Most Bond fanboys have terrible taste and are nowhere near as smart as they think they are.

John Glen was a genius at action sequences and few of the actions sequences since his era come close. Many in fact are visual noise.

Kingsley Amis, John Pearson, Christopher Wood, Sebastian Faulks at his best and in some ways Charlie Higson all write better than Ian Fleming.

Fleming was right: the book Bond was a cardboard dummy.

Thunderball is a boring book. The Spy Who Loved Me may be Fleming's best. The Property of a Lady may be his best short story.

[The Shark]

Marvin Hamlisch did a fantastic job on TSWLM soundtrack. Better than most of John Barry's scores.

I find this utterly baffling.

[AMC Hornet]

You had me going, Glidrose, but you lost me at "John Gardner was the wrong man to write Bond. His books are no good" and everything that came after.

[David Schofield]

When I first read the Fleming novels in the late 70s - the classic Pan still-life covers - I always pictured James Bond as short, blond haired, craggy-faced and muscular.

Honest.

[Miles Miservy]

I think we should be more specific than we have been in why our opinions are "unorthodox". For example, I find movies such as Moonraker and Die Another Day are far more well-loved here than some people seem to think. It's not very unorthodox if everyone agrees, is it?

The thing about these are that there's no wrong answers (Except for all of you... just kidding). With every decade, you tend to realize that original films are remade.

FYEO = remake of FRWL
TSWLM = remake of YOLT
AVTAK = remake of GF
DAD = remake of DAF

Make no mistake... I DO enjoy them all but there are some I won't go back to as quicly as others.

Everything about DAF is wrong. The entire picture makes fun of itself. From Blofeld in drag to two of the LAMEST henchmen in the entire series. We meet Tiffany Case and see her as this shrewd, intelligent diamond smuggler and by the end of the movie she's just a whiny, snivling bimbo in a bikini. (When she says, "EEEEEWWW!!" at the sight of the bomb in the dessert, it's like nails on a blackboard.

TMWTGG is Moore's weakest film. The only aspect of this movie that saves it from itself is Christopher Lee. The book was so much better (as they almost always are). The plot is as dated and simplistic as a book report. There actually wasn't any reason for 007 to kill Scaramanga.

I did enjoy both of Dalton's movies. The only thing that limited TLD, I think, was the significant lack of other Bond women. Although LTK had a weaker plot than TLD, Sanchez was a much more menacing villain. Benicio del Toro was a cool henchman.

Pierce Brosnan was on a roll... that is, right up until DAD. There's nothing I can say about this chowderpot of a screenplay that hasn't already been said before.

You come into a premier of the next 007 movie with certain expectations. Sometimes you're blown away (i.e. GE, CR, MR...). other times not so much (i.e. DAD, OP, TMWGG)

It'll be interesting to see what SKYFALL does for my expectations.

[Binyamin]

- Goldfinger is NOT "the quintessential Bond movie that truly launched the franchise." It's possibly the worst Bond film ever made and de-railed everything fantastic that had been accomplished in the previous two films. Most people going on about "classic Goldfinger" have never actually SEEN it, I'd guess.

- Diamonds Are Forever IS rather classic.

- So is Live and Let Die. One of the best Bond films ever, in fact.

- FYEO. Another classic. And Melina is one of the top five Bondgirls.

- OHMSS is NOT some hidden classic. It's a flawed movie that COULD have been a classic but feel short.

- TND is quite good.

Edited by Binyamin, 20 January 2012 - 01:23 AM.

[Mickeba]

The only bad thing about Golden Gun is the little kung fu girls. They are silly, but I think it's a terrific movie.

[Vanish]

I love this topic - Helps every Bond fan exercise their quirky likes and dislikes. Here 'goes:

1) Goldfinger is extraordinarily overpraised - It set the style and has numerous classic moments, but it's dull, slow paced and not very interesting.

2) OHMSS actually benefits from George Lazenby's presence - he brings a unique and fresh quality to the 007 role that, in all likelihood, Connery would not have delivered at the time.

3) The Man With the Golden Gun is one of Roger Moore's best Bond outings: Exotic and interesting, with an unusual storyline and a killer villain.

4) For Your Eyes Only is dreadfully dull for the most part, and comes complete with a dreadfully dull Bond girl and villain to boot.

5) Octopussy is easily one of the most fun movies in the entire series, and offers perhaps the most "bang for your buck" in terms of twists, turns, action set pieces, chases, beautiful women and dastardly villains.

6) Eric Serra's Goldeneye score is one of the best in the series. Atmospheric, memorable and creative.

7) Tomorrow Never Dies is fantastic in pretty much every area, except for the Bond girls.

Edited by Vanish, 20 January 2012 - 03:58 AM.

[The Shark]

I love this topic - Helps every Bond fan exercise their quirky likes and dislikes. Here 'goes:

1) Goldfinger is extraordinarily overpraised - It set the style and has numerous classic moments, but it's dull, slow paced and not very interesting.

2) OHMSS actually benefits from George Lazenby's presence - he brings a unique and fresh quality to the 007 role that, in all likelihood, Connery would not have delivered at the time.

3) The Man With the Golden Gun is one of Roger Moore's best Bond outings: Exotic and interesting, with an unusual storyline and a killer villain.

4) For Your Eyes Only is dreadfully dull for the most part, and comes complete with a dreadfully dull Bond girl and villain to boot.

5) Octopussy is easily one of the most fun movies in the entire series, and offers perhaps the most "bang for your buck" in terms of twists, turns, action set pieces, chases, beautiful women and dastardly villains.

6) Eric Serra's Goldeneye score is one of the best in the series. Atmospheric, memorable and creative.

7) Tomorrow Never Dies is fantastic in pretty much every area, except for the Bond girls.

Agree with nearly all of that.

[tdalton]

1) Goldfinger is extraordinarily overpraised - It set the style and has numerous classic moments, but it's dull, slow paced and not very interesting.

I could not agree more.

3) The Man With the Golden Gun is one of Roger Moore's best Bond outings: Exotic and interesting, with an unusual storyline and a killer villain.

I would agree that Roger Moore himself is quite possibly at his best in TMWTGG. It's a very underrated performance by Moore, who actually shows some toughness on occasion and some shades of Fleming's Bond which are often more difficult to find in his other films. With that said, though, I think the rest of the film is a complete mess.

5) Octopussy is easily one of the most fun movies in the entire series, and offers perhaps the most "bang for your buck" in terms of twists, turns, action set pieces, chases, beautiful women and dastardly villains.

Definitely agreed. While I prefer the more serious, harder-edge Bond films, OP ranks right at the top of my list of the more outlandish and "fun" Bond films.

6) Eric Serra's Goldeneye score is one of the best in the series. Atmospheric, memorable and creative.

Absolutely agreed. I'd probably go as far as to say that, with the possible exception of Sean Bean, Serra's score is the best thing about GE.

[Agent Sidewinder]

Moonraker is an excellent Bond film, and more traditionally "Bondian/" than it's held up to be.

Octopussy and A View to a Kill are both better than For Your Eyes Only.

Lazenby was closest to the literary Bond....

....while Dalton, bless him, was nowhere near it.

Christmas Jones was a decent Bond girl.

Roger Moore was convincing in the vast majority of his fight scenes

Mr. Kiss Kiss Bang Bang is a hideous song, and sounds more like something from a Bond parody than an actual Bond film.

Diamonds Are Forever is the worst song to actually make it into a Bond film....

....while The Man with the Golden Gun is one of the best.

Jeroen Krabbé made a very good villain in The Living Daylights.

Live and Let Die is Moore's weakest film.

The World is not Enough is Brosnan's best film (not sure how controversial this is, but given the amount of stick TWINE gets round these 'ere parts, it probably is).

Robert Brown's M is Admiral Hargreaves.

Sheryl Crow's title theme for Tomorrow Never Dies is a great song.

Edited by Agent Sidewinder, 20 January 2012 - 05:02 PM.