69 replies to this topic

[Hitch]

Since the announcement of Daniel Craig as the new Bond I feel that CBn has become a less friendly website; I've read more vituperative comments here in the last week than I have in the last year. Members might be for, against, or neutral about Craig's appointment, but they should certainly treat other members (and Mr Craig himself) with a bit more respect.

A quick note: the only time we have seen Daniel Craig as James Bond 007 is in the one photo. He looks terrific - he's an actor, and in that picture he's pretending to be James Bond and makes a fine job of it. The press conference was a very unusual occasion for him, even though he's well established in the industry, and to judge him as James Bond purely on that appearance is the wrong thing to do - because then he wasn't acting. The photo is the only evidence and he passes with flying colours.

*Hitch stops to wonder why he is wasting his precious time on such woefully trivial matters*

*Reminds self not to refer to self in third person*

Another quick note: CBn is a talking shop, one which also features excellent articles by members and links to news stories. Might it be an idea, just this once, seeing as this is the first time a new Bond has appeared since the advent of the internet, for CBn to post a "thanks to Pierce and welcome to Daniel" -type banner/article? Such a splash wouldn't have to be biased towards either actor - just a simple "Pierce, thanks for the memories - Daniel, the very best of luck"-type article. It might help to persuade first-time visitors (and maybe the press ) that CBn isn't a rabid fan-boy website, but a friendly place for Bond fans to visit?

I'll be quiet now.

[Scottlee]

Well I'm pro-Craig, and representation of myself and others like me is not apparant in that article. It stinks. It's a bias piece of writing. It even mis-quotes what was obviously a spoof thread.

[zencat]

Since the announcement of Daniel Craig as the new Bond I feel that CBn has become a less friendly website; I've read more vituperative comments here in the last week than I have in the last year. Members might be for, against, or neutral about Craig's appointment, but they should certainly treat other members (and Mr Craig himself) with a bit more respect.

Well said, Hitch. I couldn't agree more.

However, I do feel almost all these comments have come from new members who seem to have joined CBn just to make rude comments. They are not representive of CBn and I don't expect they will last long unless they really are here to talk Bond.

I also really encourge members to use the "report this post" button when they encounter some of these rude new members and posts so we can delate them.

[Athena007]

Sam Fisher, you are missing the whole point here. It's not just about the two incidences that were picked up by publications. I think a lot of the nastiness and negativity has calmed down a bunch since the new Bond announcement. But I just wanted to make everyone aware of something here.

You don't like Craig, great. But don't abusing other CBn members by calling them "crazy idiots" for liking Craig or calling Craig haters "dumbass American teenagers". This is unacceptable and I've been seeing this nasty attitude coming from both sides here on CBn. Would you say this to someone if they were talking to you face to face? Just because this is the internet does not give anyone the right to be abusive just because you can't see who you're talking to and are just "ranting" into cyberspace. The internet is real and so are the people on it, so be respectful. And Sam Fisher... I'm talking to you too.

I'm not particularly all hunky dorry over Craig as the new Bond. But all this "Craig is the worst Bond" crap is ridiculous. How can he be the worst Bond when he's not even had the opportunity to be James Bond on screen. No one here as seen him as 007 yet. So those who are not being Craig judgmental and being a supporter aren't necessarily saying, "Whatever Eon wants, we are drones." No... they're saying Ok thank gawd they finally chose a 007, I may or may not be happy about it but yay a new movie is actually happening... we'll see how Craig performs. It's called being reasonable, respectful while voicing an opinion. Perhaps you should try it sometime.

Thank you for that. I'm glad that someone finally said it.

You're welcome and thank you. I was a little hesitant to post this but felt it had to be done as well... it's all up there in my post.

Since the announcement of Daniel Craig as the new Bond I feel that CBn has become a less friendly website; I've read more vituperative comments here in the last week than I have in the last year. Members might be for, against, or neutral about Craig's appointment, but they should certainly treat other members (and Mr Craig himself) with a bit more respect.

And Hitch, thank you (as a CBn member) for your whole post as well addressing the same issues. I worry that with all the negativity people are being driven away by it and don't feel that they can voice themselves.

[marktmurphy]

However, I do feel almost all these comments have come from new members who seem to have joined CBn just to make rude comments. They are not representive of CBn and I don't expect they will last long unless they really are here to talk Bond.

I was looking through AJB on the day of the announcement (as CBN managed to go offline) and every single post was negative about the man. How can so many people show so little imagination? Looking at the same thread on CBN on the day when it came back online- all but a tiny minority were positive. Very strange; so I'd rather be here.

[Skudor]

I think it just takes a bit of maturity and perspective to give the guy a chance. He was hardly my first choice, but I can honestly say now that I think he has every chance of being a great Bond. I wouldn't be surprised to find that a lot (by no means all, though) of the knee jerk reaction to Craig comes from people mostly weened on Brosnan Bond - it's not a surprising reaction in that context. Picking Craig was a brave and unconventional choice and it's bound to have some people fuming. Hopefully they'll calm down.

[marktmurphy]

I was thinking last night (and this has nothing to do with anything) that Craig is the first of the non-Cubby Bonds. He's a new generation.

[David Schofield]

I think it just takes a bit of maturity and perspective to give the guy a chance.  He was hardly my first choice, but I can honestly say now that I think he has every chance of being a great Bond.  I wouldn't be surprised to find that a lot (by no means all, though) of the knee jerk reaction to Craig comes from people mostly weened on Brosnan Bond - it's not a surprising reaction in that context.  Picking Craig was a brave and unconventional choice and it's bound to have some people fuming.  Hopefully they'll calm down.

I would be VERY surprised to discover that any of the Craig-bashers were able to walk unassisted when the Bond prior to Brozza, Tim, was announced in summer 1986. And that very few of them had read a Fleming novel cover to cover.

Just a theory.

[Blue07]

[quote name='David Schofield' date='20 October 2005 - 10:45'][quote name='Skudor' date='20 October 2005 - 09:24']I think it just takes a bit of maturity and perspective to give the guy a chance.

[marktmurphy]

You've seemed very fair and open minded, Lappaman. I don't think anybody could hold your doubts against you- you're totally entitled to them. What is rankling is the constant 'he's ugly'/'isn't fit to lick Pierce's boots' type of nonsense which has been cluttering the place up. Your debates will always be welcome.

[Blue07]

You've seemed very fair and open minded, Lappaman. I don't think anybody could hold your doubts against you- you're totally entitled to them. What is rankling is the constant 'he's ugly'/'isn't fit to lick Pierce's boots' type of nonsense which has been cluttering the place up. Your debates will always be welcome.

Thank you marktmurphy, your comments help to put my mind at rest. I feel more welcome on here now.

[stromberg]

I don't consider myself a Craig Basher - I wasn't in favour of him at all and I am a Pierce fan (but I grew up on Moore so i dont fit into that theory) I'm also new to the forum but didn't start coming on here simply to knock the casting of Craig. I have to say that although I don't subscribe to extreme attacks on Craig is it now not ok to be against the casting and to state your case accordingly? I certainly wish him well and hope he is tremendous because above all I love the Bond franchise and I certainly want it to continue to thrive. There is understandably a huge amount of post on him because at this point in time after all these years this is the most important bit of James Bond news there has been. Invariably not everyone will be pleased with the casting. So just as everyone likes and dislikes different films and everyone has their favourite Bonds is it not the case that this forum is for lots of Bond fans, all with differing views to chat and debate the merits of the films, actors, books and more all relating to their own viewpoints? I totally agree that criticism should be constructive but are we not allowed different viewpoints on here? Also as a Brosnan fan (and not a child!) I must note there has also been a very large amount of Brosnan-bashing mostly in response to people disliking Craig. Swings and roundabouts? We all have different opinions, we all have our favourites, and we all have our points of view. Please let not this forum become a good talking propaganda machine for EON. Be constructive, but be fair. The thing that unites us is a love of Bond. We don't all have to love the man who plays him or the films they are in.

Fair points, Lappaman.

Certainly, CBn doesn't want to become "a good talking propaganda machine for Eon" - given the history of CBn, we have no reason to do so. And it's not only the new members who are doing the bashing, but also some folks who have been around here for quite a while. And - as Roebuck pointed out in the "negativity" thread - with the recent increase of memberships, there's also a good portion of decent and knowledgable posters with interesting views who are an asset to the forums and are most welcome to join the ride for some interesting discussion and good debating.

No one here (hopefully) has a problem with fair and constructive criticism and diversity of opinions. But a great many of critsisms towards Daniel Craig are unfair, biased and deconstructive, mostly basing on nothing but his looks and the fact that he's just not Pierce Brosnan (or name any other Bond actor). And of all things, this gets picked up by the media and puts CBn in a bad light. Add to that that our poll, which is currently at about 60% approval towards Daniel Craig, gets misquoted. Would be a shame if the CBn Team wasn't concerned about this, wouldn't it?

Every Bond actor gets his share of stick, but contrary to Daniel Craig, all of them have already been in a James Bond movie and have had the chance to prove wether or not they are capable of portraying the world's most famous superspy. As you wrote, "we don't all have to love the man who plays him or the films they are in." But Daniel Craig has yet to do so. Until then, he has my support. And I sincerely hope that this will last beyond the release date of CR.

[Lady Rose]

Looks like the pro-Craig people have it a lot better than the anti-Craig people, because at least they're excited about the new Bond film. I'm glad I'm not a Bond fan who's not looking forward to CASINO ROYALE.

This is exactley how I feel.Craig was never a choice of mine, but he is the choice of Eon and I do have a little faith in what they are trying to achieve.It is a bold and exciting move.It may not work, but lets give it a go and see what happens.We may all enjoy it.Craig is a very fine actor who will bring great depth to the role.Soemthing that has been seriously lacking in recent years.I have enoyed Bond in all his incarnations.I see no reason not to enjoy Craig.

I may add that AJB has also managed to to get itself in the media.In the
the New York Times and Reuters.Neither were positive comments about Craig.There has also been an awful lot of negative threads and aggressive posting.This is not just a CBn problem.

[mcsearg]

Since the announcement of Daniel Craig as the new Bond I feel that CBn has become a less friendly website; I've read more vituperative comments here in the last week than I have in the last year. Members might be for, against, or neutral about Craig's appointment, but they should certainly treat other members (and Mr Craig himself) with a bit more respect.

Well said, Hitch. I couldn't agree more.

However, I do feel almost all these comments have come from new members who seem to have joined CBn just to make rude comments. They are not representive of CBn and I don't expect they will last long unless they really are here to talk Bond.

I also really encourge members to use the "report this post" button when they encounter some of these rude new members and posts so we can delate them.

Agrred, Zen. I encountered a nasty post by a new member just yesterday. It was reported, and was deleted almost immediately. Nicely done..

Good luck Mr. Craig, you ARE Bond!

[Lounge Lizard]

I just ignore the average Craig Basher since they come with very little of interest and most have not even read the book to begin with. But I find the average Craig fan just as annoying as well their blind pro stance based upon the same info as the other camp. It all comes down to a taste which is subjective at best.

Well, I can only speak for myself, but I don't think I'm being a brainless optimist about Craig and [B]CR. I voted yes in the 'Craig approval' thread, based on assumptions made on his ability as an actor. I've never stated bluntly that he'll be the best Bond since Connery; but I think he has the potential to be.

As I said in my first post, I thought the appointment of Craig would be a fun time for me to join CBn. We live in interesting times, so to speak- also because Internet forums now get covered by the media more often. How far can our media-consciousness go? I'm not really sure if it is necessary to censor away the more aggressive Craig bashers, or any bashers for that matter, unless people get rude toward other forum members. Let's fight people with arguments, and if people don't respond to reason, let's just ignore them. I won't lose sleep over that.

Edited by Lounge Lizard, 20 October 2005 - 03:40 PM.

[Tarl_Cabot]

I think the response has been mostly positive; the thread about "blaming Craig" was tounge and cheek....I'm actually surpirsed by how many fans are open minded to the change...a few naysayers, sure but that's to be expected.

Craig wasn't my top choice but I've moved on.No Clive Owen or ____? ok..get over it and give this guy a chance.

The thread about CR locales has me geeked up!

[Genrewriter]

I think the problem is that the naysayers just come off as a bit louder and more repetitious.

[Michigansoftball#1]

The references to CBn in the media are to be expected when a big 007 announcement gets made and they are not always going to reflect the fan community in the best light.

Controversy sells newspapers. Thats the way the biz works.

CBn posts "news articles" so they shouldn't be surprised by this, they cast themselves as a news service. so they have to expect all the legal baggage that comes with running a news service. Blogs and websites are being held to the same standard as established news services whioh if course makes the job of mods even more important. They do an important, highly responsible job that actually involves a lot of skill and knowledge (of the law) - they deserve our respect. They have mine. Good job!

[Agent Provocateur]

I don't consider myself a Craig Basher - I wasn't in favour of him at all and I am a Pierce fan (but I grew up on Moore so i dont fit into that theory) I'm also new to the forum but didn't start coming on here simply to knock the casting of Craig. I have to say that although I don't subscribe to extreme attacks on Craig is it now not ok to be against the casting and to state your case accordingly? I certainly wish him well and hope he is tremendous because above all I love the Bond franchise and I certainly want it to continue to thrive. There is understandably a huge amount of post on him because at this point in time after all these years this is the most important bit of James Bond news there has been. Invariably not everyone will be pleased with the casting. So just as everyone likes and dislikes different films and everyone has their favourite Bonds is it not the case that this forum is for lots of Bond fans, all with differing views to chat and debate the merits of the films, actors, books and more all relating to their own viewpoints? I totally agree that criticism should be constructive but are we not allowed different viewpoints on here? Also as a Brosnan fan (and not a child!) I must note there has also been a very large amount of Brosnan-bashing mostly in response to people disliking Craig. Swings and roundabouts? We all have different opinions, we all have our favourites, and we all have our points of view. Please let not this forum become a good talking propaganda machine for EON. Be constructive, but be fair. The thing that unites us is a love of Bond. We don't all have to love the man who plays him or the films they are in.

Excellent post, Lappaman. I agree 100%.

I find it very interesting how many posters on this forum changed their stance on Craig almost immediately upon hearing the news that he is the new Bond. Just before Craig's appointment, there were so many posters on the CBn message boards openly condemning Craig as Bond. Then, as soon as he was announced, these very same posters practically started proclaiming Craig as "the second coming." Jumping on the bandwagon? Maybe. In any case, that's got to be good news for the Pro-Craig Brigade. I never favored Craig as Bond but I am at least willing to reserve judgement on how good he is (or is not) as Bond until Casino Royale comes out.

If it ever comes to the point where we're not allowed to post anything negative about Daniel Craig, I'll have to wonder why so many were allowed to write such scathing remarks about Pierce Brosnan in the past. I am always bewildered at some of the "fans" on this forum who slander Brosnan at every turn. While it's true that George Lazenby is my least favorite Bond, I don't find it necessary to vehmently hate the man. It's not like he did anything personally against me. And I don't find a need to mention my opinion on Lazenby in every one of my posts. In fact, to the best of my recollection, this is the first time I've ever brought it up.

[WC]

Since the announcement of Daniel Craig as the new Bond I feel that CBn has become a less friendly website; I've read more vituperative comments here in the last week than I have in the last year. Members might be for, against, or neutral about Craig's appointment, but they should certainly treat other members (and Mr Craig himself) with a bit more respect.

Well I don't know about unfriendly. In the anti-craig thread (which is now closed) it was a very light-hearted atmosphere with plenty of laughs around about all sorts of matters, not just Craig. I haven't sensed a real hostility between members towards each other. Sure, some might not agree with Craig or might be somewhat apprehensive to him, but the anti-craig thread was, in the end, all light-hearted fun.

[ACE]

The report quoting CBn threads, this time, was particularly unfortunate.

Unfortunately, CBn is beholden to the democrasy of the net, something other media are not always so vulnerable to.

However, the control, sense, judgment of the threads on this site in recent days is exemplary. I particularly applaud Athena007 brave and much needed post.

BTW, people may be Craig or anti-Craig, pro-Brosnan or anti-Brosnan but we are all, BOND FANS, or at least I thought so. Craig is Bond now. Vote with your dollars because all the negativity (as opposed to constructive, argued criticism and debate) is just blowing against the wind.

Well done CBn.

Fail not!

ACE

[tonymascia1]

[quote name='Athena007' date='19 October 2005 - 21:05'][quote name='MSNBC']

[tonymascia1]

Since the announcement of Daniel Craig as the new Bond I feel that CBn has become a less friendly website; I've read more vituperative comments here in the last week than I have in the last year. Members might be for, against, or neutral about Craig's appointment, but they should certainly treat other members (and Mr Craig himself) with a bit more respect.

Well I don't know about unfriendly. In the anti-craig thread (which is now closed) it was a very light-hearted atmosphere with plenty of laughs around about all sorts of matters, not just Craig. I haven't sensed a real hostility between members towards each other. Sure, some might not agree with Craig or might be somewhat apprehensive to him, but the anti-craig thread was, in the end, all light-hearted fun.

Agreed. The "anti-Craig" thread took a left turn away from nastiness early on and became very light-hearted and tongue-in-cheek. Oh well...

The next time our humor gets too "sophisticated" for the media, we'll just run subtitles underneath the posts, to help them out...

[tdalton]

I think that the media, before commenting on Daniel Craig and CR, should pick up the novel and read it. It's a fast read, so it wouldn't take more than an afternoon or so. Then they'd get a great idea as to what it is they're talking about, and would probably start referring to the movie as an adaptation of Fleming's novel rather than a remake of the 1967 spoof. I mean, most reporters research what it is they're writing about before they conduct interviews and such, so why would it be too much to expect them to at least have read CR before they constantly criticize the producers and Daniel Craig for trying to (hopefully) faithfully adapt the novel for the screen.

Edited by tdalton, 20 October 2005 - 05:40 PM.

[Sam Fisher]

Sam Fisher, you are missing the whole point here. It's not just about the two incidences that were picked up by publications. I think a lot of the nastiness and negativity has calmed down a bunch since the new Bond announcement. But I just wanted to make everyone aware of something here.

You don't like Craig, great. But don't abusing other CBn members by calling them "crazy idiots" for liking Craig or calling Craig haters "dumbass American teenagers". This is unacceptable and I've been seeing this nasty attitude coming from both sides here on CBn. Would you say this to someone if they were talking to you face to face? Just because this is the internet does not give anyone the right to be abusive just because you can't see who you're talking to and are just "ranting" into cyberspace. The internet is real and so are the people on it, so be respectful. And Sam Fisher... I'm talking to you too.

I'm not particularly all hunky dorry over Craig as the new Bond. But all this "Craig is the worst Bond" crap is ridiculous. How can he be the worst Bond when he's not even had the opportunity to be James Bond on screen. No one here as seen him as 007 yet. So those who are not being Craig judgmental and being a supporter aren't necessarily saying, "Whatever Eon wants, we are drones." No... they're saying Ok thank gawd they finally chose a 007, I may or may not be happy about it but yay a new movie is actually happening... we'll see how Craig performs. It's called being reasonable, respectful while voicing an opinion. Perhaps you should try it sometime.

With all due respect I think alot of people here should open they're eyes a bit wider.

I admit that I have poked fun as some member's expense and if I have offended anyone here I do apologize but what I won't stand for is the attacks the supporters make just because a few of us won't jump on the Craig buttkissing bandwagon. My last post was just an observation of what's really going on here. If you take offense to it then that's your problem.

[Mister Asterix]

[mra]Sure you know exactly what

[tdalton]

I think that I can speak for myself on this as far as the fact that I have not followed Craig and EON blindly in all of this. I supported Daniel Craig as Bond from the very beginning. I watched Layer Cake as soon as I was able to have access to it, I watched several of his other films (Road to Perdition, Tomb Raider, etc.) and thought from the very beginning that he would be a great Bond. I made up my mind for myself after watching him in motion in an actual film. I can't, however, speak for everyone else here, but I'm offended by the mere mention that I followed EON's stance on Craig from the very beginning. I've always thought that Craig would make a great 007, and not because EON says that he will be, but because I've seen something from his past performances that show me that he has the acting ability to be a very good James Bond.

[Genrewriter]

Ditto. I would hardly say I just tow the company line. I was pulling for Brosnan until it became abundantly clear he wasn't going to be in it and as for Craig I support him because I support Bond. EON has screwed up before but judging this particular decision negatively when a single frame has yet to be shot; hell, when the entire cast has yet to be decided upon, is amazingly shortsighted and silly.

[Gri007]

The media has got stop being so childish and ingnorant and give the poor old chap a chance. I'am by all means happy the Daneil Craig is Bond.

The press can't judge him if they haven't seen him play Bond in CR.

Only reason why he probably gave short answers at the conference, therefore making the media refering to him as 'James Bland'is becuse he was probably still in shock. It is probably the first time he has been at such a big conference and was probably crapping himself.


The media is whats going to break Bond up. Craig would probabaly lose confidence becuse of what the media is saying and there fore he might just do one film .

The media need to know there limit and keep there nose out of his private affirs with Moss and Miller.

[Loomis]

[quote name='tdalton' date='20 October 2005 - 18:36']I think that I can speak for myself on this as far as the fact that I have not followed Craig and EON blindly in all of this.