95 replies to this topic

[Bond is back]

We all know what James Bond is about: Tall(6'1-2) dark and handsome(not a model but attractive) ENGLISH man,preferably 33-42.

Any questions?

Er, three of the five Bonds were models (even if it was just for a very short time).

The movie Bond is supposed to look like a male model. Just a little bit older.

Sorry, but that's the reality.

Edited by Bond is back, 03 December 2004 - 12:26 PM.

[Bond is back]

(BTW, why do I get the feeling that "Bond is back" will soon suggest that one Moomoo play the role...)

Spoon, if I knew who or what Moomoo is then perhaps I could offer an opinion. Are we talking about a cow as Bond?

[Loomis]

Colin Salmon looks nothing like Bond - as represented by the five previous actors to have played the role! Even if Colin were white I would still say no to him. He doesn't look like Bond to me. Sorry, Salmon fans, but I can't see Bond in his appearance. To bring up that old chestnut, he ain't handsome enough to be 'killer in a dinner suit' James Bond.

Agreed, Bond is black, er, sorry, Bond is back. Putting aside "the race issue" or whatever we want to call it (although I'm with the Mister Asterix camp on this one), Salmon is simply not handsome enough to be Bond. If we're going to have a black Bond, let's look at people with striking good looks and tremendous sex appeal like Denzel Washington - I know he's American, but I believe John Gavin and James Brolin were lined up for Bond back in the day, and I gather Washington's a whiz with accents and has played a Brit on at least one occasion (FOR QUEEN AND COUNTRY).

Salmon is far from ugly, but his looks are really nothing special. Of course, you could say the same about Clive Owen (as I know you do, Bond is back ), but Owen does at least "look like Bond", which Salmon fails to do. Owen has that impossible-to-define je ne sais quoi Bondian quality about him, a quality Salmon lacks.

Like freemo and marktmurphy, I'm not bowled over by Salmon's abilities as an actor, either.

In short, forget it.

[Mister Asterix]

[quote name='Blofeld's Cat' date='2 December 2004 - 20:24'][quote name='Spoon' date='3 December 2004 - 10:14']You always hear the "no one wants Blade to be white" argument, and I think it is a very weak one.

[Seannery]

Hey Methos -

Next it's gonna be "Peter Wingfield for Bond?  Bookmakers say so!" 

(Actually I think he'd make a swell villain or periphery 00-Agent)

Ha! You're right Wingfield would be fine as one of the villains or another 00. That would be inspired casting.

[Prav_007]

Just to sum up my position:
Colin Salmon is a good actor
Colin Salmon does not have the looks as James Bond, so I personally wouldn't want to see him in the role.
I beleive any race can play Bond, as long as they bring its essence.
I love Fleming, I would love to see a different person play Bond, I respect Fleming characterization, but I would mend a bit with the physical attributes, Bonds true character is within him. Call me un-true Bond fan if you want.

Bond was always was to me an Englishman, not a white or black englishman, just an Englishman, what difference does it make whoever is casted? Just as long they can act as an englishman. Thats how I see it.

[zencat]

It was all a publicity stunt, according to The Scotsman.

[quote]Bets on First Black James Bond Dismissed as 'Stunt'

By Katherine Danks, PA

A flurry of bets on actor Colin Salmon to replace Pierce Brosnan as the next James Bond was dismissed today as a

[Prav_007]

whoo, good that rumour was dismissed. (500 posts! )

Edited by prav_007, 03 December 2004 - 07:34 PM.

[craig1234564]

i live in england and can definately see some changes happening, in the role models being put forward.
there are now black players representing england,
mainly black athletes represent britain,
turn on the tv the news reader is black,
top of the pops has a black presenter, most of the acts are black,

the one thing i thought would never change was james bond,
the names james bond not winston bond

if they make james bond black i will emigrate to australia as it will be the last straw.
james bond is not black please dont do this.

i am not racist i like black people they have a good attitude to life, but why want to be something that you are not?
immigrants can be british-african british asian but they will never be english or scottish.

[Roebuck]

Why is it you never see a sentence beginning ''I am not racist...'' that doesn't have the word ''but'' in it?

[Bond is back]

Quote:

"It's a stunt of some description"

GOD FORBID!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

Well, strike me down with a feather and call me Octopussy!!!!! I never thought of that! LOL

[Qwerty]

[quote name='zencat' date='3 December 2004 - 13:14']It was all a publicity stunt, according to The Scotsman.

[quote]Bets on First Black James Bond Dismissed as 'Stunt'

By Katherine Danks, PA

A flurry of bets on actor Colin Salmon to replace Pierce Brosnan as the next James Bond was dismissed today as a

[Alex Zamudio]

I knew it was some sort of stunt, I wouldn

[Blofeld's Cat]

Dec 3 does hold a place in Bond history – it was on Dec 3, 1985 that Roger Moore officially retired from the series.

Grief - how do you store these dates??!

Well, for this particular date...HINT.

[Adrian Carlisle]

[quote name='Seannery' date='3 December 2004 - 17:50'][quote name='Adrian Carlisle' date='2 December 2004 - 19:40']Hey Methos -

Next it's gonna be "Peter Wingfield for Bond?

[Blofeld's Cat]

If this was a "stunt" on the part of the actor or his "handlers" then it won't surprise me if Colin finds himself out of any Bond movies from now on. Eon arn't too enthused about actors and/or their PR machine trying to force any Bond issues onto the public.

[Qwerty]

If this was a "stunt" on the part of the actor or his "handlers" then it won't surprise me if Colin finds himself out of any Bond movies from now on. Eon arn't too enthused about actors and/or their PR machine trying to force any Bond issues onto the public.

He doesn't strike me as one who'd coordinate something like this.

[Blofeld's Cat]

Perhaps not him personally, but it's true SOP from "The PR Machine."

[Qwerty]

Yeah, more likely in that case then.

[Antiriad]

If this was a "stunt" on the part of the actor or his "handlers" then it won't surprise me if Colin finds himself out of any Bond movies from now on. Eon arn't too enthused about actors and/or their PR machine trying to force any Bond issues onto the public.

Indeed! I wonder if the Broccolis still consider Gerard Butler after proclaiming himself "the next Bond" 3-4 years ago.

[Seannery]

If this was a "stunt" on the part of the actor or his "handlers" then it won't surprise me if Colin finds himself out of any Bond movies from now on. Eon arn't too enthused about actors and/or their PR machine trying to force any Bond issues onto the public.

Indeed! I wonder if the Broccolis still consider Gerard Butler after proclaiming himself "the next Bond" 3-4 years ago.

I certainly hope they do he has the looks, charisma, the physicality and underrated talent.

Edited by Seannery, 07 December 2004 - 05:34 PM.

[Antiriad]

Well it would be interesting to see how much his big break in this Christmas's Phantom of the Opera film does for his chances.

[spynovelfan]

Sorry to flog a dead horse, but if I could weigh in on the Salmon thing for a minute. I don't think it'll happen - I suspect this might have been a good way to garner some publicity by EON, in fact. But I think Salmon might have been a very good idea in some ways. In some ways.

1. It is damnably good publicity. This story made headlines. An official announcement casting Salmon would make international headlines, and stir a lot of interest, debate and so on. It would herald a real shake-up of the franchise, and Bond would become a 'water-cooler' topic once more.

2. I don't think it's quite fair to go back to Fleming. Fleming's Bond wouldn't have worn Brioni, used an electric razor, descibed smoking as a filthy habit, etc. The film Bond is an evolution of Fleming's character, updated for the modern world. Fleming's Bond was certainly white: it would have been almost unthinkable in the 50s for M.I.6 to have employed a black agent. Not anymore, though. Fleming's novels were arguably racist, but they were a product of their times. M's comment about Bond being a sexist misogynist dinosaur was to show that times have moved on. And he's a hell of a lot less misogynist in the films than he used to be. What *can't* change about Bond is that he is British, debonair, somewhat cocky, a womaniser, a bon vivant, a gourmet, handsome, very fit, witty, intelligent, resourceful, courageous. A fat Bond wouldn't work. A gay Bond wouldn't work. An actor who appeared idiotic (Keanu Reeves, say) wouldn't work. But a black Bond? If the actor could portray all of the above, why not?

The films aren't set in the 1950s anymore, and the universe has to work in two time zones. The film Bond was expelled from Eton, sure - but not in the 1930s. There are a few inconsistencies and uncertainties in his story, anyway - did he study Oriental Languages, or was that a boast, etc. So it's a juggling act. Some will baulk at the idea of a black guy playing this part, but I personally don't. There have been black Hamlets. Were there black people in Denmark at that time? No. People often bring up a white Shaft -but Shaft was largely defined by being black. His upbringing, education, world view and more besides could not plausibly have been experienced by a white man. Bond's upbringing, education and world view couldn't have been experience by a black man when Fleming created the character - but they can now. If the actor fits the bill, I say go for it.

3. I think Salmon does fit the bill. I think he looks more like James Bond than Colin Farrell, Ewan McGregor and Orlando Bloom put together. He's classically handsome, elegant but has something of a ruthless look, too.

http://www.hvrsd.k12.../images/020.jpg

I don't think the continuation is a problem. People will discuss it, sure - but if he were to get the gig, it would just be an interesting piece of trivia. There's going to be a gap of a couple of years before the next one. If they got in a new Bill Tanner, M and Moneypenny and the rest, it would be enough of a cut-off with the Brosnan era. Very few people apart from James Bond fans and Colin Salmon fans know he was in the films anyway. I think his name's a bit silly. 'Colin' is hardly very macho, and 'Salmon' compounds that. But, again, I don't think it really matters. I think the key thing is can the guy do it? I've seen him in several TV series in the UK, and yeah, I think he could. I think he'd probably be very good.

[Mister Asterix]

[mra]Excellent post, spynovelfan. One that I don

[spynovelfan]

[mra]Completely agree. But while this would be great

Edited by spynovelfan, 07 December 2004 - 04:49 PM.

[YOLT]

I think that my making Bond half Swiss Fleming left an open door for a European Bond. I dont think that a black Bond is possible now but why not in the future? About 50 years or so when the population indicators change I think its a possibility or a Indian Bond, why not? Dont forget that because Bond is working for Britain doesnt makes him English. He is half Scottish and half Swiss.

Edited by YOLT, 07 December 2004 - 05:11 PM.

[Mister Asterix]

[quote name='spynovelfan' date='7 December 2004 - 10:46'][mra]The point is understood about Shaft, but what modern white hero is

[YOLT]

Isnt James Bond half Swiss then why cant he be Swiss? Because he is serving for Britain doesnt makes him English. We have to respect Ian Fleming.

[Ryder on the Storm]

Quite frankly I'm sick of seeing white roles being taken over blacks!

You have the film "Walking Tall." A true story about a WHITE sheriff who sees the lawless activity going on in his town and decides to fight back. Remember, in real life the Sheriff is white, but nooooo, nowadays he's a black/somoan guy by the name of The Rock.

"Kojak." Starring the Greek Telly Savalas will now be played by the black Ving Rhames in a tv series.

The Freakin' "Honeymooners." Classic tv series from the '50s starring white people has now been blacked into a movie coming out next year.

The list goes on and on...

I'm getting sick and tired of it!

Keep James Bond WHITE!!!!

[Bon-san]

I do not care how people felt about anyone feels about whatever role being played by a person of a different race. I care about the role being played as the proper race. Kingsley played Gandhi as an Indian and played Stern as a Jewish man. If he would have played Gandhi as white then I would complain. Zorro and Charlie Chan have usually been played by white men, but they were played as Latino and Chinese respectively.
Carradine played Kwai Chang Cain as Chinese. Linda Hunt played Billy Kwan as a male Chinese/American. Nimoy played Spock as a Vulcan.

None of those bother me. But if some plays Spock as Mongolian, Rocky Balboa as Middle Eastern, or James Bond or Jim West as black, then I complain.

[/quote]

I respect your long history of thoughtful posts, Mr. *, but I find this point of view a bit troubling in that:

Apparently, Anthony Hopkins can legitimately portray a Mexican, but Colin Salmon can't legitimately portray a white man. And why is this? Merely, and only, due to skin color it seems. Is that the only reason Salmon can't be Bond? Because it's more difficult for makeup artists and cameramen to change the appearance of pigmentation in a black person's skin, than it is to do so for a white person? [And possibly, because it's more difficult for Eurocentric attitudes to accept a black playing a white than vice versa?]

I've really thought about this for awhile here, and I've argued it with myself from all angles. And Mr. A's argument [while well-reasoned] is ultimately troubling to me.

I'm white.

I could handle a black James Bond in a heartbeat, for the reasons stated by many above (e.g. we're in a different world than the 1950's now).

I'd want a British Bond, a hetero Bond, a rascal, etc. But it's not imperative to me that he be played by a white guy.