377 replies to this topic

[Matt_13]

Agree to disagree then. The Bourne films have a ton of humor. As for Bond going through a more down to earth stage after a decade long camp fest, something always triggers that change. In the eighties it was the likes of Indiana Jones, Die Hard, and Lethal Weapon. Now it's Bourne. LTK plays like a standard 80's action flick (right down to a score by Michael Kamen, no less). I'm not insinuating that Bourne has a monopoly on the gritty spy genre, or is in any way the originator. I just think the Bourne films, especially when they first came out, were more contemporary and topical than Bond was, and were extremely popular off the bat. It's hard to ignore the influence they had, in addition to other movies like Batman Begins, as that's really where the whole reboot thing started. Hell, even the producers likened the movie to BB. It's just the cycle. Bond influenced Batman Begins and Bourne in it's own right (not to mention The Dark Knight, XMEN First Class, and Mission Impossible to name a few others), but the current era we find ourselves in now, that grittier, modern take on the character, owes at least a little of it's appreciation to Bourne for nudging them in the right direction.

As a side note, forum members here trash the Bourne films for no other reason than the fact that they feel betrayed by their popularity in comparison to the latter Brozza Bonds. It's ok to like both, you know. As for the shaky cam, I like it. It works, and it gives the films that documentary feel that enables the action to feel more grounded and exciting. Supremacy is my favorite of the Bourne movies by far, but Ultimatum is quite thrilling and Identity is a solid espionage thriller. They are very good movies, and a hell of a lot better than the majority of the nineties Bond films. In my opinion, naturally.

[Mr. Arlington Beech]

the James Bond series had become a repetitive exercise in gadgets and poor puns.

Arguably so, though at least they had sex, humour (bad or not), and colour. Staples of the franchise that the Craig kicked out door.

I think CR has plenty of (yes, dark) humor, sex and colour. Sadly, I can't say the same about QOS- not enough of the aformentioned elements, for my taste, in this movie- .

Edited by Mr. Arlington Beech, 09 February 2012 - 07:07 PM.

[Mr. Arlington Beech]

Agree to disagree then. The Bourne films have a ton of humor.

I'm sorry, but I still can't find almost any trace of humor (including the dark one) in the Bourne movies- I mean, give me an example, because I just can't really see any of it-.

In fact, I think that the lack of humor is one the general major criticism against those movies, while- as I said earlier- in CR you can find plenty of dark humor which is actually a trait that you can trace as far as DN in the series, and is just emphasized in CR after a lot of childish humor filling the Brosnan era.

Edited by Mr. Arlington Beech, 09 February 2012 - 07:28 PM.

[Aris007]

Agree to disagree then. The Bourne films have a ton of humor.

I'm sorry, but I still can't find almost any trace of humor (including the dark one) in the Bourne movies- I mean, give me an example, because I just can't really see any of it-.

In fact, I think that the lack of humor is one the general major criticism against those movies, while- as I said earlier- in CR you can find plenty of dark humor which is actually a trait that you can trace as far as DN in the series, and is just emphasized in CR after a lot of childish humor filling the Brosnan era.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NrONotIe57c

The end of this scene is an example, as far as I'm concerned, of the sense of humour used in the film. It's not screaming, but it raises a smile.

[marktmurphy]

The trailer worries me a bit; feels like a bit of a cheap cash-in rather than proper sequel. Not convinced yet.

[Safari Suit]

I think it looks fun, great cast too. I just hope the xXx2-esque (yeah, I went there!) gimmick doesn't add too much baggage.

[Captain Tightpants]

I do think, however, that casting Albert Finney in SKYFALL is pretty strange, considering that he will feature in this new BOURNE film again.

I'm pretty sure that Finney will be playing vastly different roles in LEGACY and SKYFALL.

The trailer worries me a bit; feels like a bit of a cheap cash-in rather than proper sequel. Not convinced yet.

I've heard that the story examines a greater conspiracy than what was shown in the Damon trilogy. IDENTITY, SUPREMACY and ULTIMATUM really dealt with Bourne's search for his identity as David Webb - LEGACY will apparently look at the purpose of Operation Treadstone and what happened to its agents after Jason Bourne exposed the program, and in doing so, will move away from the whole "Who am I?" archetype. So it certainly sounds like it's heading in the right direction. It would be very easy to simply make Aaron Cross a carbon copy of Jason Bourne, but it looks like Tony Gilroy hasn't fallen into that trap.

[SecretAgentFan]

I do think, however, that casting Albert Finney in SKYFALL is pretty strange, considering that he will feature in this new BOURNE film again.

I'm pretty sure that Finney will be playing vastly different roles in LEGACY and SKYFALL.

I know. But still, have him appear in both franchises... Well, unless Judi Dench, Ralph Fiennes and Javier Bardem don´t go to BOURNE as well...

[Captain Tightpants]

I see no reason why they would.

And Finney is a taltented-enough actor that his apperances in ULTIMATUM and LEGACY will be the last things on anyone's mind during SKYFALL.

[SecretAgentFan]

I disagree. Since LEGACY opens before SKYFALL the press will mention the Finney-double appearance definitely.

But I´m sure SKYFALL will distinguish itself through lots of other factors.

[SecretAgentFan]

Deleted

[Captain Tightpants]

But I´m sure SKYFALL will distinguish itself through lots of other factors.

The way I see it, it's only a problem if Finney is playing a doctor who turns soldiers into assassins through brainwashing.

[S K Y F A L L]

I'm looking forward to this and how they explain the title and how Bourne isn't in it. How will they make sequels with the Bourne title now that it appears Bourne is out of the picture?

[Matt_13]

The new trailer for those who haven't watched yet.

[Simon]

Looks superb, although this chap seems to have gone a bit xXx in terms of super skills status.

Will definitely be seeing it though.

[tdalton]

Looks very good and hopefully it'll be a return to form for the series after the last two films.

I just hope that they keep the camera somewhat steady this time.

[killkenny kid]

Great minds, T. Great minds.

[S K Y F A L L]

Me too, I hope that trend or fad is over but it looks alright hadn't seen it yet and it pretty much answers my previous question.

[DamnCoffee]

Jeremy Renners face annoys me. He's like a wannabe Daniel Craig.

[Chief of SIS]

Surprised how well that trailer was. Anticipation for the film has been minimal at best for me but that looked actually pretty good. Smart for them to have events concurrent to 'Ultimatum.' It's nice to have one plot drive the other. As far as Renner, it's hard to judge. The trailer was very light on character. I wouldn't call him a Craig wannabe. He delivers the line "well I'm not just some science project am I?" with far less grit between his teeth than Craig would as Bond. Not a criticism to Craig, he's just a less animated actor.

Also this poster...



is better than this poster...

Edited by Chief of SIS, 03 June 2012 - 10:45 PM.

[solace]

Jeremy Renners face annoys me. He's like a wannabe Daniel Craig.

I know what you mean Mharkin. Though it does make me think back to when Mat damon was announced as Bourne. I am big fan of the books and quite a lot of Bourne fans didnt see it working. So, Im gonna reserve my judgement for now.

[SecretAgentFan]

IMO, the SKYFALL poster is miiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiles ahead of the BOURNE poster. And the trailer for LEGACY affirms that it is the umpteenth rehash of the "Bourne" story. I do like Renner - but this is one film I will only want to see on DVD.

"Bourne", with Damon or Renner, is and always will be just a Bond wannabe.

[killkenny kid]

"Bourne", with Damon or Renner, is and always will be just a Bond wannabe.

I've said it for years.

[Dustin]

Is Bourne even a Bond wannabe?

The Bourne films (the books are a different matter entirely) to me are more in the THREE DAYS OF THE CONDOR mould, with a bit of MARATHON MAN and RONIN thrown in for good measure. I've certainly never seen these films as Bond wannabes. M:I and its sequels are working the Bond field. Bourne isn't at all, mostly avoided the glamour theme, and where it's used it is meant to decode designer surfaces and items as just another layer of camouflage. The Bournes are perhaps closest to early Constantin Costa-Gavras, with the political angle directly leading to action pieces. There's hardly anything that speaks 'Bond' to me in the Bournes.

[SecretAgentFan]

A superagent, doing outrageous stunts? Sounds like Bond, to me.

If BOURNE wanted to be in the CONDOR or MARATHON MAN mould I would love it. Those guys actually suffered when they got hurt, they tried to avoid any physical violence and certainly weren´t capable of afflicting it. But Jason Bourne is like a videogame character. Punching and kicking and jumping without ever getting seriously hurt (okay, save from the beginning when he gets shot).

And, sorry, but Costa-Gavras really had a political angle in his films. BOURNE is only about action. The political angle here is pseudo-fluff-comic-book-stuff.

[The Shark]

To say BOURNE is anywhere in the same league as Z, THE DAY OF THE JACKAL or MARATHON MAN is quite frankly nuts. Those were challenging, unsettling films made with real conviction and guts. The BOURNE films are simply soulless, falsely sentimental, televisual, nihilistic trash.

[Ren]

The Trailer sure looks promising.

[Dustin]

A superagent, doing outrageous stunts? Sounds like Bond, to me.

But that is hardly all Bond is about, is it?

If BOURNE wanted to be in the CONDOR or MARATHON MAN mould I would love it. Those guys actually suffered when they got hurt, they tried to avoid any physical violence and certainly weren´t capable of afflicting it. But Jason Bourne is like a videogame character. Punching and kicking and jumping without ever getting seriously hurt (okay, save from the beginning when he gets shot).

Furthermore, Bourne is more a weapons-system than a super agent. There is next to no personality revealed that Bourne/Webb has or hasn't. We do not know the reasons that made him join, neither does he himself. There must have been reasons, strong ones even. But we aren't told about them. He is of course highly trained, so it's hardly surprising he should display higher abilities than the armchair patriots the CIA are sending after him. The people giving him really hard time are the other "Bournes" (code-named after the respective cities they reside in; going back I believe to another of Ludlum's books). And he does get injured in Moscow, and one suposes back in the USA, too.

And, sorry, but Costa-Gavras really had a political angle in his films. BOURNE is only about action. The political angle here is pseudo-fluff-comic-book-stuff.

Isn't every political angle nowadays?

[Safari Suit]

Looks superb, although this chap seems to have gone a bit xXx in terms of super skills status.

Frankly, the whole concept has more than a whiff of xXx 2! Despite that, I think this is looking excellent from top to bottom; you can keep all your people in capes, this is what I'm really looking forward to this summer.

Jeremy Renners face annoys me. He's like a wannabe Daniel Craig.

I know what you mean Mharkin.

I don't see it, and frankly I doubt you'd find many people making the connection outside of Bond forums

[S K Y F A L L]

I just seen one of the Bourne novels 'Bourne Dominion' at the store, has anyone read them? are they any good? are they all about Bourne? Has the movie completely left the novel story line? Will they continue to use the novel titles I wonder...