Jump to content


This is a read only archive of the old forums
The new CBn forums are located at https://quarterdeck.commanderbond.net/

 
Photo

Golden Gun, Moonraker or View?


75 replies to this topic

#31 glidrose

glidrose

    Lt. Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPip
  • 2469 posts

Posted 08 August 2012 - 04:33 PM

Moonraker first, AVTAK a close second, and the last time I tried watching TMWTGG is was well-nigh unbearable.

#32 BoogieBond

BoogieBond

    Lieutenant

  • Crew
  • PipPip
  • 834 posts

Posted 08 August 2012 - 08:20 PM

Moonraker easily, it's a spectacular, epic, stunning, light, action adventure, not to be taken seriously, but it's on a massive scale and has the ambition of being the biggest Bond film of them all.
I find it hugely entertaining, and some of the stunts still look pretty good today.

Then AVTAK
Then TMWGG
but it's close

It does depend what you like. If you like more of a detective story where Bond is searching for the villain for at least half the film then TMWGG is for you. I think out of the three, TMWGG has a fairly serious tone for the first half or so, and Bonds character is particularly unsympathetic. Bond and Scaramanga are 2 shades off the same brush, and Bond doesn't like that comparison one bit. Not many gadgets, the humour is silly, but mainly at Goodnight and Pepper, in contrast Scaramanga is quite a menacing villain.

AVTAK is in the middle in terms of tone for me, there's some humour, not really any gadgets to speak of, but plenty of action and stunts, Moore is more charming than in TMWGG, and Bond is more a straight up hero. Stacy does detract a bit from the film for me. There's some scale and stunts, much more than TMWGG

MR is the antithesis of TMWGG, it's all scale and comedy and fun and a light fluffiness. Bond is a straight up hero for sure, no shades of grey, not much detective stuff(although a bit in France and Rio) Jaws, Locations, Beautiful girls, it's all chucked on the screen and is marvellous.

#33 plankattack

plankattack

    Lt. Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPip
  • 1385 posts

Posted 09 August 2012 - 02:17 PM

Both TMWTGG and MR veer all over the place, with some great moments and some of the series' most jaw-droppingly low points. AVTAK is the most even of the three and yet unfortunately, IMHO the blandest. MacNee's presence is a godsend and the "killing Tibbett was a mistake" moment is classic Bond, yet the film is ultimately forgettable.

I've always been a critic of MR - there's just too much mucking about for my taste. Jaws, his girlfriend, pigeons, Close Encounters references, all work to the film's detriment. If all that comes out, then left is an epic Bond that would've topped TSWLM and YOLT. But it refuses to take itself seriously and I think that undermines all that's good about it, including Drax, terrific special effects, the centrifuge scene, and Ken Adams at his over-the-top best.

So that leaves TMWTGG. I can look past Goodnight as village idiot, have no choice to pretend that Pepper is in fact part of a dream I'm having while I nap through that part of the movie, leaving me instead to focus on a pretty good performance by Sir Rog, a terrific villain, and a film still clinging to what's left of classic 60s EON.

TMWTGG it is then, by a whisker, but to speak up for all three, each one is followed by strong entry!



#34 Miles Miservy

Miles Miservy

    Lieutenant

  • Crew
  • PipPip
  • 683 posts
  • Location:CT

Posted 09 August 2012 - 07:19 PM

The Man with the Golden Gun, Moonraker and A View to a Kill are generally the Roger Bonds which are criticized the most.
Which of the three do you prefer and which one did you like the least?


I was 13 when MOONRAKER was in the theaters. Coming right off the tides of TSWLM, It held my rapt attention for the entire summer. (the 1st OO7 film I'd seen was Golden Gun so that will ALWAYS hold a place in my heart.)

AVTAK was too much; too late. Although, the plot was the most sinister of Moore's adventures & Max Zorin the most interesting, if not twisted of villains, the movie falls short. The entire supporting cast (Stacey Sutton included) are merely flat & 2-dimentional. The action sequences, unto themselves, seem to take away from the piece rather than add to it. And, there are too many moments to mention where, it seems obvious (to the audience as well as the cast) that Roger Moore is quite wrung out. Every nuance is overplayed & every glib remark is over the top. I do believe he'd introduced himself as, "Bond, James Bond." more times in this one film than all his others combined.

#35 plankattack

plankattack

    Lt. Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPip
  • 1385 posts

Posted 09 August 2012 - 09:29 PM

. I do believe he'd introduced himself as, "Bond, James Bond." more times in this one film than all his others combined.


Except when he introduced himself as "Stock, James Stock"!!! :)

#36 Jarvio

Jarvio

    Midshipman

  • Crew
  • 55 posts

Posted 15 October 2012 - 02:07 PM

AVTAK is the strongest. It has some great and memorable action sequences - the golden gate bridge fight, the mine sequence, the city hall fire, the fire engine chase, the paris chase... It also has one of the best villains - Zorin.

Next is TMWTGG - Not a favourite of mine, but it does have it's merits. Scaramanga is a great villain and I find his and bond's funhouse duel quite memorable. The plot is very slow-moving though.

MR is the weakest. It has some great scenes, such as the centrifugal scene, but unfortunately the whole film is ruined by the jaws love scenes, space, the laser guns, and the super race plot.

Edited by Jarvio, 15 October 2012 - 02:09 PM.


#37 archer1949

archer1949

    Sub-Lieutenant

  • Crew
  • Pip
  • 171 posts

Posted 15 October 2012 - 02:30 PM

I am not a fan of any of those, but Golden Gun is at least an interesting failure for me. It had a weird psychedelic vibe to it and a great villain in Christopher Lee's Scaramanga.

AVTAK could have been a decent Bond movie, if it hadn't been for the over the top silliness,and the creaky, bored Roger Moore.

I HATE Moonraker. It rival DAD for the absolute nadir of the franchise.

#38 Vauxhall

Vauxhall

    Commander

  • Executive Officers
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 10744 posts
  • Location:London, UK

Posted 15 October 2012 - 03:01 PM

1. Moonraker
2. The Man with the Golden Gun
3. A View to a Kill

MOONRAKER has probably become my favourite Moore film, as I usually stop watching it about two-thirds of the way in before things get too daft. I find the start of the movie, particularly the scenes in Venice and Rio, very enjoyable indeed.

#39 Ernst Stavro BIofeld

Ernst Stavro BIofeld

    Midshipman

  • Crew
  • 61 posts
  • Location:S.P.E.C.T.R.E. Headquarters

Posted 15 October 2012 - 03:18 PM

1. Moonraker

I enjoyed this installment for the most part.


2. A View to a Kill

Thanks in large part to Mr. Walken.


3. The Man with the Golden Gun

Decent, I suppose. But found it less enjoyable than the other two efforts in question. I also say this even though the film includes a personal favorite Bond girl, Maud Adams.

#40 Gothamite

Gothamite

    Sub-Lieutenant

  • Crew
  • Pip
  • 409 posts
  • Location:Dublin, Ireland

Posted 15 October 2012 - 03:45 PM

I very much enjoy A View to a Kill. It's not a great film by any stretch, but it's often a good deal of fun and features a great villainous duo in Zorin and May Day. I can enjoy Moonraker if I'm in the mood for it, which admitedly isn't all that often. The Man with the Golden Gun is just awful, aside from the funhouse sequences.


I agree with all of this. Of the three, AVTAK might be my favourite. Roger was definitely past his prime, but nevertheless the film has a credible plot, very relevant to the time and while the beats are too similar to Goldfinger, nothing really stretches the bounds of possibility. James Bond actually seems like a spy in it, geezerish and pun-laden though he may be. And I love Zorin and Pola Ivanova. Even Tanya Roberts gets a bad rap.

There's a bit of a nostalgia-factor with AVTAK for me (for whatever reason, I enjoyed it greatly when I'd see it on television, eventually spurring me on to buy the VHS which I watched to death as a kid), but I really can't see why everyone hates it so much other than its general feeling of tiredness and the lack of any truly iconic stunts (the Eiffel jump is pretty good, other than that you just have the decent-enough firetruck chase and the 'amputated-Renault' chase).

Somebody said that AVTAK looks like a TV movie and sadly that's absolutely accurate; the shots and most of the locations are all pretty formulaic and look like something from a considerably lower budget production than a Bond film (San Francisco in the 80s is almost synonymous with cheapness IMO) and this is probably the main reason why I don't think the inclusion of Timothy Dalton would have improved the film at all.

Moonraker and TMWTGG are actually overtly offensive in how excesses of humour and implausibility completely ruin otherwise perfect sequences (the car flip in Golden Gun and the otherwise AMAZING skydive fight in MR, my favourite Bond stunt ever). Moonraker has plenty of charm in it and it's perfectly watchable in its own kooky way, though.

Golden Gun has Christopher Lee, sure, but in almost every other way it's the closest thing a Bond film has ever come to truly being a bad, unwatchable piece of crap.

So yeah, AVTAK, MR and then waaaay down the very bottom, TMWTGG.

Edited by Gothamite, 15 October 2012 - 03:49 PM.


#41 Conlazmoodalbrocra

Conlazmoodalbrocra

    Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 3546 posts
  • Location:Harrogate, England

Posted 15 October 2012 - 03:46 PM

A View To A Kill every day of the week. Then Moonraker, then The Man With The Golden Gun.

#42 Matt Sherman

Matt Sherman

    Sub-Lieutenant

  • Crew
  • Pip
  • 122 posts
  • Location:Gainesville, Florida

Posted 15 October 2012 - 03:49 PM

I've just read Andrew McNess's book, "James Bond In Our Sights: A Close Look At A View To A Kill". Highly recommended! Will help you understand the risk-taking nature of this Bond and the subtleties of the cast performances.

#43 FlemingBond

FlemingBond

    Lieutenant

  • Crew
  • PipPip
  • 610 posts
  • Location:Phoenix, Az U.S.

Posted 15 October 2012 - 03:50 PM

The Man with the Golden Gun the Least. The humor reached it's silliest point, the budget was low, the scenery is Bad.
Moonraker could have been better, too much humor, too much sci-fi, while still being a well made film
I've always preferred A View to a Kill . true Moore was old, but the humor was more controlled, Walken was a great villain and the plot at least not outer-space or 'everyone on earth must die!"

#44 Miles Miservy

Miles Miservy

    Lieutenant

  • Crew
  • PipPip
  • 683 posts
  • Location:CT

Posted 15 October 2012 - 04:19 PM

Moonraker. It is like The Spy Who Loved Me all over again, which is not really bad at all. The whole relationship between Bond and Jaws is also furthered, i mean they are like arch nemeses at this point. This guy again?


Always had a problem with that. If you're going to put him in the 2nd movie, fine. Did anyone remind OO7 that punching JAWS in the face was futile? I wonder what JW Pepper might have to say about it.

Moonraker first, AVTAK a close second, and the last time I tried watching TMWTGG is was well-nigh unbearable.


Both Christphers (Lee & Walken, respectively) were Extraordinary villains. I've often wondered what impact they'd have if they were in films other than their own;

Say if Christopher Lee were cast as Stromberg or Christpher Walken were cast as Kamal Khan, maybe?

#45 ggl

ggl

    Lieutenant

  • Crew
  • PipPip
  • 620 posts
  • Location:Spain

Posted 15 October 2012 - 04:22 PM

AVTAK is one of my favourite Moore┬┤s (with FYEO). Last time I saw them, I enjoyed TMWTGG better than LALD... And MR... well...

#46 jrcjohnny99

jrcjohnny99

    Lieutenant

  • Crew
  • PipPip
  • 856 posts
  • Location:Los Angeles

Posted 15 October 2012 - 05:59 PM

1. Moonraker
2. The Man with the Golden Gun
3. A View to a Kill

MOONRAKER has probably become my favourite Moore film, as I usually stop watching it about two-thirds of the way in before things get too daft. I find the start of the movie, particularly the scenes in Venice and Rio, very enjoyable indeed.


+1
The first half of MR is as strong as just about any other Bond pic, i'm always surprised that people rip on the humor/silliness of MR yet defend FYEO and it's embarrassing Blofeld/Parrot/Thatcher scenes....

#47 Iceskater101

Iceskater101

    Lt. Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPip
  • 2398 posts
  • Location:Midwest, MN

Posted 23 October 2012 - 04:41 PM

Moonraker is definitely my least favorite. TMWTGG is my fave out of the three

#48 00 Brosnan

00 Brosnan

    Lieutenant

  • Crew
  • PipPip
  • 506 posts
  • Location:East Coast, U.S

Posted 23 October 2012 - 06:11 PM

The Man with the Golden Gun is my favorite of the three. It lacks much substance, but the I really enjoy the humor in this one. From the car chase with Sherriff J.W Pepper and Bond's relationship with Mary Goodnight, to the dojo scene and Nick Nack. Some good locations as well, the Queen Elizabeth wreckage as a secret HQ was cool and Thailand is gorgeous.

AVTAK is my second least-liked film in the series (slightly edging out DAF). The only positive thing I can really say about the film is that Christopher Walken made a fantastic villain. The score is pretty questionable, Tanya Roberts couldn't be anymore dull/clueless, cheesy action sequences, and Moore just looks plain old (yes, older than in OP)

Moonraker is okay. The film has an interesting villain in Hugo Drax and I find Bond's time at his home fun. Jaws was a welcome addition too. The whole shooting laser guns while floating around in space is a little too ridiculous for me though. I found Lois Chiles character somewhat annoying as well.

LALD, FYEO, TSWLM, and even OP are much better entries for Roger Moore in my opinion.

#49 FredJB007

FredJB007

    Sub-Lieutenant

  • Crew
  • Pip
  • 154 posts
  • Location:Clarksville, TN USA

Posted 23 October 2012 - 06:37 PM

If I have to pick one......for best, Moonraker. The first part of the movie is quite good, but falls downhill fast when Bond goes to Venice. The least, A View to a Kill. Its just a bad ripoff of Goldfinger. And Tanya Roberts is such a bad Bond girl, she makes Denise Richards believeable. If that's possible.

#50 Redneck007

Redneck007

    Midshipman

  • Crew
  • 44 posts
  • Location:North Carolina, USA

Posted 23 October 2012 - 07:46 PM

1. TMWTGG
2. MR
3. AVTAK

#51 Turn

Turn

    Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 6837 posts
  • Location:Ohio

Posted 23 October 2012 - 09:52 PM

TMWTGG and MR are pretty close to each other in my rankings. I enjoy both, so I am really not sure which I'd rank ahead of the other.

AVTAK still lingers near the bottom, with only TWINE keeping it out of rock bottom. Walken's presence will always raise its profile for me.

#52 FOX MULDER

FOX MULDER

    Sub-Lieutenant

  • Crew
  • Pip
  • 178 posts

Posted 23 October 2012 - 11:49 PM

Honestly, I don't know why "Golden Gun" receives so much criticism.

Not only is it my favourite of the three films you mention, it is one of my favourite Bond films altogether. It had a magnificent villain, a straightforward plot, a great performance by Moore, the beautiful Maud Adams, good music - and a midget!

TMWTGG is a totally superb Bond film.

Moonraker would be my least favourite of the ones you mention.

#53 Cruiserweight

Cruiserweight

    Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 6815 posts
  • Location:Toledo, Ohio

Posted 26 October 2012 - 01:54 AM

I'll keep it simple.

Favorite: A View to a Kill (Probably my favorite Bond film overall)
Least favorite: Moonraker (I like it, just not as much as the other two.)

#54 rafterman

rafterman

    Lt. Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPip
  • 1963 posts
  • Location:Republic of Korea, south of the Axis of Evil

Posted 26 October 2012 - 03:03 AM

Moonraker. It's big and epic while the others are smaller and cheaper. Moonraker has great locations and a grand scale the other two lack. The problem is that it's the same plot as Spy Who Loved Me. I still really enjoy it. In fact, the Sugarloaf tram scene is the earliest Bond memory I have. That scene got me interested enough to check out the series.

#55 copperhead1

copperhead1

    Midshipman

  • Crew
  • 44 posts
  • Location:USA

Posted 26 October 2012 - 03:16 AM

Oddly enough, I prefer TMWTGG, simply because it's one of those films that's soooooo bad that it's good.

AVTAK is my least preferred out of the three.


#56 Tony_OO_Black

Tony_OO_Black

    Sub-Lieutenant

  • Crew
  • Pip
  • 112 posts

Posted 27 October 2012 - 05:27 PM

I really think The Man With the Golden Gun is very overrated; flat story, not enough Christopher Lee, Sheriff JW [censored]ing Pepper stinking the place up, and a rushed climax. My least favourite of the three.

A View to a Kill is my favourite; nowhere close to Moore's best, in fact it's quite a poorly put together film, but it's got Christopher Walken being nicely bonkers, Grace Jones and Patrick Macnee. I've always fancied the hell out of Tanya Roberts too, so that doesn't hurt!

#57 DR76

DR76

    Lt. Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPip
  • 1673 posts

Posted 27 October 2012 - 05:29 PM

The Man with the Golden Gun, Moonraker and A View to a Kill are generally the Roger Bonds which are criticized the most.
Which of the three do you prefer and which one did you like the least?



I prefer "A VIEW TO A KILL" over the other three. Yes, it's like a remake of "GOLDFINGER". But something of an improvement.

My least favorite is "THE MAN WITH THE GOLDEN GUN". I just don't like it that much.

#58 George Kaplan

George Kaplan

    Sub-Lieutenant

  • Crew
  • Pip
  • 118 posts

Posted 08 November 2012 - 06:04 PM

I'd go with A VIEW TO A KILL as my favorite; Moore does a pretty good job (as always). I remember many people criticizing Zorin's plot as being stupid; watching it this last time it struck me that I don't think Zorin's plot was ever really about making money or cornering markets (like he says) but I think he just wants to destroy stuff and uses money as the lure to get others in. May Day was a good henchwoman (possibly one of the most memorable), loved the interplay between Moore and McNee. I do find that at least one of the set pieces drags for me - the firetruck chase and its a terrible shame they ruined the snowboard/ski chase with a comedy playing of California Girls.

MOONRAKER weirdly I liked it a lot better this time around than in previous viewings. Its a little over-the-top (okay maybe a lot) and I've never been entirely happy with Jaws' transition to hero (though I understand why they did it - I was one of those kids who loved Jaws as a villain in TSWLM) but it strikes all the right cords for me, if not enough to put it over as a particular fave.

THE MAN WITH THE GOLDEN GUN in someways is handicapped in my opinion simply because I think that with the cast and locations they could have done so much better - easily could have been one of the best. In particular I find the final "fight" - which primarily features Bond wandering around and a complete lack of Christopher Lee doing anything as terribly anti-climactic. At least Nick Nack gets a few hits in (although, really, losing your knife on the first bed bounce? Tsk-tsk). And while I like Maude Adams' part pretty well, I've never really warmed up to Britt Eklands role. I find the chase with Sherriff Pepper to be hard to watch and the comedy sound effects when Bond jumps the river is almost as bad as the California Girls bit in AVTAK. There's still stuff I like - for example Scaramanga and Bond's talk during the boxing match plays up the kind of mano-a-mano match that I as the viewer expect but TMWTGG never delivers.

#59 seawolfnyy

seawolfnyy

    Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 4763 posts
  • Location:La Rioja

Posted 08 November 2012 - 06:17 PM

I have a soft spot for TMWTGG as it was the first Bond film I ever saw. AVTAK next and the load of crap that is MR last. I would almost go as far to say that MR is the worst Bond film overall if it weren't for the ice wave and disintegrating plane in DAD.

#60 Judo chop

Judo chop

    Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 7461 posts
  • Location:the bottle to the belly!

Posted 08 November 2012 - 06:27 PM

TMWTGG and AVTAK were okay for their day. MOONRAKER is one of the greatest films of all time. I'm smiling now just thinking about it.

:) See?