104 replies to this topic

[freemo]

I have a real loathe-hate relationship with this film. I haven't seen it in several years and I doubt I'll ever watch it again.

I do think that Denise Richards' performance has become a lightning rod or sorts for a lot of fans, particularly those who otherwise purport to like the film. I think maybe that deep down, in their heart of hearts, there exists this nagging feeling that film is in fact terrible, but they can’t admit it to themselves, can’t come to terms with it in their minds, so then pin it all on her. Read the testimonies of TWINE fans and you'll read people at war with themselves.

If you think she’s one of the twelve worst things about this film, you’re very much mistaken. She’s probably two of the best.

[fulgentius]

Just saw this one again.

I have mixed feelings about TWINE, though I like it a bit more now than I did when it was released.

I love what it tries to be - a serious spy thriller with dramatic weight.

But it just doesn't work - the generic and silly Brosnan-era action scenes keep bringing it down, and feel like they belong in a different movie.

IMHO it is a misfire, which is a infuriating, because it could have been a top Bond film but ends up being worse than the generic TND.

Pros :

- the overall story and character development
- the score
- the PTS

Cons :

- awful action scenes (looks to me like the work of the 2nd unit with no supervision whatsoever from Apted, they don't feel organic)
- awful one-liners
- horribly written scenes (yes Denise Richards is bad, but she's not helped by the script, ie. she asks Bond's name while she is running from an explosion etc.)
- terrible performance by Pierce (the personna is there, but he's terrible when he tries to stretch his acting muscle, especially during the "isn't that your motto" scene)
- ugly-looking film

[Colossus]

There were loads of TWINE threads a few months ago with meaty convos about the merits of this movie and shortcomings that ir eally wish i could have dove into... but alas it caught me in the thick of smothering life to have time for it. But mark my words guys....... gals...... TWINE is bomb...... even though it is sort of sucky i shall defend it.

[Iceskater101]

I am bringing the World is Not Enough up to college with me. I have a soft spot for this one, I have no idea why. My mom doesn't like this one too much.

[Double-0-Seven]

I am bringing the World is Not Enough up to college with me. I have a soft spot for this one, I have no idea why. My mom doesn't like this one too much.

Me too. It's the first Bond I ever saw in theaters, so it'll always be special for that reason. My interest in it was furthered when the video game came out for Nintendo 64, which I found to be a great successor to the GoldenEye game.

I do think the good outweighs the bad. Solid story, pretty good acting for the most part, good locations, and an incredible pre-title sequence. However, it's probably a lone example of a film in the Pierce Brosnan era that has too much action. The ski chase and caviar factor scenes, while good by themselves, seem kind of shoehorned in there for the sake of action and take away from the story rather than add to it. Even the boat chase does to an extent, but I'll forgive it because it's there for excitement in the pre-titles which is more or less what the pre-titles have always been about.

Re-watching it a few nights ago, I don't think Denise Richards is that bad. I'll take her over Stacey Sutton or Mary Goodnight. She's not that great of an actress but she's not downright horrible. A lot of reviews I've seen always comment on her appearance too - that she doesn't look like a nuclear physicist. Well, what is a nuclear physicist supposed to look like? There's lot of hot girls in the science programs at my school. Her performance doesn't exactly sell it (sounds like she's reading her lines from a cue card) but her appearance? C'mon!

[Gothamite]

It was indeed the first Bond I ever saw in the cinema and I loved it. I saw it at my 10th birthday party and it was followed by an epic evening of James Bond-playing in my neighbourhood (my friend Tom even had a toy P99). It's a memory I'll forever cherish.

In later years however, I've realised that the film is definitely the blandest of all of Brosnan's efforts. As some posters have already mentioned, it's trying to be the kind of full-fledged character drama that Laz/Dalton/Craig's films all were/are, but it's too overblown and falls on its face. The scene where Bond confronts Elektra about how Renard knew about his sore shoulder is one of the worst-acted James Bond actor scenes in the entire franchise, I believe. The script jumps from having Bond be the Eon Superhero to some kind of half-assed attempt at Fleming.

It's really a whole lot of nothing and it's one of my least favourites. But in saying that, it's still a James Bond film and no James Bond film is completely devoid of merit. I love the title song (no really), the Thames chase is really great and the heartbreaking Q sequence redeems the entire film. An exit worthy of a king.

Edited by Gothamite, 10 November 2012 - 06:00 PM.

[mrevans]

This was the second Bond film I saw in theaters. I was 8 at the time and I loved it initially. Over the years, I've liked it less then like it more, then less and so on and so on. I also think its a mixed bag. I feel like the concept is great on paper but it just didn't come together on film as well. this is one of the few Bond movies that, if I came across it on television one day, I'd probably skip it because, personally, it feels weak and underwhelming to me. But there's still things I like about it.

Pros:
Good Brosnan performance. From interviews he gave, I feel like he thought this was going to be great and was really invested.
I really bought that Bond had feeling for Electra, and his conflict was evident. I've always felt Bond has white knight syndrome. This works for me.
Can always use more Zukovsky (probably didn't spell it right)
Bullion's a good weasel character.
Great Q/R sequence.
Like the pre-title sequence.
Scene between Bond, Electra, and M after Bond shoots Electra. Great silent moment. Best scene in the film by far.

Cons:
Renard is pretty unmemorable to me. Kind of wasted. He feels no pain and should be like a superhuman in a fight (according to film logic) yet when he fights Bond there's no real payoff to this set up.
I do not believe Christmas Jones is a nuclear physicist... no matter how hard I try.
Electra (may have spelled that wrong too) starts out kind of interesting but by the end she's too childish, irrational, and running from Bond playing a weird game of tag is too crazy even for her. I see her as cold and calculated, not a brat with a tantrum.
Zukovski's death was a little too easy and convenient but at least they showed a satisfying respect between him and Bond.
The Christmas joke at the end makes me blush and put my face to my palm, but I think that's the point.
And just to be nit-picky, R's quip about the millennium bug at the end falls flat for me and draws an eye roll. Wouldn't be worth a mention if this scene didn't so closely mirror the hilarious MR end scene where Q perfectly delivers his "reentry line" which is so much better by comparison.

[George Kaplan]

I think Bullion's an interesting character - we don't get long lived weasel characters in Bond films that much. Agree with the Bond-Elektra / MM-Bond bit at the end of the film; felt really right leading up to that moment.

In the ensuing years after seeing this one in the theater its light had dimmed in my memory a good bit, but overall I liked it upon rewatching pretty well. They didn't always hit what they tried for, but they tried some interesting things.

The end bit though - with Christmas and Bond together - just doesn't feel like its been motivated by the rest of the movie. I think they could have excised that and not lost anything, really (or had a more platonic relationship end). I don't think Richards is awful, but the combination of the character she presented and the character that was written didn't really work. So I can see why she gets a lot of flak, but I think ultimately no actress could salvage the part since it seems to exist mostly to have someone with "nuclear science" experience around to explain things to the audience and cause some additional plot problems. No real depth of character there (I think they used it all up on Renard and Elektra).

[Lucky]

I love it. It is my second favorite of the Brosnan Bond movies, behind Goldeneye, and it is possibly in my top 5 Bond films (at least in the top 10). I think the story for the most part is really good. There are some nice and bittersweet moments between Bond and Q. Bond killing Elektra is still one of my favorite Brosnan scenes. I like Valentin and his complicated relationship with Bond. I know Christmas Jones gets some flack among some people, but I didn't really mind her that much. I thought there were a lot of good scenes with M as well, and it was nice to learn more about her. I liked the climax in the submarine as well. Renard was a good villain, I liked he was motivated by more sympathetic motives than most. Elektra was a piece of work, in a good way, and I found her arc interesting and liked how good she was at manipulating people to her advantage.

[tdalton]

I used to be something of a "fan" of this film, if for no other reason than it at least "tried" (and I use that term loosely) to be a serious entry in the series. As I've revisited it over the years, though, I've liked it less and less to the point that I have to consider it one of the weakest entries in the series. It's not as bad as the dreadful The Man with the Golden Gun and Die Another Day, but it's certainly close.

[JimmyBond]

I gave it another watch last night, and my opinion of it hasn't changed since my Bond marathon this past summer. I still really enjoy it. I love that they came off of TND with a film that tried to tell a story and take it's time doing so. It didn't quite succeed in the way I'm sure some of the folks involved were hoping (it's still held back by some of the "formula"), plus it has I think my favorite Bond performance from Pierce.

[Iceskater101]

I think Denise Richards isn't that bad either. I mean there have been worse.. I like this film though especially since the Bond girl is bad. I like that a lot.

[WasteOfScotch]

As I said in my ranking post. I think TWINE is a ruined cake that had awesome ingedients.
I see it as a huge misfire, but I truly believe it could have been Brosnans finest hour.

It's the only Bond film that I wish could be "done over" with the exact same cast and story, and they'd "get it right" this time.
Apart from Richards, who I think is the worst Bond girl of all time.

The stuff that is good already could have been *amazing* (Renards condition, Marceau's hatred, Bonds turmoil, M's peril), the stuff that is bad is *really* horrible (Cleese making an embarrassment of himself, dull final fight, Denise Richards) .

[Turn]

I will always rank Denise Richards ahead of Tanya Roberts and Talisa Soto. Richards is no less unbelievable as a nuclear scientist than Roberts is as a geologist. Let's face it, you don't dwell on that, they were there for eye candy appeal. Blame the writers for making Stacy Sutton a whiny twit and the actress for making it come across so well, or poor if you prefer.

As far as Talisa Soto goes, she doesn't give any indication as to why a guy like Sanchez would cut a man's heart out for leaving him. She's possibly the most wooden actress in the entire series.

I'm surprised anybody remembers the Goldie character. Although I don't know anything about his music career, he just seemed like somebody who was shoehorned in as a cameo. He was basically unnecessary comic relief, just another forgettable element to a very uneven film.

[George Kaplan]

Huh, didn't even know the guy who played Bullion WAS a musician. And I probably wouldn't have remembered him had I not rewatched TWINE recently, but I enjoyed him being a weaselly bad guy. It wasn't something that Bond films usually go for, as most of the baddies are tough guys who stay loyal to their employer.

I don't think Richards is awful as her character, I think they just don't really give her much to do or much to work with; this in turn gives little development to her relationship with Bond or relevance to the story. But then I don't have a problem with Roberts or Soto either. I'd argue that the biggest problem with Christmas Jones is her total irrelevance to 9.9/10 of the movie and seems to exist primarily so Bond can end up with "the girl" and keep the series formulas going.

[coco1997]

I recently undertook a 'marathon' of all 22 official EON-produced Bond films over the course of three or so weeks prior to the release of SKYFALL. TWINE--a film I once ranked quite highly on my list of Bond favorites--has dropped considerably upon later review. GOLDENEYE is still my favorite Brosnan entry, and DAD has surprisingly risen to number two. The first hour is some of the most visually appealing, fun, and surprisingly daring film reel from the Brosnan era, despite the fact that it becomes a big, stupid mess during the final thirty-some minutes. TND feels like classic Bond for a good portion of its runtime but sadly degenerates into a generic, Rambo-esque shootout at the climax.

But TWINE is kind of all over the place. The locations are drab, or, at least, ineffectively rendered, and colorful, intriguing locations are an enormous part of a Bond film's ability to leave a positive lasting impression, which is one of the reasons I've never been able to enjoy AVTAK. Brosnan doesn't handle melodrama well; this might've been a film better suited for Dalton. The movie obviously tries to be taken more seriously than its predecessor, but the constant crude innuendoes, 'Christmas Jones', the new Q/R, etc. inhibit it from doing so. Renard is one of the most forgettable, underdeveloped villains in the series and the PTS, despite being quite fun, is ridiculously overlong. With TND and DAD, you can keep one eye on your Blu-Ray players and pinpoint the precise moments when the movies devolve into absurdity and you can turn your brain off. With TND, it's when Bond and Wai Lin infiltrate Carver's stealth ship. With DAD, it's when the story moves to Iceland. But TWINE is consistent mediocrity with only a few brief moments of greatness--the PTS, Desmond Llewelyn's final scene, the torture chair--smattered throughout.

[George Kaplan]

I also re-watched all the films and generally liked all of Brosnan's except Goldeneye better than my memories of seeing them in the theater.

I'd actually say that all of the Brosnan films except Goldeneye suffer from sticking to certain formulas - TND and TWINE could both have excised the second female lead (Hatcher and Richards) without much damage to the stories IMO for example. They have some solid ideas but not always the convention to eschew from having things that fullfill the "Bond movie" expectations and I think they all suffer from it. Had they moved away from the formula, I think they could have easily taken more time to develop characters like Renard - who for a prime villain takes forever to show up in the film.

[MI6Operative]

Well.

I'm new here and all and as such I don't  have much cred. However it seems to me that hating on Brosnan's films and Brosnan in general in regards with James Bond is sort of the flavor of the moment, the new bandwagon everyone is so jolly getting on. It's sort of what happened with the success of the new Nolan Batman films vs the old Batman films. Yes, Forever and Batman & Robin were horrid, but both of Burton's films are incredible pieces of art, and yet they get bashed, even though they are not afraid of approaching the franchise honestly.

 

Is Denise Richards incredibly bad? Yes, quite possibly the worst. However, and I may be alone here, I will never be able to look at this film and somehow think it is worse than Bond up in space trying to play at being Luke Skywalker, or Bond dressed up as a clown doing slapstick whilst trying to defuse a nuke, or perhaps swinging from a rope in the jungle imitating Tarzan. Is some of the action mindless and had no excuse? Yes. But so is Bond, the SECRET service agent, a spy, waltzing into Silva's island and getting the Bond girl killed in cold blood, when a) he already had radioed his location, he could have just waited out or used a bit of stealth and After getting the Bond girl killed, he demonstrates that he could have at any given moment destroyed all of Silva's men and taken control of the situation, thus making the whole sequence of events feel forced, and rather incredibly stupid on Bond's behalf.

 

The performances by all of the cast excepting Richards are very good, and Elektra is a very memorable villain. The grand plan wasn't so far fetched. And for those people who say they can't like this movie after studying film, well, I have too, and it is incredibly silly to try and compare what is esentially an action/thriller aiming to be a blockbuster to The Godfather or A bout de souffle. Please, get into context and get over yourselves, we watch Bond films to have fun and because we love the character, not to experience artistic epiphany. 

 

It's a perfectly good and enjoyable film, certainly not the best or even close, but good enough, and it certainly doesn't make me facepalm over how silly it is (excepting perhaps, Richards part).

[seawolfnyy]

If you look at the parallels between TWINE and SF it almost seems like Skyfall was a do over and is the film that EON was aiming for in 1999. Look at the parallels:

-attack on MI6

-M threatened

-Bond fails to protect an asset

-the relocation of MI6

-Scotland

-Bond has an injury and needs to pass an evaluation

-Bond's loyalty to M is tested

-A new Q is introduced

-Villains have personal vendettas against M for her "betrayal" of the them

[delfloria]

 

Does anyone else have a strange affection for the 19th Bond film?

Nope.

No as well. I even went the world premiere and was still disappointed.

 

But I do understand how you feel about it because it was your first Bond film.

[Iceskater101]

If you look at the parallels between TWINE and SF it almost seems like Skyfall was a do over and is the film that EON was aiming for in 1999. Look at the parallels:

-attack on MI6

-M threatened

-Bond fails to protect an asset

-the relocation of MI6

-Scotland

-Bond has an injury and needs to pass an evaluation

-Bond's loyalty to M is tested

-A new Q is introduced

-Villains have personal vendettas against M for her "betrayal" of the them

Definitely agree! it does have a lot of similarities! Skyfall is the better version of TWINE. Though I still love TWINE though. Guilty Pleasure

[seawolfnyy]

Definitely agree! it does have a lot of similarities! Skyfall is the better version of TWINE. Though I still love TWINE though. Guilty Pleasure

No problem with that . Everyone's got their guilty pleasures. Mine's TMWTGG, which is a terrible film, but I give it a pass since it was the first Bond film I ever saw.

[Iceskater101]

Yeah I like that one too because I love the fun house it's awesome, but I hate that karate school scene.

[Nicolas Suszczyk]

It's a very good film indeed. Some Bond feeling is missing, that's why I prefer GoldenEye and TND over it, but yes, I like it evry much!

[Mallory]

Not my favorite Bond film, I liked the Brosnan films a lot when I was a kid because they were basically video games. 

 

Two things I always had a problem with The World is Not Enough

 

1. Renard had a lot of build up only leading to an underwhelming climax. 

 

2. Bond and Elektra. Mostly Bond turning down her advances and ultimately and suddenly sleeping with her. 

 

I liked the complexcity of Elektra's character but I feel the writers tried to make the film too complex. If you explain the rational of Elektra's captivity and her revenge strategy you go crosseyed. My guess is that Renard kidnapped her, she latched on to him for suvival, got pissed that her father wasn't paying her ransom and then schemed to kill him. Then she brings up her mother...yeah and the film is lost. 

 

Nice to see Robbie Coltrane get the screentime he deserves, he had one scene in GoldenEye and that was it. A shame because his character was so memorable.

 

The casting of Denise Richards was a mistake. She was one of the most desired women at the time, kind of like Teri Hatcher was for Tomorrow Never Dies. They should have cast Maria Grazia Cucinotta as the main girl instead of killing her off. The filmmakers clearly did not consider...anything for the Bond girls for Brosnan. 

 

A hell of a lot better than Die Another Day.

Edited by Mallory, 25 December 2012 - 02:02 AM.

[Iceskater101]

Yeah I enjoyed this film more than Die another Day.

[Mallory]

The torture chair scene disturbs me everytime. I have a weird thing about breaking necks. Gives me the shivers.

[seawolfnyy]

The torture scene has nothing on the one in CR though. That one hurts everytime I watch it.

[Mallory]

True. Rope to the nuts is a lot worse. Not sure how he was able to have sex with Vesper though unless he was in care for several weeks.

[seawolfnyy]

I believe he is even though they don't really make any mention of it. In the novel, he spends about a month recovering and even mentions having to make sure everything still works down there. I think in the film pretty much the first 75% of it take place in the span of roughly 7-10 days and the last quarter takes place about 1 month after the rest of it.