42 replies to this topic

[john.steed]

Never Say Never Again, yes. NSNA is a faithful/serious adaptation of an Ian Fleming novel and it stars Sean Connery as 007. That is enough for me.

That is my thinking as well. I would also add the the makers of the film had the legal rights to make the film.

[Safari Suit]

So did the people who made the two earlier Casino Royales. I don't think leagality is an issue here, it's not as if anyone would just make a James Bond film and hope that maybe EON will forget to sue!

For the record, I consider NSNA a Bond film. I don't really consider CR 67 to be a Bond film, even though it is one of only two films outside of the EON series to feature a character (more than one as it turns out) called James Bond. I consider it to be a spoof. I am rather fond of it as it happens, although I don't own it. As for the 54 CR, I must confess I've never seen it.

[DR76]

Since both CR '67 and NSNA are based upon James Bond novels by Ian Fleming, I consider them both Bond movies.

[Forward Look]

Since both CR '67 and NSNA are based upon James Bond novels by Ian Fleming, I consider them both Bond movies.

Both movies, and CR1954, feature a leading character named James Bond. All have certain elements of Fleming's original books in their screenplays. Completely and totally legitimate for me.

[dee-bee-five]

I count Never Say Never Again as part of the Bond family. It's a damn good entertaining film, and personally, I find it a lot better than some of the 'Official' Bond movies.

I disagree on all counts.

NEVER SAY NEVER AGAIN ain't part of my Bond family. NEVER SAY NEVER AGAIN is like a rubbish younger uncle that comes round every few years and leaves everyone in a state of shock and anger.

I agree 100%. I loathe NSNA. And even if I didn't despise the grave-robbing-up-yours ethos with which Connery and McClory embarked on the enterprise, I should still regard it as a cheap-looking, poorly scripted and terribly directed B movie.

I must admit, though, that the '67 Casino Royale flick is a guilty pleasure.

[Loomis]

This thread asks the question:

"Can CR'67 and NSNA be considered as Bond movies?"

The answer is yes.

Let's ask another question: "Can CR'67 and NSNA be considered as Eon Bond movies?"

The answer is no.

It's not rocket science. CR'67 and NSNA are Bond movies. They're just not part of the Eon series.

Is anyone still having trouble with this?

[Simon]

This thread asks the question:

"Can CR'67 and NSNA be considered as Bond movies?"

The answer is yes.

Let's ask another question: "Can CR'67 and NSNA be considered as Eon Bond movies?"

The answer is no.

It's not rocket science. CR'67 and NSNA are Bond movies. They're just not part of the Eon series.

Is anyone still having trouble with this?

To be frank, I was wondering whether there was another aspect to his thread that I was missing, so passed on by...

Yeah, not as though they're Mickey Mouse movies.

[Col. Sun]

CR '67 and NSNA star James Bond, feature many of Fleming's characters (M, Moneypenny, Largo, Blofeld etc.) and are both based on Bond novels.

They are James Bond films as simple as that.

Just because one is a (bloated) spoof and the other one was not produced by Eon either doesn't mean they can be dismissed just because they are not as popular with many Bond fans.

[dee-bee-five]

This thread asks the question:

"Can CR'67 and NSNA be considered as Bond movies?"

The answer is yes.

Let's ask another question: "Can CR'67 and NSNA be considered as Eon Bond movies?"

The answer is no.

It's not rocket science. CR'67 and NSNA are Bond movies. They're just not part of the Eon series.

Is anyone still having trouble with this?

Well, clearly they can be regarded as Bond movies, just as, I suppose, Tony Blair can be regarded as being honest man.

And I suppose, if pushed, I must accept the logic that they are Bond films. But I prefer to think of neither as being proper Bond films. And that is, of course, my right, just as it is the right of others to disagree.

[Loomis]

And I suppose, if pushed, I must accept the logic that they are Bond films. But I prefer to think of neither as being proper Bond films.

By "proper Bond films", I guess you mean "good Bond films". I don't consider TWINE a proper Bond film, but I have no choice but to concede that it is a Bond film.

Or do you mean that you prefer to think of neither as being part of the Eon series? If so, well, that goes without saying (or should do - some fans appear to believe, for some mindblowing reason, that they should be retroactively welcomed into the Eon fold and given DVD cover designs to match the 22 Eon films).

If, however, you are suggesting that there is no such thing as a Bond film that wasn't made by Eon, then that flies in the face of hard fact.

Can HIGH TIME TO KILL be considered a Bond novel? Of course - whether it's a good one is neither here nor there (I happen to think it isn't). But it is, undeniably, a Bond novel. You simply can't take that away from it.

Does that mean that HTTK should be packaged in a collection with the Fleming novels? No, it doesn't. It's not part of the same canon of Bond - the core canon, if you like (similarly, the Eon films represent the core canon of the celluloid 007 - but not the only canon).

[dee-bee-five]

If, however, you are suggesting that there is no such thing as a Bond film that wasn't made by Eon, then that flies in the face of hard fact.

It might not be logical but, actually, that's an argument I would have a lot of sympathy with...

[Colossus]

This thread asks the question:

"Can CR'67 and NSNA be considered as Bond movies?"

The answer is yes.

Let's ask another question: "Can CR'67 and NSNA be considered as Eon Bond movies?"

The answer is no.

It's not rocket science. CR'67 and NSNA are Bond movies. They're just not part of the Eon series.

Is anyone still having trouble with this?

Yeah i'm also confused at the confusion here, but it's kind of funny!

As for the 54 CR, I must confess I've never seen it.

One thing about it is Peter Lorre's Le Chiffre is completely better than Mikkelsen's. He is the one i imagine in the book, he is the sweaty toad.

[DLibrasnow]

Both CASINO ROYALE (1967) and NEVER SAY NEVER AGAIN (1983) feature a character named James Bond and are both (loosely in the case of the former) on Fleming material, which is more than can be said for a number of EON entries.

Hence they are both Bond movies.

And personally I prefer NEVER SAY NEVER AGAIN to the majority of the EON offerings.