887 replies to this topic

[Judo chop]

This thread is a merry-go-round.

No... I take that back. It's not that much fun.

It's more like a turnstile.

[Harmsway]

You're a funny one, Harmsway. I feel you're playing devil's advocate and hiding your appreciation for Quantum.

I quite like QUANTUM OF SOLACE. I think it's very good indeed, and probably one of the best Bond films. But I'm not playing devil's advocate here - I think it's certainly, and clearly, inferior to CASINO ROYALE.

The combo Craig-Mikklesen-Green-Giannini-Dench is not as strong as Quantum's five-some because in Quantum Gianinni and Dench actually surpass their CR work, imo.

Maybe that's true, but it still doesn't pan out for me, because I feel that Craig is significantly superior in CASINO ROYALE, that Mikkelsen is significantly superior to Amalric, and Green is significantly superior to Kurylenko. So I definitely weigh CASINO ROYALE more heavily.

Also, the Siena art gallery scene has Bond go mano-a-mano against Mitchell, a very human foe. That he kills Mitchell is down to milliseconds and luck.

Sure, but the stuff Bond is taking in stride is ridiculous.

I'll grant that Mollaka is a more cartoonish foe than Mitchell - and that on the whole, CASINO ROYALE has a bit more of a cartoonish vibe than QUANTUM OF SOLACE - but I don't think that's inherently a bad thing.

And what about the ability of Bond to have sex so quickly after having had his balls broken? It's a combo of Superman and John Holmes there!

I'm not sure that the film discloses how long he was resting up. So I'm going to leave that alone.

This thread is a merry-go-round.

No... I take that back. It's not that much fun.

It's more like a turnstile.

[HildebrandRarity]

You're a funny one, Harmsway. I feel you're playing devil's advocate and hiding your appreciation for Quantum.

I quite like QUANTUM OF SOLACE. I think it's very good indeed, and probably one of the best Bond films. But I'm not playing devil's advocate here - I think it's certainly, and clearly, inferior to CASINO ROYALE.

The combo Craig-Mikklesen-Green-Giannini-Dench is not as strong as Quantum's five-some because in Quantum Gianinni and Dench actually surpass their CR work, imo.

Maybe that's true, but it still doesn't pan out for me, because I feel that Craig is significantly superior in CASINO ROYALE, that Mikkelsen is significantly superior to Amalric, and Green is significantly superior to Kurylenko. So I definitely weigh CASINO ROYALE more heavily.

Also, the Siena art gallery scene has Bond go mano-a-mano against Mitchell, a very human foe. That he kills Mitchell is down to milliseconds and luck.

Sure, but the stuff Bond is taking in stride is ridiculous.

I'll grant that Mollaka is a more cartoonish foe than Mitchell - and that on the whole, CASINO ROYALE has a bit more of a cartoonish vibe than QUANTUM OF SOLACE - but I don't think that's inherently a bad thing.

And what about the ability of Bond to have sex so quickly after having had his balls broken? It's a combo of Superman and John Holmes there!

I'm not sure that the film discloses how long he was resting up. So I'm going to leave that alone.

You can figure the time line from Mollaka's cell phone (in both Madagascar and Miami) and by the CCTV footage at the One & Only Ocean Club in The Bahamas...and then Vesper's cell phone in Venice that he recovers in less than a couple of weeks.

As per the acting, well, that's opinion...and I think Craig, Dench and Giannini are 'better' in Q0S. As for the other two actors, well I wouldn't give Green the out-right edge...and i'd be more inclined to give the Frencman the edge over the Dane but not definitively. All opinion of course.

Regardless, the fact that this discussion is even happening suggests that the Bond series is at the "highs", once again.

[eddychaput]

I'm not going to visit this thread anymore. Cio!

[MattofSteel]

Too bad. It was going so well for awhile! I forget what the main argument even is right now. That Hildy likes the film too much? And that Mr. Beech merely thinks it's a 'good' movie?

Oh, woe is us.

[ElFenomeno]

CR is the better movie. all my friends , non-bond fans , agree with me.
-better PTS/better ending. IMO CR's ending will not be topped in the next 10-15 years.you just can't beat that
-better action scenes .well edited and filmed.
-better dialogue. i mean 90% of the dialogue between Vesper and Bond is pure gold.unlike what ?? 10 lines of dialogue between Bond and Camille ?
-it's 2 hours and 20 minutes and you can sink your teeth in the movie.really feel it.
-CR has no Dench in the bathroom.Do we really need to see M's bath-room habits in a Bond film? Would the early Bond films have been any better if they had included lengthy scenes of Bernard Lee trimming his nasal hair whilst briefing Bond on his mission? No.

Edited by ElFenomeno, 10 February 2009 - 11:51 AM.

[Safari Suit]

CR is the better movie. all my friends , non-bond fans , agree with me.

But why are non-fans better judges than fans? I am sure for every argument that says that their opinion is inherently more valuable there is a counterpoint in the "fans" corner (how do you define "fan" anyway?).

Anyway for all we know you could have like two friends. I kid of course. For what it's worth all but one of my friends that have seen the film would agree with your friends. But I wouldn't.

-better dialogue. i mean 90% of the dialogue between Vesper and Bond is pure gold

It didn't seem like gold to me, pure or otherwise.

[HildebrandRarity]

So, "Everytime I see you, I feel reborn" and "That's because you know what I can do with my little finger" is pure gold?

The dialogue in Casino Royale is more cringe-worthy than Q0S.

I actually agreed on that one, if you read my post...

Besides, QUANTUM OF SOLACE did have at least one howler: "You and I have a mutual friend!"

If that's the only 'howler' in the movie, then it's streets ahead of OHMSS's howlers!

That's if it's a 'howler'...the reason it's not is because the actual line "You and I had a mutual friend" was for the audience because the attack on Carlos came so rapidly and out of the blue that audiences wouldn't have immediately picked up that it was Carlos behind the windshield who was about to get a heart full of lead as payback for Mathis.

I think that line is for the benefit of the viewer.

[Mr_Wint]

So, "Everytime I see you, I feel reborn" and "That's because you know what I can do with my little finger" is pure gold?

The dialogue in Casino Royale is more cringe-worthy than Q0S.

I actually agreed on that one, if you read my post...

Besides, QUANTUM OF SOLACE did have at least one howler: "You and I have a mutual friend!"

If that's the only 'howler' in the movie, then it's streets ahead of OHMSS's howlers!

That's if it's a 'howler'...the reason it's not is because the actual line "You and I had a mutual friend" was for the audience because the attack on Carlos came so rapidly and out of the blue that audiences wouldn't have immediately picked up that it was Carlos behind the windshield who was about to get a heart full of lead as payback for Mathis.

I think that line is for the benefit of the viewer.

Even with that line, I don't think anyone understands that he "killed" Mathis.

[HildebrandRarity]

So, "Everytime I see you, I feel reborn" and "That's because you know what I can do with my little finger" is pure gold?

The dialogue in Casino Royale is more cringe-worthy than Q0S.

I actually agreed on that one, if you read my post...

Besides, QUANTUM OF SOLACE did have at least one howler: "You and I have a mutual friend!"

If that's the only 'howler' in the movie, then it's streets ahead of OHMSS's howlers!

That's if it's a 'howler'...the reason it's not is because the actual line "You and I had a mutual friend" was for the audience because the attack on Carlos came so rapidly and out of the blue that audiences wouldn't have immediately picked up that it was Carlos behind the windshield who was about to get a heart full of lead as payback for Mathis.

I think that line is for the benefit of the viewer.

Even with that line, I don't think anyone understands that he "killed" Mathis.

O come now Mr_Wint. How could people not understand that?

[blueman]

Uh, this last little bit of talkback is weird: it was very obvious and all made sense at first viewing. I knew who was responsible for Mathis's death right when he died - the head of the police and whomever controlled him (Greene). Duh. IMHO. It was also obvious who Bond said the line to in the jeep, he'd just gotten into it moments before, and liked the line just fine as Bond was metting out justice at that point.

All that worked for me, gave closure for Mathis. If it hadn't been included I likely wouldn't have missed it, but just another instance of how well thought out and put together the script/film is.

[Daddy Bond]

I think why the whole discussion of some people saying that others just didn't pay attention when they watched QOS is that a vast majority of things some people didn't see or were missed WERE clearly seen and observed by others.

[HildebrandRarity]

I think why the whole discussion of some people saying that others just didn't pay attention when they watched QOS is that a vast majority of things some people didn't see or were missed WERE clearly seen and observed by others.

There are known knowns. Then there are known unknowns. There are even unknown unknowns. But where it really gets ed up is when there unknown knowns.

[Daddy Bond]

I think why the whole discussion of some people saying that others just didn't pay attention when they watched QOS is that a vast majority of things some people didn't see or were missed WERE clearly seen and observed by others.

There are known knowns. Then there are known unknowns. There are even unknown unknowns. But where it really gets ed up is when there unknown knowns.

I agree. I think.

[__7]

Yup. Seems some people don't like too much Bond cluttering up their Bond.

I believe everyone at some point, have preconceptions about how Bond should be. So I don't think it just some, but all, who "don't like too much Bond cluttering up their Bond".

This is a good point. What is "Bond"? The Moore films are about as "Bondian" as you can get, but I think we all agree that CR and QoS are vastly superior films. So what gives? Can a Bond film be too "Bondian". I think it can. You can take "Bond" to far and all of a sudden you have Goldmember. So we're back to the original question what is Bond (or, if you like, how much Bondian less or more has to be there before the film becomes something more or less than a Bond film)? I look at DN (#2 on my list), the original and someone could make a very convincing argument the best Bond film. It was Bondian in the right places and not so much in the places where it wasn't needed...I'm starting to ramble a bit, but I think you see where I'm headed with this, so you folks with more experience take over.

[danielcraigisjamesbond007]

I think that, for me at least, I was so looking forward to this movie. I loved CR, and that made me think that QoS would be even better.
I even remember when the title of the film was announced. It didn't bother me because it came from Fleming, and didn't have the word "die" in it (TND, DAD, ex.). I defended the title until I was blue in the face. I translated (so to speak) the meaning to anyone who didn't know.
I kept playing the trailer over and over again. So, when Quantum finally arrived in theatres, I was excited to see it. Unfortunately, however, I knew something was wrong right when the car chase happened. The editing of this movie is utter
To be fair, there are several scenes that are great (Fields death, the opera).
So, not the worst Bond movie for me, but definitely 08's biggest disappointment (Just my opinion, of course).

[Double-Oh Agent]

I think that, for me at least, I was so looking forward to this movie. I loved CR, and that made me think that QoS would be even better.
I even remember when the title of the film was announced. It didn't bother me because it came from Fleming, and didn't have the word "die" in it (TND, DAD, ex.). I defended the title until I was blue in the face. I translated (so to speak) the meaning to anyone who didn't know.
I kept playing the trailer over and over again. So, when Quantum finally arrived in theatres, I was excited to see it. Unfortunately, however, I knew something was wrong right when the car chase happened. The editing of this movie is utter
To be fair, there are several scenes that are great (Fields death, the opera).
So, not the worst Bond movie for me, but definitely 08's biggest disappointment (Just my opinion, of course).

While I doubted that Quantum Of Solace would/could reach the heights of Casino Royale, I nevertheless was looking forward to it and expecting a good film.

Upon seeing it though, I felt much like you--disappointed. I saw a brief clip of the car chase on the Jimmy Kimmel show a day or so before the film opened and it looked great. That, combined with reading what stunts they were doing in that location during filming had me thinking it might be an all-time great car chase. But then I saw the chase in the theater and the disappointment started setting in as it was way too short and had that absolutely ridiculous super-quick editing making all my thoughts of an all-time great car chase evaporate almost as quickly as the editing. (I swear the Jimmy Kimmel cut had a more traditional editing style than what the film wound up with). Then came the disappointing title sequence which kept the film in the hole, and finally the desecration of Mathis sealed the deal.

[Mr_Wint]

O come now Mr_Wint. How could people not understand that?

Because the Police chief had a very small role in the film before Mathis death. We only see them togheter for about 5-10 sec.

I think that, for me at least, I was so looking forward to this movie. I loved CR, and that made me think that QoS would be even better.
I even remember when the title of the film was announced. It didn't bother me because it came from Fleming, and didn't have the word "die" in it (TND, DAD, ex.). I defended the title until I was blue in the face. I translated (so to speak) the meaning to anyone who didn't know.
I kept playing the trailer over and over again. So, when Quantum finally arrived in theatres, I was excited to see it. Unfortunately, however, I knew something was wrong right when the car chase happened. The editing of this movie is utter
To be fair, there are several scenes that are great (Fields death, the opera).
So, not the worst Bond movie for me, but definitely 08's biggest disappointment (Just my opinion, of course).

While I doubted that Quantum Of Solace would/could reach the heights of Casino Royale, I nevertheless was looking forward to it and expecting a good film.

Upon seeing it though, I felt much like you--disappointed. I saw a brief clip of the car chase on the Jimmy Kimmel show a day or so before the film opened and it looked great. That, combined with reading what stunts they were doing in that location during filming had me thinking it might be an all-time great car chase. But then I saw the chase in the theater and the disappointment started setting in as it was way too short and had that absolutely ridiculous super-quick editing making all my thoughts of an all-time great car chase evaporate almost as quickly as the editing. (I swear the Jimmy Kimmel cut had a more traditional editing style than what the film wound up with). Then came the disappointing title sequence which kept the film in the hole, and finally the desecration of Mathis sealed the deal.

I liked the title but I had a feeling that the film wouldn't be that great after seeing the trailer. Sadly, I was right and QOS now belongs in my bottom 3 (only LTK and DAD are worse IMO). My biggest problem with the film is not the stupid plot or the horrible editing but the lack of anything memorable. I had no idea that Bond could be this dull.

Still, as with all Bondfilms, it is easy to find a lot of good things; Arnold's score is quite good, Mathis and Mr White are interesting characters and I hope Pigott-Smith will return as the Foreign Secretary in future Bondfilms. Hell, make him the new M.

[Commander Swanbeck]

I hope Pigott-Smith will return (...) Hell, make him the new M.

Very very good idea !
His behaviour reminds me Edward Fox in NSNA !

[danielcraigisjamesbond007]

I think that, for me at least, I was so looking forward to this movie. I loved CR, and that made me think that QoS would be even better.
I even remember when the title of the film was announced. It didn't bother me because it came from Fleming, and didn't have the word "die" in it (TND, DAD, ex.). I defended the title until I was blue in the face. I translated (so to speak) the meaning to anyone who didn't know.
I kept playing the trailer over and over again. So, when Quantum finally arrived in theatres, I was excited to see it. Unfortunately, however, I knew something was wrong right when the car chase happened. The editing of this movie is utter
To be fair, there are several scenes that are great (Fields death, the opera).
So, not the worst Bond movie for me, but definitely 08's biggest disappointment (Just my opinion, of course).

While I doubted that Quantum Of Solace would/could reach the heights of Casino Royale, I nevertheless was looking forward to it and expecting a good film.

Upon seeing it though, I felt much like you--disappointed. I saw a brief clip of the car chase on the Jimmy Kimmel show a day or so before the film opened and it looked great. That, combined with reading what stunts they were doing in that location during filming had me thinking it might be an all-time great car chase. But then I saw the chase in the theater and the disappointment started setting in as it was way too short and had that absolutely ridiculous super-quick editing making all my thoughts of an all-time great car chase evaporate almost as quickly as the editing. (I swear the Jimmy Kimmel cut had a more traditional editing style than what the film wound up with). Then came the disappointing title sequence which kept the film in the hole, and finally the desecration of Mathis sealed the deal.

O come now Mr_Wint. How could people not understand that?

Because the Police chief had a very small role in the film before Mathis death. We only see them togheter for about 5-10 sec.

I think that, for me at least, I was so looking forward to this movie. I loved CR, and that made me think that QoS would be even better.
I even remember when the title of the film was announced. It didn't bother me because it came from Fleming, and didn't have the word "die" in it (TND, DAD, ex.). I defended the title until I was blue in the face. I translated (so to speak) the meaning to anyone who didn't know.
I kept playing the trailer over and over again. So, when Quantum finally arrived in theatres, I was excited to see it. Unfortunately, however, I knew something was wrong right when the car chase happened. The editing of this movie is utter
To be fair, there are several scenes that are great (Fields death, the opera).
So, not the worst Bond movie for me, but definitely 08's biggest disappointment (Just my opinion, of course).

While I doubted that Quantum Of Solace would/could reach the heights of Casino Royale, I nevertheless was looking forward to it and expecting a good film.

Upon seeing it though, I felt much like you--disappointed. I saw a brief clip of the car chase on the Jimmy Kimmel show a day or so before the film opened and it looked great. That, combined with reading what stunts they were doing in that location during filming had me thinking it might be an all-time great car chase. But then I saw the chase in the theater and the disappointment started setting in as it was way too short and had that absolutely ridiculous super-quick editing making all my thoughts of an all-time great car chase evaporate almost as quickly as the editing. (I swear the Jimmy Kimmel cut had a more traditional editing style than what the film wound up with). Then came the disappointing title sequence which kept the film in the hole, and finally the desecration of Mathis sealed the deal.

I liked the title but I had a feeling that the film wouldn't be that great after seeing the trailer. Sadly, I was right and QOS now belongs in my bottom 3 (only LTK and DAD are worse IMO). My biggest problem with the film is not the stupid plot or the horrible editing but the lack of anything memorable. I had no idea that Bond could be this dull.

Still, as with all Bondfilms, it is easy to find a lot of good things; Arnold's score is quite good, Mathis and Mr White are interesting characters and I hope Pigott-Smith will return as the Foreign Secretary in future Bondfilms. Hell, make him the new M.

It's good to know that I'm not the only one who thinks this. I mean, some things in Quantum are good, but, as an overall film, it doesn't work for me at all. And I don't hate the people who liked Quantum (Hey, if you liked QoS, that's great. I can see why with the countless action scenes). But for me, and some of us, the film just doesn't work. So, I respect the people who love and loathe Quantum.

[Dainshdude118]

TBH, i think that QOS had too much action and not enough time to stop and think. The 'talky' scenes ie. Mathis' death and the airoplane bar scene were some of the best in the film.

[Daddy Bond]

TBH, i think that QOS had too much action and not enough time to stop and think. The 'talky' scenes ie. Mathis' death and the airoplane bar scene were some of the best in the film.

Really? A lot of people say this, that there aren't a lot of points where the film slows down to let you think. Here are some of the many moments that I can remember where the film slows down and there is little to no action (these are not necessariy in order) and there a good amount of dialogue in many of these...

The dialogue of Bond and M in Italy and then the interrogation of Mr. White
The investigation of the agent's apartment.
The examination of the money at MI6.
Camille talking with Greene by the dock - Greene and the General talking by the dock.
On the airplane and the airport with Greene, Felix and Tanner.
The first part at the Opera for several minutes.
Bond at the airport.
Bond's traveling and arriving at Mathis' house where they have a long talk.
Bond's dialogue with Mathis on the plane.
Arriving at the airport with Mathis, the taxi ride, going to the two hotels, checking in.
Bond with Fields
Bond and Fields at Greene's evening party.
The death of Mathis
In the cave with Bond and Camille - they have a dialogue and explore the cave.
Bond and Camille walking in the desert and eventually taking a bus.
The death of Fields
At the CIA office with Felix and Tanner.
Bond's dialogue with Felix at the bar.
The signing of the papers at the hotel in the desert (Greene, the General and Elvis)
Bond and Camille talking and cleaning their guns.
Bond and Greene out in the desert where Bond gives Greene the motoroil(I wouldn't really call that an action sequence)
Bond and Camille in the SUV
The final sequence where Bond confronts Vesper's old boyfriend.

That's well over 20 substantial events/scenes in the move (and there are more) where there is basically no action, where the movie slows down and even explains things. True, there are plenty of action scenes bracketing some of the events, but the quantity of action scenes are far fewer:

The original car chase (somewhat short)
The foot chase following the interrogation
Bond killing of the assassin (a fairly short scene)
The gunfight at the Opera (somewhat short).
The boat chase (somewhat short).
The plane chase and parachute sequence.
Escaping from the hotel after Field's is murdered (very short)
Escaping after the dialogue with Leiter in the bar (very short)
The final fights in the burning hotel.

Even if I'm missing a couple, that's about 9 action sequences - 3 are very, VERY short (the killing of the assassin, escaping the hotel after Field's murder, escaping after talking to Felix in the bar) - and three more are fairly short (the PTS, the gunfight at the opera and the boat chase), which leaves only three substantial or lengthy action sequences (the foot chase, the plane chase/parachute and the final fights at the burning hotel). Am I missing something major?

Was there a lot of action? Sure. Wall to wall action? I strongly disagree. Was the movie fast paced, sure, but there was plenty of dialogue, plenty of moments to catch your breath - unless you were just so stunned by the previous action scenes that the slow moments seemed to pass by unnotices (a bit like being stunned by a flash/bang granade).

[Mr_Wint]

TBH, i think that QOS had too much action and not enough time to stop and think. The 'talky' scenes ie. Mathis' death and the airoplane bar scene were some of the best in the film.

Really? A lot of people say this, that there aren't a lot of points where the film slows down to let you think. Here are some of the many moments that I can remember where the film slows down and there is little to no action (these are not necessariy in order) and there a good amount of dialogue in many of these...

The dialogue of Bond and M in Italy and then the interrogation of Mr. White
The investigation of the agent's apartment.
The examination of the money at MI6.
Camille talking with Greene by the dock - Greene and the General talking by the dock.
On the airplane and the airport with Greene, Felix and Tanner.
The first part at the Opera for several minutes.
Bond at the airport.
Bond's traveling and arriving at Mathis' house where they have a long talk.
Bond's dialogue with Mathis on the plane.
Arriving at the airport with Mathis, the taxi ride, going to the two hotels, checking in.
Bond with Fields
Bond and Fields at Greene's evening party.
The death of Mathis
In the cave with Bond and Camille - they have a dialogue and explore the cave.
Bond and Camille walking in the desert and eventually taking a bus.
The death of Fields
At the CIA office with Felix and Tanner.
Bond's dialogue with Felix at the bar.
The signing of the papers at the hotel in the desert (Greene, the General and Elvis)
Bond and Camille talking and cleaning their guns.
Bond and Greene out in the desert where Bond gives Greene the motoroil(I wouldn't really call that an action sequence)
Bond and Camille in the SUV
The final sequence where Bond confronts Vesper's old boyfriend.

That's well over 20 substantial events/scenes in the move (and there are more) where there is basically no action, where the movie slows down and even explains things. True, there are plenty of action scenes bracketing some of the events, but the quantity of action scenes are far fewer:

The original car chase (somewhat short)
The foot chase following the interrogation
Bond killing of the assassin (a fairly short scene)
The gunfight at the Opera (somewhat short).
The boat chase (somewhat short).
The plane chase and parachute sequence.
Escaping from the hotel after Field's is murdered (very short)
Escaping after the dialogue with Leiter in the bar (very short)
The final fights in the burning hotel.

Even if I'm missing a couple, that's about 9 action sequences - 3 are very, VERY short (the killing of the assassin, escaping the hotel after Field's murder, escaping after talking to Felix in the bar) - and three more are fairly short (the PTS, the gunfight at the opera and the boat chase), which leaves only three substantial or lengthy action sequences (the foot chase, the plane chase/parachute and the final fights at the burning hotel). Am I missing something major?

Was there a lot of action? Sure. Wall to wall action? I strongly disagree. Was the movie fast paced, sure, but there was plenty of dialogue, plenty of moments to catch your breath - unless you were just so stunned by the previous action scenes that the slow moments seemed to pass by unnotices (a bit like being stunned by a flash/bang granade).

No matter how you look at it, QOS is very action-packed. Due to its short running time it might be one of the most action-packed Bondfilms ever (togheter with films like FYEO and TND). There's nothing wrong with that. But one of my problems with QOS is that the slow, 'talky', scenes - which are supposed to give some motivation to all action - feels so lackluster. Every speech from Dench is now tiresome beyond imagination. Bond himself is not at all interesting. No memorable oneliners, no Bondmoves, no panache. It's only cold-blooded kills over and over again which feels totally out of character. Felix Leiter has the same uncomfortable-but-still-cool-look through the whole film. Its almost like he didn't want to be in this film at all. Horrible. And, finally, all scenes involving Gregg Beam or General Medrano feels like a waste with valuable screentime.

Combine all that with terrible editing and directing. Apparently, in this extremely compressed Bondfilm, the filmmakers thinks they have time to show Gregg Beam's reaction to turbulence or to show some totally uninteresting lizard crawling around in the desert. Yet, a key-scene like the interrogation with Mr White can easily be cut down to seconds...

[byline]

Every speech from Dench is now tiresome beyond imagination. Bond himself is not at all interesting. No memorable oneliners, no Bondmoves, no panache.

FWIW, I feel exactly the opposite. Yes, the dialogue is sparse, but I also think it's concise and to the point. Any more, and there would be way too much talking to suit the circumstances, IMO. And the sparks that fly in the dialogue between M and Bond are among my favorite memories of Craig's films.

No memorable one-liners? I can think of several right off the top of my head:

"Time to get out."
"If they wanted his soul, they should have made a deal with a priest."
"I really think you people should find a better place to meet."
Mathis: "I think she has handcuffs." Bond: "I hope so."
Camille: "Your mother?" Bond: "She likes to think so."
"I never left."

Not sure what you mean by "Bondmoves," but one of my favorite Bond moves came with that lovely cat-like hop Craig did over the railing in the hotel, just after he's escaped M's thugs in the elevator.

No panache? I guess it all depends on perception, but for me, Craig's Bond has a very subtle, yet discernible, panache. It's just that he's not hitting us over the head with it every other second.

[Eddie Burns]

Those one liners above are the dreariest i've ever heard. Plus Craig did struggle with the delivery with some of them. Memorable? The only memorable one was the lottery/sabbatical one.

Which leads me to think that considering the Dr. No script didn't have any one liners, Terence Young and Sir Sean did a marvellous job improvising. Thats wit and originality, and most importantly memorable. Having lines delivered in the manner of Arnie isn't memorable.

Haggis got paid $4mil to deliver a non-existent script, and Forster and Craig are the last I would choose to create a script on set that contained an ounce of wit in it. Some guys on here a delusional in thinking this movie is tight, better paced (Transporter 1,2,3 are better paced than most Bond movies, that doesn't mean they're quality), with better acting and dialogue. Craig's performance was better in CR, fact(Bafta agrees with me). Dench was better in CR, fact. Olga was on screen mainly for the action and really didn't have that many lines, fact. Any movie with an action scene every 5 minutes always looks better paced

[Mr Teddy Bear]

[Dainshdude118]

TBH, i think that QOS had too much action and not enough time to stop and think. The 'talky' scenes ie. Mathis' death and the airoplane bar scene were some of the best in the film.

Really? A lot of people say this, that there aren't a lot of points where the film slows down to let you think. Here are some of the many moments that I can remember where the film slows down and there is little to no action (these are not necessariy in order) and there a good amount of dialogue in many of these...

The dialogue of Bond and M in Italy and then the interrogation of Mr. White
The investigation of the agent's apartment.
The examination of the money at MI6.
Camille talking with Greene by the dock - Greene and the General talking by the dock.
On the airplane and the airport with Greene, Felix and Tanner.
The first part at the Opera for several minutes.
Bond at the airport.
Bond's traveling and arriving at Mathis' house where they have a long talk.
Bond's dialogue with Mathis on the plane.
Arriving at the airport with Mathis, the taxi ride, going to the two hotels, checking in.
Bond with Fields
Bond and Fields at Greene's evening party.
The death of Mathis
In the cave with Bond and Camille - they have a dialogue and explore the cave.
Bond and Camille walking in the desert and eventually taking a bus.
The death of Fields
At the CIA office with Felix and Tanner.
Bond's dialogue with Felix at the bar.
The signing of the papers at the hotel in the desert (Greene, the General and Elvis)
Bond and Camille talking and cleaning their guns.
Bond and Greene out in the desert where Bond gives Greene the motoroil(I wouldn't really call that an action sequence)
Bond and Camille in the SUV
The final sequence where Bond confronts Vesper's old boyfriend.

That's well over 20 substantial events/scenes in the move (and there are more) where there is basically no action, where the movie slows down and even explains things. True, there are plenty of action scenes bracketing some of the events, but the quantity of action scenes are far fewer:

The original car chase (somewhat short)
The foot chase following the interrogation
Bond killing of the assassin (a fairly short scene)
The gunfight at the Opera (somewhat short).
The boat chase (somewhat short).
The plane chase and parachute sequence.
Escaping from the hotel after Field's is murdered (very short)
Escaping after the dialogue with Leiter in the bar (very short)
The final fights in the burning hotel.

Even if I'm missing a couple, that's about 9 action sequences - 3 are very, VERY short (the killing of the assassin, escaping the hotel after Field's murder, escaping after talking to Felix in the bar) - and three more are fairly short (the PTS, the gunfight at the opera and the boat chase), which leaves only three substantial or lengthy action sequences (the foot chase, the plane chase/parachute and the final fights at the burning hotel). Am I missing something major?

Was there a lot of action? Sure. Wall to wall action? I strongly disagree. Was the movie fast paced, sure, but there was plenty of dialogue, plenty of moments to catch your breath - unless you were just so stunned by the previous action scenes that the slow moments seemed to pass by unnotices (a bit like being stunned by a flash/bang granade).

you might have just convinced me

My oppinion that the action scenes often just have Bond fighting his way through endless goons still stands though.

Edited by Dainshdude118, 17 February 2009 - 11:51 AM.

[danielcraigisjamesbond007]

Haggis got paid $4mil to deliver a non-existent script, and Forster and Craig are the last I would choose to create a script on set that contained an ounce of wit in it. Some guys on here a delusional in thinking this movie is tight, better paced (Transporter 1,2,3 are better paced than most Bond movies, that doesn't mean they're quality), with better acting and dialogue. Craig's performance was better in CR, fact(Bafta agrees with me). Dench was better in CR, fact. Olga was on screen mainly for the action and really didn't have that many lines, fact. Any movie with an action scene every 5 minutes always looks better paced

To add to that point, I believe that the script for Quantum had a lot of problems right from the start. Also, I believe that Haggis finished the script just an hour or two before the Writer's Guild of America strike last year. So, in Haggis' defence, he might have been in a rush to finish the script..

[HildebrandRarity]

Transporter 1,2,3 are better paced than most Bond movies, that doesn't mean they're quality), with better acting and dialogue.

I suppose they're fine if you like cartoons.

The fact is that Q0S is an adult action adventure film and my opinion is that you like cartoon action movies.

You've revealed yourself!

[Daddy Bond]

Transporter 1,2,3 are better paced than most Bond movies, that doesn't mean they're quality), with better acting and dialogue.

I suppose they're fine if you like cartoons.

The fact is that Q0S is an adult action adventure film and my opinion is that you like cartoon action movies.

You've revealed yourself!

Indeed, they are very different movies. The Transporter movies are okay, but, as you said, they are a bit cartoonish and fake - I'm thinking especially of the car jump from the top of the parking garage across to another building or the barrel roll to knock a bomb off the bottom of the car (both in Transporter 2). Very silly moments IMHO.

QOS is WORLDS better than any of the Transporter movies (which I DON'T hate - they're just not in the same league), much more realistic and grown up.

Personally, I really like the pacing of QOS which moves rapidly from action scene to moments of calm, back to action, to more calm, back to action - wonderful pacing which moves the film along brilliantly IMHO.