77 replies to this topic

[Badfinger-Boogie]

I never really knew the story behind Dalton's departure from the role.

I know that Connery left after YOLT because he was sick of being Bond and the fame that it brought him, so he bolted. He was then replaced by Lazenby, who (despite a 7-film contract) left because he thought Bond's popularity was stuck in the 60s and would end soon. Connery was paid a whoppin' amount to return for DAF, so he did, but then decided he was done forever (or at least until NSNA), so he left with the intent of never returning. Then Moore came and stayed for a long time. I heard that he actually could've done an eighth film if he'd wanted to, but he probably felt that he was too old and had been around too long, so he quit too. And Brosnan wanted to do a fifth film, but the producers didn't want him anymore and fired him from the role. (correct me if I'm wrong on any of those)

So what brought Dalton's role to an end? I know there was a whole bunch of legal disputes that put the series on a long hiatus. Was it the disputes that made a third Dalton film impossible? Or was it something else? What exactly were the disputes about anyway?

[Blofeld's Cat]

I never really knew the story behind Dalton's departure from the role.

I know that Connery left after YOLT because he was sick of being Bond and the fame that it brought him, so he bolted. He was then replaced by Lazenby, who (despite a 7-film contract) left because he thought Bond's popularity was stuck in the 60s and would end soon. Connery was paid a whoppin' amount to return for DAF, so he did, but then decided he was done forever (or at least until NSNA), so he left with the intent of never returning. Then Moore came and stayed for a long time. I heard that he actually could've done an eighth film if he'd wanted to, but he probably felt that he was too old and had been around too long, so he quit too. And Brosnan wanted to do a fifth film, but the producers didn't want him anymore and fired him from the role. (correct me if I'm wrong on any of those)

Pretty much right except for the last sentence. The Broz wasn't fired, he just wasn't renewed after his last contract (IE: Die Another Day) was completed.

So what brought Dalton's role to an end? I know there was a whole bunch of legal disputes that put the series on a long hiatus. Was it the disputes that made a third Dalton film impossible? Or was it something else? What exactly were the disputes about anyway?

There are many a thread in the CBn forums on this subject alone. Did he jump? Was he pushed? Was he jushed? Did he pump? The definitive answer is still wafting in the ether somewhere, but I think the consensus of opinion (mine too) is that it was just a mutual decision between Eon and himself. Time was right for both parties to move on.

[jaguar007]

You will probably get just as many answers to this question as there are members on this forum. None of us really know for sure what exactly happened, but one popular theroy is that Broccoli wanted Dalton for GE (he even was delivered the script)but MGM wanted Brosnan who was probably more marketable to the public as James Bond. Dalton, being the class act that he is, gracefully bowed out of the role so the Broccoli family could get on with filming GE.

[Mr. Blofeld]

I still think Dalton should have done GoldenEye; Brosnan was just a poseur.

[draxingtonstanley]

Well a Dalton GE is indeed a tantalising prospect but there is no doubt that Brosnan's Bond really caught the public imagination and gave the series a huge shot in the arm.
I have no idea of the details,but suspect that Dalton was ready to move on by the time that all the legal shenanagins between Sony and EON had been sorted out.
So I see it as a mutual parting of the ways. Ready to be proved wrong by all means.

Edited by draxingtonstanley, 30 November 2007 - 10:44 PM.

[plankattack]

Agree with all the above that it was very much mutual consent. It's frequently said that TD and the Broccolis got on very well on a personal level and Cubby had always stuck by his man through the early 90s, so I'm sure the parting truly was mutual. Does anyone have an overview of the contract that TD signed in '87 and have any idea of what or if there was a settlement. If TD signed EON's standard 3-picture deal, did they pay off on the third?

[jaguar007]

Agree with all the above that it was very much mutual consent. It's frequently said that TD and the Broccolis got on very well on a personal level and Cubby had always stuck by his man through the early 90s, so I'm sure the parting truly was mutual. Does anyone have an overview of the contract that TD signed in '87 and have any idea of what or if there was a settlement. If TD signed EON's standard 3-picture deal, did they pay off on the third?

His 3 picture deal had expired by the time GE had began pre production.

[Royal Dalton]

Pay or Play contract. He would have been paid for the third film back in '92, or whenever.

[Stephen Spotswood]

My understanding is that Timothy Dalton walked. There was a five year gap, with some nasty shenanigans going on with studio mergers. While TD was under contract as Bond, this made it difficult for him to accept work elsewhere, but he was idle during the mergers. And in the meantime he turned 50, and probably because he didn't want to be another Roger Moore, playing the part way too long, he asked to be released.

Edited by Stephen Spotswood, 04 December 2007 - 02:46 PM.

[Beretta]

I still think Dalton should have done GoldenEye; Brosnan was just a poseur.

It appears we share the same opinion...
But THe Broz ( I like this surname from Blofeld's Cat if I'm not wrong)was good in GE...for my taste.

[Zorin Industries]

Timothy Dalton was NOT fired from Bond. There are a multiple of reasons why - some of them personal and some of them legal (and some of which are not everyone's business) - but I think I can categorically say Timothy Dalton would be the last 007 actor who that would ever have happened to.

[marktmurphy]

I've also heard that Dalton was happy to do one more and say goodbye, but they actually wanted him to do a forth and possibly more to relaunch the series; so they decided to end it.

[Judo chop]

...because he didn't want to be another Roger Moore, playing the part way too long, he asked to be released.

After seeing him in Hot Fuzz just the other day, I have to say Tim is still looking very Bondlike at ripe old 63. I was very impressed. Granted, in that film he wasn

[Royal Dalton]

Of course he wasn't fired. You can't fire someone who's not under contract.

But, if the studio wants a new leading man, and they won't put up the finance without one, then something's going to have to give. And, in this case, it was Dalton.

Life's not fair, but there it is.

[Judo chop]

Of course he wasn't fired. You can't fire someone who's not under contract.

But, if the studio wants a new leading man, and they won't put up the finance without one, then something's going to have to give. And, in this case, it was Dalton.

Life's not fair, but there it is.

I wonder how strongly Cubby and co. negotiated their end of the deal?

ie. I wonder if they tried to throw in (or throw 'out', as it were) Glen and the writers to keep Dalton? It's my age old rant: Dalton would have been much better publicly accepted with a different/better/more appropriate visionary behind the camera.

[Stephen Spotswood]

I remember a couple of Daltonesque moments in Goldeneye, Bond brooding on the beach, Bond brooding in his room over drinks, Bond telling Orson Bean's character he was an orphan.

But Brosnan looked more pouty on the beach, more space out in the drinking scene.

Primarily what bugged me was the return of "funny" girl names like Xenia Onatopp and every few minutes Bean saying something like he can't believe it everytime Bond pulled a stunt.

Even in Tommorrow Never Dies, Brosnan's bond discovers the corpse of Terri Hatcher's character, in a Dalton like moment, that had no where near the visceral impact of Dalton discovering Stella's body in Licensed to Kill. That's when I gave up on Brosnan's Bond.

[DamnCoffee]

From what I've heard, Dalton finished Licence to Kill and was still Bond untill 1991, where his contract expired, correct me if i'm wrong, but i'm quite sure he signed another 1 film contract (Thinking another film was in production), but the franchise went into financial difficulty whereupon he the producers and Dalton both decided that it was time for him to move on. It was Dalton's decision though, I think he was calling the shots.

[ACE]

Of course he wasn't fired. You can't fire someone who's not under contract.

But, if the studio wants a new leading man, and they won't put up the finance without one, then something's going to have to give. And, in this case, it was Dalton.

Life's not fair, but there it is.

I think this is the most accurate post on the subject in this thread.

[plankattack]

Of course he wasn't fired. You can't fire someone who's not under contract.

But, if the studio wants a new leading man, and they won't put up the finance without one, then something's going to have to give. And, in this case, it was Dalton.

Life's not fair, but there it is.

Is this a thread about TD,......or Brozza?

[Mr. Blofeld]

I remember a couple of Daltonesque moments in Goldeneye, Bond brooding on the beach, Bond brooding in his room over drinks, Bond telling Orson Bean's character he was an orphan.

Erm... you mean Sean Bean, right?

[Napoleon Solo]

I remember a couple of Daltonesque moments in Goldeneye, Bond brooding on the beach, Bond brooding in his room over drinks, Bond telling Orson Bean's character he was an orphan.

I'm guessing this should have read "Sean Bean" instead of "Orson Bean." Not to make light of the post (which was a serious analysis). I just chuckled, imagining Orson Bean, the long-time To Tell the Truth panelist and actor, playing Sean Bean's role in Goldeneye.

[boeserzwilling]

From what I've heard, Dalton finished Licence to Kill and was still Bond untill 1991, where his contract expired, correct me if i'm wrong, but i'm quite sure he signed another 1 film contract (Thinking another film was in production), but the franchise went into financial difficulty whereupon he the producers and Dalton both decided that it was time for him to move on. It was Dalton's decision though, I think he was calling the shots.

Promotion for Dalton's third Bond movie at the 1992 Cannes Film Festival:
http://www.ianflemin.../cannes99.shtml
The article says '1992' but I believe this was earlier (1990 ?).

[Cruiserweight]

It's such a shame that it all went down this way.Another Dalton bond film would have been fantastic in my opinion.

[Stephen Spotswood]

I remember a couple of Daltonesque moments in Goldeneye, Bond brooding on the beach, Bond brooding in his room over drinks, Bond telling Orson Bean's character he was an orphan.

I'm guessing this should have read "Sean Bean" instead of "Orson Bean." Not to make light of the post (which was a serious analysis). I just chuckled, imagining Orson Bean, the long-time To Tell the Truth panelist and actor, playing Sean Bean's role in Goldeneye.

Give the man an exploding cigar! I didn't catch that. Orson Bean was also in Dr. Quinn Medicine Woman.

Orson Bean:

http://www.drquinnmd...ments/bray2.jpg

Sean Bean:

http://www.fanzone50...harpe/SB_sh.jpg

Mr. Bean:

http://miund.files.w.../06/mr-bean.jpg

Maybe that explains why I've been feeling gassy lately.

Edited by Stephen Spotswood, 05 December 2007 - 01:54 PM.

[Mr. Blofeld]

I remember a couple of Daltonesque moments in Goldeneye, Bond brooding on the beach, Bond brooding in his room over drinks, Bond telling Orson Bean's character he was an orphan.

I'm guessing this should have read "Sean Bean" instead of "Orson Bean." Not to make light of the post (which was a serious analysis). I just chuckled, imagining Orson Bean, the long-time To Tell the Truth panelist and actor, playing Sean Bean's role in Goldeneye.

Give the man an exploding cigar! I didn't catch that. Orson Bean was also in Dr. Quinn Medicine Woman.

Orson Bean:

http://www.drquinnmd...ments/bray2.jpg

Sean Bean:

http://www.fanzone50...harpe/SB_sh.jpg

Mr. Bean:

http://miund.files.w.../06/mr-bean.jpg

Maybe that explains why I've been feeling gassy lately.

Dear, oh dear; Mr. Bean as Trevelyan?! He would have been making goofy faces and doing pratfalls all throughout GoldenEye!

[baerrtt]

Of course he wasn't fired. You can't fire someone who's not under contract.

But, if the studio wants a new leading man, and they won't put up the finance without one, then something's going to have to give. And, in this case, it was Dalton.

Life's not fair, but there it is.

I wonder how strongly Cubby and co. negotiated their end of the deal?

ie. I wonder if they tried to throw in (or throw 'out', as it were) Glen and the writers to keep Dalton? It's my age old rant: Dalton would have been much better publicly accepted with a different/better/more appropriate visionary behind the camera.

Could it have been an unfortunate case (as MGM saw it) that regardless of the material or who was behind the camera, there was something about Dalton the public (at large) were never going to accept? Dalton maintained, even when stuck with the mediocre John Glen and the standard of writing, that he was aiming for a completely serious take on Bond. GE may, in parts, seem like a Dalton film but I don't believe Brosnan went over with the public because of his 'serious' moments, but rather the lighthearted Roger Moore mark 2 persona he was very successful in portraying. Look at how people perceived the character of Bond to be during Dalton's(and Brosnan's) time in the role. Gadgets, quips, girls etc or even look at the action genre as a whole during Dalton's period to Brosnan's first three. Character driven stories with flawed protagonists were sparse, unlike now, simply because audiences wanted pure, mindless escapism from the genre. Even with the appropriate vision, taking these factors into account, I feel that the studio thought that (regardless of the finshed product) a 'traditional' movie Bond was needed to relaunch the franchise in the mid 90s.

[Napoleon Solo]

My spouse never accepted Dalton. She said he had "pig fingers." That sounds silly, but for some women (I'm told), hands are a big thing.

[Cruiserweight]

My spouse never accepted Dalton. She said he had "pig fingers." That sounds silly, but for some women (I'm told), hands are a big thing.

What's pig fingers?

[Napoleon Solo]

My spouse never accepted Dalton. She said he had "pig fingers." That sounds silly, but for some women (I'm told), hands are a big thing.

What's pig fingers?

Shorter, stubbier fingers (at least in my wife's opinion).

[Royal Dalton]

Pigs don't even have fingers!