61 replies to this topic

[K1Bond007]

So, Bond 22 is going to be a continuation of CR, and possibly contain elements of The Hildebrand Rarity, Quantum of Solace, The Property Of A Lady, Risico and/or 007 In New York?

Yeah.. whoop-ti-do, right? Anyone could have guessed that. In fact, just take out the short stories altogether and say Fleming in general. That should cover it.

And maybe a few bits of Gardner here and there.

I thought we had moved on to Benson. There's even some stuff from Higson that could easily be adapted to screen for the adult Bond. The henchman with the apache in DoD, for instance. I just like the thought of

Spoiler

a henchman that constantly appears to challenge Bond only to lose something (e.g., a limb) every time. Keeping it realistic and kind of subtle like the book instead of just a running Moore-ish gag.

[zencat]

Yes! I agree, K1. I love that as well. But it would be a shame to see them lift Higson's ideas without credit.

Heck, I think they should hire Charlie to write the script (and not as a rewriter, start with Higson). He is a screenwriter as well and a novelist, and he certainly understands Bond. I think he'd do a great job.

[00Twelve]

I think I'm one of those sticks in the mud that doesn't care to see any Higson material. Granted, I have never read it. And the henchman who loses a limb every time he battles Bond? Sounds like a mix of Get Smart and Monty Python.

As far as the rumor goes, I liked the above idea for 007 in NY as part of the PTS, but yeah, there's not much interesting material left in the other stories. I also think they're missing a good opportunity by not adapting FAVTAK. It was a great little short story. I'm still taking all this rumor material with a grain of salt or 7.

[K1Bond007]

Heck, I think they should hire Charlie to write the script (and not as a rewriter, start with Higson). He is a screenwriter as well and a novelist, and he certainly understands Bond. I think he'd do a great job.

Sure. That's totally plausible. Plus Higson could write the novelization*. Win+Win for both sides of the Bond family as it could potentially raise awareness of Higson which could in turn be used for future books and further sales of his already released novels.

I think I'm one of those sticks in the mud that doesn't care to see any Higson material. Granted, I have never read it. And the henchman Sounds like a mix of Get Smart and Monty Python.

And here I took the time to spoiler it. GG. In any case, I have to say you haven't read it so you really have no idea what you're talking about. Sorry if that comes off rather cross, but you have to admit , it's true. Read the material. They're not kiddie adventures. There's actual stuff they could definitely use that would be great for the screen. It's not specific to young audiences. Blood Fever had some good stuff especially the finale; the palace and Carnifex's sister or was it wife?. More so the last two books than the first.

[killkenny kid]

Any plot that would get Craig's Bond in New York. I want to see.

[stamper]

The auction element was used too prominently already in Octopussy.

You know, the Casino element from Casino Royale we pretty much used in about 50% of the Bond movies, and no one ever complained.

[RazorBlade]

I don't think Solange's storyline was all that close to Quantum of Solace. The difference between QoS and CR is that Philip Masters in QoS was a good person who was driven to cruelty by an unfaithful wife. Hardly the relationship of Solange and Dimitrio, since being a bad man was what attracted Solange to him in the first place.

I can see Masters' storyline being used as a backstory for a future villain. A good man who was driven to hate by a women who betrayed him. He would be a reflection of Bond, as the betrayal of a women made them the men they have become. One was driven to the side of good the other to the side of evil. The villain still has the capacity for good and Bond the capacity for evil. How two men can have similar experiences that sets them on two different paths that will collide at some point. That would make for a great movie right there.

It would have to depend on how she betrayed him, it can't be simple rejection since we've all been through that. But I've put forth similar ideas on other threads.

Mostly I want Bond 22 to be interesting. Anything the EON comes up with will be fine by me.

[Stax]

Somebody else has probably suggested this by now, too, but The Property of a Lady is interesting to ponder since the lady in question could refer to Vesper. What if her property was the Algerian love knot necklace? She did leave that behind. What if it -- like her cell phone -- is actually a clue or key of some kind for Bond in the next film? Maybe something is hidden in it? Just a thought.

Edited by Stax, 26 March 2007 - 10:42 PM.

[zencat]

I think I'm one of those sticks in the mud that doesn't care to see any Higson material. Granted, I have never read it. And the henchman who loses a limb every time he battles Bond? Sounds like a mix of Get Smart and Monty Python.

As opposed to a manservant who decapitates people by throwing his bowler hat? Or an evil Chinaman with hooks for hands who Bond buries under bird dung? Sounds pretty darn "Get Smart" or "Monty Python" to me. But in the hands of Fleming, it's pure Bond. Same with Higson.

[00Twelve]

I knew I'd catch hell for saying all that! I'll take your word for it, zen and K1. Maybe I'll read Higson one day.

[zencat]

I knew I'd catch hell for saying all that! I'll take your word for it, zen and K1. Maybe I'll read Higson one day.

Ah, yes...and then we will turn you to the ways of Roger. Repeat after me; "Moonraker is a great Bond film."

[killkenny kid]

Indeed zen, just check out my last post.

[K1Bond007]

I knew I'd catch hell for saying all that! I'll take your word for it, zen and K1. Maybe I'll read Higson one day.

Ah, yes...and then we will turn you to the ways of Roger. Repeat after me; "Moonraker is a great Bond film."

Whose "we"? I'm out Zen. I have limits you know?!

[Lionheart]

I don't think Solange's storyline was all that close to Quantum of Solace. The difference between QoS and CR is that Philip Masters in QoS was a good person who was driven to cruelty by an unfaithful wife. Hardly the relationship of Solange and Dimitrio, since being a bad man was what attracted Solange to him in the first place.

I can see Masters' storyline being used as a backstory for a future villain. A good man who was driven to hate by a women who betrayed him. He would be a reflection of Bond, as the betrayal of a women made them the men they have become. One was driven to the side of good the other to the side of evil. The villain still has the capacity for good and Bond the capacity for evil. How two men can have similar experiences that sets them on two different paths that will collide at some point. That would make for a great movie right there.

It would have to depend on how she betrayed him, it can't be simple rejection since we've all been through that. But I've put forth similar ideas on other threads.

Mostly I want Bond 22 to be interesting. Anything the EON comes up with will be fine by me.

Well, let Masters be Vespers Algerian boyfriend and the title for Bond 22, Quantum Of Solace, works both on Bond and the boyfriend. What amount of comfort - quantum of solace - does Bond 's hunt of the organisation behind Mr White and avenging of Vesper fulfill? What amount of comfort serves Vespers boyfriend by avenging her death and betrayal?

[bill007]

.....I can see Masters' storyline being used as a backstory for a future villain. A good man who was driven to hate by a women who betrayed him. He would be a reflection of Bond, as the betrayal of a women made them the men they have become. One was driven to the side of good the other to the side of evil. The villain still has the capacity for good and Bond the capacity for evil. How two men can have similar experiences that sets them on two different paths that will collide at some point. That would make for a great movie right there.

It would have to depend on how she betrayed him, it can't be simple rejection since we've all been through that. But I've put forth similar ideas on other threads.

Mostly I want Bond 22 to be interesting. Anything the EON comes up with will be fine by me.

Well, let Masters be Vespers Algerian boyfriend and the title for Bond 22, Quantum Of Solace, works both on Bond and the boyfriend. What amount of comfort - quantum of solace - does Bond 's hunt of the organisation behind Mr White and avenging of Vesper fulfill? What amount of comfort serves Vespers boyfriend by avenging her death and betrayal?

I like where you guys are taking this. Good stuff, indeed.

[Lounge Lizard]

I don't think Solange's storyline was all that close to Quantum of Solace. The difference between QoS and CR is that Philip Masters in QoS was a good person who was driven to cruelty by an unfaithful wife. Hardly the relationship of Solange and Dimitrio, since being a bad man was what attracted Solange to him in the first place.

I can see Masters' storyline being used as a backstory for a future villain. A good man who was driven to hate by a women who betrayed him. He would be a reflection of Bond, as the betrayal of a women made them the men they have become. One was driven to the side of good the other to the side of evil. The villain still has the capacity for good and Bond the capacity for evil. How two men can have similar experiences that sets them on two different paths that will collide at some point. That would make for a great movie right there.

It would have to depend on how she betrayed him, it can't be simple rejection since we've all been through that. But I've put forth similar ideas on other threads.

Mostly I want Bond 22 to be interesting. Anything the EON comes up with will be fine by me.

Well, let Masters be Vespers Algerian boyfriend and the title for Bond 22, Quantum Of Solace, works both on Bond and the boyfriend. What amount of comfort - quantum of solace - does Bond 's hunt of the organisation behind Mr White and avenging of Vesper fulfill? What amount of comfort serves Vespers boyfriend by avenging her death and betrayal?

Clever thinking, folks. An approach like that would certainly deepen a 'revenge-driven' plot, which can easily become clich

[spynovelfan]

Well, let Masters be Vespers Algerian boyfriend and the title for Bond 22, Quantum Of Solace, works both on Bond and the boyfriend. What amount of comfort - quantum of solace - does Bond 's hunt of the organisation behind Mr White and avenging of Vesper fulfill? What amount of comfort serves Vespers boyfriend by avenging her death and betrayal?

Oh, very nice! I'll third (fourth? fifth?) the idea of adapting Quantum of Solace, and quickly repear a post of mine from last month on the subject:

If I were using the title, I'd model the villain on Masters, and reveal at some point in the film that his wife is effectively imprisoned by him as punishment for earlier infidelity, and that she can't afford to get out. Bond, of course, rescues her. A bit like LTK, perhaps, but then a lot of the Bond films have similarities, and if you called him Masters and her Rhoda and made her a former air stewardess, and used the title... If they can make CASINO ROYALE work, they could make this work, surely. QUANTUM OF SOLACE sounds very classy, mysterious and Bond to me.

But I like the idea of making Vesper the Rhoda character.

Also agree that seeing Craig's Bond in New York could be terrific. Perhaps they could bring in some shooting in Rockefeller Centre?

[JLaidlaw]

I don't know the truth of it, but Quantum of Solace and Octopussy always struck me as stand-alone stories to which Fleming added his famous character for marketing purposes. Octopussy remained adaptable in some form, but the only bit of Quantum of Solace adaptable has already been done; The bit where Bond essentially says he might just retire and marry 'a Japanese' is used as dialogue in You Only Live Twice.

Actually it'd be interesting to see what sort of film treatments we could come up with based on the unadapted Fleming elements... New Thread perhaps?

[spynovelfan]

I don't know the truth of it, but Quantum of Solace and Octopussy always struck me as stand-alone stories to which Fleming added his famous character for marketing purposes. Octopussy remained adaptable in some form, but the only bit of Quantum of Solace adaptable has already been done; The bit where Bond essentially says he might just retire and marry 'a Japanese' is used as dialogue in You Only Live Twice.

Actually it'd be interesting to see what sort of film treatments we could come up with based on the unadapted Fleming elements... New Thread perhaps?

I think there already is a thread like that. I agree that those two short stories seem to be short stories with Bond attached, but this seems less true of Octopussy: Bond doesn't do much, but he is integral to the plot. I don't agree that the only elements of QoS have been done - I think Gobi-1, Razorblade and Lionheart have just shown how, with a little lateral thinking, the central relationship could be used to fit into a sequel to CASINO ROYALE rather well. I think some of Fleming's very best writing is in his short stories, and the central themes of guilt, duty, age, justice v revenge and so on that haunt Octopussy in particular could provide great material to drive a script.

[David Schofield]

I'm not sure whether this idea of making Vesper's boyfriend isn't being a little too clever.

Are we to assume that Vesper made him the man he has become, as Rhodda did with Masters in the short story? That is, that Vesper really was an avaricious manipulative bitch. There is no eveidence in her portrayal in the film of CR to indicate those tendancies.

Similarly, Philip Masters in Fleming's QOS is in no way a criminal, not has he criminal tendencies. Are we to conclude that after Rhodda treatment of him, he became one? I think this is altering Fleming's intenttion a little too much (though the treatment of Mathis' character may have set a trend).

Or are we simply going to use the clever implication in the title of QOS that would indicate Bond getting some kind of revenge/satisfcation (lack of?) for Vesper? In which case, the Fleming short story is totally ignored.

[spynovelfan]

I'm not sure whether this idea of making Vesper's boyfriend isn't being a little too clever.

Are we to assume that Vesper made him the man he has become, as Rhodda did with Masters in the short story? That is, that Vesper really was an avaricious manipulative bitch. There is no eveidence in her portrayal in the film of CR to indicate those tendancies.

Similarly, Philip Masters in Fleming's QOS is in no way a criminal, not has he criminal tendencies. Are we to conclude that after Rhodda treatment of him, he became one? I think this is altering Fleming's intenttion a little too much (though the treatment of Mathis' character may have set a trend).

Or are we simply going to use the clever implication in the title of QOS that would indicate Bond getting some kind of revenge/satisfcation (lack of?) for Vesper? In which case, the Fleming short story is totally ignored.

Fair points - but I'll leave them to the scriptwriters! I do enjoy reading ideas thought up by fans and thinking them up myself, but I'm not sure there's much point in going too far with them. After all, then they probably won't be used.

On the other hand, if someone wanted to pay me a lot of money to write a Bond film based on Quantum of Solace, I'd be happy to give it a go.

[00Twelve]

Yes, this is indeed clever thinking on the QOS material, so word to you all for that. Still, I keep having this nagging feeling that it would change Bond to put him as well as V's bf in the place of Masters. Bond originally had nothing to do with that situation, and it seems, to me (so take this with a grain of salt ), to be way out of his MO to get wrapped up in the drama, rather than be all the more cold for it, even if it's an intriguing idea to explore more psyche.

[stamper]

Er, isn't Vesper's boyfriend character dead ?

[Jim]

Er, isn't Vesper's boyfriend character dead ?

In the book, I think so; not sure about the film, although I seem to remember some reference at the end of the film when M does her now traditional "Oh, we didn't bother checking her out properly" routine. Rebooted, but still a frickin' idiot.

[00Twelve]

MI6 and CTU are both getting quite old in this capacity.

[VisualStatic]

Er, isn't Vesper's boyfriend character dead ?

In the book, I think so; not sure about the film, although I seem to remember some reference at the end of the film when M does her now traditional "Oh, we didn't bother checking her out properly" routine. Rebooted, but still a frickin' idiot.

In the book, he was a prisoner to the Russians. Vesper assumes that he is, which is part of why she commits suicide, along with falling in love with James.

[RazorBlade]

[quote spynovel fan
On the other hand, if someone wanted to pay me a lot of money to write a Bond film based on Quantum of Solace, I'd be happy to give it a go.
[/quote]

You and me both, my friend. And I'm sure there are tons of others on this board who would fight us for the chance as well. hmmm. Gives me an idea.

[Santa]

if someone wanted to pay me a lot of money

That about covers it for me

[Loomis]

Er, isn't Vesper's boyfriend character dead ?

In the book, I think so; not sure about the film, although I seem to remember some reference at the end of the film when M does her now traditional "Oh, we didn't bother checking her out properly" routine. Rebooted, but still a frickin' idiot.

As well as micro-managing, ill-tempered, lazy and incompetent, with a hefty side order of self-righteousness.

[Jim]

Er, isn't Vesper's boyfriend character dead ?

In the book, I think so; not sure about the film, although I seem to remember some reference at the end of the film when M does her now traditional "Oh, we didn't bother checking her out properly" routine. Rebooted, but still a frickin' idiot.

As well as micro-managing, ill-tempered, lazy and incompetent, with a hefty side order of self-righteousness.

One would have thought that she would have reflected on the lessons of the Miranda Frost affair.

No - wait - that hasn't happened yet, has it? Or has it? Is this the same person?

Ow, brain hurts.