53 replies to this topic

[Fiona Volpe lover]

I slighly prefer DAF,and I actually think Connery is really good hear,it's almost a throwback to the Connery/ Bond of Dr No. But he disposes of Blofeld awfully quickly!

[DaveBond21]

The only reason FYEO even has the reference to Tracy and to Blofeld is it was written to keep continuity in thinking it would be a new actor as Bond as Moore was holding out.

I dont think that is the only reason. My theory is that John Glen liked OHMSS and hence the many references to that film; Tracy, Blofeld, "Goodbye Countess" on a beach similar to OHMSS PTS, Draco-Columbo, Piz Gloria - St. Cyril, a long ski-sequence etc.

That could play into it, but I am sure the main reason is for continuity's sake. I recall Moore not even being signed until nearly the last minute.

It was also the first proper attempt to acknowledge what a good movie OHMSS was. It wasn't too popular in 1969 but as the 1970s wore on, and the movie proved popular when shown on TV, it was no longer the embarrassment it had been for the Bond team. They decided to reference Tracy for the first time in TSWLM, and then went one step further and actually show Bond paying his respects not only to his dead wife, but it was also a symbolic tribute to the movie OHMSS.

[Craig Lazenby]

I liked how DAF was more quick, showing Bond's anger, while FYEO was a little too campy but shows a better connection to OHMSS and Tracy. Therfore, I'd give it to FYEO.

[sharpshooter]

I liked the FYEO PTS better. The build up to the scene with Bond paying his respects to Tracy, and I always loved the concept of Bond hanging on for dear life on a helicopter. When he does regain control, it is good fun.

[Mr. Blofeld]

FYEO; it's miles better than DAF's goofy as hell PTS.

[00Twelve]

It's a very good question. Both featured a Bond who was RANDOMLY flippant about encountering his wife's murderer, and a Blofeld who was randomly unmanly.

But of the two, I appreciated FYEO's acknowledgement of OHMSS and the events that occurred therein (and um, remembered that EON's Blofeld is BALD). Plus, I actually liked the helicopter stuntwork quite a bit.

The only part that grates on me about the FYEO PTS is how "cute" Bond is with Blofeld. I know, it's Moore, and that's just Moore. It's not a big complaint, really. FYEO for me.

Points to DAF for Bond's encounter with Marie. Quintessential Connery.

[DaveBond21]

and um, remembered that EON's Blofeld is BALD

Actually, I should stick up for DAF here.

I think we do see how DAF's Blofeld was transformed from a bald-headed baddie to Charles Gray, with the series of face changes shown on dummy heads briefly during the PTS.

[Scaramanga'74]

My vote goes to DAF. Comical? Definitely. But equally ruthless as well as 007 dispatches his arch-nemesis to Kingdom Come with a characteristic Bond quip "Welcome to hell, Blofeld". One can sense Bond deriving immense pleasure in the vengeance he had brought upon SPECTRE's CEO. Such sentiment is noticeably missing in the 12th film in the EON produced series.

[tdalton]

I don't think that either is effective at all in avenging Tracy. Both are amongst the worst pre-title sequences in the franchise, so I can't really pick one over the other because they both fail on so many levels. FYEO is, though, attached to a much better film, but both sequences aren't very good.

[Harmsway]

DIAMONDS ARE FOREVER's wins out, just because we get the rather fun "Bond beats up people" montage. And the brutality of ConneryBond strangling a girl with her own bikini top ranks among the harshest moments in the franchise.

[DaveBond21]

And the brutality of ConneryBond strangling a girl with her own bikini top ranks among the harshest moments in the franchise.

I always find that one of the more titilating scenes of the Bond franchise....

[Scaramanga'74]

And the brutality of ConneryBond strangling a girl with her own bikini top ranks among the harshest moments in the franchise.

I always find that one of the more titilating scenes of the Bond franchise....

'Titilating'? Yes, it does. But it still doesn't come close to Bond's fake third nipple in TMWTGG.

[Double-Oh Agent]

DIAMONDS ARE FOREVER's wins out, just because we get the rather fun "Bond beats up people" montage. And the brutality of ConneryBond strangling a girl with her own bikini top ranks among the harshest moments in the franchise.

I like both of them despite their faults, but if I have to choose one I would go for Diamonds Are Forever and Harmsway's explanation is the reason why. Bond is on a mission to get revenge for his wife's death. Yes, it's not mentioned that he is, but it is clearly implied. What's the real problem with DAF is that Bond doesn't get pissed off again when he learns that Blofeld has tricked him and is still alive in the Whyte House. Bond should have gotten vengeful and changed to a single-minded mission mindset at that point. By the way, I've never bought into the DAF PTS as taking up where You Only Live Twice left off just because it starts in Japan scenario. Bond is in Japan because he's tracking down Blofeld and one of Blofeld's previously known locations was Japan, plain and simple.

As for FYEO, Blofeld's delicatessen line is absolutely horrible--the worst line in the series and Moore's lightheartedness at getting rid of Blofeld is disappointing. There should have been more menace or at least relief and satisfaction out of finally destroying his enemy, alas there wasn't. But up until Moore picks up Blofeld on his helicopter ski, For Your Eyes Only is absolutely terrific.

[hilly]

The whole set-up of the DAF pre-titles seems to be based around the concept of " Hurrah!Connery's Back!". The unseen but unmistakeable voice, campy music and the cartoon-ish sound and visual images (The guy in the casino in sunglasses and fez is my favourite). To be honest, I think they could have shown Connery washing his socks and, with the right effects made it into a PTS. The whole idea of Blofeld's double being dispatched and dispensed with, is almost saying "ok, we're through with the fake,now back to the genuine article (in hindsight, a bit unjust, but probably Saltzman and Broccoli's sentiments at the time). I find DAF's pre-titles ok, but a little smug (and the fight with Blofeld and the guards is stilted and a bit clunky too)

FYEO has more spectacular stunt work but equally cartoonish images and dialogue (the vicar making the sign of the cross at Moore, most of Blofeld's lines). I prefer this one though, as Roger plays it almost straight and I love the luck of relief on his face when he finally gets control of the helicopter (though points knocked off for the rag doll that he chucks out mid-air!)

[DaveBond21]

What's the real problem with DAF is that Bond doesn't get pissed off again when he learns that Blofeld has tricked him and is still alive in the Whyte House

That's because this movie doesn't refer to Tracy's death at all.

[dogmanstar]

That's because this movie doesn't refer to Tracy's death at all.

And that Bond lets Blofeld get away! What happened to the 'Welcome to hell' seriousness of the beginning? The whole PTS in DAF falls apart right about batho-sub time. I mean, episodes of the A-Team or Bionic Woman should end like DAF, not a Bond movie.

My vote: FYEO.

[blackjack60]

DAF pre-titles are great up until the mud bath scene, then it all nose dives....the stupid mud bath bit with a rubbish blofeld and guards in boiler suits who cant fight....and the moose trap of course.

I heartily disagree. How is Grey's wonderfully supercilious, cold Blofeld worse than the cringing coward of FYEO? Who cares if he was bald or not, at least he never made any wisecracks about stainless steel delis! DAF's mud-bath setting also adds a touch of (fecal) weirdness and funk to the story, and it's effectively used--we get the startling and horrific image of a man being buried alive in mud, and then we get Blofeld's spectacular (and painful) exit. Yes, the dubbing is bad, but the action itself is appropriately brutal: Bond clocks Blofeld with an operating lamp, straps him into a gurney, and then shoves him into a vat of boiling mud. What a nasty way to go! (And most likely inspired by Tingaling Bell's fate in the DAF novel). Plus the way Connery savors the line "Welcome to hell Blofeld!" indicates a man truly satisfied by gratifying his bloodlust, in contrast to Moore, who merely seems mildly amused by the idea of catching up to his wife's killer. True, FYEO teaser has a lovely opening, but after Bond steps into the helicopter it literally nosedives.

Edited by blackjack60, 08 March 2008 - 12:34 AM.

[tama_drummer91]

I have never fully understood the hatred for FYEO PTS. I love it, I have for years. I love the scene in the graveyard and the helicopter stuff. The DAF PTS is one of the worse in the series. It has some very weird acting, horrible audio synchronization, and a tubby Sean Connery. Not to mention the lack of a good fight between Bond and Blofeld. It just really sucks. FYEO is far superior.

[Turn]

DAF pre-titles are great up until the mud bath scene, then it all nose dives....the stupid mud bath bit with a rubbish blofeld and guards in boiler suits who cant fight....and the moose trap of course.

I heartily disagree. How is Grey's wonderfully supercilious, cold Blofeld worse than the cringing coward of FYEO? Who cares if he was bald or not, at least he never made any wisecracks about stainless steel delis! DAF's mud-bath setting also adds a touch of (fecal) weirdness and funk to the story, and it's effectively used--we get the startling and horrific image of a man being buried alive in mud, and then we get Blofeld's spectacular (and painful) exit. Yes, the dubbing is bad, but the action itself is appropriately brutal: Bond clocks Blofeld with an operating lamp, straps him into a gurney, and then shoves him into a vat of boiling mud. What a nasty way to go! (And most likely inspired by Tingaling Bell's fate in the DAF novel). Plus the way Connery savors the line "Welcome to hell Blofeld!" indicates a man truly satisfied by gratifying his bloodlust, in contrast to Moore, who merely seems mildly amused by the idea of catching up to his wife's killer. True, FYEO teaser has a lovely opening, but after Bond steps into the helicopter it literally nosedives.

I agree. So many fans talk about what a wonderful Fleminesque movie FYEO is, but they still throw in these silly scenes which distract from the fact that this is Bond's revenge on Blofeld after having shown Tracy's grave just minutes previous. At least Connery's Bond has the smirking satisfaction that he's killed Blofeld (at least he thinks) in that scene.

[Spikey]

I thought Moore was lucky to get a chance to go the whole Tracy revenge thing, after TSWLM got Blofeld-less.

I think he handles the grave scene excellently, and I think Bond has a right to be callous- think the book "YOLT"- when Bond finally speaks, he says "Hello Blofeld you old bastard" laughingly. I don't consider Moore smirking to detract from the seriousness, I think it just shows he has the upper hand.

The real "bastard" is Kevin McClory, who prevented FYEO from having anyone but a "Bald Villain" in the opener. Although don't get me wrong, Broccoli and Saltzman are at fault for DAF as well (what a -up it was with regards to Blofeld).


I definitely think FYEO wins, because he actually dispatches Blofeld, and because in the context of the film, FYEO is yards better.

But if I was only allowed to watch the openings and not the rest- I'd probably think FYEO was weird and DAF cool. Unfortunately the movies were longer than the openers- a syndrome Brosnan's years were famous for IMHO (amazingly good openings, terrible next 100-plus minutes, awful awful endings).

I guess I like FYEO's better since Blofeld's actually dispatched in a satisfying way. Of course, dialogue/etc would have helped, but serious Moore beats old, half-assed Connery any day for my money. After YOLT Connery lost my vote. He's awful in that flick and seems out of place with the Blofeld stuff in DAF after OHMSS.

- Spike

[Conlazmoodalbrocra]

Definitely For Your Eyes Only. It's set-up perfectly, starting with Bond visiting Tracy's grave followed by a terrific tense moment where it looks as if Bond is going to be finished, but the way in which Blofeld is dispatched is definitely satisfying as was said before, and I think that it really gives you a feeling of sweet revenge, especially seeing as it's been a while since Blofeld featured in a Bond movie.

[HH007]

FYEO, for reasons which others have stated.

[Hitmonk]

'Welcome to hell Blofeld"

vs

'Now, Now, Keep your hair one'

Now, admittedly playing Devils advocate here, in terms of ruthlessly dispatching ESB, are either really any worse than:

'Oh, He's branched off"

It's always stuck me as being odd that Bond is spends most of the film in single minded pursuit of Blofeld, only to laugh him off right at the very end.

[Conlazmoodalbrocra]

'Welcome to hell Blofeld"

vs

'Now, Now, Keep your hair one'

Now, admittedly playing Devils advocate here, in terms of ruthlessly dispatching ESB, are either really any worse than:

'Oh, He's branched off"

It's always stuck me as being odd that Bond is spends most of the film in single minded pursuit of Blofeld, only to laugh him off right at the very end.

Vey good point Hitmonk! Never looked at it that way, but you've raised a good point in that if the person you loved more than anyone else had just been killed, would you really make such juvenile quips after the process of killing him? I find it unlikely, but then again, I've never had either a wife killed, r killed my worst enemy (even though I'd enjoy killing my worst enemy - JOKE!!!)