84 replies to this topic

[Judo chop]

Roger Moore sleeping with Grace Jones.

If ever there was a good reason for not pushing the erotic envelope...

[AlwaysanAston]

I agree with most of the earlier posts, however, I did not see anyone mention the absolutely ridiculous sequence of Stacy leaving the mine. White dress with heels? She climbed out of a mine shaft that's been flooded with thousands of gallons of water. She emerges from the mine looking like she just left the salon. Still wearing heels! The capper for this truly poor sequence is to see Zorin snatch her off the ground in the blimp. I mean really?

I can't see how the producers or any intelligent person could have sat through the first screening and not immediately thought this was ridiculous. Unless the intention was to "spoof" the genre. Sad but somebody explain to me the thought process on that movie.

[Scottlee]

Well, Stacey leaving the mine in heels isn't so improbable. As for the blimp picking her up, why couldn't it have done that?

[Number 6]

It's a rehash and a poorly made Goldfinger rehash to boot.

It didn't help that you could hear Moore's bones creaking during his action scenes, either...

[Marc-Ange]

It is not my favorite film, but I don't hate it either. I don't really under stand why people hate the whole California Girls thing. It was done in Moore movies before, this introduction of campy popular things. TSWLM had the aforementioned Lawrence of Arabia music when Bond was on a camel. Then in Moonraker, they played the theme to the Magnificent Seven when he was riding to the MI6 base in Brazil. Still more...in For Your Eyes Only, I am pretty sure they are playing the Ice Castles music when Bibi is skating (how hard of a stretch is that for her!?) They even play the 007 theme in Octopussy when Bond first comes to India and meets Vijay (Armitraj.)

That said here are some reasons:

1. Tanya Roberts (HOT, but shrieks too much)

2. The movie kinda just plods along, no real direction. It seems like a whole bunch of mini ideas just jammed together

3. It looks cheap (This cheap approach Hurt Dalton later on. When will ION get their act together?)

4. The whole Eiffel Tower chase scene is exhausting.

5. Too many alter egos (John Sinjohn-Smythe? James Stock?)

6. The whole horse stable - steroids - genetic thing (see point 2)

7. He is not James Bond 007. He is 0077!

Now, I realize that some of this is nitpicking. However, you wanted 007 reasons! Still it is a fun movie and it has my girlfriend's favorite theme song!

Edited by Marc-Ange, 08 January 2006 - 05:11 PM.

[Diabolik]

001. Roger's just too old. He has a difficult time just stepping up on the bomb and then moments later (his stuntman) has amazing agility.

002. Tanya Roberts can't act! Sure she's beautiful, but what a hack (and that screech,, I mean scream!)

003. That silly robot dog! Especailly in the final scene. It just makes me cringe everytime I see it.

004. Credit sequence. The day-glo girls with plastic pistols is SO anemic. Sure, it's a challenge to come up with fresh ideas for the credit sequence, but Maurice, Pleassseee!

005. The blimp sequence. The idea that Bond is hanging from a rope for A LONG TIME without getting tired or climbing up it. Add to that the blimp is so small. We all see the Goodyear blimp at sports events. It's massive. It's what we've come to expect.

006. The meeting of Zorin's "investors" in the blimp. I don't mind similarities in different Bond films, but when you just rehash the TB Spectre scene so blantantly (And why can't they use a dummy who's legs don't bend back the wrong way? You're spending a jillion dollars on a film, a few extra hundred for a good dummy doesn't seem unreasonable).

007. "California Girls" PLEASSSEEEE! First they try to build a "serious" mood to the scene, then out of left field, the Beach Boys, and then back to "serious" mood. Just didn't work.

[Diabolik]

006. I mean the GF "thug" meeting, not TB.

[Number 6]

001.  Roger's just too old.  He has a difficult time just stepping up on the bomb and then moments later (his stuntman) has amazing agility.

Lol! It was rather pathetic...

[RJJB]

1. Roger Moore sucks at any age.

2. Tanya Roberts strengthens the argument that American actresses should not be
Bond Girls.

3. Another ridiculous "Superman" stunt when Moore grabs onto the blimp rope when
Zorin is making his getaway.

4. The fire sequence in the SF city hall is very badly done. Not very thrilling
seeing Moore/his stunt double carrying Tanya Roberts over his shoulder.

5. The entire Pola Ivanova sequence has no purpose in the movie. It adds
nothing.

6. The lame scene of MayDay pushing the Rolls with Moore and Patrick Macnee
into the lake.

7. The demolition of the car Moore is riding in during the Eiffel Tower
sequence. The James Bond theme plays in the background and is reduced to
supporting this so called humorous scene.

I could go on, but you only wanted seven examples.

[Tinfinger]

Watching this now on AMC

[rashid12]

you mean Roger kicks at any age. atleast he can do some moves without a toupee falling off, which is more i can say of sean connery.


[quote name='RJJB' date='9 January 2006 - 04:29']1. Roger Moore sucks at any age.

2. Tanya Roberts strengthens the argument that American actresses should not be

Edited by rashid12, 09 January 2006 - 05:09 PM.

[rashid12]

no offense but bond films aren't meant to be logical or based on reality; they are a form of escapism. the only reason why anyone doesn't like this great film is simple: roger moore is in it. you wouldn't say this if some other actor had starred in it. personally roger did a great job, and was serious in some scenes. he has that command and he appears like he cares that the world is saved , unlike connery who never seemed to care.
[quote name='rashid12' date='9 January 2006 - 17:08']
you mean Roger kicks at any age. atleast he can do some moves without a toupee falling off, which is more i can say of sean connery.


3. Another ridiculous "Superman" stunt when Moore grabs onto the blimp rope when

Edited by rashid12, 09 January 2006 - 05:19 PM.

[RJJB]

Sorry, but the topic is why people don't like AVTAK.
Reducing it to another Moore vs. Connery rant is a waste of time.

[james st.john smythe]

on the whole i like it, apart from rogers stunt double should of got equal billing. u can tell its just some bloke in a wig, yheres no attemp to hide the fact either

[rashid12]

and i was just saying why i like a view to a kill just not to let things be so one sided; it would be so boring that way, and its funny that everyone talks about stuntmen for roger when there was an obvious stuntmen for a certain actor in a bond film who i won't mention in case i am accused of reducing it in to a connery vs moore section.

Sorry, but the topic is why people don't like AVTAK.
Reducing it to another Moore vs. Connery rant is a waste of time.

Edited by rashid12, 09 January 2006 - 06:02 PM.

[Turn]

I don't really under stand why people hate the whole California Girls thing.  It was done in Moore movies before, this introduction of campy popular things.  TSWLM had the aforementioned Lawrence of Arabia music when Bond was on a camel.  Then in Moonraker, they played the theme to the Magnificent Seven when he was riding to the MI6 base in Brazil.  Still more...in For Your Eyes Only, I am pretty sure they are playing the Ice Castles music when Bibi is skating (how hard of a stretch is that for her!?)   They even play the 007 theme in Octopussy when Bond first comes to India and meets Vijay (Armitraj.)

The reason many people don't like the California Girls inclusion is it's inappropriately placed during an action piece where things were pretty tense for Bond and we should be focusing on the action and not the sillieness of it. When I saw AVTAK in the theater for the first time, I thought the California Girls song was from the soundtrack of the other film being played in the multiplex; it couldn't be from a Bond film, could it?

Not that Bond action during the Moore era was necessarily serious, but you've got bullets whizzing over his head prior to and after the snowboarding incident, so it's tough to maintain that balance when they pull it in two ways. The humor works better when it comes at the end of an action sequence or with a quip maybe tossed in.

The other examples you use weren't in action sequences, so they don't really count in that way. Besides, the Ice Castles thing is a little nod to Lynn Holly Johnson being the star of that film.

If some people like California Girls in the precredits of AVTAK, fine for them, but I think it shows what's wrong with the film -- it's totally out of balance and all over the place. We go from action to lighthearted, from escaping fires to watching drunks spill wine, from the realism of Howe's death to rides on top of fire engines knocking cowboy hats off guys riding in convertibles to showing minors being gunned down in cold blood. Does it want to be OHMSS or Moonraker? It's a patchwork of both with the patches being scraps.

[Scottlee]

Turn, the reason I like the California Girls thing is because of the way it made me feel as a kid. I saw AVTAK in the late eighties on VHS when I was 8 or 9 years old. And for months after I would idly ride my skateboard in front of the house pretending I was Roger Moore's Bond - ducking and weaving away from faceless baddies with the Beach Boys playing in the background. I get a tingle in my body whenever I see that sequence.

[Turn]

Turn, the reason I like the California Girls thing is because of the way it made me feel as a kid. I saw AVTAK in the late eighties on VHS when I was 8 or 9 years old. And for months after I would idly ride my skateboard in front of the house pretending I was Roger Moore's Bond - ducking and weaving away from faceless baddies with the Beach Boys playing in the background. I get a tingle in my body whenever I see that sequence.

Scottlee, that's cool and I respect that. I know you and DLibrasnow and a few others like AVTAK a lot and it makes me kind of want to give it another chance when I read the enthusiasm you have for it and I hope my rants don't diminish that for you.

It's just that I was really disappointed by the film and it just doesn't get any better in comparison to some of the others. I was really looking forward to AVTAK (like all Bond films at the time). It came out one week before I graduated from high school. I took my girlfriend at the time and I just came out underwhelmed. Bond, Walken, summertime -- it should have had it all, but just didn't do it for me.

That didn't stop me from going to see it two more times that summer, hoping each time it would get better. But even my friends who went with me were underwhelmed too. That was the year Rambo came out and that was the new wave of action flick. Although I didn't necesarily agree, AVTAK seemed quaint and tired compared to that as that's all anybody talked about at that time.

[ChickenStu]

I can only think of one reason.

IT'S BLOODY BORING.

[Tinfinger]

Watching this one and then putting on The Living Daylights, you have to give the producers points for getting their act together. For starters, with TLD, you have an actor playing Bond you can believe in again. You have credibility. AVTAK just doesn't have a shred of credibility to it.

[Darksideoftheschwartz]

Watching this one and then putting on The Living Daylights, you have to give the producers points for getting their act together.  For starters, with TLD, you have an actor playing Bond you can believe in again.  You have credibility.  AVTAK just doesn't have a shred of credibility to it.

sence when did we offically decide that Bond movies have to have any credibility to be good *cough* Moonraker *cough*

[alneri007]

Walken should have called for more cowbell and dance to the song "Let's face the music and Dance" or at least play the role of "The Continental," as James Bond competitor. (Or even have psychic capibilities like Ed Glosser, Trivail Psychic).

Plus Midge Pinciotti should have never been there. How could they even make her into some geological scientist? She in Kelso/Coach/Woody/Wiggum territory here.

[Flash1087]

Walken should have called for more cowbell and dance to the song "Let's face the music and Dance" or at least play the role of "The Continental," as James Bond competitor.  (Or even have psychic capibilities like Ed Glosser, Trivail Psychic).

  Plus Midge Pinciotti should have never been there.  How could they even make her into some geological scientist?  She in Kelso/Coach/Woody/Wiggum territory here.

...Midge? That's seriously MIDGE?

[dunmall]

yes she was also one of the last angles before the series finished....
hey that reminds me they had an episode of that 70s show where she was joined by a couple of other bond girls ( i think it was barbara carrera, lois chiles and maud adams, but i'm not sure)

[stamper]

All these post makes me wonder if I shouldn't start a reedit of the movie, ala Matrix Dezionised... I'm sure I can make this 007 outing more focused, efficient, taking out the stuntmen, the shrieks, the Beach Boys, and concentrating on what makes Bond work. Did you guys think about that ?