37 replies to this topic

[JimmyBond]

TWINE is easily my favoirite of the Brosnan Bonds, and has very few flaws. The only problem I have is(like Brosnans other two) the last half feels very rushed.

After Bond is assumed dead, Bond and Christmas meet up with Zuckovfsky(sp?) and of course, the helicopter action sequence. I think this action sequence detracts greatly from the film and goes on too long. At best, they could have had an assassain attempt to kill Valentine and had Bond stop him(a really great Bondian fist fight is lacking from TWINE).

Without long sequence, we could have gotten more character interaction between Bond and Valentine. Perhaps some more shots of Turkey before Bond is in the Ex KGB HG.

Thoughts? Opinions? Love to hear em.

[James Page]

I kinda have to agree with you on this one, although the scene did deliver some of the best moments for me:

Zukovsky smirking when Bond's BMW is sawn in half

"Q's not going to like this" - just a shame that line was drowned out by the SFX

Bond shooting one guy through the floor, then popping up a hatch and knocking another over

"The insurance company is never going to believe this!"

But then, Zukovsky did have nearly all of the good lines in TWINE. One reason I'm glad they cut the scene of Bond checking his pulse and finding he was dead before chasing Elektra up Maiden's Tower. Bring him back!!! :-D

[Digitarius]

Well, that scene does have its flaws, as if it were made there just to make more action.

But you have to admit it was a fantastic set piece, and we should just leave it as that. I just wished the BMW Z8 wasn't sawed into half. It was a great car.

[Adam]

You gotta love the ski scene in TWINE b/c it happens for NO REASON. Elektra easily could've shown him a picture of the pipeline--he should've suspected her of treachery the minute she suggested they ski like 200 miles across the slopes of Eastern Europe to see the connection of a pipe...but atleast the chase is well choreographed and the music's good...I'm lamely listening to it right now. (Ice Bandits)

[Mister Asterix]

I agree, Jimmy. The World Is Not Enough was, in my opinion the best Bond film since at least On Her Majesty's Secret Service. But I also had a couple of problems with the film. My biggest problem was the editing of the action sequences was just horrible. The action just wasn't tight and the climax on the sub was a bit confusing because of the editing.

The best example of the editing diminishing the action was when Bond took the Q-boat underwater to go under the low bridge. Now we all know from the reporting from the Thames that the Q-boat actually went under the water and that Pierce himself submerged the Q-boat. But when the sequence hit the screen it appeared that the whole thing was a camera trick when we know that the Q-boat could really do this stunt.

I would love to have seen what Peter Hunt would have done with this film. It may have been the best Bond ever.

[walther]

I also agree that the ski chase and the warehouse action scenes are just there as filler. There was one part of the ski chase I thought was funny. It's where the parahawk goes over the cliff and Bond says "See ya back at the lodge." and when it's parachute opens, he drops the smile. To me Pierce just looks pissed there. Just thinking about that part makes me chuckle. As a matter of fact, I'm going to watch TWINE now...

[JimmyBond]

So it appears that we all feel the same way. The Ski chase and the helicopter attack are just kinda there.

However, the stealing of the bomb is a great piece of action and really moves teh plot forward. If Bond never saw them take the locator card from the warhead, he never would have grabbed it, given it to M. She never would have activated, and Bond wouldnt know where the plutonium was. Aside from the teaser, this is the only relevant action scene.

[Jim]

I agree with the above. The action sequences, save for the opening boaty bit, seem to be there because it's time for an action sequence and the audience might be getting bored. They don't really make much sense as far as the plot goes, although I guess one could justify the final submarine bit as plot-related, or wet T-shirt competition related. Stolen nuclear material...again...

But the ski chase just...happens, and the warehouse thing just...happens. It's like inexplicable cues for songs in bad musicals. It's time for a song. It's time to blow things up a bit. This is rather patronising to the audience. I'm not terribly sure what either of these scenes adds to the plot and, given that the ski chase is ever so slightly boring, there's a possibility that they detract from it.

Good point that the script doesn't seem to know why the helicopters attacked the warehouse either...

It's by no means a bad film, but it's depressingly easy to pick holes in it. That's quite a hard thing to do with the earlier Bond films. Perhaps we revere them too much, and they're far from perfect, and perhaps they did have the benefit of at least a skeleton from the Fleming novels, but TWINE has the air of being throwaway entertainment; fine, so long as you don't think about it.

[LeiterCIA]

I agree with all the thoughts on TWINE. Definitely a fine movie, but certainly flawed in many places.

First off, ALL of the action scenes seem like they are sprinkled throughout the film, and dont gel with the rest of the movie. The ski scene being a great example.

I dont know if the second half is rushed or not. But it DOES feel like as soon as the bomb goes off in the tunnel "killing" Bond, and Electra reveals her true colors - the plot comes to a grinding halt.

The helicopter scene is great, but a little claustrophobic, and seems awkwardly placed also; even the characters arent sure why its there. We get a phone call to Electra, "Bond is alive." But then Bond tells Zukovski, "Those blades were meant for you."

And frankly, as much as I LIKE the character of Zukovski, he seems SO out of place in this movie. (But thats another post.)

I agree with the comments on the editing. It kind of killed a great stunt in the boat, and made the ending TOTALLY confusing.

And yeah, can we see one good car actually make it till the end of a movie?? The lotus made it through more than one movie, and the DB5 is STILL running to this day.

But this movie did make me feel like they were headed in the right direction.

[JimmyBond]

No no no no no!

What the heck was I thinking saying TWINE is the best Bond film in some time

I know what it was...I was off my meds!

[sharpshooter]

That's alright, Jimmy. Opinions change over time.

[The Shark]

Can't stand the film personally, and one mere scene doesn't provide the guilty evidence. Nearly every scene does.

Everything from M's motherly psychobabble, to Brosnan being hilariously upstaged by Carlyle, and of course the infamous "Stockholm" syndrome.

It really is a comedy of errors. An unintentional farce.

TWINE is the anti-thesis to Fleming's Bond, with a dull, ham-fisted, and inconsistent performance from Brosnan. The direction was mediocre, action sequences dull and directive, god-awful score, same old Purvis & Wade psychobabble BS with M, a weak villain, ultimately trying to have it's cake and it eat it too. By aiming to be a darker, more character driven thriller, with more complex pretensions (unclear villains, Stockholm Syndrome, more fallible Bond, imprisoned M - all with as much finesse as a 10 year old writing a creative writing piece for homework) while simultaneously being a 90s, explosion-filled blockbuster to keep ADD teenagers satisfied, and it ends up satisfying no-one.

At least the fantastical Moore films knew they were silly, and had a sense of lightness and tongue in cheek, not to forget a consistent and strong performance from Moore, good scripts, terrific Barry scores, awesome stunt-work, and a definitive sense of Englishness. TWINE tries to be a soap-opera drama, as well as a glossy, Americanised, PG rated, over-the-top action film.

In many cases it suffers from the same problems that CR does, but to a much larger extent, with none of the strong points.

[JimmyBond]

I was just going over my old threads to see how my thoughts and feelings were back then. Boy, it's hard to believe I've been visiting this site for about eight years.

Is interesting to see that I felt very highly of TWINE back then.

[Aris007]

Things change! That's fine!

[Gogol Pushkin]

I was just going over my old threads to see how my thoughts and feelings were back then. Boy, it's hard to believe I've been visiting this site for about eight years.

Is interesting to see that I felt very highly of TWINE back then.

I know what you mean mate. I was fifteen when TWINE came out and truth is I loved it back then. I thought it was quite simply the best slice of James Bond I had ever seen. But now I can see the issues with it. The PTS is superb, but it opens the film way too spectacularly that it really can't compete with itself, and then to add more issues to the mix, as a film it wants to have its cake and eat it. The script tries to have so called complex characters and plotting akin to a Fleming novel, yet on the other hand, the action sequences go on forever, the editing is way too frenetic, Denise Richards is a Nuclear Scientist (yes Denise, of course you are) and Pierce...poor, poor Pierce. I think he gets the rough end of the stick here. On one hand he wants this to be his OHMSS, and he tries to deliver that, yet more often that not, the scripts and Eon productions it seems, want him to be Roger Moore.

Edited by Gogol Pushkin, 08 July 2010 - 06:31 PM.

[DaveBond21]

"The insurance company is never going to believe this!"

I remember this line getting a big laugh in the theater.

[JimmyBond]

"The insurance company is never going to believe this!"

I remember this line getting a big laugh in the theater.

I also recall Bond's shooting of Elektra getting the desired response it was supposed to: people were genuinely shocked that Bond would do that.

[Colossus]

Boris is pretty funny in here i agree.

[Stephen Spotswood]

For me Pierce Brosnan was the worst Bond, merely a wooden prop for explosions and stunts to surround.

I rank him lower than Moore, which is saying a lot.

[Mr. Blofeld]

Boris is pretty funny in here i agree.

Boris wasn't in TWINE; he was in GoldenEye, and froze to death at the end of that movie's climax.

[JimmyBond]

Boris is pretty funny in here i agree.

I haven't seen the extended cut yet. I heard the way he gets unfrozen is memorable though.

[The Shark]

Boris is pretty funny in here i agree.

I haven't seen the extended cut yet. I heard the way he gets unfrozen is memorable though.

Unlike every nauseating second of THE WORLD IS NOT ENOUGH.

[AMC Hornet]

As much as I enjoyed the opening boat chase in TWINE, I have it admit that it too was superfluous.

Renard: "We know exactly where the money will be when it detonates. We want you in a boat with several guns so that you can shoot anyone you see poking his head out the hole."

Q: "The best place to put a boat launching chute in this building would be on the fourth floor. It worked for Stromberg - it will work for us."

The only purpose the shi chase served was to convince Bond that Renard was gunning for Elektra. He'd already had a similar experience in Cortina D'Ampezzo with Kristatos' men posing as Doves. Oh well, those who don't learn from history....

Likewise the warehouse fight. The narrative stops dead for the incredibly noisy sequence, then picks up again from precisely where it left off. At least TND's narrative was driven by the action scenes - the plot advanced during the action, not after.

Without the action scenes, however, we would have had a very tense little drama about characters, trust and betrayal, and we would all be sitting here bleating about how it needed more action - maybe a boat chase, a ski chase, and more happening at the warehouse...

There's no pleasing everyone. It's a good thing that there are 22 flavours to choose from.

[JimmyBond]

The only purpose the shi chase served was to convince Bond that Renard was gunning for Elektra.

Then they failed miserably, not a single parahawk goes after Elektra. You'd think Bond would be smart enough to notice that out of five parahawk fliers none chase Elektra. None.

[DaveBond21]

I enjoy the Parahawk scene. It's great fun.

I love all the Bond ski sequences in the franchise.

I don't care if any of them have anything to do with the plot, I just sit back and enjoy. Most people don't watch a Bond movie for the plot. They watch it for the action and cool locations/girls.

[Gogol Pushkin]

I enjoy the Parahawk scene. It's great fun.

I love all the Bond ski sequences in the franchise.

I don't care if any of them have anything to do with the plot, I just sit back and enjoy. Most people don't watch a Bond movie for the plot. They watch it for the action and cool locations/girls.

You know, I'm with Dave. Plot hole it may be, but that sequence is enjoyable, not to mention scored pretty well by David Arnold, it's one of my favourite cues from the OST.

[Colossus]

Ditto. Great movie

[JimmyBond]

In this thread we get to watch my opinion change and change again!

I no longer dislike the film, and find it a flawed, but fun film. Definitely my favorite of Brosnan's.

[SecretAgentFan]

Personally, I think it has one of the best lines that define the character in "I never miss". And Bond killing Elektra in that moment is coming so fast and shockingly - it really lifts this film up.

Thinking about that: It seems that all Brosnan Bonds have at least one such moment in which the plot pauses and the character gets time to shine. In GE they have the beach scene (although here the dialogue is for my taste a bit too much on the nose), in TND it would be the hotel scene with Paris (yeah, before the shoulder biting...), in TWINE it is the killing of Elektra and in DAD it would be Bond in the hospital talking to M.

We had bits of this in TSWLM with Bond and Anya talking about their profession, but I guess the Brosnan era basically tried to work this in - and paved the way for the CraigBond who got much more time reflecting on himself.

[Miles Miservy]

Boris is pretty funny in here i agree.

I haven't seen the extended cut yet. I heard the way he gets unfrozen is memorable though.

Unlike every nauseating second of THE WORLD IS NOT ENOUGH.

Nothing grates like nails across a chalkboard like Denise Richards struggling through the line, "Total... catastophic... um, meltdown..."

I kinda have to agree with you on this one, although the scene did deliver some of the best moments for me:

Zukovsky smirking when Bond's BMW is sawn in half

"Q's not going to like this" - just a shame that line was drowned out by the SFX

Bond shooting one guy through the floor, then popping up a hatch and knocking another over

"The insurance company is never going to believe this!"

But then, Zukovsky did have nearly all of the good lines in TWINE. One reason I'm glad they cut the scene of Bond checking his pulse and finding he was dead before chasing Elektra up Maiden's Tower. Bring him back!!! :-D

I've juat always been disappointed that they'd gotten rid of the Z-8 so quickly as thay had in Goldeneye. Why even bother with it at all? At least the 750 in TND had a an interesting chase with a little wit attached to it. As for the other 2 I'd just mentioned, it was as if the directors had said, "Oh yeah; put the cars somewhere in there. I think we made a promise to BMW or something."