208 replies to this topic

[Tarl_Cabot]

"I hope the CIA gets its act togather and gets UBL."

I give it 6 months.The cache Bush is enjoying for today's events will likely propel greater attention and resources to getting OBL.They cannot win this war without getting that man.They have down played the importance to cover the embarrassment but he's got to be caught.It's not an option to allow him to be evade capture.

Then Bush will destroy Dean in November. Who would have thought it in November 2003?

[Felix_Leiter]

I wonder how this will politically pan out for G.W. Bush? Will voters forget about the country's domestic and international strifes, not too mention the continuing military death toll and rally around the capture of Saddam?

[Bondian]

Same over here with Blair Felix. I think that Tony Blair found it hard today not to break out into, "ding-dong the witch is dead". He looked too serious to be serious. If you know what I mean?!?!.


Cheers,

Ian

[Bondian]

SH+OBL=SHLOB
Cheers,

All the best,


Ian

[Blue Eyes]

Originally posted by booyeah_
are you a vet? Do you know any vets? Chances are they may have killed enemy combantants during their service. Are those veterans scum?

In order: Thankfully no. Yes, my father and grandfather. Yes they killed people. But there's a big difference between killing a person with a gun and an unarmed 66 year old in a jail cell.

Were the jurors, prosecutors and judges at Nuremberg, who sentenced eleven Nazi war criminals to death, scum?

Sure, they became scum when they made themselves murderers by killing people who no longer posed any threat.

Tarl_Cabot
I was teasing about the Bond films...sorry, I thought we were having a polite disagreement. I don't wanna make enmies with the A Team.

Don't worry, no hard feelings.

1)Where did you get that figure?
2)What crime would he be committing?

1) $170 million figure from various US newspapers, and not denied by Baby Bush when asked how he intended to spend said figure on his election campaign.
2) A moral one. If he's any good at his job he'll get re-elected solely due to the news coverage he receives. Can you imagine what wrongs you could right with $170 million in the world?


****

Overall, you cannot kill a man for killing people. It doesn't work like that. It's immoral, and it doesn't send out any of the right messages but only the wrong ones.

[Bondian]

Hello?....Echo?

[jwheels]

I do not think it is immoral to kill a person who murdered innocent people, but taht is my oppinion.

I also agree with Tarl and others. I do not have any pity for the man, and feel he should get whatever is coming to him.

I also think that we are only seeing a small fraction of what is really going on, and that are leaders who are seeing the whole picture, will make the right decisions.

[Bondian]

Hi jwheels57,

I very much agree with your last sentence, it is up to them and I sincerely hope they make the right decision.


Cheers,

Ian

[booyeah_]

jwheels, how many people do you want as the next bond girl?

[jwheels]

Originally posted by booyeah_
jwheels, how many people do you want as the next bond girl?

Catherine Bell in the next one, and Keira Knightly in one in about 10-15 years.

[Bondian]

For just a laugh how about having SH as 'doug' the dug-out man?.

Ok, I'm cracked I know.


Cheers,


Ian

[Felix_Leiter]

I'm with you Blue Eyes. Murdering the murderer doesn't make a lick of sense.

An eye for a eye will leave the whole world blind.

[jwheels]

I've been meaning to change that around a little bit booyeah, thanks for the reminder.

[jwheels]

Originally posted by Felix_Leiter
I with you Blue Eyes. Murdering the murderer doesn't make a lick of sense.  

An eye for a eye will leave the whole world blind.

Yes, but in a world of blind people, the one eyed man is king.

[Bondian]

jwheels, what if that one eyed man is long sighted?.

Cheers,


Ian

[bond007vna]

Hello Everyone,-I even couldn't to believe in all this,-
http://www.pbs.org/w.../shows/gunning/ ;-)
13 December/Saturday/,-somewhere in His born town!!!Just like how!!!
Well,than,-I would like to express my admirations to the fighters who did
that,-to the done job!!! C o n g r a t u l a t i o n s G u y s ! ! !
Now,-the evil gonna be take under judging,-in the court,-something like:
Justice for all,-right?!?!But He is proved criminal and must be punished
without judicature and without judgement!!!About the forthcoming show
in the court,-yeah,-it gonna be an Great political process,-I'm waiting to
watch how exactly Saddam will be play a games with the judges:;-)He
even don't speak english;-),-didn't He???Ah,-it will don't be a easy!!!
And completely not on last place:Where is Osama,-what exactly happe-
ned with Him and what He is doing this days,-any answers concerning all
this???But any way,-I mean,-I hope,-God knows,-what exactly is going
to be!!!
BOND007VNA!!!

MODERATOR'S NOTE: This new 1 post thread has been merged into this well established thread. Thank you. Blofeld's Cat

[Blofeld's Cat]

I gather Saddam won't be selling his story to some women's periodical.

[jwheels]

Originally posted by Bondian
jwheels, what if that one eyed man is long sighted?.

Cheers,


Ian

He will have to stand far away from everything, probably on a Throne on top of a mountain.


You know that in less than a year this whole thing will be turned into a TV movie.

[Dr Niles Crane]

for holding people in prison without charging them of a crime

Guantanamo Bay

for not allowing them access to any of the standard international legal protections

Guantanamo Bay

for torturing prisoners

Using the Pakistanian Security forces to 'interrogate' terrorism suspects

for holding prisoners in conditions that would make the UN go 'Oh My God'

Guantanamo Bay

for executing people of sub standard intelligence

The one that strikes me the most was the black guy who was so mentally retarded that he actually saved his pie for later because he had no concept that he was not going to be able to come back for it later. Clinton's hard line stance got him elected though..?


for having a very dodgy legal system

The county in California where only 3 people out of 5000 arrested went to trial because quite frankly they just could not give a damn. The chief pathologist in Oklahoma who kept 'adjusting' the dna results to favour the prosecution.

You will he happy to know that they scheduled a full inquiry into all death penalty cases, unfortunately owing to the sheer numbers it was estimated that 30 innocent people would die before their cases were investigated.

for funding drug cartels

George Bush - senior, as the head of the CIA. You see it was the middle of the Cold War and anyone who wasn't left was OK.


for funding anti government rebels

Same thing: Why do you thing Norriega was put into power? Why do you think the US backed Al Quiada against the Soviet Union?

for funding a leader whose main funding supply was drugs

Panama: But then, just like saddam he stopped doing what he was told and they desposed him - the Americans fire bombed large parts of Panama city - the bits where the anti-Norriega rebels were.


for invading another country and deposing its legitimately elected leader
for assinating another legitimately elected leader

Pinochet - well that one worked out well. But look at the bright side - It sure boosted sales of cattle prods and resulted in a very nice play that was turned into a great movie starring Sigourney Weaver and Ben Kingsley.

for sending agents out to torture prominent enemy targets to death

Operation Pheonix during the Vietnam war

for bombing a neutral country using chemical weapons

Cambodia

for using weapons outlawed by the UN (the kind that blow limbs off)

America used cluster bombs in Vietnam, Yugoslavia, Afghanistan and Iraq. As they are dropped from airplanes they are not classed as land mines. Each cluster bomb is composed of 200 to 700 bomblets. When the bomblet explodes it fragments into about 300 pieces of jagged steel. Pilots regularly fly at very high altitudes to avoid anti-aircraft fire. However this means that the bombs may fall indiscriminately and hit civilian not military targets

Cluster bombs may also become landmines. Each cluster bomblet is activated by an internal fuze, and is set to explode above ground, on impact, or to be time-delayed. Many cluster bombs fail to explode on impact.

And the best bit about cluster bombs? They look exactly like food packet rations.


for ensuring that medical supplies did not reach civilians and thousands died in agony through lack of drugs

Sanctions. Do you know that Iraq' children cannot recieve books as they are sanctioned. Not that they really care as they spend most of their time dying nowdays - malnutrition, cancer (way to go depleated uranium) and any number of groovy ways.

for using depleated uranium on areas where it knew the civilian population would be exposed to it and cause cancer rates to rise to fifty percent of the population

Cancer rates in Southern Iraq have risen to about fifty percent in children - and you guessed it no drugs are getting in because they could be used to made WMDs so they have to treat cancer with panadol.

for managing to shoot more civilians than enemy troops

er - not that I am saying anthying against the highly trained American Army. I particularly liked the soldier who said throwing grenades was 'cool'

for managing to shoot more friendly troops than enemy troops

Well that will happen when you send your pilots out on speed.

for having its leader serve a fake turkey to bolster the morale of its troops and reassure them of the justification of having invaded another country (this is considered bad in some parts of the world - think WW2 and WW1)?




It is all relative isn't it?

I just wonder if it is possible to find a court that might have the impartiality and the moral foundations to even attempt to begin to judge him.

Revenge shouldn't be a problem though. But revenge for what?

I know revenge for the 500 000 thousand children who will be killed by post war disease and malnutrition after Iraq was invaded (that is the second time - just add the a few hundred thousand from sanctions resulting from the last war). Oh hang on Saddam didn't invade Iraq..?

So revenge for the 100 000 Iraqi soldiers killed during the war... no that doesn't sound right?

I know revenge for the two million refugees and the thirty thousand refugee deaths resulting in America attacking.. dang I am still coming back to the same problem - Saddam didn't attack Iraq.

I know revenge for the Secretary of State selling chemical weapons to Saddam Hussein in the eighties... no?

I know - how about not complying with UN weapons inspectors... Oh he did? Dang!

I know - how about having weapons of mass destruction?

Oh he didn't?

How about attacking another soverign country and ignoring the UN... Oh shoot - that was America - really?

How about causing his own troops - about 160 thousand of his own troops medical problems and 25 thousand of them psychological trauma - no don't tell me...

How about September 11 - well that might have worked if the President hadn't admitted he hadn't had anything to do with it - on national television.

How about for being a really bad guy?

Now that one works. Yes he is a complete and utter murdering psycho. Didn't worry us before (especially when we were supplying him with weapons), but now for some reason we feel very upset about it.

I know - Lets put him through a kangaroo court, shoot him and get on with backing the next lot of butchers and murderers...

As I specıalıse in international law I understand national interest/self preservation is a time honoured pursuit and I respect this. It is the 'attempts' at moral justification that rather sickens me. That and the hundreds of thousands of unnecessary deaths as six percent of the world's population attempts to enforce its morals on the other 94 percent and then gets shirty when they get all stroppy about it.

When the whole world knows it was a fake turkey - it is time to give it up.

The whole thing is just - as it has always been.

[Mister Asterix]

I can

[Jriv71]

Originally posted by Xenobia
Saddam Huessin should be treated the way he has treated no one else:

-- He should get a fair trial.

-- He should be spared the death penalty.

He should, however, be sprayed with the same chemicals he sprayed on the Kurds in the late eighties and early nineties, and probably since then too, and he should be kept alive and made to suffer the way others have suffered under him.

-- Xenobia

Uh, those chemicals killed people. SO, I agree, spray away.

[Jriv71]

Originally posted by Blue Eyes


Now they'll try and push for the death penalty, which I personally feel is totally wrong. But would it really surprise us? This is the US Government who broadcasts pictures of dead people willingly.

Have a clue. Those pictures were broadcast to quell the notion that we lied about the sons being killed. I'm sure people like you would have been ready to pounce had we not shown the pictures. Trying to make the U.S. government seem as bad as, say, Iraq's government, is a bit offensive, but go right ahead, if that's all you can come up with.

[DLibrasnow]

Great news....I don't think it will make much difference in Iraq though since i believe the rebels/terrorists are more allied to Osama Bin Laden.

By the way - don't put him to death. Don't make him a martyr.
Saddam would be more powerful than ever if we allowed him to achieve martyrdom among his supporters.

[Rolex]

Lets be honest as honorable as some people

[DLibrasnow]

It seema a number of people on here are in favor of making him a martyr

[Jriv71]

Originally posted by Dr Niles Crane
for holding people in prison without charging them of a crime

Guantanamo Bay......

If you really don't understand why we would've detained certain people, you just can't be helped. And why wouldn't we support the Afghan resistance against the Soviets. Hello??? Remember the Soviets???

Look, our legal system, and the other things you mentioned are not perfect (I guess everything's perfect in Australia,) but your entire text is utterly anti-American (which, of course is your right to be, I truly mean that, it's your right to hate whoever you want, and to say it) but at least admit it.

That's really what I want to hear. Say it. "I hate the U.S. and its people, because you're the ones who've instituted the death penalty and other nasty things I hate and elected the leaders who've done such awful things." Say it!!! Not everyone here agrees with all U.S. policies, but when you call Bush criminal or immoral or say the same things about his predecessors, you're insulting the 47% of us who voted for him and the 60%(I'm guessing) who support him now.

I just want to hear you say it, that's all. If you're not willing to say it, what's the point of your rant?

[Jriv71]

Oops, accidental post.

[DLibrasnow]

Originally posted by Jriv71


If you really don't understand why we would've detained certain people, you just can't be helped.  And why wouldn't we support the Afghan resistance against the Soviets.  Hello???  Remember the Soviets???

Look, our legal system, and the other things you mentioned are not perfect (I guess everything's perfect in Australia,) but your entire text is utterly anti-American (which, of course is your right to be, I truly mean that, it's your right to hate whoever you want, and to say it) but at least admit it.

That's really what I want to hear.  Say it.  "I hate the U.S. and its people, because you're the ones who've instituted the death penalty and other nasty things I hate and elected the leaders who've done such awful things." Say it!!!  Not everyone here agrees with all U.S. policies, but when you call Bush criminal or immoral or say the same things about his predecessors, you're insulting the 47% of us who voted for him and the 60%(I'm guessing) who support him now.

I just want to hear you say it, that's all.  If you're not willing to say it, what's the point of your rant?

Good post Jriv7....I would guess the original poster just has some major inferiority issues. (Just kidding)

[Jriv71]

No. No inferiority issues there. The Dr. truly hates us, and feels in no way inferior. On the contrary, The Dr. knows that they're better than us, and doesn't mind telling us so.

'Cos if it you think it comes off any other way, you're crazy.

[Sensualist]

O dear.

So what's everyone's call on the type of movie Bond 21 will be?