65 replies to this topic

[Blox]

Scaramanga: Never Say Never Again is considered by many fans to be the black sheep of the Bond canon.
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I don't know why they think so. McClory's contract with Eon from 1965 gave him the right to do a remake in 10 years. Perhaps Broccoli and Saltzman didn't expect Bond to be around by 1975. Whatever the case may be, McClory had a bona fide right to do a remake based on the novel and the scripts. They probably erred in agreeing to the clause.

It is amazing the film was made at all. NSNA was confronted with litigation all the way through -- efforts to stop its production. Many extra scenes were shot lest others be precluded legally. The scipt was carefully scrutinized by the lawyers and the NSNA storyline carefully pinned to the characters and events in the earlier TB novel, drafts and screenplays. To survive this sort of scrutiny and pressure from a major studio is remarkable. NSNA did a comendable job of delivering a distinct viewing experience. That is, it did not appear to be a scene for scene, shot for shot remake.

Now that MGM owns the property, it would be interesting to go back, recover the camera negative, and recut, rescore, and retitle the film to improve the pacing. It will never be an Eon entry. But for better or worse, in many ways, its roots have more to do with Fleming than the stuff being dreamed up today.

B l o x

[DLibrasnow]

I would love to see the deleted scenes with Max Von Sydow reinserted back into NSNA...

I really like the movie and I like the fact that it was different from the EON series.

[Blox]

I agree. There were extra bits -- fight scenes from the opener. Scenes where Bond is shadowing Domino. Aerial process "beauty" shots of Largo's lair. the scenes with Blofeld you are referring to. A scene on the yacht. Additional fight scenes from the finale -- including Bond swinging on a cable into action -- a la Sir Roger in Octopussy. There were many scenes -- I do not pretend to recall them all.

[DLibrasnow]

I echo your sentiments...
Now that MGM owns NSNA they should give us those extra scenes, they must exist somewhere...I would love to have them insert those scenes and then bring in someone like John Barry to redo the soundtrack. I bet that Barry would create a great soundtrack for the movie, especially since they would not be rushing him to meet a theatrical release date.

[Turn]

I'd be in favor of these suggestions. I have the feeling MGM won't do anything with them, especially since they want EON's favor, and will just leave it barren and there as a reminder you can't mess with the original series.

[Blox]

D Lib: Now that MGM owns NSNA they should give us those extra scenes, they must exist somewhere...I would love to have them insert those scenes and then bring in someone like John Barry to redo the soundtrack.

....Actually Jack Schwartzman was planning to rescore the picture shortly before he died. The war is over on this property. They could do whatever they wish. They could have buried it (as some were suggesting might happen after they acquired the rights.) But there it is -- on DVD. While a redo is unlikely, the brass is smart enough to recognize that, with relatively little investment, they could create a "new" property out of 20 yr old film and all of the exploitation that would go with it. Robert Wise redo of Star Trek the Mo Pix comes to mind, as well as Lucas's redo of the first Star Wars pictures.

[Tanger]

Hell, if they reinserted all the deleted scenes (if they could find them), created a title sequence but had Bond doing the game in the pre-title, rescored it and then gave it a gunbarrel i'd be out like a shot to see it or buy it DVD. They couldn't exactly reinsert it into the series as it is what it is which is a remake of Thunderball, but it would make it more of an official Bond film.

[Dr.Carl Mortner]

It's only in the past few years that NSNA has got such a bad reputation. At the time, it received a lot of critical attention for the very fact that Sean Connery was back. I think the only thing that hurt it at the BO was the fact that it was a fall release -- as it was, it was Number One for something like three or four weeks back in '83.

As far as an NSNA "special edition" goes, well, it would be nice but I highly doubt it. What we're talking about here is a dramatic alteration of the film, and I recall few movies that have received that treatment. The Star Wars special editions included extra special effects and some deleted scenes, but otherwise the movie itself wasn't altered. Similarily, the Apocalypse Now director's cut featured many extra scenes. And let's not forget that the above movies have long been considered masterpieces in their own rights, something that NSNA most certainly is not. The concept would be nice for Bond fans but I don't think it's realistic.

[ChandlerBing]

There was a chap on another site who had experimented with altering NSNA with a gun barrel and new music.

[Turn]

Has anybody ever gone back and actually legitimately altered a score beyond updating those from silent films?

[Jayboy]

I like NSNA, and I have respect for it. It is quite good and feels different. I am cyrrently producing a NSNA DVD collectable booklet

[DLibrasnow]

Originally posted by ChandlerBing
There was a chap on another site who had experimented with altering NSNA with a gun barrel and new music.

Yes, that has appeared here on CBN...I think it was Blofelds Cat (without the apostrophe - not the CBN staff member) but I could be wrong...It was the "Eon's Never Say Never Again Pre Credits" thread in the Sean Connery forum.

[Pussfeller]

I like NSNA, but it isn't a movie that one can watch over and over again without a long pause in between viewings. I rent it about every four months and watch it twice. That's enough for me to suck the entertainment value out of it.

NSNA was surprisingly well-written, as far as dialogue and witticisms are concerned. It was not the most imaginative story (obviously it could not be), and some situations were ludicrous or embarassing (such as Fatima Blush throwing the snake into Patachi's car to kill him).

I do not watch this film with non-Bond fans because I always have to answer "Are they all like this?"

[DLibrasnow]

Originally posted by Pussfeller


NSNA was surprisingly well-written, as far as dialogue and witticisms are concerned.

I think NSNA has the best dialogue of any James Bond movie...

[Pussfeller]

Perhaps that has something to do with the non-Eon writing team. Who did write that script, by the way?

[Tanger]

Lorenzo Semple Jr. as far as I know. I don't know if anybody did any other drafts.

[ChandlerBing]

I used to watch it all the time way back in the summer of 87, when I had a big huge crush on Kim Basinger. 9 1/2 Weeks had been released not long before that! I used to watch it over and over, and my parents thought it was kinda funny. I think I might have been 10 yrs old then. Wow, where does time go?

[DLibrasnow]

The same writer as 1980s "Flash Gordon"...WOW! Two of my favorite movies!

[ChandlerBing]

Is that Flash Gordon or Flesh Gordon....hmm, which one is which?

[DLibrasnow]

The "Flash Gordon" that stars Timothy Dalton, Topol, Melody Anderson, Sam Jones, Max Von Sydow and Brian Blessed.

[ChandlerBing]

Heh, heh. Just messing with you, DLibrasnow. Flesh Gordon's the pørno version, as I understand it.

[DLibrasnow]

I think you are correct Chandler!

[ChandlerBing]

And no, I have never seen Flesh Gordon. I've just heard, well, you know...word of mouth.

[DLibrasnow]

Of course you haven't

[Triton]

I'm a big fan of Never Say Never Again. The more serious tone of the film was a very welcome change from the largely comedic undefined Octopussy. I very much liked Max von Sydow as Ernst Stavro Blofeld, he seemed to be the most sane and professional making him the most realistic of all the Blofeld's to appear on screen. I always wondered why the criminals ever put up with Blofeld and SPECTRE in the Eon films because of some of the petulance and the frequent executions. I guess the pay had to be good to put up with the risk. I also have to remark about the Persian cat as well, the cat actually looks loved and happy for once.

I also like Klaus Maria Brandauer as Maximillian Largo and Bernie Casey as Felix Leiter. There really seems to be sense of friendship between Bond and Bernie Casey's Leiter character which makes him the most memorable to me. I don't know why the Eon films mostly cast such forgetable actors as Felix Leiter, with the exception of course of Jack Lord and David Hedison.

Barbara Carrera is great as Fatima Blush.

I also found Lorenzo Semple Jr.'s script to contain very witty dialogue and it was a very entertaining re-working of the Thunderball story. And like many of you, I am a big fan of Flash Gordon (1980). Go Flash!

I would be a bigger fan of the movie if it were not for the score by Michel Legrand. I like Michel Legrand's score for The Thomas Crown Affair (1968), Ice Station Zebra (1968), and The Three Musketeers (1973), the only other films that I remember seeing that were scored by Legrand.

As for Flesh Gordon, it is so famous, or infamous, that I would like to see it at least once. My understanding is that it is more camp than pørn. Bjo Trimble, the woman who organized the letter campaign to save Star Trek, was a makeup artist on the film, Greg Jein created models, Rick Baker did special make up effects, and Dennis Muren created optical effects.

[DLibrasnow]

Originally posted by Triton
I'm a big fan of Never Say Never Again. The more serious tone of the film was a very welcome change from the largely comedic undefined Octopussy. I very much liked Max von Sydow as Ernst Stavro Blofeld, he seemed to be the most sane and professional making him the most realistic of all the Blofeld's to appear on screen. I always wondered why the criminals ever put up with Blofeld and SPECTRE in the Eon films because of some of the petulance and the frequent executions. I guess the pay had to be good to put up with the risk. I also have to remark about the Persian cat as well, the cat actually looks loved and happy for once.

I also like Klaus Maria Brandauer as Maximillian Largo and Bernie Casey as Felix Leiter. There really seems to be sense of friendship between Bond and Bernie Casey's Leiter character which makes him the most memorable to me. I don't know why the Eon films mostly cast such forgetable actors as Felix Leiter, with the exception of course of Jack Lord and David Hedison.

Barbara Carrera is great as Fatima Blush.

I also found Lorenzo Semple Jr.'s script to contain very witty dialogue and it was a very entertaining re-working of the Thunderball story. And like many of you, I am a big fan of Flash Gordon (1980). Go Flash!

I would be a bigger fan of the movie if it were not for the score by Michel Legrand. I like Michel Legrand's score for The Thomas Crown Affair (1968), Ice Station Zebra (1968), and The Three Musketeers (1973), the only other films that I remember seeing that were scored by Legrand.  

As for Flesh Gordon, it is so famous, or infamous, that I would like to see it at least once. My understanding is that it is more camp than pørn. Bjo Trimble, the woman who organized the letter campaign to save Star Trek, was a makeup artist on the film, Greg Jein created models, Rick Baker did special make up effects, and Dennis Muren created optical effects.

Thank you Triton...I agree with your post on so many levels. I think NSNA is a movie that Bond fans should celebrate precisely because of the differences that it displays from the EON 007 series. I do think that NSNA has the best dialogue of any James Bond movie and also that Barbara Carerra is probably the best villainess, not just of the Bond movies but in the history of movies -- her scene where she makes 007 write that endorsement is simply priceless - "Well, there was this one girl in Philadelphia!"
I also believe that Bernie Casey made a great Felix Leiter. Connery's 007 and Casey's Leiter seemed to have a genuine friendship not seen in the EON pictures (with the exception of David Hedison - who after all was a personal friend of Roger Moore's anyway).
I just wish they could reinstate the Max Von Sydow's deleted scenes because I think he gave an interesting portrayal of the character.

[IndyB007]

I've always enjoyed NSNA.... perhaps being that it was the first Bond film that I saw has a little something to do with it, but I have always found it entertaining. I especially like the beginning war game scenario and the whole "Tears of Allah" and Palmyria set pieces, and the fight at Shrublands has always been a favorite with me. The score also has a few moments in it that really set it apart for me.... oh the nostalgia.....

Anyway, about the DVD release of it. I bought it when it first came out so I have the one with the arcade scenes missing. I have since tracked down a widescreen copy on both VHS and Laserdisc, but from what I've read above, they have re-released the NSNA DVD with the arcade scenes restored? Don't know if I should shell out some more cash for it, but its only about $10 - $15 so I might as well.......

"Heavy Mr. Bond?"

[Tanger]

I'm always hearing about these missing scenes but I'm sure that mine has them. Does anyone know if the first R2 releases were complete or not?

[DLibrasnow]

Originally posted by IndyB007

Anyway, about the DVD release of it. I bought it when it first came out so I have the one with the arcade scenes missing. I have since tracked down a widescreen copy on both VHS and Laserdisc, but from what I've read above, they have re-released the NSNA DVD with the arcade scenes restored? Don't know if I should shell out some more cash for it, but its only about $10 - $15 so I might as well.......

"Heavy Mr. Bond?"

Yes MGM quickly realized that the initial run of the DVDs had the missing scenes and corrected the problem (quite promptly). The corrected version has two or three asterix's after the title on the top security seal...

[Gogol]

Nope