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Could Idris Elba be the next James Bond?


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Poll: Could Idris Elba be the next James Bond?

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Could Idris Elba be the next James Bond?

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Is it basically too early to be asking about the next Bond, whoever it is?

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#91 Odd Jobbies

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Posted 30 December 2012 - 02:05 PM

I've come across this interesting nugget from the Life magazine book "50 Years Of James Bond":- "In 1955, not long after the publication of Casino Royale, the Russian born producer-director Gregory Ratoff optioned the book and hired the young Lorenzo Semple Jr. to write a script. Neither man thought much of the main character. "Frankly, we thought he was kind of unbelieveable and as I recall, even kind of stupid" Semple recalled in Variety. "So Gregory thought the solution was to make Bond a woman, 'Jane Bond', if you will, and he even had a plan to cast Susan Hayward in the role."  "

 

Changing the racial background or even the gender of 007 might seem like some 21st century press gimmick or agent's pitch to the producers, but it seems some were considering it before Bond had reached the cinema screen. On reflection I'm glad they didn't.

 

Great find!

 

Goes to show that bad ideas have always been around.



#92 Matt_13

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Posted 30 December 2012 - 03:18 PM

I think Elba would make a great villain for Craig's Bond. He still hasn't faced off against a physically formidable adversary. With Elba touted as a potential Bond, we could not only get some nice physicality, but also the potential for some fun at the expense of the rumors. May be fun to see him outclass Craig in the films, though that would require the reintroduction of Bond's more snobbish tendencies regarding food and drink.



#93 Aziz Fekkesh

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Posted 30 December 2012 - 05:48 PM

What an interesting topic. I admire the candour and insightfulness of those who've responded.
 
As far as I'm concerned, Idris Elba fits Bond like the paper on the wall (i.e. sophisticated, British and smokin' hot). The same goes for Colin Salmon, come to that. Either would, in my opinion, do a bang-up as Fleming's (or, more to the point, the Broccoli's) hedonist, misogynist, snob assassin.
 
If Bond were a real historical figure or had been provided by Fleming with more than two sentences of backstory or if any continuity in the character's portrayal in the films hadn't already been gleefully scattered to the four winds I might take issue with such a casting decision, but as it is, I wouldn't be fussed.
 
On the other hand, if Cho Chang in the Harry Potter movies had been played by anyone other than a Scot, I'd have been pissed.
 
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#94 Dustin

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Posted 30 December 2012 - 06:48 PM

I wonder, is this discussion in general - Elba or Salmon aside - more related to the one about turning Bond into a female character (thanks for that find about Semple jr.; I had no idea this was ever in the cards!) or to the various fans rejecting Craig for lacking enough similarity with their ideas about Bond?

I've already stated the initial headline is a no-news, a piece designed to fill space, like for example MOON NOT FALLING ON MANHATTAN - SCIENTISTS 'FAIRLY SURE' IT WON'T HAPPEN THIS MONTH. But it's interesting to note how the public's general idea about who/how/what can be "Bond" and which stories the character can tell seems subject to change. It seems CASINO ROYALE and the reboot that went with it - and Craig's casting, thought that perhaps was not the key factor - has opened doors for the series we wouldn't have dreamt Bond could ever use.

Edited by Dustin, 30 December 2012 - 06:50 PM.


#95 archer1949

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Posted 31 December 2012 - 05:36 AM

I'm sorry, but there is a certain point where you change a character so much, he becomes competely unrecognizable. Bond's backstory is already established. His Jingoist, somewhat elite attitude is set in stone.

 

I guess a Black guy could have the same familial background and attitude, but it seems really contrived. It reminds me of the way some of the early Arnold Schwarzenegger movies bent over backwards to explain away why these all-American hero-types were being portrayed by this big dude with the heavy Austrian accent.

 

It just seems highly unlikely.

 

Changing everything to accommodate some kind of misguided racial quota is stupid.A silly gimmick. And no matter how good the actor is, putting a Black guy in the role is just that: a silly desperate gimmick.


Edited by archer1949, 31 December 2012 - 05:37 AM.


#96 quantumofsolace

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 04:06 PM

http://www.digitalsp...-pipe-down.html



#97 SecretAgentFan

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 05:26 PM

Not this again...



#98 Hockey Mask

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 05:40 PM

How is it possible that this resurfaces again and again?  I don't have a problem with posting the link but with the "original" news story.  Elba needs to squash this stuff once and for all.



#99 Nicolas Suszczyk

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 02:10 AM

"I know Ian Fleming lived in Jamaica for a long time, didn't he? I think it's interesting to think what he would have made of a black man playing Bond."

 

Don't ask, and let the master rest in peace!

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#100 AgenttiNollaNollaSeitsemän

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 04:12 AM

"I know Ian Fleming lived in Jamaica for a long time, didn't he? I think
it's interesting to think what he would have made of a black man
playing Bond."

 
He would have hated it with a fierce passion, Mr Elba.


#101 Vauxhall

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 10:36 AM

I still reckon this is probably all misdirection before Idris Elba is announced as a villain for BOND 24. Hopefully.



#102 PPK_19

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 08:02 PM

I still reckon this is probably all misdirection before Idris Elba is announced as a villain for BOND 24. Hopefully.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if that was the case. Would be a nice change of pace. Haven't had a main black villain since LALD. 



#103 007jamesbond

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 10:54 AM

I can't picture him as a villain role.........more like a fellow 00 agent to Bond? perhaps 



#104 PPK_19

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 11:10 AM

I can't picture him as a villain role.........more like a fellow 00 agent to Bond? perhaps 


Could be. We haven't seen another double-oh work alongside Bond since 006 in Goldeneye.

As long as there is no 'betrayal' storyline, getting sick of the "sometimes we're so focused on our enemies that we forget to watch our friends" motif.

But seeing a black double-oh working with Bond would be a nice change. Saying that i'd like to see Felix make a return in Bond 24.

But i don't want Elba to be the next Bond. Bond isn't black, end of story.

#105 S K Y F A L L

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 01:02 AM

I've only seen him in The Office and Prometheus. I think he is in The Wire but have never seen it. Perhaps he's in talks to play Charles Robinson...



#106 00 Brosnan

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 04:35 AM

I'm not for this at all. I have zero problem with a "black" actor taking on a successful role/series, but there has to be limits...for all races. Bond is a British, white dude. He has a long history.

 

At the end of the day the characters wouldn't be the same.



#107 Odd Jobbies

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 11:40 AM

It's fine with me so long as:

 

Brad Pitt  gets to play Malcolm X

George Clooney  is Barack Obama in the inevitable biopic

and Jack Black  is the new SHAFT !

 

It all makes perfect sense ;)


Edited by Odd Jobbies, 14 February 2013 - 12:39 PM.


#108 Hawksmoor

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Posted 17 February 2013 - 06:19 PM

I think Elba would make a great Bond now, but I agree with earlier posters that time (and age, sadly) are against him. Let's take an optimistic estimate that Bond 24 (Craig 4) does make it to the screen by late 2014, then Bond 25 (Craig 5) by, what - late 2016? Everyone then takes a year off to develop scripts and agree contracts and so on. So even the tightest timescales possible would still mean Bond 26 won't have cameras rolling until early 2018. By that point Elba will be 48, and into his fifties by time he made a second Bond film. Just feels unlikely to me that we would ever now see an actor debuting as Bond in his late 40s.



#109 Dustin

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Posted 17 February 2013 - 06:59 PM


and Jack Black  is the new SHAFT !

 

It all makes perfect sense ;)

 

Why not Armond White?



#110 bondjames

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 02:13 AM

Idris Elba will not be Bond. Period.

 

Why? Because we already have a black Moneypenny and a black Felix. We can't have a black Bond in the same period or it's going to look wierd.

 

Now, can Elba be Bond? Certainly. Can he make a good Bond? Definitely. Should he be Bond? No. Bond is white. It's the fantasy that's been with us for 50 years on film and longer in the novels. It's what we know and changing it for the sake of change would be pointless and inappropriate. There are other actors apart from idris who can do a good job with Bond without jarring the fantasy. Changing Moneypenny and Felix did not have that much of an impact as they are supporting characters (although I do have a bit of a problem with a black Moneypenny - as it plays subconsciously into old stereotypes about unconsumated/inappropriate interracial activities from an earlier era).

 

Bond is the main character and should remain white in my opinion.



#111 AMC Hornet

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 03:15 AM

It's fine with me so long as:

 

Brad Pitt  gets to play Malcolm X

George Clooney  is Barack Obama in the inevitable biopic

and Jack Black  is the new SHAFT !

 

It all makes perfect sense ;)

More or less what I was going to say, although I wasn't going to go after Malcolm or Obama.

 

Indeed, a white Shaft? No, John Shaft is a product of his environment and a natural reaction to the antiquated notion that only a white man can be a hero, and that the role of black actors in the seventies was limited to playing muggers and pimps.

 

Let Bond be white. Let him continue to "kick and chop his way through the minorities of the world" (Time, 1973), representing the British attitude. You can make John McClane black, or cast Michael Clarke Duncan as the Kingpin (the best part of Daredevil); in fact, the coolest bit of casting in Die Hard With a Vengeance was Graham Greene as a NY cop. Just a cop. No feathers in his hair, no "my people" - just a cop. That's affirmative action.

 

James Bond is a product of the (once) predominantly white British class system. Fleming was a racist snob, but 007 is only a snob. There is no need to make him black - just make another Shaft, and cast Daniel Craig or Christopher Eccleston as the villain.



#112 Dustin

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 05:49 AM

On a related notion, could Bond wear glasses?

#113 SecretAgentFan

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 07:56 AM

He did wear hairpieces.



#114 Zographos

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 08:32 AM

More or less what I was going to say, although I wasn't going to go after Malcolm or Obama.


It's fine with me so long as:

 

Brad Pitt  gets to play Malcolm X

George Clooney  is Barack Obama in the inevitable biopic

and Jack Black  is the new SHAFT !

 

It all makes perfect sense ;)

 

Indeed, a white Shaft? No, John Shaft is a product of his environment and a natural reaction to the antiquated notion that only a white man can be a hero, and that the role of black actors in the seventies was limited to playing muggers and pimps.

 

Let Bond be white. Let him continue to "kick and chop his way through the minorities of the world" (Time, 1973), representing the British attitude. You can make John McClane black, or cast Michael Clarke Duncan as the Kingpin (the best part of Daredevil); in fact, the coolest bit of casting in Die Hard With a Vengeance was Graham Greene as a NY cop. Just a cop. No feathers in his hair, no "my people" - just a cop. That's affirmative action.

 

James Bond is a product of the (once) predominantly white British class system. Fleming was a racist snob, but 007 was only a snob. There is no need to make him black - just make another Shaft, and cast Daniel Craig or Christopher Eccleston as the villain.

I'd be inclined to disagree with you.  Does Bond as a character speak to "whiteness" in the same way that he speaks to ideas of masculinity or British nationalism, or that Shaft speaks to "blackness"?  Would Idris Elba as Bond be a greater departure from the series' roots than, say, GoldenEye's use of BMW?  I'm skeptical on both counts (though your mileage may vary).

 

I don't know that I'd conflate phenotypical whiteness the way you do either.  Does Bond cease to be a white character when played by a black actor?  Well, does Bond cease to be an English character when played by a Scottish, Australian, or Irish-American actor?  You could argue yes, but in that case we've been in dangeroush watersh for a while.

 

The main issue as I see it, and the thing I'm amazed is rarely brought up, is that a black actor would present barriers to some fans imagining themselves as Bond.  Which is pretty much the point in the end, ain't it?  In all the pages and pages and pages of Idris Elba/Colin Salmon threads that have flooded internet forums for years, no one opposed to the idea has come out and stated this.  Maybe they fear it would be interpreted as racism?

 

I don't know that it comes, on the whole, from racism.  Fans were livid about Craig's blond hair after all - some apparently still are - so fans are just being their usual weirdo selves in that regard.  I remember someone bursting a vein about Jinx no longer being black in 007 Legends, so you have to expect that any kind of change is liable to incur wrath (if that answers your glasses question, Dustin).  But yeah, probably there's a bit of racism insofar as blacks not being seen as enviable vessels for the kind of class fantasizing that Bond movies are all about.

 

There simpy remains too much fondness for Transatlantic Bond puttering about in German roadsters in what amount to American action movies to assume the objection to Idris Elba is merely one of "tradition".

 

I'd be interested to know what you think, though.


Edited by Zographos, 19 February 2013 - 08:34 AM.


#115 Dustin

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 12:08 PM


I'd be inclined to disagree with you. Does Bond as a character speak to "whiteness" in the same way that he speaks to ideas of masculinity or British nationalism, or that Shaft speaks to "blackness"? Would Idris Elba as Bond be a greater departure from the series' roots than, say, GoldenEye's use of BMW? I'm skeptical on both counts (though your mileage may vary).

I don't know that I'd conflate phenotypical whiteness the way you do either. Does Bond cease to be a white character when played by a black actor? Well, does Bond cease to be an English character when played by a Scottish, Australian, or Irish-American actor? You could argue yes, but in that case we've been in dangeroush watersh for a while.

The main issue as I see it, and the thing I'm amazed is rarely brought up, is that a black actor would present barriers to some fans imagining themselves as Bond. Which is pretty much the point in the end, ain't it? In all the pages and pages and pages of Idris Elba/Colin Salmon threads that have flooded internet forums for years, no one opposed to the idea has come out and stated this. Maybe they fear it would be interpreted as racism?

I don't know that it comes, on the whole, from racism. Fans were livid about Craig's blond hair after all - some apparently still are - so fans are just being their usual weirdo selves in that regard. I remember someone bursting a vein about Jinx no longer being black in 007 Legends, so you have to expect that any kind of change is liable to incur wrath (if that answers your glasses question, Dustin). But yeah, probably there's a bit of racism insofar as blacks not being seen as enviable vessels for the kind of class fantasizing that Bond movies are all about.

There simpy remains too much fondness for Transatlantic Bond puttering about in German roadsters in what amount to American action movies to assume the objection to Idris Elba is merely one of "tradition".

I'd be interested to know what you think, though.



When reading this I could have sworn that was my point a few pages back in an exchange with FOX MULDER, a black Bond preventing some fans from identifying themselves with Bond. I've just checked but I really didn't put it that way. At any rate that's what I meant to say back then - which is in my view the reason we won't see it happen soon.*

Is this now 'racism'? Or a - perhaps very specific - non-racist version of racism? Given the numerous entries hastening to assure 'I'm no racist, but...'

My opinion is the core of the matter lies in how people define themselves. The ability to identify one's own image in the mirror is a crucial step in a hominid's development (not only humans are able to do this). This image is a very early and basic experience. And the colour of skin a basic trait within that image. So we (we = humans) tend to identify ourselves easier with those sharing the basic features and attributes than with others. I suppose it's the same with gender, people can sympathise with a character of the other sex, but have difficulty identifying themselves with that character. Not because they choose to do so, because they can't easily do it.



*Ironically there has been a small-scale version of this pop-culture phenomenon only recently: Ben Aaronovitch's RIVERS OF LONDON received a US cover that tries to hide the hero's ethnicity.

#116 larrythefatcat

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 12:43 PM

I used to be against the "black Bond" possibility... but that was mostly because P. Diddy/Puff Daddy was trying to get himself cast as Bond. He is very wrong for the role for sooo many reasons, but his race definitely isn't the problem.

The only problem with Idris would be that I'd be waiting for Michael Scarn to show up and cause trouble... or Loki... or an "engineer"...

I was just wondering why I didn't ever think that Lara Croft would just show up in a Craig film... and it's probably because I don't remember his character in the 'Tomb Raider' film very clearly.

Edited by larrythefatcat, 19 February 2013 - 12:46 PM.


#117 AMC Hornet

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 06:49 PM

Dustin and Zographos raise a good point - one I was not cognizant enough to articulate in my previous post.

 

Until the 1970s there were precious few positive black role models in films, and Sidney Poitier seemed to get the lion's share of them.Then along comes Richard Roundtree as Shaft and gives a sizable and hitherto untapped demographic an action hero of their own - one who couldn't and mustn't be white. Now instead of saying "I could be a black James Bond," a previously marginalized population can look in the mirror and say "I could be Shaft" (or Nick Fury, or whoever).

 

Do I look in the mirror and say "I could be a white Zeus Carver"? No, but as a teacher I do strive to do my best to be like Mr. Thackery in To Sir With Love. Then I put on my tux, admire myself in the mirror as Daniel Craig does in Casino Royale and say (to quote our own Jaques Stewart) "Shee-it, you is 007'ed out in this mother-fu#&er!"

 

So much for being articulate. But as Zographos and Dustin seem to agree - if I read them correctly - to make Bond black would call for just that sort of paradigm shift. Being tall, fair-haired and blue eyed I like to compare myself to Roger Moore. Cast Idris Elba and a new demographic can identify with 007, but the old fans - or at least Aryan dinosaurs such as I - will lose our ability to identify with him. I was never meant to identify with Shaft and that's fine, but can't we keep Bond as he is and introduce more black heroes to compete in that market? Would making Bond black be progressive or merely giving in?

 

I'll watch anything with Samuel L. Jackson, Will Smith or Danny Glover in it,  and if they play a Bond-like character, great - but to cast one of them as Bond? It's not what I want. I wouldn't want to see Vin Diesel play Shaft either - that would be just as wrong.



#118 Dustin

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 08:03 PM

Coming back to this tomorrow, Hornet. There's a football match on that needs my attention at the moment. Urgently...



#119 DominicGreene

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 11:32 PM

If Idris Elba or any black male ever became Bond, I would stop watching Bond completely. 



#120 AMC Hornet

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Posted 20 February 2013 - 03:23 AM

Halle Berry or Naomi Harris it is, then.