199 replies to this topic

[Double-0-7]

My thoughts were caught by several CBn chaps already - this does not compare favorably to Goldfinger or Moonraker. Certainly not Dame Shirley's fault, she really belts out a song. Is her voice ageless?

No Good About Goodbye has a Bond-like sound to it, I could believe it was written for Quantum of Solace, but I don't see where it would be a great fit. But I certainly like hearing it and think it will probably grow on me. AWTD will never be my favorite Bond theme, but I no longer feel the need to hit 'skip' when it comes up during the QOS soundtrack. Songs like NGAG are nice to find and discuss. I also like having the option to add it to the collection of Bond music on my computer to revisit later.

Great find, JADSTERSDAD and WC. And lively conversation as usual, agents!

[Royal Dalton]

It's not the greatest song ever written, but it's okay(ish).

I think it might have worked better for the film if it had been sung by a man, though (Tom Jones, maybe, if we're going all retro), since it's, presumably, a song about Bond, sung in the first person.

[DaveBond21]

It's a good song. Maybe they should have saved it for Bond 23? I love Dame Shirley and David Arnold's work. It sounds a bit like TWINE.



But I still like Another Way to Die.

[Quantumofsolace007]

ok first good to see I'm not the only one who thinks it wouldn't work.

this is Moonraker Backwards. In other words bland forgettable and Just doesn't fit Quantum of Solace or Daniel Craig's bond. I'm listening to it as I type this. IJust don't like it at all.


Ok Now I'm gonna listen to the much Better another way to die while typeing this part.


I can walk away and do other things yet Another way' to die's riff is implanted in my brain the bassey song It just ended 5 seconds ago and i don't remeber a thing about it. before people say "well you only want the next pop artist for bond"

No I want either Yes or Paul Mcartney again Neither of them are new and one well yeah If anyone on this forum can name me the current lineup of yes without cheating (going to their site or another site) I'd be really dam suprised. Hell I'd be suprised if anyone can namwe me 3 of their songs.


I'm a rock guy what can i say.

[sharpshooter]

Just doesn't fit Quantum of Solace or Daniel Craig's bond.

Massively disagree. "No Good About Goodbye" is the type of song Quantum of Solace required. Not a cringe worthy attempt at rock with questionable lyrics. "Another Way to Die" is out of place. It doesn't compliment the film's vibe or reference the themes in a satisfactory manner. Bassey's effort is a class above anything "Another Way to Die" offers.

[DaveBond21]

ok first good to see I'm not the only one who thinks it wouldn't work.

this is Moonraker Backwards. In other words bland forgettable and Just doesn't fit Quantum of Solace or Daniel Craig's bond. I'm listening to it as I type this. IJust don't like it at all.


Ok Now I'm gonna listen to the much Better another way to die while typeing this part.


I can walk away and do other things yet Another way' to die's riff is implanted in my brain the bassey song It just ended 5 seconds ago and i don't remeber a thing about it. before people say "well you only want the next pop artist for bond"

No I want either Yes or Paul Mcartney again Neither of them are new and one well yeah If anyone on this forum can name me the current lineup of yes without cheating (going to their site or another site) I'd be really dam suprised. Hell I'd be suprised if anyone can namwe me 3 of their songs.


I'm a rock guy what can i say.

I can guarantee that neither Paul McCartney or Yes will provide the theme for Bond 23. Are "Yes" even still together? They reached their peak in 1977 surely?

[Matt_13]

It's adequate. Both songs are pretty mediocre. I honestly don't know which I like more, but this is incredibly interesting.

[Qwerty]

I like it. Not as good as her Goldfinger or Moonraker songs but a very good modern Bassey song.

Completely agreed.

[Matt_13]

The one thing I will say is that she does sound absolutely wonderful and it is truly remarkable that she is still able to sing that well. Bravo my dear!

[Dekard77]

I prefer AWTD. Maybe cos I loved the main titles. This one seems moody/depressing and dated. However Arnold's intrumental/theme used is really amazing. I feel Barry worked wonders with Bassey. Especially with DAF.

[Captain Tightpants]

I didn't like it. It was too obvious, too up-front. It was like the fan-made song that basically recited the Bond/Vespr dialoue from CASINO ROYALE.

[JADSTERSDAD]

It's good I guess, but can't say I care for it that much. Forgettable, a bit dull, and honestly I'm not even 2 minutes in and it's beginning to annoy me a little bit. Another Way to Die wasn't by any means the best Bond theme, but it was certainly better than this. Now then, time to arm the blast shields...

Fire all phasers and photon torpedoes! AWTD better than this? I give up on any consensus about 'quality' Bond. AWTD cds aren't fit to be coffee coasters for Shirley, David and Don while they were recording this BOND song!

I prefer AWTD. Maybe cos I loved the main titles. This one seems moody/depressing and dated. However Arnold's intrumental/theme used is really amazing. I feel Barry worked wonders with Bassey. Especially with DAF.

This post confused me. Which instrumental? The only recognisable one is A Night At The Opera (which IS amazing, admittedly).

I hated the titles also. Scrap them and get Danny Kleinman back to work something up for this song. Trust me, if you saw that combination at the beginning of the film after the chase (and including the gunbarrel where it OUGHT to be) then we would have had a chance at a film that rivalled Casino Royale.

[Mr Teddy Bear]

What a dirge! Within seconds I knew it was just a lazy rewrite of Surrender and The World Is Not Enough, the former of which is itself a rewrite of Diamonds Are Forever and the latter is just ... well, the soundtrack to a funeral to be honest.

I really think that recreating the sound and style of the classic Bond songs is no way to go about it. Just think of Live And Let Die, Nobody Does It Better, A View To A Kill, You Know My Name ... all gave something 'new' to the series, while definitely giving the Bond vibe. White and Keys may have failed with their song, but at least it was its own man, as it were. It crackles and moves along nicely, and I'd take that over the Bassey song any day.

Couldn't agree more.

This is a terribly dull song. And this coming from someone who liked Surrender and The World is Not Enough for what they are. This new one sounds like it belongs on one of those imitation Bond commercials you see for lipstick or other such product.

All credit to Bassey, though - her voice hasn't aged a day since Goldfinger.

[HellIsHere]

Moderator's note: Please do not request tracks from this album.

[[dark]]

Looks like there might be something to this... We put the question to David Arnold via Twitter and this was his response:

i started on ideas for the song during QOS, hence the string line that opens the song,only a couple of lines ,once jack and alicia came on board , we didnt do anything else.When asked to produce Shirley Basseys album,myself and Don finished it for her

[Simon]

The 'what if' threads usually tire me senseless but I must admit to feeling Shirley Bassey's song would have benefitted QoS in some small way. If not from a revenue point of view, then certainly a class one.

I really thought that over time, my appreciation of AWTD would have grown the way it did with YKMN once it had the titles slapped over it and it had become a part of the canon.

It has not come about for AWTD, and this is in no small way for me, also due to the horrendous titles sequence that totally failed to serve either the song or the film.

So to this end, I believe Shirley's song would have also required a Dan K work of art to bring it all about.

Preferred Surrender, DAF, Mr. But her voice, it does create tingles down the spine.

[Trident]

Looks like there might be something to this... We put the question to David Arnold via Twitter and this was his response:

i started on ideas for the song during QOS, hence the string line that opens the song,only a couple of lines ,once jack and alicia came on board , we didnt do anything else.When asked to produce Shirley Basseys album,myself and Don finished it for her

Aw, bloody hell, what a shame!

I actually liked AWTD quite some initially, but have to conced it didn't age well (if the few months since QOS can be regarded as aging process; probably not). But NGAG would have had some potential, without a doubt. White/Keys' duett unfortunately lacks practically every potential to become a 'classic', while Bassey on the other hand would have blown lots of volume into the titles with this piece, especially considering Arnold might have taken it some steps further in Bond's direction.

[marktmurphy]

Arnold did work on AWTD; perhaps suggested that motif and/or the title- I always thought it referenced the 'Another Way to Die' line from the song: it's the same number of notes, after all. Although it had its roots in Quantum, I don't think this is the great lost Bond song. Shame he didn't dig 'I Will Return' up from the grave: I like that tune.

I really like AWTD as a song: I think it's a proper rock song. Great though You Know My Name is, it's a bit 'dad rock'.

[Gabriel]

Another Way to die was the ing , up, y, third rate excuse for a theme song ever to make it on to the opening titles of a Bond film. That a producer or a marketing guy could sit there and listen to that piece of and say 'Well done folks! That's a great Bond theme tune and a great piece of music in its own right!' beggars all belief!

Edited by Gabriel, 11 November 2009 - 01:10 PM.

[JADSTERSDAD]

Looks like there might be something to this... We put the question to David Arnold via Twitter and this was his response:

i started on ideas for the song during QOS, hence the string line that opens the song,only a couple of lines ,once jack and alicia came on board , we didnt do anything else.When asked to produce Shirley Basseys album,myself and Don finished it for her

Brilliant. Thanks for eliciting that. Twitter has some uses! Try asking him about "I Will Return"!

I can't get the hang of it. Is is right that you can't post comments on Twitter unless someone chooses you (like a friend in Facebook)?

[Dekard77]

What a dirge! Within seconds I knew it was just a lazy rewrite of Surrender and The World Is Not Enough, the former of which is itself a rewrite of Diamonds Are Forever and the latter is just ... well, the soundtrack to a funeral to be honest.

I really think that recreating the sound and style of the classic Bond songs is no way to go about it. Just think of Live And Let Die, Nobody Does It Better, A View To A Kill, You Know My Name ... all gave something 'new' to the series, while definitely giving the Bond vibe. White and Keys may have failed with their song, but at least it was its own man, as it were. It crackles and moves along nicely, and I'd take that over the Bassey song any day.

Couldn't agree more.

This is a terribly dull song. And this coming from someone who liked Surrender and The World is Not Enough for what they are. This new one sounds like it belongs on one of those imitation Bond commercials you see for lipstick or other such product.

All credit to Bassey, though - her voice hasn't aged a day since Goldfinger.

Here here!!!!!

[tim partridge]

I think this song sums up everything wrong with what irks me about David Arnold and Bond. It sounds to me like a bloated, pastiche Marks and Sparks Christmas ad nightmare.

I think it's a cheap hodgepodge of Barry OHMSS period synth and bass licks (which are repeated throughout), and DAF orchestration (which he already did on the SHAKEN NOT STIRRED album). It maybe sincere but it just seems fanboyish to me. At 1.14 and 2.24 you can hear that synth murmur straight out of SURRENDER (a song made well over ten years ago), and that seems to be the sole attempt to keep it contemporary. Not to mention the drum and horn line sounds exactly the same as SURRENDER too. It seems to be all the same 1993 trip hoppy tricks we saw on PLAY DEAD (but without the Bomb the Bass spike of that classic).

I think Bond songs are best produced by qualified pop song people, and not a composer whose sole pop ventures have revolved around Bond. The result seems very out of touch and dated. Listen to the orchestral pop Trevor Horn did for the new Robbie Williams album (Bodies etc), which I think shows how to do relevant, big orchestral pop in the Bond sense. I like Arnold's melodies, and I thought his QOS score was his best yet, but I think we could get so much more from his Bond.

Don Black with Bond isn't my cup of tea at all (love TO SIR WITH LOVE). I'd be interested in hearing Bricusse or David return (I'd even take Tim Rice)...

In my opinion, at least it seems they tried to capitalise on the Ronson/Winehouse magic with awkward substitutes Jack White and Alicia Keyes. I think at least they got the direction right, even if the song wasn't great.

[David Schofield]

I think this song sums up everything wrong with what irks me about David Arnold and Bond. It sounds to me like a bloated, pastiche Marks and Sparks Christmas ad nightmare.

Yup.

This is Bond theme as Bond theme as pastiche of Bond theme. Bond music for those that think only the 60s Bonds count and EON hasn't been the same since the "passing" of C. Broccoli, T. Young, R. Maibaum, P. Hunt, K. Adam, J. Barry & Co.

This WORKS with a 6'2" very good, looking perma-tan lead in a vintage silver Aston Martin, permanently overdressed and with leggy-lovelies at every turn chasing a very bald villain.

This don't work with Dan Bond. Like many of those dated Bond cliched EON sort to avoid when they appointed him.

[JADSTERSDAD]

I think this song sums up everything wrong with what irks me about David Arnold and Bond. It sounds to me like a bloated, pastiche Marks and Sparks Christmas ad nightmare.

Yup.

This is Bond theme as Bond theme as pastiche of Bond theme. Bond music for those that think only the 60s Bonds count and EON hasn't been the same since the "passing" of C. Broccoli, T. Young, R. Maibaum, P. Hunt, K. Adam, J. Barry & Co.

This WORKS with a 6'2" very good, looking perma-tan lead in a vintage silver Aston Martin, permanently overdressed and with leggy-lovelies at every turn chasing a very bald villain.

This don't work with Dan Bond. Like many of those dated Bond cliched EON sort to avoid when they appointed him.

Sorry, but to suggest something's bad/inappropriate because it's old/nostalgic etc. is crude and just wrong. Why do you think there's been so much fanfare and success about Shirley Bassey's comeback in general? Why was there so much praise (and there was) for David Arnold's Tomorrow Never Dies score after the massive misstep of Goldeneye?

And what about John Barry's Octopussy theme? Very popular, very lightweight, very retro. Terence Young? Great! Martin Campbell? Also great. Things can move on but still retain some measure of what made a series and a character compelling. This song would have filled the bill. The White/Keys song? That belongs...... hell, it doesn't belong anywhere! Except in a bargain bin. No, wait. A trash bin.

Poll.....poll........POLL!

[David Schofield]

I think this song sums up everything wrong with what irks me about David Arnold and Bond. It sounds to me like a bloated, pastiche Marks and Sparks Christmas ad nightmare.

Yup.

This is Bond theme as Bond theme as pastiche of Bond theme. Bond music for those that think only the 60s Bonds count and EON hasn't been the same since the "passing" of C. Broccoli, T. Young, R. Maibaum, P. Hunt, K. Adam, J. Barry & Co.

This WORKS with a 6'2" very good, looking perma-tan lead in a vintage silver Aston Martin, permanently overdressed and with leggy-lovelies at every turn chasing a very bald villain.

This don't work with Dan Bond. Like many of those dated Bond cliched EON sort to avoid when they appointed him.

Sorry, but to suggest something's bad/inappropriate because it's old/nostalgic etc. is crude and just wrong. Why do you think there's been so much fanfare and success about Shirley Bassey's comeback in general? Why was there so much praise (and there was) for David Arnold's Tomorrow Never Dies score after the massive misstep of Goldeneye?

And what about John Barry's Octopussy theme? Very popular, very lightweight, very retro. Terence Young? Great! Martin Campbell? Also great. Things can move on but still retain some measure of what made a series and a character compelling. This song would have filled the bill. The White/Keys song? That belongs...... hell, it doesn't belong anywhere! Except in a bargain bin. No, wait. A trash bin.

Poll.....poll........POLL!

Everything you suggest harks to the past of Bond, though, as this theme does - rather than being a new direction for the future.

Just as Dan Bond is different, so - creatively - the future should be to the past.

Reheating cliches and labelling them "retro" is the defence of the forwardly-uncreative, I'd suggest.

However unappealing AWTD might have been, there is no need to fall back on 60s lounge.

[Trident]

I think this song sums up everything wrong with what irks me about David Arnold and Bond. It sounds to me like a bloated, pastiche Marks and Sparks Christmas ad nightmare.

Yup.

This is Bond theme as Bond theme as pastiche of Bond theme. Bond music for those that think only the 60s Bonds count and EON hasn't been the same since the "passing" of C. Broccoli, T. Young, R. Maibaum, P. Hunt, K. Adam, J. Barry & Co.

This WORKS with a 6'2" very good, looking perma-tan lead in a vintage silver Aston Martin, permanently overdressed and with leggy-lovelies at every turn chasing a very bald villain.

This don't work with Dan Bond. Like many of those dated Bond cliched EON sort to avoid when they appointed him.

But actually Arnold stated it started out as a Bond theme, but wasn't pursued after White came on board. Question would be, how much would NGAG have changed if it had been forged into shape?


I don't think it would have necessarily have been the epitome of the generic Bond song. Sure, it would never have been as controversial and distictive as AWTD. But nonetheless I think it still could have been a decent song even for the Craigsmeister.

[Mr_Wint]

I think this song sums up everything wrong with what irks me about David Arnold and Bond. It sounds to me like a bloated, pastiche Marks and Sparks Christmas ad nightmare.

Yup.

This is Bond theme as Bond theme as pastiche of Bond theme. Bond music for those that think only the 60s Bonds count and EON hasn't been the same since the "passing" of C. Broccoli, T. Young, R. Maibaum, P. Hunt, K. Adam, J. Barry & Co.

This WORKS with a 6'2" very good, looking perma-tan lead in a vintage silver Aston Martin, permanently overdressed and with leggy-lovelies at every turn chasing a very bald villain.

This don't work with Dan Bond. Like many of those dated Bond cliched EON sort to avoid when they appointed him.

Sorry, but to suggest something's bad/inappropriate because it's old/nostalgic etc. is crude and just wrong. Why do you think there's been so much fanfare and success about Shirley Bassey's comeback in general? Why was there so much praise (and there was) for David Arnold's Tomorrow Never Dies score after the massive misstep of Goldeneye?

And what about John Barry's Octopussy theme? Very popular, very lightweight, very retro. Terence Young? Great! Martin Campbell? Also great. Things can move on but still retain some measure of what made a series and a character compelling. This song would have filled the bill. The White/Keys song? That belongs...... hell, it doesn't belong anywhere! Except in a bargain bin. No, wait. A trash bin.

Poll.....poll........POLL!

Everything you suggest harks to the past of Bond, though, as this theme does - rather than being a new direction for the future.

Just as Dan Bond is different, so - creatively - the future should be to the past.

Reheating cliches and labelling them "retro" is the defence of the forwardly-uncreative, I'd suggest.

However unappealing AWTD might have been, there is no need to fall back on 60s lounge.

The trick is not to make everything "different". If it was so easy then anyone could make a great Bondfilm. The big challenge is of course to find the right balance between nostalgia and a contemporary style. This is true for anything related to Bond. And this is the way Bondfilms (or any other genre) move forward with time.

But let's not make this so complicated.

AWTD v.s. NGAG - Which one do you prefer?

[David Schofield]

The trick is not to make everything "different". If it was so easy then anyone could make a great Bondfilm. The big challenge is of course to find the right balance between nostalgia and a contemporary style. This is true for anything related to Bond. And this is the way Bondfilms (or any other genre) move forward with time.

Well, my idea what movies take Bond forward and away from - as far as possible - Bondian cliche are LTK, CR and QOS.

Hybrid, undecided movies of the Brosnan era are for other tastes.

[SecretAgentFan]

I think this song is nice and Bondian - but it lacks the special hook that would elevate it to the highs of the previous Bassey Bond songs.

And although I was critical of AWTD - it is more distinctive IMO.

[plankattack]

But let's not make this so complicated.

AWTD v.s. NGAG - Which one do you prefer?

Very true. While I do agree that Bond 2.0 shouldn't be afraid to dump some of the old cliches, I don't think it should be done just for the sake of doing so. I just don't think NGAG is very good, not because it's "nostalgic" or "retro" I just don't think it hangs together as a song. TWINE on the other hand is a far more successful Arnold "nod" to the past and I have no problem with it being in a post-60s Bond flick.

I do agree (with Tim Partridge I think) that Arnold gets himself into trouble when he's too busy attempting to reference the "old days." CR is a great theme tune, and a terrific soundtrack in classic Bond-style, yet never once do I think any moment is a "nod" or a "tribute" to Barry. It's a difficult, but not impossible balancing act to pull off. I just don't think NGAG succeeds.