955 replies to this topic

[JameswpBond]

I see a lot of myself in the James Bond of the books apart from the knowledge of food.

[tonymascia1]

The classlessness of the modern director has something to do with the demise of the classical Hollywood studio system, perhaps. The studio system relied on rules, codes and etiquette- its primary artists dressed as stylishly as its stars. Many directors wore dandyish clothes. And that had practical justifications: when working in the comfort of a studio, it is much easier to keep your suit in fine condition. When 'the movies' moved outside the studio, and filmmaking began to involve more and more location work, we saw the emergance of the hands-on, technician-director, with his Peter Pannish garderobe of shorts and baseball cap (of course, this law never applied to Western / outdoors directors of the studio days, like John Ford- although even they had far more sense of personal style than most modern day directors). I think a more casual sense of dress was also a means of rebelling against what was regarded as studio era 'stuffiness' in the late 1960s. Hmmm, the Sixties...

I certainly can't argue, Lounge Lizard, that the director should be free to dress any way he wants, while working, and definitely while on location.

Nevertheless, it could not be too much of a stretch of Mr. Campbell's imagination to figure that the eyes of the entertainment world and its fans would be on him that day. As well, James Bond -- both the man and the franchise -- have always attempted, and usually with success, to convey an image of elegance. Mr. Campbell, as a key figure in the press conference, should have shown more respect for the press, the audience, and the memory of Cubby Broccoli's beloved creation -- a creation, I might add, beloved by many largely because of his invariably tasteful sartorial appearance.

Fashion, in general, has become a sign of the times.

Look at photos of Terence Young (director of DN, FRWL, and TB) --- style and panache he passed on to Sean Connery. This worked so well...

"Style" is another reason I like Bond. Except for a few shaky choices during Roger Moore's stewardship, I've gotten more out of what Our Hero wears than from a million fashion magazines or well-meaning girlfriends.

Edited by tonymascia1, 19 October 2005 - 05:51 PM.

[WC]

"Style" is another reason I like Bond.  Except for a few shaky choices during Roger Moore's stewardship,  I've gotten more out of what Our Hero wears than from a million fashion magazines or well-meaning girlfriends.

Really? I guess I went for the wrong fashion choices in retrospect. Better get rid of that safari jacket, flares, gold button blazers or big seventies collars. So much for that wardrobe!

[tonymascia1]

[quote name='Welshcat' date='19 October 2005 - 13:56'][quote name='tonymascia1' date='19 October 2005 - 17:49']
"Style" is another reason I like Bond.

[Dalton's Wendy]

[quote name='Lounge Lizard' date='19 October 2005 - 13:44'][quote name='Dalton's Wendy' date='19 October 2005 - 18:38']I certainly can't argue, Lounge Lizard, that the director should be free to dress any way he wants, while working, and definitely while on location.

Nevertheless, it could not be too much of a stretch of Mr. Campbell's imagination to figure that the eyes of the entertainment world and its fans would be on him that day.

[Kara Milovy]

You're most welcome luv.

Here's some ammo for you ladies although it may be the obvious given the new 007.

A number of ladies I know have been more vocal about Craig and seem to be going both extremes - He's either repulsive or devistatingly handsome. Your thoughts either way?

Well, I find him very unattractive, but I'm going to see more of his movies. I've only seen him in Road to Perdition, and he was such a CREEP in that.

But I do agree that I know quite a number of women who have no interest in Bond but tolerated going to the films because of Pierce. I think Pierce (who is not my personal favorite in the sexy department) has the most chick-appeal of any Bond since Connery.

But Bryce, you're much better looking than this Craig guy!

[Kara Milovy]

I hate to have to say it, but, in my humble opinion, Craig is just lacking in the departments of class -- and it.

Perfect summary.

[tonymascia1]

Which Bond women did any of you find disappointing, annoying, or otherwise setting back the cause of both Bond movies and equality?

For me, Mary Goodnight is an obvious choice. It was very smart to keep her in a bikini for a long while in that movie; I think much better dialogue and bits of action could have been written for her, without taxing Britt Ekland's talents.

My Stacey Sutton comments would be about the same as those for Mary Goodnight. For some reason, she may be the most conservatively dressed Bond girl in the series, something I can't believe Tanya Roberts (one year removed from "Sheena") would have demanded.

A surprise for some of you may be Daniella Bianchi's character in FRWL. While she is doped up for part of the film, her "oh James" may be as annoying as anyone's in the entire series.

Part of what makes Bond movies stand out for me are when he encounters capable women. What fun is it to have Our Hero --- or any other self-respecting man ---wear a "Bimbo Albatross" around his neck?

Edited by tonymascia1, 19 October 2005 - 06:18 PM.

[Kara Milovy]

Perhaps posing a question our fine female members is the best way to kick off this thread (which I do think is a good idea). Let's stay away from Craig for the moment (please), and instead ask which Bond or which Bond film is the film that made you a fan? A female Bond fan is a unique creature and I'm always interested in knowing how she caught what is a traditionally male illness.

Well, you know this about me, Zen, but for the general edification of the folder

I saw DAF as a girl and I loved it, and all the Connery films I saw, but I was turned off by Moore.

What made me a hard-core, can't-live-without-him Bond fan was TLD. The thrill, the excitement, the romance, the style. This was the perfect film to remind me that I had always loved Bond and always would. Roger Moore could never do that for me, not even Pierce did that for me because I'd seen TND by then, only a viewing of TLD on video in 1999 brought me home.

[Kara Milovy]

The lovely coda which I must add to the Goldfinger story is that, some years after the fact, I met, and had cocktails with, Sean Connery!

Okay, that just made my body hurt.

Can I come to your house and kill you?

[Kara Milovy]

Great thread!
We all know that James Bond is someone that every man wants to be him and every woman wants to go to bed with. That was the case with Connery, Moore and Brosnan. Lazenby and Dalton came pretty close too. (Sorry Wendy!) I just don't see that with Daniel Craig (yet).

I have to say that I don't think I know any women who want (or wanted) to sleep with Moore (even in his prime). I can't even visualize the event.

The Bond films during Moore's tenure were less of sex-and-thrills and more of comedy-and-exotica. There was a more unisex appeal.

[WC]

Which Bond women did any of you find disappointing, annoying, or otherwise setting back the cause of both Bond movies and equality?

For me, Mary Goodnight is an obvious choice.  It was very smart to keep her in a bikini for a long while in that movie; I think much better dialogue and bits of action could have been written for her, without taxing Britt Ekland's talents.

My Stacey Sutton comments would be about the same as those for Mary Goodnight.  For some reason, she may be the most conservatively dressed Bond girl in the series, something I can't believe Tanya Roberts (one year removed from "Sheena") would have demanded.

A surprise for some of you may be Daniella Bianchi's character in FRWL.  While she is doped up for part of the film, her "oh James" may be as annoying as anyone's in the entire series.

Part of what makes Bond movies stand out for me are when he encounters capable women.  What fun is it to have Our Hero --- or any other self-respecting man ---wear a "Bimbo Albatross" around his neck?

For me:

1. Halle Tosis in DAD. Definitely not a breath of fresh air to the series. We could've done without her overdominance and ghastly acting. When she rose out of the sea (apparently a la Ursula Andress), you just wanted to re-enact another classic Connery moment: plunging her back in, a la Bambi and Thumper!

2. Michelle Yeoh - she was where the "Bond Woman" rot was beginning to set in.

3. Teri Hatcher - as much as i like the actress, she didn't really seem to belong in a Bond movie - she started this current trend of having a popular American actress in each film. Please let it stop! Now!

4. Denise Richards - more of this "Bond Woman" nonsense! And now we're meant to believe she's a top nuclear scientist named Christmas Jones? How on earth did they pick her? "Oi, Yule do?"

[Kara Milovy]

Questions for this thread's sponsors (and all other female members)...

What is it that makes a Bond film --- or a Bond actor --- special for you?

What changes in the movies/in Bond himself over the last 40 years you've liked the most?  What changes do you like the least (or out-andout dislike)?  If you could write/produce/direct Your Ultimate Bond Movie, what would you do (other than casting me    )?

They used to say it about Connery

[tonymascia1]

Welshcat,

You're "four-for-four", my friend.

It's interesting how the chemistry PB had with the Bond girls in Goldeneye went right out the window with his subsequent three films (the great Sophie Marceau excepted). Not his fault...

[tonymascia1]

Kara,

Excellent points about the "element of danger". A fine line to be walked, for sure.

Have you seen Layer Cake? Craig's chemistry with Sienna Miller is excellent. It was this movie that lessened any worries of him "crossing the line" as Bond.

While some may point to Layer Cake and say "Sure, they had it --- they were hot and heavy offscreen", I'll just refer them to Gigli, with Jennifer Lopez and Ben Affleck. From watching Gigli, you'd never know those two even knew each other.

Edited by tonymascia1, 19 October 2005 - 07:01 PM.

[zencat]

The Bond films during Moore's tenure were less of sex-and-thrills and more of comedy-and-exotica. There was a more unisex appeal.

Well observed and said, Kara.

[Kara Milovy]

I have a question. It might be one which has already been covered or alluded to elsewhere:

Do you girls prefer Bond (as both a character and movie franchise) to be more PC and less chauvinistic, or vice versa?

I don't think those are the only two choices. Bond was rarely chauvinistic in the movies; a few parochial remarks is all. From Sylvia Trench on, Bond could respect a forward and self-contained woman. In OHMSS, Bond loved Tracy partly because she was a "bird with a wing down," and partly because she was tough enough to come to his rescue in Switzerland.

Should Bond girls be Bond women and virtually Bond's equal (as the franchise has been pushing for in the last few films) or do you like it the way it was in, say, the Connery films or TLD where the female was there merely to be rescued and even, dare I say, romanced?

I don't think we should confine ourselves to one kind of woman. I think the tough spy type of Bond girl is viable, but to believe that's Bond's only potential partner is PC. I'm happy to have a Jinx or a Wai Lin in some movies, if we can have a Kara or a Honey in others.

Let's not forget that all of the Bond girls have been wonderful women, whether or not they could handle a gun! Kara was one of the world's top cellists; that ain't bad! Honey knew all this botany and marine biology and such, and was a tough survivor. The "helpless" Bond girls simply have different areas of expertise.

Much as men like to imagine themselves as Bond, I like to imagine myself as a Bond girl, and I don't think I'll be kicking much a%% anytime soon. So yeah, I like an old-fashioned damsel in distress from time to time.

Edited by Kara Milovy, 19 October 2005 - 07:23 PM.

[Dalton's Wendy]

The lovely coda which I must add to the Goldfinger story is that, some years after the fact, I met, and had cocktails with, Sean Connery!

Okay, that just made my body hurt.

Can I come to your house and kill you?

Sure! Just give me a few days to revise my Will!

P.S. Kara -- he was a dream! Simply oozing with IT!!!

[Kara Milovy]

Which Bond women did any of you find disappointing, annoying, or otherwise setting back the cause of both Bond movies and equality?

Oh, Mary Goodnight gets a bad rap, and for most of the film, it's not her fault. Until the very end, she doesn't do anything terribly stupid, but the film treats her stupidly.

Tiffany Case also gets a bad rap. She's tough and interesting as a diamond smuggler, very self-contained and sexy. It's just that she can't fire a machine gun!

The worst Bond girls are Stacey Sutton and Denise Richards, both bimbos with scientific window dressing. If you're going to cast a bimbo, cast her as a bimbo. Don't have a bimbo pretend to be a geologist or a physicist, it's stupid. And Sutton shrieked. A lot.

I also can't stand Holly Goodhead, who had no chemistry with Bond and was very abrasive.

I love Kara (obviously), Aki, Tanya, Pussy Galore, Honey Ryder...mostly Connery era. Solitaire could have been good but was wasted. I love Anya Amasova. So, I guess it's a mix; not all kickass, not all helpless.

[tonymascia1]

Dalton's Wendy,

Certainly, THIS is the place for "it":

Can you define, or at least give examples, of what you consider "it"? Your lunch with Sir Sean is Exhibit A; any others? Obviously, they don't have to be personal experiences...


This would help me personally. I thought I had "it", but I must have left "it" in my car or in my Brioni suit...

[AnGer 007]

"...have you guys learnt how to make a woman SWOON from Bond??? Yes! because Bond makes us SWOON!...
...he [Craig] doesn't have the style and the IT to me. The IT cannot be defined.. it's just IT.. it's the je ne sais quoi which makes a man irresistible like Bond!..."

Well, I have tried to make women SWOON but I've failed miserably. Women tell me I don't have IT either. So my sympathy goes out to Daniel Craig. I know the feeling buddy.

"Should Bond girls be Bond women and virtually Bond's equal (as the franchise has been pushing for in the last few films) or do you like it the way it was in, say, the Connery films or TLD where the female was there merely to be rescued and even, dare I say, romanced?"

For me Carey Lowell as Pam Bouvier in Licence To Kill was the perfect combination. She was a strong and believable character, she could handle herself and looked gorgeous. And there are many other Bond girls with that perfect mix.
On the opposite sides are the likes of Tanya Roberts and Britt Ekland who did nothing more but scream and look helpless and Wai Lin and Jinx who not only don't need Bond but upstage him at times. Just look at the DAD poster. (Is it a coinsidence that there were rumors of possible Wai Lin and Jinx movie spin-ofs?)

[Colonel Moon]

How many posts

[tonymascia1]

One very interesting thing so far with this thread:

Dalton's Wendy, Alessandra, and Kara Milovy --- you are all big Timothy Dalton (as Bond) fans. I respect the heck out of each of you, but am wondering if "less capable" women (which, unfortunately, are the majority) were more impressed with Sir Roger's interpretation (at Dalton's expense)... aside from all the blah, blah about budget, marketing, and competition, this may be why TLD and LTK underperformed...

My mother (a very capable woman, but not a statistically valid sample) preferred Moore to Dalton, but STILL loves Sean Connery...

It may not be a "danger" thing, or an "it" thing, or a "taste" thing. It may be what Alessandra said on another thread: MARKETING.

What do you think?

[Kara Milovy]

One very interesting thing so far with this thread:

Dalton's Wendy, Alessandra, and Kara Milovy --- you are all big Timothy Dalton (as Bond) fans.  I respect the heck out of each of you, but am wondering if "less capable" women (which, unfortunately, are the majority) were more impressed with Sir Roger's interpretation (at Dalton's expense)... aside from all the blah, blah about budget, marketing, and competition, this may be why TLD and LTK underperformed...

My mother (a very capable woman, but not a statistically valid sample) preferred Moore to Dalton, but STILL loves Sean Connery...

It may not be a "danger" thing, or an "it" thing, or a "taste" thing.  It may be what Alessandra said on another thread: MARKETING.

What do you think?

We need a CBn woman who digs Moore. Are there any?

Like I said before, Moore was a "comic fun" Bond. Women enjoyed the movies for the same reason that men did, and not for the sex. Stylish, yes. Sexy, no.

[Athena007]

We need a CBn woman who digs Moore. Are there any?

Like I said before, Moore was a "comic fun" Bond. Women enjoyed the movies for the same reason that men did, and not for the sex. Stylish, yes. Sexy, no.

*raises hand*

And actually, I think Moore is/was damn sexy as Bond.

My Ranking:
1. Moore / Brosnan
2. Lazenby
3. Dalton / Connery

[WC]

well yea there's a LOT more to Bond.
for example.. have you guys learnt how to make a woman SWOON from Bond??? Yes! because Bond makes us SWOON!

Hmmm... I must be doing something wrong here. I've been trying to imitate Bond in all my activities and somehow I've been doing quite the opposite of making them swoon. Here are a few examples:

1. At a gathering of the Feminist's Society the other day, I slapped a woman's bottom while walking past and uttered the lines, "man talk!"

2. Then, I accompanied a friend to one of her therapy sessions. She had trouble sharing. I said "Here. Let me help you get something off your chest."

3. At a visit to the dentist, a lovely new female had just joined. I thought I'd do my Bond impression when she took out her dental instruments. I said "wait till you get to my teeth!".

4. With a former girlfriend, after a night of passion, I tried to say something distinctly Bondian when she wanted me to speak tenderly to her. I said "My dear, you don't think it gave me any pleasure do you? What I did, I did for Queen and country."

5. On another occasion with this same ex-girlfriend, I was helping her colour her hair. She asked that I read out the instructions on the packet. I said "You expect me to talk?" to which she replied "No, I expect you to dye."

6. One day my ex and I went swimming. I decided to compiment her. I said "You swim like a man!"

7. The last straw with this ex-girlfriend was after a stunning concert in which she was the lead Cellist. Afterwards, when she asked me how she sounded, I replied "Why didn't you learn to play the violin?"

So... like I said, for some reason my attempts at being like Bond to the females seems to have failed. No swooning from them whatsoever ! I can't imagine why!

[Dalton's Wendy]

We need a CBn woman who digs Moore. Are there any?

Yes, Kara, there certainly is: my dear friend LADY TEMPLAR, who runs a superb website dedicated to Sir Roger. I'll ask her to join us! Good idea!

And -- to my friend Tony -- I will post my IT theory a bit later, since I am presently at the office. Loved your line about the car or the Brioni suit!

[tonymascia1]

We need a CBn woman who digs Moore. Are there any?

Yes, Kara, there certainly is: my dear friend LADY TEMPLAR, who runs a superb website dedicated to Sir Roger. I'll ask her to join us! Good idea!

And -- to my friend Tony -- I will post my IT theory a bit later, since I am presently at the office. Loved your line about the car or the Brioni suit!

Yes, having Lady Templar joining this discussion will be very informative.

Thanks...

[Kara Milovy]

We need a CBn woman who digs Moore. Are there any?

Like I said before, Moore was a "comic fun" Bond. Women enjoyed the movies for the same reason that men did, and not for the sex. Stylish, yes. Sexy, no.

*raises hand*

And actually, I think Moore is/was damn sexy as Bond.

My Ranking:
1. Moore / Brosnan
2. Lazenby
3. Dalton / Connery

Wow. That's...different.

But it makes sense. Zencat resembles Moore/Brosnan more than he does the other three. No wonder you're such a good match!

[Alessandra]

We need a CBn woman who digs Moore. Are there any?

Like I said before, Moore was a "comic fun" Bond. Women enjoyed the movies for the same reason that men did, and not for the sex. Stylish, yes. Sexy, no.

*raises hand*

And actually, I think Moore is/was damn sexy as Bond.

My Ranking:
1. Moore / Brosnan
2. Lazenby
3. Dalton / Connery

ooooh. interesting rankings. I find the pairs very interesting. Because the actors paired look very different to me, and you must see them in a different way from mine.
I find the couple moore/brosnan very interesting for one thing: they very much differ for physical aspect, but they have in common such an amount of style that nobody (Aside from Dalton in my opinion) can compete.
I take it you are a woman who gives style a great importance Athena! and I would tend to say that style IS very sexy.
wait a sec.. I am certain you give a lot of importance to style, because, like myself, you find Angelina Jolie disgusting!!!
the woman was on vacation when style was distributed...
to get back to the Bond men, I would pair them as follows

1)Brosnan/Dalton
2) Connery
3)Moore/Lazenby.

I do like Timothy Dalton a lot, but I have a weakness for Pierce... he is stylish and just dam sexy and goodlooking even when he wears a pair of jeans and a shirt. (see "laws of attraction") and that is the ultimate proof that a man has style.
Style doesn't come with a Brioni suit (ok let's say not entirely!).. it comes from within. you have IT or you don't! Pierce has tons of IT! (and so does Sir Roger, whom doesn't manage, although, to "make my blood boil" as I say in Italian!).
timothy, aaah timothy. He, too made me swoon. Just a little bit less than Pierce (so Wendy and Kara, I will leave Timothy to you ladies!
As for Mr Sean "the original Bond" Connery.. well he is Bond...and was just too sexy to handle when he started the part... but he just has that little bit of, how can I say.. roughness, going on about him that makes me put him at a lower position.
Lazenby, terrific actor but just wasn't my cup of tea from the looks point of view.. and Sir Roger.. well he is extremely stylish.. but I find him, to a certain extent, a bit "cold". Not that he doesn't kiss Bond girls well, don't misunderstand! lol Maybe, he just was a bit too "detached" for my own taste. Or maybe, since I've always preferred Tony Curtis to him in their fantastic series, I just couldn't betray my first love as a 4-year-old!