2 replies to this topic

[Tiin007]

This is a topic I've been thinking about for some time.

 

Our 24 (and counting) Bond films have loads of characters-- villains, girls, allies. 

 

Yet, I sometimes get the feeling that certain characters would have been enhanced if they had been another, already-existing character in the franchise. 

 

If I am being unclear, I'll give you three examples:

 

1) Pola Ivanova should have been Anya Amasova-- Okay, this one may not fully count because apparently my wish was fulfilled in an earlier draft of the script. Regardless, in AVTAK, Bond meets up with a sexy Soviet agent that he has a history with-- clearly someone whose path he had crossed before. They have a steamy encounter in a hot tub, as Bond tries (and succeeds) at retrieving Pola's recorded tape of Zorin. It would have been a nice nod if, instead of Pola Ivanova, the character was Anya Amasova from TSWLM (I'd have even been okay with Fiona Fullerton still playing the part in place of Barbara Bach). 

 

2) Paris Carver should have been Sylvia Trench Carver-- In TND, Bond reunites with an old flame, who is now married to the film's villain, adding a new layer to the typical Bond girl formula. I think the character could have resonated more with fans had she been a prior Bond girl, as the name Paris is meaningless to longtime aficionados. What if-- just hear me out-- Elliot Carver's wife was Sylvia Trench from DN and FRWL?  Nothing (other than her name) would need to be changed. Heck, when Bond asks, "was it something I said?" and she responds with the "how 'bout the words 'I'll be right back'?", it would have been a great nod to fans, as abandoning Sylvia for his job was precisely what Bond did on those two occasions. "This job of yours is murder on relationships." It would have gone completely over the heads of the vast majority of the audience, but Bond fans would have appreciated it immensely. (This is much better than the types of winks and nods prevalent in the Craig era.) 

 

3) Craig Mitchell should have been Villiers-- Just after the title sequence of QoS, M's bodyguard tries to release Mr. White and kill M, leading to an epic chase through Sienna. "We have people everywhere." Indeed, having M's personal bodyguard (for eight years!) be a mole should have carried more weight than it did. What if, instead of creating a character named Mitchell we have never seen or heard of before, the character was instead Villiers (M's secretary) from the previous movie? We already know that Villier's globe-trots with M (accompanied her to the Bahamas in CR), and having him serve as the mole in MI6 would not only have carried emotional weight (we had seen him throughout the previous film), but also would have explained what exactly happened to him. As things currently stand, we have no idea what happened to Villiers after CR. Disposing of him this way would have also been a nice transition to Bill Tanner-- who essentially plays the Villier's role throughout the rest of QoS anyway. 

 

Anyway, those are three I would suggest, each of which I believe would have greatly enhanced their respective characters. 

 

Which Bond characters do you wish had been consolidated into one?

 

[Professor Pi]

Initial drafts of Die Another Day had Jinx as Wai Lin.  That might have worked as an anniversary nod, but Bond films don't like to repeat their heroines.

 

I like your idea for #3, Villiers being Mitchell, though I couldn't see the actor they cast as surviving long in a fight with Bond.

 

I think having Anya in AVTAK would have taken the audience out of the movie, and somewhat diminished Anya's character.  Pola seemed much shallower.

 

Sylvia Trench would be tough to do what with the time and different Bond actor (three removed, right?)  Plus, that was only Pierce's second movie, though having Paris be Pam Bouvier or Kara Milovy would have been a nice tie-in to Dalton's Bond.  But both those characters are deeper than Paris' (why did she marry Carver anyway?  Allways seemed like a gold digging move.)  In that regards, Talisa Soto's Lupe Lamora would have been an ideal fit, though she never lived with Bond, let alone a serious relationship.

 

They do have recurring characters as Bond's male allies.  Felix Leiter (David Hedison being the only repeat actor 'til Jeffrey Wright,)  Joe Don Baker's Wade, Robbie Coltraine's Dimitri Zukovsky, Bill Tanner, and Robinson.  They also did this with JW Pepper and Jaws.

 

The idea with the women characters is to introduce someone new, both to Bond and his audiences.  I don't think they'll ever revisit a female character that was with Bond (the joke with both Sylvia and Moneypenny is that they never hookup with Bond.)  I wold have liked to have seen Olga Kurylenko's character again, and perhaps Monica Belluci's in the next Bond, but that seems unlikely.  Plus it would seem kind of a cheat in lieu of creating and developing a new character. 

[Tiin007]

If Moore, Dalton, and even (subtly) Brosnan could all reference Tracy, then I don't think bringing back Sylvia Trench (whose history with Bond is already fully covered in the existing Paris dialogue) would be such a stretch, particularly as the goal would not be for casual viewers to catch it anyway. Of your suggestions, Lupe Lamora would have been the best option, I think.

 

 

The idea with the women characters is to introduce someone new, both to Bond and his audiences.  I don't think they'll ever revisit a female character that was with Bond (the joke with both Sylvia and Moneypenny is that they never hookup with Bond.)  I wold have liked to have seen Olga Kurylenko's character again, and perhaps Monica Belluci's in the next Bond, but that seems unlikely.  Plus it would seem kind of a cheat in lieu of creating and developing a new character. 

 

I think that is the problem. Oddly enough, while I am totally fine with sticking with the formula, I find the notion of a classic Bond girl a bit outdated at this point. My brother once pointed out to me that he thinks SF is the only entry in the franchise without a traditional Bond girl (Severine is fleeting, Eve is Moneypenny and as far as we know does not sleep with Bond, and M is... well... M), and I think that is one of the reasons I enjoy SF so much. It felt refreshing. One does not need to completely subvert the formula to feel fresh and modern; one only needs to remove the too-tired trope of the classic Bond girl.

 

QoS, after the loss of Vesper, should have been the film to break from tradition in this regard (and probably could have been, had Fields not been in the movie, leaving Camille as more of an ally than a typical Bond girl). And I'd even go so far as to say that Madeline really pulled down SP for me, although that may have been more an issue of execution than a need to shoehorn in a serious relationship for Bond. 

 

Moving forward, I'd be okay with any of the following:

1) Madeline remaining the Bond girl for Bond 25 (could give EON a chance to redeem themselves with her character).

2) No Bond girl for Bond 25.

3) The return of Camille for Bond 25 (I found her to be a better character than Madeline anyway). 

 

New Bond girls don't really get me excited anymore, particularly since EON has felt obliged to give us two (sometimes three) per film.