28 replies to this topic

[seawolfnyy]

After having seen Spectre, while Greene and Quantum are mentioned (very, very briefly) and Mr. White appears, the rest of the film is completely ignored. When Bond is traversing through the abandoned Vauxhall building, photos of Vesper, Le Chiffre, Silva, M and I believe Mr. White too are visible. However, conspicuously absent is Dominic Greene (also, Fields is omitted, though so is Severine). Is possible to think that EON has basically given Quantum of Solace the side-story treatment? It's clear from Casino Royale's end, that it can't be completely erased from history, however, it seems that EON has done their best to tell us that the events of that film have really no bearing on the overall story. It appears to be canon, but not important.

[DamnCoffee]

I think the reason Quantum of Solace was 'side lined' or not given a bigger role to play it events is because it's pretty much a film where nothing really happens. In SPECTRE's grand scheme of things, the plot in Bolivia probably didn't mean much. Greene also wasn't really a high linking operative in Quantum/SPECTRE either, so beyond mentioning him in the case they did in the film (crossing paths with Bond in the past), then mentioning him any other way wouldn't really make much sense.

[MattofSteel]

I think the reason Quantum of Solace was 'side lined' or not given a bigger role to play it events is because it's pretty much a film where nothing really happens. In SPECTRE's grand scheme of things, the plot in Bolivia probably didn't mean much. Greene also wasn't really a high linking operative in Quantum/SPECTRE either, so beyond mentioning him in the case they did in the film (crossing paths with Bond in the past), then mentioning him any other way wouldn't really make much sense.

 

This, and it's a film that a fair majority of people seem to consider their least favourite of Craig's tenure, so the less said about it the better.

[FlemingBond]

how is it nothing really happens? Greene is supposed to be the head of Quantum, Bond takes him down , gets information from him about the other members that MI6 then goes to round up, and then at the end Bond arrests Vesper's boyfriend who was another agent of Quantum romancing girls, getting them blackmailed.

Basically Craig has made 4 movies. in the second film he takes down Quantum....in the 4th he um takes down the group behind Quantum.

Edited by FlemingBond, 07 November 2015 - 11:15 PM.

[deth]

Perhaps cinematically it would have just gotten silly having too many faces to look at...

[Vauxhall]

Greene is mentioned earlier by Blofeld though, and also features on Q's computer screen. It was just too many pictures for the shooting range, and probably an admission that he wasn't as important.

[sharpshooter]

I'm probably not in a position to comment with another week until I see the film. However:

 

My guess is they emphasise the event of CR and SF because they had the greatest impact on Bond, MI6 and could be considered successes. In CR, Vesper was killed and White walked away with the money. We never discover if MI6 recovers it. In SF, Silva bites the dust, but nonetheless, M is killed. 

 

Quantum of Solace bookends CR more than anything, namely the conclusion with Yusef and the Algerian love knots. 

 

Success was salvaged from CR and SF, whereas Greene's scheme failed. He couldn't really hold anything up as his legacy. The only toll Greene inflicts on Bond is the oil death of Fields. And to be cold hearted, she didn't factor into the grand scheme of things. Mathis is killed, but that couldn't be tied to Greene. Mathis was double crossed by his friend the Chief. 

[seawolfnyy]

Damn, I totally forgot about Mathis. It's been awhile since I've watched QoS. It just seems to me that the negative reaction QoS received and the lower box office take than Casino Royale, have made EON really push it to the sidelines. They confirm that Quantum of Solace happened, but it's not important to the overall story. Mr. White continued with SPECTRE even after Quantum folded. I think EON knows that you can't just retcon out $200 million. 

[RMc2]

Perhaps cinematically it would have just gotten silly having too many faces to look at...

 

Pleased to see SPECTRE has access to official publicity stills... 

[deth]

Damn, I totally forgot about Mathis. It's been awhile since I've watched QoS. It just seems to me that the negative reaction QoS received and the lower box office take than Casino Royale, have made EON really push it to the sidelines. They confirm that Quantum of Solace happened, but it's not important to the overall story. Mr. White continued with SPECTRE even after Quantum folded. I think EON knows that you can't just retcon out $200 million. 

 

I think Quantum was mentioned at least once, and so was Greene... they didn't try too hard to make QOS vanish. It's not like Silva was mentioned more than that really.

 

(btw, did anyone else think the Silva tie-in was a bit odd? There was no indication in SF that he had any grander context in mind)

 

 

Perhaps cinematically it would have just gotten silly having too many faces to look at...

 

Pleased to see SPECTRE has access to official publicity stills... 

 

 

Haha! Noticed this too. 

[seawolfnyy]

Well, remember Spectre is everywhere....EVERYWHERE.

[deth]

Well, remember Spectre is everywhere....EVERYWHERE.

 

 

No doubt when Bond stubs his toe, it's because Spectre put the object in his way... plotting the demise of his toe the whole time.

[Dustin]

(btw, did anyone else think the Silva tie-in was a bit odd? There was no indication in SF that he had any grander context in mind)

Very weak link, most unconvincing for me. I can swallow that Quantum is now simply called Spectre and that they have been alive and kicking after QOS until this morning, literally. But Silva was, as far as we learn from SKYFALL, an independent character with independent goals. And Bond would have long since been blasted to smithereens by Silva's gunship if things had been going according to his plan. Which obviously would not have helped Oberhauser with his aspirations to further author Bond's pain.

But then again, maybe Oberhauser just included Silva to further annoy Bond, who knows?

[Walecs]

please delete

Edited by Walecs, 08 November 2015 - 03:57 PM.

[FlemingBond]

Damn, I totally forgot about Mathis. It's been awhile since I've watched QoS. It just seems to me that the negative reaction QoS received and the lower box office take than Casino Royale, have made EON really push it to the sidelines. They confirm that Quantum of Solace happened, but it's not important to the overall story. Mr. White continued with SPECTRE even after Quantum folded. I think EON knows that you can't just retcon out $200 million. 

 

 

Quantum only made $13 million less worldwide than Casino Royale.

[seawolfnyy]

Yes, but Casino Royale's budget was also $50 million less than Quantum of Solace, meaning that QoS did not turn as big of a profit as Casino Royale.

[thecasinoroyale]

I think 'SPECTRE' was what 'Quantum Of Solace' wanted to be for the Craig era but it didn't work, and so a desperate link was formed between the two to make Oberhauser's gang the REAL power.

[Professor Pi]

 

(btw, did anyone else think the Silva tie-in was a bit odd? There was no indication in SF that he had any grander context in mind)


 

Very weak link, most unconvincing for me. I can swallow that Quantum is now simply called Spectre and that they have been alive and kicking after QOS until this morning, literally. But Silva was, as far as we learn from SKYFALL, an independent character with independent goals. And Bond would have long since been blasted to smithereens by Silva's gunship if things had been going according to his plan. Which obviously would not have helped Oberhauser with his aspirations to further author Bond's pain.

But then again, maybe Oberhauser just included Silva to further annoy Bond, who knows?

 

 

I think Silva was on SPECTRE's sub contractor list, but like he did with MI6, Silva went rogue and was just out for himself.  I don't think he answered to anybody after a certain point.

[seawolfnyy]

I think 'SPECTRE' was what 'Quantum Of Solace' wanted to be for the Craig era but it didn't work, and so a desperate link was formed between the two to make Oberhauser's gang the REAL power.

It's pretty much been confirmed by the writers that this is the case. Quantum only existed because EON wanted to return to the days of SPECTRE, but didn't have the rights to use SPECTRE. Though the fact that Quantum was only a branch of SPECTRE kind of diminishes it's impact in Quantum of Solace. Not that they came off as anything more than a bunch of squabbling brats, but still.

[PrinceKamalKhan]

I think 'SPECTRE' was what 'Quantum Of Solace' wanted to be for the Craig era but it didn't work, and so a desperate link was formed between the two to make Oberhauser's gang the REAL power.

Exactly. I just saw SPECTRE and commented to my friends that that's the film I wanted to see after CR.

[graric]

how is it nothing really happens? Greene is supposed to be the head of Quantum, Bond takes him down , gets information from him about the other members that MI6 then goes to round up, and then at the end Bond arrests Vesper's boyfriend who was another agent of Quantum romancing girls, getting them blackmailed.

Basically Craig has made 4 movies. in the second film he takes down Quantum....in the 4th he um takes down the group behind Quantum.

I don't think Greene was supposed to be the head of Quantum, just one of the higher ranking members.
(The way the other members activley question the Bolivia plan in the Opera scene, certainly suggested he wasn'ta single authoriy they all deferred to, but jus one of seeral high ranking members at the meeting.)

[jamie00007]

It annoyed me how much they ignored QoS considering it was the most connected movie of the three to Spectre. I know QoS isn't a universally loved movie, but it was a bit ridiculous when Silva was more prominently featured.

[seawolfnyy]

It annoyed me how much they ignored QoS considering it was the most connected movie of the three to Spectre. I know QoS isn't a universally loved movie, but it was a bit ridiculous when Silva was more prominently featured.

Yea, that's what I don't get either. Silva is retconned to be a major player in Spectre, but in Skyfall it seems to be very clear that he is acting alone.

[deth]

 

It annoyed me how much they ignored QoS considering it was the most connected movie of the three to Spectre. I know QoS isn't a universally loved movie, but it was a bit ridiculous when Silva was more prominently featured.

Yea, that's what I don't get either. Silva is retconned to be a major player in Spectre, but in Skyfall it seems to be very clear that he is acting alone.

 

 

Absolutely, however most movie-goers don't really remember QOS.... but they all remember Skyfall, for various reasons.

[Guy Haines]

I think the reason Quantum of Solace was 'side lined' or not given a bigger role to play it events is because it's pretty much a film where nothing really happens. In SPECTRE's grand scheme of things, the plot in Bolivia probably didn't mean much. Greene also wasn't really a high linking operative in Quantum/SPECTRE either, so beyond mentioning him in the case they did in the film (crossing paths with Bond in the past), then mentioning him any other way wouldn't really make much sense.

I think Greene was a high ranking member of something - whether Quantum alone or both Quantum and SPECTRE (Purvis and Wade's notes in Empire magazine are clear - Greene was in charge of SPECTRE in South America - the confusion lies in the operation being called "Quantum". My guess - given that Madeleine says that Mr White was part of SPECTRE - is that Quantum was a division of the SPECTRE organisation. Given the types who were involved with it - financial types, political types and the like - it was perhaps the financial side of SPECTRE, maybe its hedge fund.)

[Pierceuhhh]

We're putting more thought into it than the writers and producers. That's a little sad when they had two years to write it and get paid what they do, but hey.

I preferred the good-natured old "we don't care and you shouldn't either!" approach fostered by CUBBY. The problem now is that they don't care, but think we do because Sony's market research says audiences today enjoy pointless continuity.

SPECTRE is still a massive step up from the Marvel Nothingverse, which is all buildup and no actual content.

[Makeshift Python]

It comes down to the fact that there was never much of an intimate conflict between Bond and Greene as there was with Le Chiffre, White and SIlva. In the grand scheme of things, Bond was only using Greene to get to someone else, which he himself says with Camile. In the film they only have three very brief moments together. First in the opera, then at the Greene party, and finally the end where Bond takes down Green, sweats him off for information, and leaves him with a can of oil in the middle of the desert.

 

I think a lot of that sums why Greene isn't highly ranked as a villain. Too little conflict and interaction with Bond to make a real impression.

[Dustin]

Greene was more like the henchman of that film, also with regard to the fight. Elvis remains an utterly unthreatening character with very little menace and a killer toupee. So Greene hardly figures in the course of events as more than a footnote.

[seawolfnyy]

Greene was more like the henchman of that film, also with regard to the fight. Elvis remains an utterly unthreatening character with very little menace and a killer toupee. So Greene hardly figures in the course of events as more than a footnote.

I think one could make the argument that Mr. White is the true villain of QoS.