130 replies to this topic

[Guy Haines]

She says, "Fill this beaker for me," and he answers, "From here?"  Which is not only Benny Hill-esque, it's actually FROM Benny Hill.  I've always hoped for an extended version where Bond chases the nurse around the examining room to the tune of "Yakety Sax."
 
I'm not saying I didn't laugh at the "pee" joke, myself, and Connery sells it with his incredulous scowl at the specimen jar ("Damn!  How unhealthy AM I, anyway?") before we learn the real cause of death.  I'm just saying that it keeps the fight from making into the Red Grant/Oddjob/Peter Franks pantheon.
 
NSNA is funny: it starts with the interesting premise of "what if Bond got old," trades on the "We got Connery back!" gimmick and even throws in a cameo by the Bentley.  Then it gets down to the business of trying to be a Roger Moore movie, and never looks back.

Actually the "fill the bottle from there" line was used - also used? - in the pilot episode of the BBC TV sit-com "Porridge", starring Ronnie Barker as convict Norman Stanley Fletcher. He's in the prison doctor's examination room and is asked to provide a sample - Fletcher is at one end, the nurse at the other.

By a curious co-incidence, a couple of writers who were brought in to polish up the NSNA script were Dick Clement and Ian Le Frenais - who just happened to be the script writers for "Porridge"! ;-)

[glidrose]

She says, "Fill this beaker for me," and he answers, "From here?"  Which is not only Benny Hill-esque, it's actually FROM Benny Hill.  I've always hoped for an extended version where Bond chases the nurse around the examining room to the tune of "Yakety Sax."
 
I'm not saying I didn't laugh at the "pee" joke, myself, and Connery sells it with his incredulous scowl at the specimen jar ("Damn!  How unhealthy AM I, anyway?") before we learn the real cause of death.  I'm just saying that it keeps the fight from making into the Red Grant/Oddjob/Peter Franks pantheon.
 
NSNA is funny: it starts with the interesting premise of "what if Bond got old," trades on the "We got Connery back!" gimmick and even throws in a cameo by the Bentley.  Then it gets down to the business of trying to be a Roger Moore movie, and never looks back.

Actually the "fill the bottle from there" line was used - also used? - in the pilot episode of the BBC TV sit-com "Porridge", starring Ronnie Barker as convict Norman Stanley Fletcher. He's in the prison doctor's examination room and is asked to provide a sample - Fletcher is at one end, the nurse at the other.

By a curious co-incidence, a couple of writers who were brought in to polish up the NSNA script were Dick Clement and Ian Le Frenais - who just happened to be the script writers for "Porridge"! ;-)

And who also claim to have been brought in to punch up the Moonraker screenplay after Christopher Wood turned in his draft.

Odd, tho', Moonraker's dialogue & verbal gags sound like Christopher Wood and not Clement and Le Frenais. Perhaps C&LF were responsible for the visual gags and the "I never learned to read" quip all of which Wood detested.

[Surrie]

Having watched 'Moonraker' again yesterday I can confirm that I am a big fan of this installment. It never used to rank particularly highly for me, but after LALD it's my favourite Moore outing. Pacing is good, clear-cut story, excellent villain, beautiful set design and great cinematography. Like most other Bond films, it reflects the cinema trends at the time of release, which I think unfortunately was why it has got a bad rap from some. 

[hoagy]

In this film, unlike most of Sir Roger's Bond films, the awful outweighed the good.  Since much of the awful comes in the final portions of the film, the weight is felt by the viewer moreso.  AVTAK did not come out well on balance, either, but it may be that MR's spectacle made the contrast between good and awful more noticeable.

[SecretAgentFan]

Actually, I would love to see another Bond film taking itself so seriously as MOONRAKER does.

[David_M]

 

 

In this film, unlike most of Sir Roger's Bond films, the awful outweighed the good.  Since much of the awful comes in the final portions of the film, the weight is felt by the viewer moreso.  AVTAK did not come out well on balance, either, but it may be that MR's spectacle made the contrast between good and awful more noticeable.

 

 

I don't know, I think MR has a sense of fun and energy throughout.  It may not be very original -- in fact it's pretty much a remake of the film that preceded it by a mere two years -- but everyone seems to be having fun and determined to outdo themselves, right down to Barry's score and Ken Adam's sets.  For my money, MR was the last BIG Bond, and maybe the  biggest of the lot.

 

AVTAK, on the other hand, felt obligatory and by-the-numbers, and from script to direction to performances, it feels like everyone's attitude is, "well, it's time for another one, so we better get it in the can."  I'm not a big fan of the Duran Duran title song, but to the extent it continues to have a big following, I think it's because it's the only fresh and energetic thing in the whole endeavor. Plus, all of Glenn's entries have something of an "economy class" feel to them.

 

That said, if you're dead set against Bond going in to space, and if you resent naked appeals to the box office "trend du jour", I can see where the last third or so of MR would drive you to drink. 

[Turn]

Couldn't agree more on the above points by David M. MR has a genuine feel of a good time at the movies, which it was when I saw it at age 12 and it blew me away. I still enjoy it and have never agreed with the harsh criticisms. It definitely has cringe-worthy moments, which are outweighed by the good.

 

AVTAK tries to have it both ways, as a more serious thriller and as comedy and works as neither. On an ironic note, critic Jeffrey Lyons on the television film review series Sneak Previews actually said in his review at the time "It's like they said 'come on, guys, time to make another Bond film.'" Walken and the theme song are the only saving graces for me, despite the many retroviews I keep finding fans sharing about how it's an underrated gem.

[BoogieBond]

Yes, probably best to take MR as Epic escapist fun.

The locations are amazing. Love the action sequences, the freefall PTS still holds up. The Ken Adam sets and John Barry music are also great.

I normally watch the first 90 minutes till they get to space. Its a visually stunning thrill ride(albeit with silliness, plot holes) up to then. I do like it a lot as a pure Epic adventure.

[FlemingBond]

i watched Moonraker last night for the first time in probably a dozen years. A plot hole suddenly struck. Why doe Bond and Holly get on board the shuttle?? They don't know about the space station. Where do they think they're going?

[Dustin]

Since the entire staff of Drax' household seems to be clearing out of the base it's just logical that they follow I would have thought. By that time Bond's mission to find the missing Moonraker shuttle was all but finished, he 'found' it, after a manner. Technically the next step would be to identify the people responsible (Drax and friends) and keep them from being naughty again (by killing them). After this priority would be the return of the missing shuttle, though that's kind of a bonus service since space shuttles are not as conveniently driven as Bentleys (or Lotuses) and Bond can not really be expected to land this thingy on Heathrow, 00-prefix or not. Also it's not clear whether Bond returns in the exact same shuttle that was stolen. But we may safely assume this one is just as good...

[sharpshooter]

Why doe Bond and Holly get on board the shuttle?? They don't know about the space station. Where do they think they're going?

They're simply going where the action is. Remaining Earth-bound reduces their usefulness to zero. 

[Surrie]

 

Why doe Bond and Holly get on board the shuttle?? They don't know about the space station. Where do they think they're going?

They're simply going where the action is. Remaining Earth-bound reduces their usefulness to zero. 

 

 

Nicely put, ha!

[hoagy]

In answer to the question which serves as the name of this thread, another question serves well as the response:  Have you seen it ?

[hoagy]

Not saying it did not have good bits, but the awful stuff was so awful that it made it that much MORE of a shame that the good bits were wasted in what was, altogether, awful.  (I know.  I should be imprisoned for murdering grammar and composition with that first sentence.)  Great comeback with the next film, FYEO, though it was not much fun, and OP then brought the fun back in a big. bold glamorous Bond way.  Not a ridiculous Bond-in-outer-space-and-Jaws-is-a-good-guy ! way, but in a way that did not produce groans (but for a few moments where even the wardrobe could not help Bond, and the running-after-the-car bit was not funny and only illustrated badly how the star was too old-looking and out of shape for the film).  Alas, things went way, way down the tubes with AVTAK.  What a shame.  Another waste of some good bits and good actors. They had a money-making machine and just cranked 'em out, good, bad and indifferent.

[DaveBond21]

One of my favourite scenes is Drax on the phone after Bond has killed his henchman:-

 

"Yes a minor crisis has been averted. No, no nothing serious, but all merchandise is to be re-routed as from today. Now, regarding a replacement for Char, you have someone in mind? Oh, yes, well if you can get him...."

 

and the next thing we see is Jaws at airport security. I'd love to know who Drax is talking to - some sort of agency for henchmen! Is that where Sandor came from? Or Locque?

 

_________________________________________________________________________________

[sharpshooter]

Jaws has his loyalty to the highest bidder. Unlike Jaws, people talk on a regular basis and criminals associate with criminals. I'm willing to accept Drax developed these connections in the underworld. And because Jaws had his fingers in many pies, he was known by many in the industry.

[TheREAL008]

Moonraker was flawed by trying to adhere to Star Wars, when it could have been much more.

It's the one movie where I wished it stuck to the plot of the book, albeit in an updated format. ICBM's were becoming all the rage then and it would have been awesome to see Sir Roger's Bond handle something truly sinister as Drax and Moonraker. 

[Surrie]

Moonraker was flawed by trying to adhere to Star Wars, when it could have been much more.

It's the one movie where I wished it stuck to the plot of the book, albeit in an updated format. ICBM's were becoming all the rage then and it would have been awesome to see Sir Roger's Bond handle something truly sinister as Drax and Moonraker. 

 

Although I do agree with you regarding 'sticking to the plot of the book more' I don't think we can blame MR for this. All Bond films have been a reflection of their times and MR was released during Star Wars' hay-day. 

[Dustin]

At the time the space shuttle was 'hot', probably the one BIG machine that was a focus of technological progress and 'the future' in general. Given the way the Bond films were marketed, with science fiction as a closely related genre and a source for many elements and gimmicks, it was hardly feasible the Bond films would not pick up the shuttle - and in MOONRAKER, a title begging to be spiced up with SF.

ICBMs indeed were a topic, but a rather serious one, perhaps too serious from a purely entertaining point-of-view. And in a way they were already used in TSWLM. I can understand why they decided to spin the story in the direction we've seen.

[DaveBond21]

At the time the space shuttle was 'hot', probably the one BIG machine that was a focus of technological progress and 'the future' in general. Given the way the Bond films were marketed, with science fiction as a closely related genre and a source for many elements and gimmicks, it was hardly feasible the Bond films would not pick up the shuttle - and in MOONRAKER, a title begging to be spiced up with SF.

ICBMs indeed were a topic, but a rather serious one, perhaps too serious from a purely entertaining point-of-view. And in a way they were already used in TSWLM. I can understand why they decided to spin the story in the direction we've seen.

 

That's a very good description of the times, Dustin.

 

___________________________________________________________________________________________________________

[sharpshooter]

I think it’s amazing that depending on my mood, Licence to Kill and Moonraker could vie to be my favourite Bond film. And they’re light years apart in tone. I think that says something about the versatility of the character and his world. But also it creates conflict between the fan base given the different sensibilities people have. Therefore I think a balance between the two styles is best going forward. 

[Surrie]

I think it’s amazing that depending on my mood, Licence to Kill and Moonraker could vie to be my favourite Bond film. And they’re light years apart in tone. I think that says something about the versatility of the character and his world. But also it creates conflict between the fan base given the different sensibilities people have. Therefore I think a balance between the two styles is best going forward. 

 

What other film within the franchise would you describe as the best balance between the two...? Just out of interest.

[sharpshooter]

What other film within the franchise would you describe as the best balance between the two...? Just out of interest.

The Living Daylights, perhaps. 

[hilly]

Moonraker is fun and it is entertaining. It shamelessly and unapologetically cashed in on the Star Wars/Close Encounters sci-fi boom of the late 70s and all concerned were clearly on a bit of a high after the success of TSWLM.

I remember reading a quote from Lewis Gilbert, stating that the studio simply wanted the closest thing that they could get to TSWLM without it looking like plagiarism....and it shows. The character-types are supsiciously similar, the set-pieces, in-jokes and gadgets are a bit tokenistic and there does seem to be a sense of "we'll make it bigger than the last one, but it's the same general idea"

There seems to be a slight air of complacency about the film. Moore got a huge payrise,as he was now out of his original 3 picture contract and was negotiating on a film by film basis.Whilst he is great, the cruise control button seems to have been engaged and he seems a little detached from the proceedings (as Connery was, post- Goldfinger).

 

It's still better than AVTAK or DAD though

[Surrie]

Moonraker is fun and it is entertaining. It shamelessly and unapologetically cashed in on the Star Wars/Close Encounters sci-fi boom of the late 70s and all concerned were clearly on a bit of a high after the success of TSWLM.

I remember reading a quote from Lewis Gilbert, stating that the studio simply wanted the closest thing that they could get to TSWLM without it looking like plagiarism....and it shows. The character-types are supsiciously similar, the set-pieces, in-jokes and gadgets are a bit tokenistic and there does seem to be a sense of "we'll make it bigger than the last one, but it's the same general idea"

There seems to be a slight air of complacency about the film. Moore got a huge payrise,as he was now out of his original 3 picture contract and was negotiating on a film by film basis.Whilst he is great, the cruise control button seems to have been engaged and he seems a little detached from the proceedings (as Connery was, post- Goldfinger).

 

It's still better than AVTAK or DAD though

 

This is probably the best summary of MR.

[sharpshooter]

I watched Moonraker again recently in light of Roger Moore's passing. This movie has it all. It's both entertaining and rooted in Fleming.

 

All the boxes are ticked:

 

Bond as a spy – safecracking and investigating warehouses/facilities.

Bond as a daredevil – freefalling, paragliding, sliding down a cable car wire.

Bond as a killer – shooting the sniper, throwing Chang into a piano, wrist gunning Drax.

Bond as a charmer – seducing Corrine, Manuela and Holly, who he sleeps with twice.

Deadly creatures – the python that wraps itself around Bond.

Foreign travel – Venice, Rio and the Amazon are breathtaking.

Masterminds –  The planetary nerve gas plot is Hitler on steroids and Drax's dialogue is razor sharp. 

Horror – Corrine killed by the dogs, Jaws in the clown outfit approaching Manuela.

Dreadful events – The centrifuge ordeal and escaping the shuttle exhaust room.

The bizarre – Jaws and his instant girlfriend Dolly, among other things.

 

Plus, I appreciate the significance of the supporting cast:

 

The last appearance of Bernard Lee as M.

The last time Ken Adam did production design for Bond.

One of John Barry’s best scores – with the last use of the 007 Theme.

Shirley Bassey’s last Bond title song.

 

It's not to everybody's tastes, but space is not a new concept for Bond. Dr No was about the title character toppling rockets. You Only Live Twice had Blofeld hijacking spacecraft. Diamonds Are Forever featured a laser satellite, as does Die Another Day. Goldeneye had the EMP satellite. Moonraker just pushed these concepts further. It's damn fun and has a lot more Fleming touches than it's ever given credit for. 

[SecretAgentFan]

I agree wholeheartedly.

 

Actually, if you took out the spaze laser battle (which I would not take out because I love it) the last act in space would not even be THAT over-the-top (or more than other Bond films).  Of course, this sequence was made only because of STAR WARS - but apart from that, MOONRAKER is an absolutely solid spy adventure.

 

And one of the most consistently entertaining and spectacular ones in the whole series.

[Dustin]

I can imagine Bond back in space some time in the future - all it would take is a plausible reason for him to go there. Regardless how the next few years will play out, it's reasonable to expect a number of prestigious projects to unfold in the not too distant future in near-earth space, a space escalator, a huge ship for the voyage to Mars, a Lunar base. All of these could be targeted by sabotage and might offer the need for a troubleshooter at the spot. Bond could well have use for a space suit again...

[sharpshooter]

I agree wholeheartedly.
 
Actually, if you took out the spaze laser battle (which I would not take out because I love it) the last act in space would not even be THAT over-the-top (or more than other Bond films).  Of course, this sequence was made only because of STAR WARS - but apart from that, MOONRAKER is an absolutely solid spy adventure.
 
And one of the most consistently entertaining and spectacular ones in the whole series.

Yeah. And lasers were introduced as early as Goldfinger. One of the most iconic sequences in Bond history features one. Moonraker only applied this technology in a more prominent way. The laser battle doesn't drag on as much as the underwater sequence in Thunderball either.

[David_M]

I actually had no trouble with Bond going into space.  I think where it tipped too far into fantasy was with the arrival of the Space Marines, which we all knew good and well was not a thing.  Doubtless they're included for the obligatory "battling armies" finale, but it makes no sense for all kinds of scientific, tactical and logical reasons.  By including them, the story's taken out of our world (to the extent Bond has ever been in our world) and into some parallel reality, where of course the US Marines of 1979 have an elite corps of space troops, in case they need to fight...I don't know...Russian space troops?  Klingons?  And obviously they're not a secret force, or else Drax wouldn't have taken the time and expense to outfit his own space troops to handle this one, specific threat (because what good would individually space-suited, laser-armed troops be in any other conceivable scenario?) More importantly, as I noted upthread, the convenient involvement of Space Marines takes most of the burden (and glory) from Bond in his "world saver" role and reduces his showdown with Drax to a mere sidebar event.

 

It would've been more interesting to see how Bond could complete his mission alone (well, with Holly and Jaws) and without all those troops to back  him up.  If you think about it, being on a space station full of enemy operatives, completely separated from any kind of assistance and with no obvious escape plan (it's not like you can climb out a window and run away) would be an extremely tense and high-pressure scenario.  As it is, I feel like the film sort of climaxes with the reveal of the station in the "sunrise," or maybe with Drax's speech.  The laser fight is empty spectacle for me and the "Space Invaders" routine with the falling globes feels like one ending too many.

 

Which is not to say that I don't still love it.  I wish they'd give it a theatrical re-lease so I could show my kids what Bond movies used to be, when they were Bond movies.