44 replies to this topic

[ggl]

 

But... what about this?? http://blogs.indiewi...ontent=Netvibes

 

Is that legal too...??

 

I think this is awful. Just because, legally, it can be done doesn't mean it should be. Especially since the goal seems to be to do it just for the sake of doing it, and re-inventing the character in the process. Not good reasons to rival the "original" Bond series, which is still going strong. If the EON franchise had died off years ago and Bond was stagnant, I would be all for seeing something, someone, bring the character to life again but, in my opinion, Bond doesn't need it just yet.

 

I "understand" Fleming's case (in a Canadian way), but how could you remake 1981's FYEO legally??

[Single-O-Seven]

 

 

But... what about this?? http://blogs.indiewi...ontent=Netvibes

 

Is that legal too...??

 

I think this is awful. Just because, legally, it can be done doesn't mean it should be. Especially since the goal seems to be to do it just for the sake of doing it, and re-inventing the character in the process. Not good reasons to rival the "original" Bond series, which is still going strong. If the EON franchise had died off years ago and Bond was stagnant, I would be all for seeing something, someone, bring the character to life again but, in my opinion, Bond doesn't need it just yet.

 

I "understand" Fleming's case (in a Canadian way), but how could you remake 1981's FYEO legally??

 

 

They can't remake the 1981 film per say. But they can re-do the content of the short story collection, parts of which obviously mirror the `81 movie. Kind of like how, when he got back the rights to Thunderball, Kevin McClory was able to reproduce in NSNA aspects of the novel which had already appeared/been referenced in the 1965 film. So legally they could never use anything original to the script of the `81 film, just material from Fleming's writing,

[Dustin]

I think they will find out that they can't, no.

[IainMcLaughlin]

Copyright is an interesting thing - it's a minefield. I've worked in publishing - variously as a writer, editor and publisher - for 30 years, and every copyright seminar I go to tops the previous one in being convoluted.

 

As the law stands now, I think a film of FYEO *could* be made in Canada but it could use none of the recognisable Bond tropes. It could only use what was in the books... though we would then get into an interesting position if EON were able to prove that Fleming was influnced by the films for later novels, which could at least take aspects of the post 1962 novels out of play... though the burden of proof would be on EON and their lawyers. The most likely enemy for a Canadian FYEO is distribution. Even a pared back adaptation would cost millions. How would they make their money back? Where could they show it? Who could they sell it to? I don't think there is a big enough market out there wher Bond is out of copyright. I don't see how they could make their money back even if they did a faithful adaptation which wouldn't cost the Earth.

 

There's also the question of how long Canada will retain its current copyright law. The previous Canadian administration was coming under pressure from a lot of quarters both internationally and domestically to get into line with the 'death plus 70' ruling. If the new government doesn't cave to pressure... I think there will be a lot of Bond coming through Canada.

 

By the way, in my posting at the top of this page I completely messed up the quote function. I do apologise for that.

[Single-O-Seven]

Yeah, but you made up for it. Good stuff.

[tdalton]

My hope would be that, if they decide to go ahead and do this, that they try to do something faithful to both the character and to the original novels and short stories, and that would include the casting of Bond.

 

In theory, I'm very much on board with someone mounting this kind of operation, assuming that it's done seriously and in an effort to actually do what they state, which is to make an "art house" Bond, because that's exactly what the character needs now that the EON film series has devolved into a self parody where they can't help but be self-referential every few minutes of the now nearly 3-hour long films. 

 

If something like this were to be a success, based on whatever metrics one would need to put in place in order to judge the success or failure of a project with the distribution limitations it would have, it might cause EON to take a look at what they're doing and re-evaluate their take on things.  Very unlikely, I'm aware, but it would be refreshing if EON would actually get back to something close to Fleming rather than just paying that idea lip service.

[ggl]

 

 

 

But... what about this?? http://blogs.indiewi...ontent=Netvibes

 

Is that legal too...??

 

I think this is awful. Just because, legally, it can be done doesn't mean it should be. Especially since the goal seems to be to do it just for the sake of doing it, and re-inventing the character in the process. Not good reasons to rival the "original" Bond series, which is still going strong. If the EON franchise had died off years ago and Bond was stagnant, I would be all for seeing something, someone, bring the character to life again but, in my opinion, Bond doesn't need it just yet.

 

I "understand" Fleming's case (in a Canadian way), but how could you remake 1981's FYEO legally??

 

 

They can't remake the 1981 film per say. But they can re-do the content of the short story collection, parts of which obviously mirror the `81 movie. Kind of like how, when he got back the rights to Thunderball, Kevin McClory was able to reproduce in NSNA aspects of the novel which had already appeared/been referenced in the 1965 film. So legally they could never use anything original to the script of the `81 film, just material from Fleming's writing,

 

Thanks. Now I understand: of course it is not a remake, it can't be a remake. It would be a "readaptation"...

[Single-O-Seven]

What I wonder, as the rights to Fleming are freely available in Canada, could a Canadian film maker go the Eon route in the sense that they could use the characters in a completely original story with a title not from Fleming? Or would they have to stick to adapting a Fleming story to avoid going outside the expired copyright allowances?

[IainMcLaughlin]

What I wonder, as the rights to Fleming are freely available in Canada, could a Canadian film maker go the Eon route in the sense that they could use the characters in a completely original story with a title not from Fleming? Or would they have to stick to adapting a Fleming story to avoid going outside the expired copyright allowances?

They could do whatever they want with it as long as they don't use any of the tropes from the EON series - or indeed anything created specifically for the films. They can add to it, set it in the 1920s, set him in Victorian times against Jack the Ripper, do a full on contemporary thriller... the limits are that they can't use anything created for the films or later non-Fleming novels. But once a character is out of copyright, you can do what you like with them. I think I'd avoid Thunderball like the plague if I was them - that's a whole can of legal worms I wouldn't want to re-open. But pretty much, in Canada, James Bond is fair game, the same way Sherlock Holmes, Allan Quatermain and Tom Sawyer are.

 

But what is theoretically possible and what is logistically and financially possible... those are very different things. Personally if I was in the biz in Canada, I'd do a Bond TV series. I think there's a much better chance of making the money back from a TV series than from a movie.

[Single-O-Seven]

 

What I wonder, as the rights to Fleming are freely available in Canada, could a Canadian film maker go the Eon route in the sense that they could use the characters in a completely original story with a title not from Fleming? Or would they have to stick to adapting a Fleming story to avoid going outside the expired copyright allowances?

They could do whatever they want with it as long as they don't use any of the tropes from the EON series - or indeed anything created specifically for the films. They can add to it, set it in the 1920s, set him in Victorian times against Jack the Ripper, do a full on contemporary thriller... the limits are that they can't use anything created for the films or later non-Fleming novels. But once a character is out of copyright, you can do what you like with them. I think I'd avoid Thunderball like the plague if I was them - that's a whole can of legal worms I wouldn't want to re-open. But pretty much, in Canada, James Bond is fair game, the same way Sherlock Holmes, Allan Quatermain and Tom Sawyer are.

 

But what is theoretically possible and what is logistically and financially possible... those are very different things. Personally if I was in the biz in Canada, I'd do a Bond TV series. I think there's a much better chance of making the money back from a TV series than from a movie.

 

 

 

Thanks for the info. And yes, a TV series might be the best bet if somebody tackles a Bond project. If they do a faithful, period adaptation of Fleming with good production vales, I might be on board, at least enough to watch it with serious interest. As opposed to having films made hoping to "compete" with Eon by doing their own rival, contemporary set series, while trying to work in theme songs and "mirrored" tropes.

[Major Tallon]

In a bit of unexpected irony, Jim our moderator, who in Post #2 above, advised us to "steer clear and watch from afar," is closely paraphrased in the introduction to this book. 

[billy007]

Followed GodwulfAZ's advice and obtained copy through ABE books distributing through Russell Books in BC.

Read first 3 stories so far.  One should be bypassed completely as Bond is comatose during entire event.

Let the individual reader form his/her own opinion. I would consider these stories homages to Fleming.(Because of copyright law all stories have to deal with Fleming's writings. No unique material in movies can be used.)

Opinions?

[GodwulfAZ]

Followed GodwulfAZ's advice and obtained copy through ABE books distributing through Russell Books in BC.

Read first 3 stories so far.  One should be bypassed completely as Bond is comatose during entire event.

Let the individual reader form his/her own opinion. I would consider these stories homages to Fleming.(Because of copyright law all stories have to deal with Fleming's writings. No unique material in movies can be used.)

Opinions?

 

I've read nine of the nineteen stories, so far, and it's most definitely a mixed bag.  The one story you noted ('The Gladiator Lie'?), wherein Bond is unconscious throughout, is just very strange, and I can't recommend either it or the opening entry, 'One is Sorrow' - a pointless little piece involving an adolescent Bond at Eton in what is practically a cameo appearance.  The Lovecraftian, Cthulhu Mythos story, 'The Gale of the World', is both fun and well-written; while essentially sacrilegious to the true Bond in his world, I enjoyed it a lot.  'Half the Sky', 'In Havana', 'Mastering the Art of French Killing' and 'A Dirty Business', were, to various extents, fun, as well, but I'd have to say that the story I read last night - 'Sorrow's Spy' by Catherine McLeod - was the one story that made me think, "Fleming could have written this...or at least liked it." 

[Jim]

A correspondent of mine has kindly (I think it's meant kindly) told me that the 007th Chapter nonsense on Goldfinger is cited in the foreword. Something of a hoot, that.

 

Unless I get to Canada I might never know.

 

I think this might be a trap to lure me to Canada and to my doom.

[Dustin]

Hah! Congrats! Nice of them to ask you first...