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Die Another Day's Redeeming Qualities Are...?


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#31 Hansen

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Posted 19 August 2014 - 05:54 AM

For the record, in regards of Cuba scenes, they were all shot in Spain.

It makes Cuba a location still to scout for a future film.



#32 Guy Haines

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Posted 19 August 2014 - 06:32 AM

It would be nice to think that one day Cuba itself might be a location for a Bond film rather than a country doubling for Cuba. But is that likely at the moment? I doubt it under the current regime.



#33 Call Billy Bob

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Posted 19 August 2014 - 01:27 PM

It would be nice to think that one day Cuba itself might be a location for a Bond film rather than a country doubling for Cuba. But is that likely at the moment? I doubt it under the current regime.

Yes, such a shame... Spain proved a worthy substitute, but nothing beats the genuine article.



#34 Trevelyan 006

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Posted 19 August 2014 - 08:10 PM

For the record, in regards of Cuba scenes, they were all shot in Spain.

It makes Cuba a location still to scout for a future film.

Boy, now I feel pretty foolish. I didn't know that...



#35 Call Billy Bob

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Posted 19 August 2014 - 08:13 PM

 

For the record, in regards of Cuba scenes, they were all shot in Spain.

It makes Cuba a location still to scout for a future film.

Boy, now I feel pretty foolish. I didn't know that...

 

You and me both...



#36 Trevelyan 006

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Posted 19 August 2014 - 08:24 PM

- Cuba being used as a filming location.

If a moderator could edit this line in the original post to:   - Cuba (Spain) being used as a filming location.

 

It would be greatly appreciated.  :P 


Edited by Trevelyan 006, 19 August 2014 - 08:24 PM.


#37 Hansen

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Posted 20 August 2014 - 01:40 PM

It would be nice to think that one day Cuba itself might be a location for a Bond film rather than a country doubling for Cuba. But is that likely at the moment? I doubt it under the current regime.

As a matter of fact, it is all in the hands of the US gouvernment who does not allow US companies to have any business with Cuba.

Not sure that the current situation in Cuba is worst than let's say the one in Argentina at the time of the shooting of Moonraker...



#38 sharpshooter

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Posted 21 August 2014 - 02:51 AM

I don't really hate DAD like some Bond fans do. In fact, there's quite a lot I like, from the first half especially.

 

The surfing sequence, although brief, was something new for the franchise.

The title sequence is fantastic, with the song working wonders against the visuals which propels the story forward.

Bond captured and bearded like Robinson Crusoe was a bold move.

The trade on the foggy bridge - good old fashioned tension and great cue from David Arnold.

The escape sequence and walk into the hotel soaking wet is hilarious.

Rauol was a good character, and would have liked more from him.

The wheelchair moment - "you do now". Always liked that.

Bond lurking around the gene therapy clinic, and the gorgeous hall of mirrors which make great visuals.

The Blades sword fight is fantastic.

The Vanquish is one beautiful vehicle.

I liked the Thunderball rebreather sequence, swimming into the hot springs.

"Boss, he beat your time." - Classic Bond right there.

The virtual reality sequence with Bond and Moneypenny is harmless fun.

 

And Brosnan's performance was probably his best of the four.



#39 Fisico

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Posted 21 August 2014 - 04:33 PM

For those who didn't know that the 'Cuba-moments' were filmed in Cadiz, I recommend watching the extra's of the movie in the blu-ray box of the 50th anniversary :) They even say that it was very cold when shooting there =P

 

About the film itself, the first 30 minutes were brilliant, afterwards it got worse and worse. I still liked the line when Bond was asked if he was looking for a tourist (by meaning Zao), and he said 'no, a terrorist' :P


Edited by Fisico, 21 August 2014 - 04:34 PM.


#40 sharpshooter

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Posted 22 August 2014 - 01:51 AM

I forgot to mention Rosamund Pike.



#41 Call Billy Bob

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Posted 22 August 2014 - 02:04 AM

I forgot to mention Rosamund Pike.

Winner!



#42 tdalton

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Posted 22 August 2014 - 04:38 AM

As Sharpshooter already correctly demonstrated, there are some good moments in Die Another Day.  They're also what make the nonsense that goes on in the film that much more frustrating.  

 

The core concept of the film's plot, Bond hunting down someone who set him up and left him to rot in a North Korean prison, is a good one.  The problem is that they don't take that concept anywhere interesting after the first 30 minutes or so.  I always thought that the film should have had Bond on the run for the entire film, with no MI6 backing.  Falco could have been involved with that, being more than willing to send agent out into the field to hunt down Bond, perhaps accompanied by an MI6 operative (or even a fellow Double-oh) that is sent by a reluctant M to perform the same task.  From there, you can get a lot of the same setups the film already has (Bond at the gene therapy clinic, the Ice Palace, the DMZ in Korea, etc.), but just with a more serious twist on it rather than going off in the complete other direction and making everything into a joke.



#43 Call Billy Bob

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Posted 22 August 2014 - 03:54 PM

Can we call DAD the "Where's Waldo?" version of a Bond film? The good parts are there, you just have to go looking long and hard for them!



#44 AMC Hornet

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Posted 22 August 2014 - 04:21 PM

That's a better idea than highlighting them with a black felt marker, as so many prefer to do.



#45 Call Billy Bob

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Posted 22 August 2014 - 04:29 PM

This is true. Instead of taking the good with the bad, they'd prefer using an MIB neuralyzer on themselves.



#46 Double-0-7

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Posted 22 August 2014 - 10:49 PM

They should have eliminated the ice dragster scene/parasurfing all together. Should have went from escape the biodomes straight to the car chase.

I couldn't agree more! If you edit this 5 minutes out the film it would flow better and remove several cringe-worthy scenes quickly.

#47 AMC Hornet

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Posted 22 August 2014 - 11:55 PM

But then we don't see how devastating Icarus is on its 'high' setting!



#48 sharpshooter

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 12:34 AM

 

They should have eliminated the ice dragster scene/parasurfing all together. Should have went from escape the biodomes straight to the car chase.

I couldn't agree more! If you edit this 5 minutes out the film it would flow better and remove several cringe-worthy scenes quickly.

 

I don't mind the ice dragster itself. It's actually a pretty nifty vehicle. But indeed, we didn't need the parasurfing and ice wave. The effects of the vehicle going over the cliff are dodgy, too. 



#49 tdalton

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 02:47 AM

They should have eliminated the ice dragster scene/parasurfing all together. Should have went from escape the biodomes straight to the car chase.

I couldn't agree more! If you edit this 5 minutes out the film it would flow better and remove several cringe-worthy scenes quickly.

I don't mind the ice dragster itself. It's actually a pretty nifty vehicle. But indeed, we didn't need the parasurfing and ice wave. The effects of the vehicle going over the cliff are dodgy, too.


I thought the vehicle going over the cliff was probably the worst effect in the film.

#50 sharpshooter

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 04:05 AM

They should have eliminated the ice dragster scene/parasurfing all together. Should have went from escape the biodomes straight to the car chase.

I couldn't agree more! If you edit this 5 minutes out the film it would flow better and remove several cringe-worthy scenes quickly.
I don't mind the ice dragster itself. It's actually a pretty nifty vehicle. But indeed, we didn't need the parasurfing and ice wave. The effects of the vehicle going over the cliff are dodgy, too.
I thought the vehicle going over the cliff was probably the worst effect in the film.
Yeah, it's pretty bad.

The cliff sequence with the parasail was meant to show Bond's resourcefulness, but it went just too far. I'm confident in saying that CGI is the most embarrassing moment in the franchise.

#51 tdalton

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 06:12 AM

 

 

 

 

They should have eliminated the ice dragster scene/parasurfing all together. Should have went from escape the biodomes straight to the car chase.

I couldn't agree more! If you edit this 5 minutes out the film it would flow better and remove several cringe-worthy scenes quickly.
I don't mind the ice dragster itself. It's actually a pretty nifty vehicle. But indeed, we didn't need the parasurfing and ice wave. The effects of the vehicle going over the cliff are dodgy, too.
I thought the vehicle going over the cliff was probably the worst effect in the film.
Yeah, it's pretty bad.

The cliff sequence with the parasail was meant to show Bond's resourcefulness, but it went just too far. I'm confident in saying that CGI is the most embarrassing moment in the franchise.

 

 

Yeah, that's got to be the one moment where even the most biased observer on set or in the editing room should have been able to tell that what they were doing wasn't good.  



#52 agentbug

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 12:46 PM

A lot of them have been mentioned so I'll be brief...

 

The car chase on the ice is brilliant. If I picked the top 20 scenes of the whole series I'd prolly put this in the list.

 

In the 'it's the little things that matter' category, I always enjoy seeing Bond re-use the agitator ring to break the windscreen when he is rescuing Jinx. Speaking of, the shot of the four characters falling through the breaking glass floor is very cool.

 

I also very much like Madonna's theme tune, however also tend to agree with the statement I once saw someone make: the only people who like Madonna's Bond theme are people who like Madonna lol.

 

And although I can't argue that on some level it isn't awful, as a lover of innuendo I do so love the exchange Bond and Jinx have re his 'mouthful'... Always makes me laugh. :)



#53 tdalton

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 02:52 PM

 

I also very much like Madonna's theme tune, however also tend to agree with the statement I once saw someone make: the only people who like Madonna's Bond theme are people who like Madonna lol.

 

 

That's probably true.  I don't think it works in the other direction, however, as not all fans of Madonna care for the Die Another Day title track.  I know because I'm one of them.  ;)

 

It's a shame that they couldn't get Madonna for a Bond film prior to her foray into electronic music.  Her early material is generally pretty good ("Open Your Heart" has always been a favorite), and something along the lines of what she was doing in the 80s or even the early-to-mid 90s would have probably set her up for a pretty good Bond track.  



#54 Trevelyan 006

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 05:25 PM

I also liked the bit about working with Chinese intelligence. It sort of always worked as a nod back to Tomorrow Never Dies, for me. One would wonder if Bond dropped in on Wai Lin's place for old times sake... Especially if they continued with the 'gone rogue' idea working as a stronger part of the plot.


Edited by Trevelyan 006, 23 August 2014 - 07:23 PM.


#55 tdalton

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 05:31 PM

I also liked the bit about working with Chinese intelligence. It sort of always worked as a nod back to Tomorrow Never Dies, for me. One would wonder if Bond droped in on Wai Lin's place for old times sake... Especially if they continued with the 'gone rogue' idea working as a stronger part of the plot.

 

That could have been an interesting angle towards bringing back a Bond girl from a previous film.  If ever there was a time in which it was appropriate to do so, a film that goes so far in embracing its "Anniversary" status would be the time to do such a thing.  Maybe Bond should have dropped in on Wai Lin while dealing with Chinese intelligence, perhaps even recruiting her to help him track down Zao instead of having Jinx be the film's Bond girl.



#56 agentbug

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 07:12 PM

An early script of DAD had Wai Lin in it. I was sceptical at first when I heard that but you can indeed see her name on a script seen in the documentary on the UK DVD of DAD.

 

Would have been interesting to bring a Bond girl back, and of all there have been I think Wai Lin is someone who is so practical, it works to have her as a Bond girl in one film and a female ally in another film. You can't really do that with most of the Bond girls IMO.



#57 Trevelyan 006

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 07:25 PM

 

I also liked the bit about working with Chinese intelligence. It sort of always worked as a nod back to Tomorrow Never Dies, for me. One would wonder if Bond dropped in on Wai Lin's place for old times sake... Especially if they continued with the 'gone rogue' idea working as a stronger part of the plot.

 

That could have been an interesting angle towards bringing back a Bond girl from a previous film.  If ever there was a time in which it was appropriate to do so, a film that goes so far in embracing its "Anniversary" status would be the time to do such a thing.  Maybe Bond should have dropped in on Wai Lin while dealing with Chinese intelligence, perhaps even recruiting her to help him track down Zao instead of having Jinx be the film's Bond girl.

 

Bond having to reach out to another intelligence agent who he worked with formerly, due to MI6 writing him off as defective. It would've added a pretty interesting and serious dynamic, I think. 



#58 dtuba

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 10:42 PM

The appearance of the end credits are a blessed relief to anyone viewing this abomination of a Bond film.



#59 sharpshooter

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Posted 24 August 2014 - 01:02 AM

That's probably true.  I don't think it works in the other direction, however, as not all fans of Madonna care for the Die Another Day title track.  I know because I'm one of them.   ;)

 

It's a shame that they couldn't get Madonna for a Bond film prior to her foray into electronic music.  Her early material is generally pretty good ("Open Your Heart" has always been a favorite), and something along the lines of what she was doing in the 80s or even the early-to-mid 90s would have probably set her up for a pretty good Bond track.  

 

I'm a fan of Madonna, too, and yes, it all depends on what era you find Madonna in. As said, American Life had a stronger electronic emphasis than usual, and all those tracks are similar in spirit to her DAD tune. Which I admire, to be honest. She wrote an album and that song slotted into it. From that time, a song like 'Love Profusion' or 'Nothing Fails' would've been good. Madonna from Ray of Light era would've been magnificent, particularly 'Skin', my favourite songs of hers. 



#60 tdalton

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Posted 24 August 2014 - 02:12 AM

 

That's probably true.  I don't think it works in the other direction, however, as not all fans of Madonna care for the Die Another Day title track.  I know because I'm one of them.   ;)

 

It's a shame that they couldn't get Madonna for a Bond film prior to her foray into electronic music.  Her early material is generally pretty good ("Open Your Heart" has always been a favorite), and something along the lines of what she was doing in the 80s or even the early-to-mid 90s would have probably set her up for a pretty good Bond track.  

 

I'm a fan of Madonna, too, and yes, it all depends on what era you find Madonna in. As said, American Life had a stronger electronic emphasis than usual, and all those tracks are similar in spirit to her DAD tune. Which I admire, to be honest. She wrote an album and that song slotted into it. From that time, a song like 'Love Profusion' or 'Nothing Fails' would've been good. Madonna from Ray of Light era would've been magnificent, particularly 'Skin', my favourite songs of hers. 

 

 

I think that perhaps "Die Another Day" might have gone over a bit better had it been given better treatment within the film.  It just doesn't work when you have an electronic dance beat being played over dark images of Bond being tortured and left to rot in a North Korean military prison.  

 

Now, that's not to say that the tune is brilliant, because it's not.  But, it's also not significantly worse than some of the other lesser tracks that the Bond franchise has produced over the years.