84 replies to this topic

[jamie00007]

One more thing, Craig has had a more hands on role in the production of his Bond films than any other Bond, even helping with the script for QoS. Why would he do that if it was just for the money? He could, like previous Bond actors, simply show up for filming and that's it if he wanted. I very much doubt Brosnan took anywhere near as much interest in the behind the scenes stuff.

[Colossus]

The thing about the behind-the-scenes stuff is, i really am part of the notion that one has one job, an actor acts, writer writes, director directs. I guess i am a formalist or something but if someone starts overlapping into others things then, well, let's just say S*** happens. 

[Guy Haines]

I've just come across an interesting article in The Independent newspaper which might be relevant to some of the debating points on this thread. Link to it below.

 

http://www.independe...in-9563010.html

[Hansen]

Strange article and mostly pointless as it seems to focus on 70s era. If Bond has been existing for 50 years, it is clearly because Bond could adapt to the audience. There is no such thing as an old 007, there are many of them and the current one will join them shortly.

[Guy Haines]

Strange article and mostly pointless as it seems to focus on 70s era. If Bond has been existing for 50 years, it is clearly because Bond could adapt to the audience. There is no such thing as an old 007, there are many of them and the current one will join them shortly.

I think it focuses on present nostalgia for the 1960s and 70s Bonds. It just struck me as relevant because there seem to be a couple of views, amongst others, on this thread about the Craig era - nostalgia for the past Bond films, and I miss the Connery era as much as I very much like the current one, and a complaint that the present Bonds are too much like certain current movies, notably Bourne and the Christopher Nolan films - and the article provides an explanation, via the comments of John Cleese, as to why the current Bond series appears, to some to be similar to those films in some respects.

 

As for Craig becoming an "old Bond" - not for a while yet I hope!

[glidrose]

Lazenby... well, he wasn´t asked back - but I´m sure he would have wanted a raise.  And Brosnan... rumor has it that his demands for a fifth Bond film were so high that this was one aspect of EON´s decision to re-boot.

Lazenby *was* asked back.

As for Brosnan, yep, I've heard that one too and believe it. Apparently he wanted 20 million plus. Also heard - and this may be a lie - that he threatened not to do it unless EON hired Quentin Tarantino, figuring he had the upper hand. So EON called his bluff.

[SecretAgentFan]

Was Lazenby really asked back?

 

I understand there are two contradicting opinions on that.  One: Lazenby had a contract with an option to do more - but he told the producers after filming OHMSS that he wanted to quit.  Which they were happy about, due to his behavior on set.  Two: The producers did not want him back because the movie did not do as well financially during its initial release - and he made up the story about his manager telling him to drop out because the Bond series was at an end anyway.

[glidrose]

Three: Lazenby said he wanted to quit and Broccoli told him, "do that and you've got nothing but spaghetti westerns ahead of you."

 

The problem with theory #2 is that Lazenby announced he was quitting *before* the film got released.

[Colossus]

anyone recall 'bond begins'fervor in 2005, 2006, 2007? those were the days. Now it is more like "ok next guy" lol.

[MkB]

Interesting thoughts in this threads, thank you for them and for expressing them in an intelligent, peaceful manner. 

Watched CR again yesterday, it's such a good Bond film... Pity Craig's tenure did not deliver (yet) what it seemed to promise in CR. I liked QoS, despite its flaws. But SF disturbs me very much, because it is a very well done take on Bond that is not at all mine. I really, really hope, despite all odds, that the franchise is not going to dig further in this direction. 

And mind you, I've seen SF 3 times in cinemas when it came out, for some reason, more than I have ever watched any other Bond film in a cinema. So box office does not always equal appreciation. 

[The Shark]

Where is Bond's intelligence? Now he's just a battering ram. When has Craig's Bond shown any guile, his ability to think himself out of any dangerous situations? He makes stupid decisions after stupid decisions, resulting in shootouts. Its all rather dull. Look at how Bond outmaneuvers Grant, his *operation grand slam, for instance?* line, even something as small as *you fools! He's got you all shooting at each other!* is just typical James Bond. I don't see any creativity with these new films.

 

[sharpshooter]

^Yep. On the Skyfall audio commentary, I recall Mendes said such a hacking process isn't really possible, but they decided to make it so for the audience. So they can see what is going on, and as you highlight, to show Bond's mind ticking over. Not to simply make him an observer. Watching that clip reminds me how much I like the film. Sure, there are what people call 'plot holes', - not sending back up with Bond and M, or Q getting hacked by Silva, and Silva's plan being so perfect. But I don't really mind. I find Skyfall entertaining on the whole and I roll with it. It's a good mix of the old style fantasy and glamour with the new hard hitting action. 

Edited by sharpshooter, 26 July 2014 - 01:43 AM.

[MkB]

Well, we have different feelings. This is precisely one of the scenes that make geeks cringe. This is not how you crack a code... and please, you just CANNOT, by definition, write "GRANBOROUGH" in hexadecimal code, which contains only 0-9 and letters A-F! This is sooooooo NOT how you do it that you have to make the extra effort to suspend disbelief, and to quote Silva, it's exhausting.

Leaving this aside, I don't like either the fact that Bond "cracks" the code not so much because he's smart as because he's actually old, old enough to know about closed Tube stations on the Metropolitan line.

 

Mind you I would not say I can't wait till the Craig era is over. I really do appreciate him as an actor, and he did an amazing job with the reboot. Mostly, I think I am worried about the Mendes era.

[The Shark]

Well, we have different feelings. This is precisely one of the scenes that make geeks cringe. This is not how you crack a code... and please, you just CANNOT, by definition, write "GRANBOROUGH" in hexadecimal code, which contains only 0-9 and letters A-F! This is sooooooo NOT how you do it that you have to make the extra effort to suspend disbelief, and to quote Silva, it's exhausting.

Good thing that most moviegoers (including me) know practically nothing about cryptography or computer programming, so this kind of inaccuracy slips us by. Fancy-sounding bs is common not just with Bond, but most Hollywood blockbusters. Even Fleming did it, and always gave it enough conviction and detail to fool most readers. It's only annoying when it crosses into an area you're an expert on.
 

Leaving this aside, I don't like either the fact that Bond "cracks" the code not so much because he's smart as because he's actually old, old enough to know about closed Tube stations on the Metropolitan line.

So it's Ok if Bond has a savant-like knowledge of metallurgy, diamonds, wine, heraldry and marine biology, but not underground stations?

[MkB]

 

Leaving this aside, I don't like either the fact that Bond "cracks" the code not so much because he's smart as because he's actually old, old enough to know about closed Tube stations on the Metropolitan line.

So it's Ok if Bond has a savant-like knowledge of metallurgy, diamonds, wine, heraldry and marine biology, but not underground stations?

 

 

Actually yes, because all the former can be related to his job, and in some cases we know he did study to acquire this knowledge for a specific, professional purpose, while the other topics of expertise are linked to his way of life and hobbies. But a middle-aged man whose hobby is to know by heart the name and location of Tube stations past and present does not scream "movie hero" to me (unless his name is Bean. Mr Bean).

But you're missing my point. I don't resent his knowing about an old Tube station. I resent the underlying idea in SF that Bond is a man of the past.

[Guy Haines]

In an era when a man with a bomb in a haversack could blow up a tube train - and let's not forget the real life series of terrorist attacks on the London underground on 7th July 2005 - why wouldn't Bond, or any agent, or policeman not have at least a basic knowledge of underground stations, even disused ones? It doesn't sound like "trainspotter" or Mr. Bean to me but someone with a good memory for places that might be of interest to an adversary. And it certainly doesn't make me think that Bond is a man of the past. Far from it - underground rail networks, along with airports and other transport systems remain prime targets for terrorists.

[The Shark]

Indeed. Bond probably brushed up on his knowledge after arriving at the new underground HQ. He would have taken a look at the plans and any nearby stations or train routes.

[MkB]

In an era when a man with a bomb in a haversack could blow up a tube train - and let's not forget the real life series of terrorist attacks on the London underground on 7th July 2005 - why wouldn't Bond, or any agent, or policeman not have at least a basic knowledge of underground stations, even disused ones? It doesn't sound like "trainspotter" or Mr. Bean to me but someone with a good memory for places that might be of interest to an adversary. And it certainly doesn't make me think that Bond is a man of the past. Far from it - underground rail networks, along with airports and other transport systems remain prime targets for terrorists.

 

Bond is MI6, not MI5. I'd understand if he knew by heart the underground network of, say, Moscow, but London is officially beyond his brief.

[sharpshooter]

you just CANNOT, by definition, write "GRANBOROUGH" in hexadecimal code, which contains only 0-9 and letters A-F! 

I don't know, I'm not really phased by this sort of stuff. I think, well, on this movie computer, he can write Granborough in hexadecimal code. 

[Guy Haines]

Does it matter which service Bond's part of? Given the international nature of terrorism, not knowing which places an adversary might strike on your home turf would be a serious disadvantage for an agent of either MI5 or MI6.

[The Shark]

Bond is MI6, not MI5. I'd understand if he knew by heart the underground network of, say, Moscow, but London is officially beyond his brief.

MI6's Vauxhall HQ has just been blown up. Bond's mentally preparing for another attack.

[MkB]

Whatever. You buy it, I don't, we're just going to have to agree to disagree

[Trevelyan 006]

Ready for Craig to be done? Not quite... Ready for a shake up in the current-era formula to "turn the corner", so to speak? Absolutely. The quintessential action-packed/dark/personal vendetta/classic-meets-modern/emotional/gritty films of the current-era have been made (and quite well, I might add).

It is high time to move in a different direction!

 

I will miss Craig once he's gone, though...

[Emma]

One more thing, Craig has had a more hands on role in the production of his Bond films than any other Bond, even helping with the script for QoS. Why would he do that if it was just for the money? He could, like previous Bond actors, simply show up for filming and that's it if he wanted. I very much doubt Brosnan took anywhere near as much interest in the behind the scenes stuff.

 

Because he had a stake in seeing that the film got out. How do you think that it would look if the film got suspended due to the writers strike? How is Timothy Dalton doing now career wise? I never thought that Craig was that invested in Bond beyond the paycheque and what it would do for his career. Which is fine with me. I don't mind that he is not a hard core fan. I did find it somewhat arrogant and annoying when he remarked that he 'he did not want to be Bond because he was an actor.' I thought that it was a stupid statement given the amount of out of work actors who would have given their right hand for such an opportunity. Craig since back peddled.

 

I am not anxious for the Craig era to be over, in fact due to CR I actually find some of the older films to be downright un-watchable. I've actually enjoyed his turn as Bond. He plays Bond more like an ex-miltary man, than some civil servant who was recruited from Oxbridge. I like Craig's take because  there's a lot of depth to it.

I do understand that nothing lasts forever and Craig should probably bow out before he's 50. I just hope that his replacement is just as good. (fingers crossed for Chris Hemsworth or Adam Raynor).

[__7]

 

you just CANNOT, by definition, write "GRANBOROUGH" in hexadecimal code, which contains only 0-9 and letters A-F! 

I don't know, I'm not really phased by this sort of stuff. I think, well, on this movie computer, he can write Granborough in hexadecimal code. 

 

Yes. A thousand times, yes.