72 replies to this topic

[Yellow Pinky]

I'd agree that the series itself certainly felt 'different' after picking up with GOLDENEYE. And to me at least LTK's winking fish always hinted at more than just the end of a Bond film. But I actually find it hard to rate-rank the Brosnan films in the same league as the Craig ones. Not because there is an evident rise in quality - which there is - or because the central character is supposed to be 'rebooted' with CASINO ROYALE. My difficulties with this task stem more from a feeling that Craig's entries seem to aim for a different experience that's not merely the sum of thecarthewatchthebirdsthestuntsthenumberyouknowtherest. Although that evidently is still part of the game. But with Craig and CR one extra dimension seems to have been added, something that previous films didn't actually involve. So I feel the task at hand isn't exactly fair towards Brosnan, or the predecessors for that matter.

I completely agree.  There's a real attempt in the Craig era to not simply give us what has come before.  It's an intangible quality that transcends simply making the next installment in a franchise and making sure to tic off the proper boxes on the list.

[bribond]

I think the difference is the Craig films write to the character and give Bond an emotional journey to go through.  It's hard to think of the villain's plot offhand in Craig's films because it is secondary to what Bond goes through.  Brosnan's films were a bit more superficial.  They had some depth but it was layered into the story rather than an arc built around the characters.  The producers took a chance with Casino Royale and when it paid off they stayed with that approach.  The World is Not Enough and Die Another Day tried for a little depth but did not want to go so far as to alienate anyone and it showed.  Kudos to them for recognizing after Die Another Day the best way to ensure Bond's survival was to use him more as a character.

[Eric Stromberg]

Okay, so we're getting close to hitting rock bottom for new topics.

 

Barbara Broccoli and MGW produced these films by themselves without ol' Cubby - okay, so he was still (barely) alive for GE, but let's look past that. There's also a new generation of Bond fans who have little use for the pre-Brosnan era. And I do think the Brosnan and Craig entries together form Bond 2.0 (and 2.1). They have a lot more in common with modern adventure films and modern cinema than what the 80's Bond films offered. Besides seven films is easier to rank than - what is it? - 23, 24, 25, 26, 61, 98, 136 films? (Imagine the lists our grandchildren will compile? "My top 25 Bond films!")

 

1. CR'06

2. TND

3. DAD

4. SF

 

...mind the huge gap...

 

5&6. (tied) TWINE & QOS

7. GE

 

What I find interesting is that there's no in-between. I either like the films (in varying degrees) or despise them. Perhaps a sign that BB and MGW are more adventurous and ambitious than HS and especially ARB.

Greetings, CBn bloggers.  This is Pierce Brosnan.  Eric has been so kind as to let me log on under his name and give you my definitive and objective rankings.

 

Tied for first place:

GE, TND, TWINE, DAD (probably my best performance in the run, if I may say), The Thomas Crown Affair (had to sneak that in)

 

(GIANT GAP, watch your step)

 

Tied for second place:

CR (should have bloody well been mine), QOS (underrated in my opinion), Skyfall (goodbye, mum!)

 

Cheers to all and back over to Eric.

[Bond31]

1. Skyfall
2. Casino Royale
3. QoS (the Most underrated Bond film in the canon)
4. Goldeneye (cause it has the god that is Sean "Sharpe" Bean in it)

 

The Rest of Brosnan's efforts weren't my cup of tea. Less about Bond and more about the Special Effects and Stunts.

Thank god for the Reboot and Craig who has bought back the coolness missing since the 60's.

[The Krynoid man]

1) Goldeneye
2) Skyfall
3) Tomorrow Never Dies
4) Casino Royale
5) TWINE
6) DAD
7) QOS

[DamnCoffee]

1. Skyfall

2. GoldenEye

3. Casino Royale

 

BIG BIG GAP

 

4. Quantum of Solace

5. Tomorrow Never Dies

7. The World Is Not Enough

6. Die Another Day

[Gothamite]

1. Casino Royale

2. Skyfall.

3. GoldenEye

4. Tomorrow Never Dies

5. Die Another Day

6. Quantum of Solace

7. The World is Not Enough

[glidrose]

I'd agree that the series itself certainly felt 'different' after picking up with GOLDENEYE. And to me at least LTK's winking fish always hinted at more than just the end of a Bond film. But I actually find it hard to rate-rank the Brosnan films in the same league as the Craig ones. Not because there is an evident rise in quality - which there is - or because the central character is supposed to be 'rebooted' with CASINO ROYALE. My difficulties with this task stem more from a feeling that Craig's entries seem to aim for a different experience that's not merely the sum of thecarthewatchthebirdsthestuntsthenumberyouknowtherest. Although that evidently is still part of the game. But with Craig and CR one extra dimension seems to have been added, something that previous films didn't actually involve. So I feel the task at hand isn't exactly fair towards Brosnan, or the predecessors for that matter.

 

Even though I don't entirely agree with your points I do entirely understand them. I can definitely sense a difference between the Brosnan and Craig entries - and not because they have different actors playing Bond.

[Dustin]

 

I'd agree that the series itself certainly felt 'different' after picking up with GOLDENEYE. And to me at least LTK's winking fish always hinted at more than just the end of a Bond film. But I actually find it hard to rate-rank the Brosnan films in the same league as the Craig ones. Not because there is an evident rise in quality - which there is - or because the central character is supposed to be 'rebooted' with CASINO ROYALE. My difficulties with this task stem more from a feeling that Craig's entries seem to aim for a different experience that's not merely the sum of thecarthewatchthebirdsthestuntsthenumberyouknowtherest. Although that evidently is still part of the game. But with Craig and CR one extra dimension seems to have been added, something that previous films didn't actually involve. So I feel the task at hand isn't exactly fair towards Brosnan, or the predecessors for that matter.

 

Even though I don't entirely agree with your points I do entirely understand them. I can definitely sense a difference between the Brosnan and Craig entries - and not because they have different actors playing Bond.

 

 

Bit like a long-running tv show that with the years slowly got shoved towards Wednesday afternoon. And all of a sudden they are once more offered the prime-time slot again; only prime-time today means something different than forty years ago - or ten years even.

[Colossus]

Interesting topic... good points on not taking into account the cold war era stuff.

 

1.GE

2.TWINE

3.CR

4.DAD

5.TND

6.SF
7.QOS

[Dustin]

That doesn't happen often, both SF and QOS near the bottom. May I ask, was GE your first Bond film, Colossus?

Edited by Dustin, 14 November 2013 - 08:14 PM.

[Colossus]

Dustin, I think for SF i have to warm up to it and let it age over the years. Right now it just does not mesh. I find it it too glum still, despite how they wanted to right the wrongs of QOS so much and tried to make it better.
GE yes it was my first one in the theater, but i watched the older ones before. I still think, despite what has been said on it over the years on these boards about GE being nonsense, etc., it owes itself to that little perplexing "lightning in a bottle" luck that is graced upon a few films which is inexplicably not owed to the efforts of anyone involved with it, it just all comes together, right moment, time, place, etc. Everything about it still reverberates. It almost feels apart from all of the Bonds before it and after it. Sort of like the OHMSS factor how it seems out of place in 1969. 

[Dustin]

I remember at the time leaving the theatre and wondering what it must feel for the youngsters who had been with me, to be introduced to Bond by this one. With hindsight it really feels like a one-off that somehow got reboot-sequels, quite unique.

[Colossus]

On the CR vs. SF debate that's been making the rounds a lot, it's just simple really: the Eva Green-Craig dynamic basically puffs away any successful efforts in SF.

[whitesox]

CR

SF

QOS

GE

DAD

TWINE

TND

[Turn]

Dustin, I think for SF i have to warm up to it and let it age over the years. Right now it just does not mesh. I find it it too glum still, despite how they wanted to right the wrongs of QOS so much and tried to make it better.
GE yes it was my first one in the theater, but i watched the older ones before. I still think, despite what has been said on it over the years on these boards about GE being nonsense, etc., it owes itself to that little perplexing "lightning in a bottle" luck that is graced upon a few films which is inexplicably not owed to the efforts of anyone involved with it, it just all comes together, right moment, time, place, etc. Everything about it still reverberates. It almost feels apart from all of the Bonds before it and after it. Sort of like the OHMSS factor how it seems out of place in 1969. 

Colossus, your thoughts are pretty similar to mine regarding SF. A year ago I went into it backed by much critical hype and amazing box office and I came out with very conflicting feelings. It was the best directed, probably best cinematography and featured the best villain in years. There is no doubting the quality and care that went into it.

 

But as a whole SF just didn't grab me the way I feel it should have for a huge Bond fan. It just didn't have the all encompassing experience I felt a lot more with CR, which felt familiar and new at the same time and has never fallen from its placing in my rankings since.

 

I've owned the SF Blu-ray since February and have only scanned through certain scenes and not been compelled to watch in its entirety. I also hope to one day hold it in higher esteem, but for now it just feels like something I'm supposed to like rather than genuinely like.

[Colossus]

Thank you! That's exactly how it felt, like we're supposed to like it perfectly encapsulates it.

[Janus Assassin]

Are we ranking best in order or favorite in order? I'll do both.

 

Best:

Casino Royale

Skyfall 

GoldenEye

The World Is Not Enough

Quantum of Solace

Tomorrow Never Dies

Iron Bond (aka Die Another Day)

 

Favorite:

GoldenEye

Casino Royale 

Skyfall

Quantum of Solace

Tomorrow Never Dies

The World Is Not Enough

Iron Bond. 

[Hansen]

 

Dustin, I think for SF i have to warm up to it and let it age over the years. Right now it just does not mesh. I find it it too glum still, despite how they wanted to right the wrongs of QOS so much and tried to make it better.
GE yes it was my first one in the theater, but i watched the older ones before. I still think, despite what has been said on it over the years on these boards about GE being nonsense, etc., it owes itself to that little perplexing "lightning in a bottle" luck that is graced upon a few films which is inexplicably not owed to the efforts of anyone involved with it, it just all comes together, right moment, time, place, etc. Everything about it still reverberates. It almost feels apart from all of the Bonds before it and after it. Sort of like the OHMSS factor how it seems out of place in 1969. 

Colossus, your thoughts are pretty similar to mine regarding SF. A year ago I went into it backed by much critical hype and amazing box office and I came out with very conflicting feelings. It was the best directed, probably best cinematography and featured the best villain in years. There is no doubting the quality and care that went into it.

 

But as a whole SF just didn't grab me the way I feel it should have for a huge Bond fan. It just didn't have the all encompassing experience I felt a lot more with CR, which felt familiar and new at the same time and has never fallen from its placing in my rankings since.

 

I've owned the SF Blu-ray since February and have only scanned through certain scenes and not been compelled to watch in its entirety. I also hope to one day hold it in higher esteem, but for now it just feels like something I'm supposed to like rather than genuinely like.

 

I fully second this

[Double-Oh Agent]

 

Dustin, I think for SF i have to warm up to it and let it age over the years. Right now it just does not mesh. I find it it too glum still, despite how they wanted to right the wrongs of QOS so much and tried to make it better.
GE yes it was my first one in the theater, but i watched the older ones before. I still think, despite what has been said on it over the years on these boards about GE being nonsense, etc., it owes itself to that little perplexing "lightning in a bottle" luck that is graced upon a few films which is inexplicably not owed to the efforts of anyone involved with it, it just all comes together, right moment, time, place, etc. Everything about it still reverberates. It almost feels apart from all of the Bonds before it and after it. Sort of like the OHMSS factor how it seems out of place in 1969. 

Colossus, your thoughts are pretty similar to mine regarding SF. A year ago I went into it backed by much critical hype and amazing box office and I came out with very conflicting feelings. It was the best directed, probably best cinematography and featured the best villain in years. There is no doubting the quality and care that went into it.

 

But as a whole SF just didn't grab me the way I feel it should have for a huge Bond fan. It just didn't have the all encompassing experience I felt a lot more with CR, which felt familiar and new at the same time and has never fallen from its placing in my rankings since.

 

I've owned the SF Blu-ray since February and have only scanned through certain scenes and not been compelled to watch in its entirety. I also hope to one day hold it in higher esteem, but for now it just feels like something I'm supposed to like rather than genuinely like.

 

I totally agree, Turn. I like Skyfall, but I don't love it. There's just something about it that I can't fully embrace and I'm not exactly sure what that is. Something seems to be missing. Colossus, I think you're right about the glum part. There just doesn't seem to be that much FUN in Skyfall. We have a nice PTS and then a boozing, melancholy Bond on the beach. We never really hit that high again until Bond saves M at the ministry meeting coinciding with the momentary rousing rendition of the James Bond Theme and then just as quickly it is gone. As much as I like Daniel Craig and think the filmmakers have put a lot of effort into making high quality, critical films in the Craig era, their end results just don't seem to have the same feel or FUN as they used to--Casino Royale excepted.

 

My rankings of the Brosnan-Craig films are:

 

1. GoldenEye

2. Tomorrow Never Dies

3. Casino Royale

4. Die Another Day

5. Skyfall

6. The World Is Not Enough

7. Quantum Of Solace

 

The first three are all excellent, top-notch Bond films.

[Turn]

I didn't expect to find this many like-minded fans regarding SF, thinking I'd be mostly alone. In thinking more about it (or on my sins, may be more appropriate) a couple of others thoughts occurred:

 

SF reminds me a lot of Goldfinger in that there is so much support and acclaim for it that you're sort of preconditioned to praise it and count it as the best or at least the best modern Bond film. As a younger fan and even up to recently there was the perception that GF was the absolute pinnacle, one I just couldn't share. Outstanding in parts but, like SF, not as satisfying as a whole.

 

A similarity between GF and SF I did really like was the laser table and Shanghai skyscraper sequence. I felt these were two of the most suspenseful sequences in the series.

 

Another thing I felt was a bit overpraised in SF was the big Aston Martin reveal. I have a friend who said he loved that scene, and it was fun and appropriate to celebrate the 50th anniversary without going the overwhelming route DAD did with the homages.

 

My thing is the classic DB5 was already resurrected in GE and TND, which sort of dampened my excitement. I have much more enthusiasm for how CR incorporated the DB5, establishing it as a Bond car and how he won it, from one of the villains no less.

[univex]

 

1.) Casino Royale

2.) Skyfall

3.) GoldenEye

4.) Tomorrow Never Dies

5.) The World Is Not Enough

6.) Quantum Of Solace

7.) Die Another Day

 

I second this. 

 

Yes, same here. Although I have no knowledge about a film called Die Another Day. What is it? Never heard of it. Right after TWINE there was that seven year gap, right?

[x007AceOfSpades]

 

 

1.) Casino Royale

2.) Skyfall

3.) GoldenEye

4.) Tomorrow Never Dies

5.) The World Is Not Enough

6.) Quantum Of Solace

7.) Die Another Day

 

I second this. 

 

Yes, same here. Although I have no knowledge about a film called Die Another Day. What is it? Never heard of it. Right after TWINE there was that seven year gap, right?

 

LOL

[Janus Assassin]

I agree, I lost all respect I had for DAD as I got older. Something about Bond fighting a villain in an Iron Man costume who shoots electricity out of his hands like Whiplash just doesn't do it for me. It's a shame that Pierce went out like that.

[Sharpe]

Mine would be:

 

1) Goldeneye - love it - got me into bond

2) Casino Royale - love it

3) Skyfall - I like it but bores me in parts

4) Tomorrow Never Dies - mostly nostalgia value I think, and that it's better than the next three...

5) Quantum of Solace - poor story, I like how it's a bit different tnough

 

MASSIVE gap

 

6) The World is Not Enough - urgh

 

Another gap

 

100) Die another day - what a POS

[kronsteen63]

1) Casino Royale

 

[gap]

 

2) GoldenEye

3) Skyfall

4) Quantum of Solace

 

[Big gap]

 

5) The World is Not Enough

6) Tomorrow Never Dies

 

[Unbelievably Huge gap, seeing as how #5 and #6 garnered the mildly annoyed reaction of "Wow, the Bond films are getting lame," to #7 making me say "This worthless waste of celluloid and CGI almost destroyed my faith in the franchise"]

 

7) Let's try to replicate second rate, action-centric spy crap like xXx since all the 12-year-olds seem to like it....er...um...I mean Die Another Day

[CasinoKiller]

1. Skyfall

2. Casino Royale

3. Goldeneye

4. Tomorrow Never Dies

5. The World is Not Enough

6. Quantum of Solace

7. Die Another Day

[Iceskater101]

Best

 

1. Casino Royale

2. Skyfall

3. Goldeneye

4. World is not Enough

 

Meh..

5. Tomorrow Never Dies

6. Quantum of Solace

 

Bad...

7. Die Another Day

[glidrose]

1. CR'06
2. TND
3. DAD
4. SF
 
...mind the huge gap...
 
5&6. (tied) TWINE & QOS
7. GE

Changed my mind about the last three.

5 QOS
6&7 (tied) GE & TWINE.

[Caesar004]

1. Skyfall

2. Casino Royale

3. Goldeneye

4. Tomorrow Never Dies

5. World Is not Enough

6. Quantum

7. Die Another Day (KITE SURFING A TSUNAMI? REALLY?)