36 replies to this topic

[Eric Stromberg]

Something like this?

http://en.wikipedia....vities_Division

[AMC Hornet]

First, kudos to Eric Stromberg for identifying 00 agents as "commandos." I've always equated them with saboteurs myself, but I like your word better. Second,I concur with Colossus that "two kills for 00 status" is "silly." It is silly, and it is not how Ian Fleming described it. In the novel Casino Royale Bond said he had the deaths of a Japanese cypher clerk in New York and a double agent in Oslo to thank for it. NOWHERE in the literary canon did Fleming say you had to perform two assassinations to achieve 00 status. That was a line made up for Casino Royale (2006). Still, as the film series is now starting over in a new era, the latter will become the new truth.
On a personal note, Hello Harry Fawkes! I used to duel with you on another, defunct website a few years ago. Did Witchslayer ever get in touch with you? I tried to contact her once, to meet in Vegas when I was going there, but her email address was also defunct.

[CasinoKiller]

Flemming's original idea behind the Double O's was that they were just hardened veteran agents who were both highly accomplished and were capable of killing in cold blood while in the line of duty. In the CR novel, it is implied that Bond was highly accomplished as an agent during the war (and after) and he'd killed two people in cold blood, and on the strength of these achievements he was awarded his number. However, as the series progressed, it seemed that Flemming had varying ideas as to what the number was all about. In some books, it was implied that the Double O section was an elite branch of the service that specıalısed in assassination, when necessary. At other times, we're told that the Double O's are just elite agents who have 'license to kill' whenever necessary in the completion of their missions, which are usually far more tougher and important than those of ordinary agents. The latter seems to be the impression given by the movies as well. However Casino Royale seems to change things again, since with Bond having to prove himself as an assassin in the beginning, it seems that the emphasis has shifted somewhat towards Double O's being assassins to some extent. I seem to recall either Marc Forrester or Daniel Craig referring to Bond as a 'flawed assassin' sometime before QOS released. Also, it clearly seems that Craig-Bond's license to kill is supposed to be somewhat more restricted than that of the previous Bonds, since M always seems so pissed off when he just kills people without permission (like Mollaka in CR, Slate in QOS etc)

[jamie00007]

Ive always taken it that assassination would be one of the major jobs given to the 00's. So it makes sense that before giving someone the job they will have needed to show a willingness to kill for Queen and country. No point in sending out a new 00 on an assassination mission only to find he cant go through with it when the time comes.

[CasinoKiller]

Actually one problem (well not really a problem per se but rather a misnomer) in the films is that James Bond is said to be a spy but his actions dont really match those of a spy but rather that of a commando. A spy is supposed to infiltrate, investigate and gather intelligence for OTHERS to act upon whereas Bond is usually sent to eliminate some threat. Of course, there are many films where hes sent on a spying mission and then circumstances force him to act like a commando but still, the fact remains that Bond rarely if ever acts remotely like a real spy.

Which is why I think EON is now taking pains to establish Bond as an assassin for MI6, rather than a real 'spy'.

[The Shark]

Actually one problem (well not really a problem per se but rather a misnomer) in the films is that James Bond is said to be a spy but his actions dont really match those of a spy but rather that of a commando.

I agree, though to narrow it down even further, what about Counter Intelligence Agent? I've always seen Bond as the man who left the spying to the while collar boys (boring spies) while he went to the spy behind the spy, the threat that made them spy.

I see one of the requirements for this profession to be ex special forces (in this case SBS and Blackops), sort of similar to the 30 Assault Unit that Fleming commanded in WWII. An elite group of commandos, who went behind enemy lines, neutralised the opposition, and retrieved all the intelligence they could find. Sounds pretty simliar to what Bond does in the classic 60s good guy vs bad guy finales, particularly OHMSS, where Bond storms Piz Gloria with Draco's criminal ex-commandos, and uses his Minox camera to take pictures on the whereabouts and other information on Blofeld's Angels of Death.

In short no, Bond isn't an never will be exclusively an assassin, he is a jack of all trades. Demolition, intelligence gathering, disrupting enemy intelligence, counter-terrorism, infiltration are all just some of the many things he as a Counter Intelligence Agent is trained in.

Edited by The Shark, 13 December 2009 - 07:35 PM.

[Major Tallon]

In short no, Bond isn't an never will be exclusively an assassin, he is a jack of all trades. Demolition, intelligence gathering, disrupting enemy intelligence, counter-terrorism, infiltration are all just some of the many things he as a Counter Intelligence Agent is trained in.

An excellent summation!