52 replies to this topic

[HildebrandRarity]

You can, however, rank the directors and I put Liman ahead of Greengrass who's overkill of hand-held will date his two episodes.

Maybe, maybe not; but what does it matter? They were made in this decade for the people watching it now- who cares whether it'll look old in twnety years time: of course it will!

Before I can do my ranking, I need some help sorting out the movies. Which was the one where Matt Damon ran like really fast, fought someone in a cramped room, eluded the CIA, agonized about not being able to remember who he was, and had a car chase through some grim-looking city streets? Thanks!

Which was that Mission Impossible movie where Tom Cruise does a daring acrobatic break-in to a top security building to steal an important thing? Y'know- the one where the bad guy turns out to be a spy gone bad. The team have to infiltrate a fancy party too- you remember.
Or that Bond film where Bond goes after a rich guy who has a massive mad plan to kill loads of people- he's got a big lair. Bond meets and seduces two girls, one of which dies, has an overblown chase through a busy city, does some silly bit of acrobatics just before the main titles (you know- the ones with all of the guns and girls in) start, has a friendly helper who gets killed, and manages to end the film kissing a girl by a large area of open water. For some reason. I think he goes to a casino too.

Yes they made it for 2007 audiences but would you feel the same way if Bond 22 was done with an over kill of hand-held next year? Perhaps you would but I prefer my Bonds to have a timeless epic quality about it. Bits and pieces like Bond '77 and Serra's GoldenEye score and the speed ramping of DAD tend to date a movie but i'm fine with trends du jour as long as they dont overwhelm like Ultimatum (which i've seen and liked) does.

In time i wont remeber BU for it's differentiating plot or score or villians but for the drama of the Tangier cat-and-mouse foot chase and the hard hitting Audi and police car chase thru New York.

Also, it wasnt until an Octopussy or a DAD came along that the soundtrack of a Bond movie couldnt be differentiated from the average Bond.

The music in Bourne is interchangeable making it, for me, 3 episodes of one movie.

Looking forward to Bond 22.

[LadySylvia]

I need to change the movies' ranking:

1. Bourne Supremacy

2. Bourne Identity

3. Bourne Ultimatum

[MarcAngeDraco]

Just got back from seeing Ultimatum and I have very mixed feelings about it. It could (probably even should) have been a great film, but it wasn't.

The gross overuse of shaky camera shots coupled with overly frenetic editing ruined far too many scenes for me. To the point where it just came across like they had no idea how to properly choreograph a fight or chase scene so they tried to make up for it with rapid fire editing of shaky handheld shots.

Disappointing too, because I really liked the plot and think the ending was perfect. They should under no circumstances try to make another, which would only ruin a perfect ending.

Anyway, my current ranking is:

1) Identity
2) Ultimatum
3) Supremacy

[VisualStatic]

Just got back from seeing Ultimatum and I have very mixed feelings about it. It could (probably even should) have been a great film, but it wasn't.

The gross overuse of shaky camera shots coupled with overly frenetic editing ruined far too many scenes for me. To the point where it just came across like they had no idea how to properly choreograph a fight or chase scene so they tried to make up for it with rapid fire editing of shaky handheld shots.

Disappointing too, because I really liked the plot and think the ending was perfect. They should under no circumstances try to make another, which would only ruin a perfect ending.

Anyway, my current ranking is:

1) Identity
2) Ultimatum
3) Supremacy

I completely agree. I just saw Ultimatum last night. The story was absolutely the best part of the movie. The editing and camera work are the worst thing I've seen in the movies to date., with possible exception of the car chase in Supermacy.

My Rankings:
1. Identity
2. Ultimatum
3. Supermacy

Identity is number one simply because there is no Paul Greengrass and his shaky cams. Ultimatum is second due to I didn't walk out of the movie with a headache from the strobbing of the shaky cams and the cuts.
Supermacy is last because of the car chase, the editing not so much the chase it self.

[Qwerty]

1. Ultimatum
2. Supremacy
3. Identity

[Daddy Bond]

Having just seen Ultimatum this morning, (and I REALLY, REALLY loved it!) Here's how I'd rank the films.

1. The Bourne Ultimatum
2. The Bourne Identity
3. The Bourne Supremacy

Tarl, you are going to be in for a treat when you go and see the movie tonight!! The action, fights and stunts are ten times what they were in Supremacy, and yes while the camera is shakey like in Supremacy, it really adds to the action and makes it more believable.. Also, nice to have John Powell back doing the score.. it wouldn't be a proper Jason Bourne movie without Powell!!

I agree with your ranking.

Regards

[Daddy Bond]

Oh, and one more thought.

Even though, yes, I like Ultimatum the most and am a HUGE Bourne fan, - sometimes the camera shook WAY too much IMHO.

A little camera shake works well at times, but not when it looks like it was being videod by a one legged drunkard who was having a sneezing fit while simultaneously doing jumping jacks and having seizures during a 12.5 earthquake with Godzilla stomping around on the streets somewhere in the background!

Sometimes it was a bit much.

Regards

[Kilroy6644]

I don't mind a bit of shake, but there's one scene in particular where the action comes to a dead stop (a car crash), but the camera keeps shaking. From the position of the camera, and the way it's shaking, it makes no sense. Plus, the Bourne movies don't seem like the right setting for a handheld cam for me. It's supposed to add realism, and they use it in a movie with choreographed fights?

[Harmsway]

1. THE BOURNE SUPREMACY

2. THE BOURNE IDENTITY

3. THE BOURNE ULTIMATUM

ULTIMATUM's good, mind you, darn good, but it just doesn't feel as well-constructed as the others. The script is more a patchwork of action scenes than it is a thriller with a satisfying narrative behind it.

[Tarl_Cabot]

1. THE BOURNE SUPREMACY

2. THE BOURNE IDENTITY

3. THE BOURNE ULTIMATUM

ULTIMATUM's good, mind you, darn good, but it just doesn't feel as well-constructed as the others. The script is more a patchwork of action scenes than it is a thriller with a satisfying narrative behind it.

I'm amazed how differently this film is recieved by the fans vs how the critics reviewed it-nearly every review had it as the # 1 Bourne by a wide margin. I need to see it again before I have a clear idea where I stand on it. I agree with alot of the complaints such as shaky cam overkill(didn't bother me in BS)but I still had a blast-easily the best film of 2007 for me.

[TheSaint]

Don't know if this is worth its own thread-of the CBners who have read the original books and seen all 3 films, how true are they to the books? Are the films improvements on the books, or disprovements?

[Loomis]

I've read IDENTITY (after seeing the film). It's a reasonably faithful adaptation (more so than the others), insofar as it keeps the basic story, although the characters are changed quite a bit, new ones are brought in, as well as a different ending, and it's all updated technologically for the 21st century. The filmmakers adapted and built on Ludlum's book in pretty much the same way as the makers of CASINO ROYALE (2006) did with Fleming's first Bond novel, in other words there are a lot of changes but it's definitely recognisable as an adaptation - of sorts - of the book.

The Chamberlain miniseries (which I like) is far more true to Ludlum, indeed about as faithful an adaptation as they could possibly have done.

Is THE BOURNE IDENTITY (Damon film) an improvement on Ludlum's novel, or inferior? Neither - it's just different. Peking duck and Russian caviar, both telling more or less the same story but doing so differently, and both doing so well.

As I understand it, though, the films SUPREMACY and ULTIMATUM have virtually nothing to do with the books. I tried to read SUPREMACY, but found it absolutely dire. Eric Van Lustbader's THE BOURNE LEGACY is mindless throwaway fun, but I don't see that it has much scope for adaptation as a film, since it is set in the Ludlum universe, in which Bourne is a much older and very different character to the one played by Damon, with very different circumstances.

The literary Bourne doesn't have the brilliance of the literary Bond, and while I like a couple of the novels I'd say that the films, overall, are far superior.

[Judo chop]

I

[Judo chop]

So I saw BU last night, and it felt very much like a continuation of BS. They

[Publius]

[quote name='Judo chop' post='762619' date='15 August 2007 - 10:43']So I saw BU last night, and it felt very much like a continuation of BS. They

[Judo chop]

[quote name='Publius' post='762858' date='16 August 2007 - 00:22'][quote name='Judo chop' post='762619' date='15 August 2007 - 10:43']So I saw BU last night, and it felt very much like a continuation of BS. They

[sharpshooter]

I love each first two. Havent seen Ultimatum yet, it comes out the 30th here.

Supremacy
Identity

For a long time I had Identiy at the top. After another viewing of Supremacy, I changed tact. Both are brilliantly good I do that often. It is a mood thing really.

I expect Ultimatum to be either second or first. We will see.

[marktmurphy]

Just got back from seeing Ultimatum and I have very mixed feelings about it. It could (probably even should) have been a great film, but it wasn't.

The gross overuse of shaky camera shots coupled with overly frenetic editing ruined far too many scenes for me. To the point where it just came across like they had no idea how to properly choreograph a fight or chase scene so they tried to make up for it with rapid fire editing of shaky handheld shots.

I really find this to be a load of nonsense- I watched it last night and I was amazed how clear everything is through the shakey cam- everything you need see is to presented to you for just the amount of time it is required to register- the main fight in Tangier clearly was extremely well choreographed and every move is easy to see. I get the feeling that those who complain about it are very easily distracted.
Although ironically, one of the most still shots in the whole thing is when Bourne is using a pocket telescope and looking into an office the other side of a New York street (and NY streets are like canyons)- somehow he manages to focus on the writing on a folder being placed into a holdall without his hand shaking at all! The man has no pulse!

As for ranking them- Ultimatum is a superb action/suspense movie (oh; Bond could learn a thing or two here- the main set pieces are all about suspense; something Bond hasn't done in years- only his pursuit of the Miami terrorist comes close, and it's easily beaten by the extremely tense big scenes in Ultimatum) but plot-wise Ultimatum is a bit thin. He's basically just following a trail to get to a guy and follows some clues; that's pretty much it. Supremacy's plot was more interesting and somehow Ultimatum doesn't feel like a movie in it's own right but just part 2 of Supremacy. It's still damn fine, though.

No more though, please, unless there's a big shakeup: the story reaches a nice conclusion, and to be honest there's only so many times you can watch a roomful of people in front of computer screens yelling 'I want to know what colour his underpants are, people!' whilst Bourne strides through a car park somewhere.

[Blonde Bond]

1. The Bourne Identity
2. The Bourne Supremacy/The Bourne Ultimatum

[Orion]

Supremecy and Ultimatum are only good if youve watched their predessors, so only Identity works as a standalone, but if watched as a trilogy i'd say

1.The Bourne Ultimatum
2.The Bourne Supremecy
3.The Bourne Identity

[Mister Asterix]

• The Bourne Identity
• The Bourne Supremacy
• The Bourne Ultimatum

ULTIMATUM's good, mind you, darn good, but it just doesn't feel as well-constructed as the others. The script is more a patchwork of action scenes than it is a thriller with a satisfying narrative behind it.

[mra]Couldn

[manfromjapan]

Ultimatum
Identity
Supremacy

Check out my reviews at paulie.toadfire.com

[sharpshooter]

1.Supremacy/Ultimatum
2.Identity