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Is Casino Royale the "perfect" Bond movie?


148 replies to this topic

#1 DaveBond21

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 03:32 AM

I am trying very hard to think of something that is wrong with Casino Royale, and I am finding it hard.

Apart from maybe FRWL, I am wondering if this is the perfect Bond movie? Can anyone find a flaw?


Maybe there's just too much music as usual, and maybe the Miami truck chase goes on too long but does anyone else agree that they've come pretty close to perfection here?


If not - please let's try and put a list of minor gripes down!

#2 PrinceKamalKhan

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 03:35 AM

I wouldn't say it was perfect. Didn't care for the microchip in the arm bit. I missed Moneypenny and Bond should have smoked at least once. I'll be able to judge better after I have it on DVD and can take it in slowly a few times. Some of the cheesier parts of Die Another Day(CGI excepted, of course) didn't stand out to me until I saw it a few times on DVD. Casino Royale is the best Bond film since at least The Living Daylights I think I can say with confidence.

#3 DaveBond21

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 03:42 AM

Good point, I did miss Q and Moneypenny, but that is something that is prevalent in other Bond movies, I suppose.

#4 PrinceKamalKhan

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 03:44 AM

Good point, I did miss Q and Moneypenny, but that is something that is prevalent in other Bond movies, I suppose.


Also, M should have been a man again(maybe Timothy Dalton! I would have like to see him ordering Craig around). Still, most of CR impressed me. I liked it even better the 2nd time. I think it will safely be in my top 007 picks of the series.

#5 Tiin007

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 03:51 AM

It's certainly not perfect, but it's definitely as close as a Bond movie can be. Had there been a tad more development of the love story (such as the scene in the ocean that was cut from the final version), then maybe it could warrant being called "perfect." Granted, that is only a VERY MINOR gripe I have with the movie. Perhaps it only bothers me because I know it existed and we didn't end up getting it. Still, the movie is superb. It is, after all, my favorite Bond movie.

#6 ChronoBreak

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 03:52 AM

It's so very, very close. If it weren't for the airport chase sequence, which felt overlong and out of place, I'd consider the film to be "Bond Perfection." As it stands though, no Bond film IMO has quite hit that mark - But CR comes as close as the best films of the series have come.

#7 PrinceKamalKhan

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 04:06 AM

Another criticism I would have is that CR sometimes seems more like 2 movies than 1. Madagascar/Bahamas/Miami feels little bit like a Bruce Willis-type action flick while Montenegro/Lake Cuomo/Venice feels like a 2nd movie (which makes sense since this part is the actual adaptation of CR novel.) While I enjoyed "both movies" that made the CR film we have, it did feel a little disjointed.

#8 Tiin007

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 04:11 AM

Another criticism I would have is that CR sometimes seems more like 2 movies than 1. Madagascar/Bahamas/Miami feels little bit like a Bruce Willis-type action flick while Montenegro/Lake Cuomo/Venice feels like a 2nd movie (which makes sense since this part is the actual adaptation of CR novel.) While I enjoyed "both movies" that made the CR film we have, it did feel a little disjointed.


That bothered me too at first, but the movie seems less disjointed the more you watch it.

#9 Publius

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 04:16 AM

No, but for me it's the closest yet, and that's why it's my favorite so far. Casting a different M, dropping the DBS and most of the product placement, changing a few minor lines of dialogue, and altering the pacing/editing/shooting of certain scenes would have pushed it closer to near-perfection than I can imagine possible.

Nevertheless, none of its flaws are remotely major or get in the way of the story and adventure, and that's what really matters. It simply boasts one of those epic scopes, with as ideal a mix as I could hope for of all the best cinematic elements (think Raiders), only seen every few decades and epitomizing why I think films even exist.

#10 DaveBond21

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 04:28 AM

Some people have suggested that there are actually 3 parts to the movie - the Bahamas-Miami section. The mission.

Then the Casino section.

and finally the love story/Venice section.

#11 Harmsway

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 04:35 AM

It's as perfect a Bond film as has ever been made or ever will likely be made.

#12 DaveBond21

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 04:38 AM

Hi Harmsway.


I am glad you loved it. I remember I was worried in case you weren't going to like the love scenes, but it seems you really did, so that is cool.

#13 Bucky

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 04:38 AM

it is perfect.

#14 lafemmefantome

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 04:41 AM

I don't know if I would say it was perfect but given the amount of times I saw it (and yes I did look at other things besides Daniel Craig in swim trunks :angry: ) I would have liked to have seen more development of the story and perhaps cut back at bit on the "sinking house" at the end.

Other than that, I have no gripes.

lafemme :cooltongue:

#15 supernova

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 05:14 AM

Casino Royale is a brilliant movie and Daniel Craig is even more excellent than anticipated BUT there are several niggles remaining for me.

1) Make up department's failure to keep Craig grease and sweat free during some of the 'quiet' moments in the movie e.g. at the back of the car with Vesper going to the Hotel.

2) In some scenes Craig's face looked skinny and than in others quite thick. Example in the back of the car, his face is chunky and neck very thick but in the scene that he is picking up Solange outside the Hotel, his face looks very skinny, also skinny face in the scene at the bathroom door when he is looking at Vesper crying under the shower. Maybe the man is just a chameleon!

3) Over the top makeup with Vesper on many occasions. Sometimes the makeup is so excessive its almost clown like. But why? Eva Green is a beautiful woman - e.g. the death scene in Venice when she is lying on top of the ruined house.

4) The movie was very long and the action scenes brilliantly edited BUT the movie's overall continuity was sometimes choppy - perhaps different editing decisions could have been made.


#16 MrDraco

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 06:25 AM

Craig is the new eleven...

#17 Harmsway

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 06:38 AM

Hi Harmsway.


I am glad you loved it. I remember I was worried in case you weren't going to like the love scenes, but it seems you really did, so that is cool.

Oh, I definitely loved it. I think it's the best Bond film of them all.

#18 Loomis

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 08:34 AM

I think it's the best Bond film of them all.


Same here.

#19 CJB

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 08:36 AM

It's as close to perfect as any Bond film has been in the last 30 years.

#20 sharpshooter

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 08:37 AM

I do also.

I accept the fact I could of ranked GE higher than it for pure nostalgic reasons, but once I saw the film it was on a whole other level.

#21 dinovelvet

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 09:42 AM

I think it's the best Bond film of them all.


Same here.


Me too, CR has knocked OHMSS off my personal No.1 spot. Didn't think it would ever happen, I thought the days of 'great' Bond films were long gone.

#22 MarcAngeDraco

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 12:16 PM

I'm not sure a 'perfect' Bond movie can ever be made, but they sure did a great job with CR. As others have indicated, I'm looking forward to seeing it at home on DVD (as I can't always accurately rank a new Bond film until I've seen it on the small screen as well).

#23 Lazenby880

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 12:27 PM

I think it's the best Bond film of them all.


Same here.


Me too, CR has knocked OHMSS off my personal No.1 spot. Didn't think it would ever happen, I thought the days of 'great' Bond films were long gone.

Agreed chaps, and dinovelvet has summed up my exact thoughts succinctly. :cooltongue:

#24 Loomis

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 01:31 PM

I think it's the best Bond film of them all.


Same here.


Me too, CR has knocked OHMSS off my personal No.1 spot. Didn't think it would ever happen, I thought the days of 'great' Bond films were long gone.

Agreed chaps, and dinovelvet has summed up my exact thoughts succinctly. :cooltongue:


I still can't believe all those Bafta nominations. :angry: And I think that, for instance, David Arnold's nomination was every bit as deserved as Craig's, and it goes to show that everyone was at the top of his game on that film. Superb, Mr Bond, superb!

#25 FullMetalJacket

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 02:47 PM

[font=Courier New]2) In some scenes Craig's face looked skinny and than in others quite thick. Example in the back of the car, his face is chunky and neck very thick but in the scene that he is picking up Solange outside the Hotel, his face looks very skinny, also skinny face in the scene at the bathroom door when he is looking at Vesper crying under the shower. Maybe the man is just a chameleon!


Actually, it's not uncommon at all for an actor's weight to fluctuate throughout the process of filming a movie. The best examples I can think of are Connery in DAF, Ewan McGregor in The Phantom Menace, and in particular, Hayden Christensen in Revenge of the Sith (some of his scenes were shot during pickups & reshoots that took place a whole year after principal photography. He had lost a lot of the muscle that he'd gained during PP, and it showed).

#26 dodge

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 03:01 PM

I think it's the best Bond film of them all.


Same here.


Me too, CR has knocked OHMSS off my personal No.1 spot. Didn't think it would ever happen, I thought the days of 'great' Bond films were long gone.


Never thought I'd see OHMSS bumped off my own list either. But it had a good run, didn't it? CR had all the qualities I loved about OHMSS--the romance, the epic sweep, the thrills--plus a powerhouse performance from a new acting titan.

P.S. to Zorin: David Arnold is no Eric Serra, but he also did a magnificent job despite the handicap!

#27 JADSTERSDAD

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 03:38 PM

Interesting thread. My answer is 'no', but I don't know what a 'perfect' Bond movie would be. This is because a definition of 'perfect' that references the books (or even only the first two films) is not correct, in my view. 'Bond' has become something that transcends the trends but takes a little bit of each good part of each trend with it. If this sounds a little complex, I would say compare From Russia With Love to Goldfinger. So close in time, actor, technicians (director and production designer notable exceptions), but the tone is vastly different. Yet it can only be a matter of opinion which is the best. I don't think anyone can say definitively that one is a more 'perfect' Bond.

As for me, I think that CR can be improved upon (with difficulty) by the inclusion of the trad gunbarrel, more Bond theme, a little more humour (Craig is even better when he smiles), a new M and the return of Q and Moneypenny. Oh... and a little more outlandish villain. But even then the two films would be like a modern day FRWL and Goldfinger. Companion pieces, not rivals.

Andy

#28 DaveBond21

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 10:04 PM

As for me, I think that CR can be improved upon (with difficulty) by the inclusion of the trad gunbarrel, more Bond theme, a little more humour (Craig is even better when he smiles), a new M and the return of Q and Moneypenny. Oh... and a little more outlandish villain. But even then the two films would be like a modern day FRWL and Goldfinger. Companion pieces, not rivals.

Andy



Good points, Andy. By the way, From Russia with Love is Daniel Craig's favourite Bond movie.

#29 Four Aces

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Posted 15 January 2007 - 11:46 PM

Absolutely the best bond, and the only one to realistically portray the character in the book, which is as a ruthless sharp witted thug desperate to get his double 0 licence and make his mark, but also with a huge ego. His ego doesn't really come accross in the other movies, the others play him as vain, and perhaps conceited, but Bond wants to win, he wants to get one over his adversaries and he wants them to know that he's got one over on them.

The fighting sequences are also superb, credible and very realistic, DC is such a superb actor, I winced during many of the fighting scenes especially the 'rope' scene! I can't say I have ever winced before in any of the others.

One final point, when Bond is fighting on the stairwell and Vesper is trying to stay out of the way, she is finally panicked into giving him a hand to wrestle the gun away, and this too is very well acted, you can see she is scared and doesnt want to interfere but a survival instinct takes over.....ooooh I could go on....in fact I will go on..(but later)!


Nice post ms minniespinney!

I think the movie was damn near perfect. The love dialogue got a little too mushy for me. I was expecting someone to say, "you had me at hello" :cooltongue:

Other than that, magnificent!

Edited by Four Aces, 15 January 2007 - 11:47 PM.


#30 Publius

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Posted 16 January 2007 - 12:22 AM

As for me, I think that CR can be improved upon (with difficulty) by the inclusion of the trad gunbarrel, more Bond theme, a little more humour (Craig is even better when he smiles), a new M and the return of Q and Moneypenny. Oh... and a little more outlandish villain. But even then the two films would be like a modern day FRWL and Goldfinger. Companion pieces, not rivals.

Go figure. :cooltongue: Aside from a new M, I think all of those would have noticeably diluted the refreshing individuality of CR, which is a big part of why it even proved so great.