22 replies to this topic

[mrmoon]

VOODOO CHARM
Not Just An Artistic Appendage?

If Goldfinger stands as Sean Connery

[Blue Eyes]

You raise an interesting issue about Baron Samedia Rory, one that I've never particularily considered. However, looking simply at him in a physical sense there's a contrast in the character. He is both black and white.

[freemo]

Great work Mr Moon, I think I've been hanging out for a bit of a look into Live and Let Die for a while. First, I liked how you mentioned there is "something

[Hardyboy]

My problem with LALD is that, stylistically, it borrows heavily from the popular "blaxploitation" films of the era (Shaft, Foxy Brown, etc.)--so much so that it doesn't even look much like a Bond film. So, I have to say I disagree with you--I believe that it was Diamonds Are Forever that really changed the look and feel of the films of the 1970s: that was the film that first played it all for laughs, and that was the style that remained in place--bar FYEO--until Timothy Dalton came along.

[mrmoon]

I said that it was Roger Moores's stylistically unique entry. I understand what you are saying and I agree with your comments, my point of view was concentrating specifically on LALD for its qualities that make it different, in particular the voodoo essence. You almost hit the nail on the head when you said it doesn't even look much like a Bond movie, that is why I have characterised it as being stylistically unique in comparison with the rest of the series. For casual fans and audiences in general it sticks in their mind because of the 'voodoo charm', whenever I mention LALD people will come back with the comment 'is that the voodoo one'. I believe it is its popularity snd distinctiveness that make it stand out as a 'Bond' movie, and so transforms it from looking unlike any we've seen before, to one we can simply not skip over and so takes its own place as one the most unique Bond movies.

[Hardyboy]

Sorry if I missed your point, Mr. Moon. I agree that the voodoo motif does make LALD stand out in the series--though, when you look at it, Dr. No also plays with "island superstitions" and how the villain uses them to control the masses; but I digress--however, I also have to agree with Freemo. Most Bond films have some sort of visual or stylistic motif--the Old World feel of FRWL, gold saturating Goldfinger, outer space in Moonraker, and the like. None of this is meant to disparage or take away from your post, Mr. Moon--it's an excellent analysis.

[mrmoon]

Great to see some other ideas u guys are throwing in.

[Xenobia]

It's interesting that Cubby Broccoli admitted to "being inspired by" Star Wars when he made "Moonraker," but, (as Hardyboy pointed out) Broccoli makes no mention of the blackspoiltation films and LALD. Was he afraid of being called "politically incorrect" before those two words entered our lexicon.

What makes LALD stand out for me is how it literally marks Moore's Bonds. While I am the first to say that Bond is not a mysogynist in the movies, he does have the occasional mysogynistic moment, and for someone accused of playing the role for laughs, Moore has a lot of them. In LALD Bond tricks a young girl out of her virginity, for absolutely no reason. (By that point, it is clear that Solitare is afraid of Kangaga and would have helped Bond if he asked.)

I am afraid to bring "black power" into a discussion of this movie. Often, when discussing how the white population has kept the African Americans down, one of the first things pointed to is the prevailance of drugs and who are most effected by its distribution (by the addiction, the violence, etc.) Let's not forget Kanaga is a drug dealer...he is enslaving not only the white man, but his own population too, and doesn't seem to mind that fact.

As for the Baron riding on the engine at the end of the movie, I always thought that was a curious ending. It was almost as if the audience was being told, "Bond has stopped this man, but the evil he repsents goes on. Nothing has changed." That is the first time, and I believe the last time, that message was sent. Why it appears in LALD, I have no idea.

Thank you Rory for an excellent, thought provoking article.

-- Xenobia

[Mister Asterix]

Originally posted by Xenobia (edited)
...In LALD Bond tricks a young girl out of her virginity, for absolutely no reason. (By that point, it is clear that Solitare is afraid of Kangaga and would have helped Bond if he asked.)...

Oh come on.

Bond slept with her the same reason he slept with all of his other enemies' women, she was a vulnerablity that he could exploit. Bond himself is shocked that she is a virgin. He rightfully assumed she was Kanaga's mistress. And don't go thinking that the only reason she slept with him was because he stacked the deck. She knew our man James was the one all along. She said so herself. It was the first time the Lovers card was drawn that convinced her of that. The first card was why she was afraid of Kanaga. The second time was just the final nail in the coffin. And like the Solitaire of the novel, her powers did not truly come from the cards, they came from her intuition, her foresight. If the cards had lied, she would have known.

And sorry but it was the best thing that ever happened to her. Would you have rather she keep virginity and die with the rest of the gang/cult?

[Hardyboy]

Interesting post, Xen. I know that Broccoli and Saltzman were very worried about how both blacks and whites would feel about LALD, and they bent over backwards to try to please all sides. Broccoli made a statement that "true equality" means that blacks should be shown as villains as well as heroes; yet the decision was made to show Bond as being something a fool in Harlem ("Nice disguise") so African Americans wouldn't be perceived as being dupes, and Baron Samedi was allowed to return at the end to show that the white Bond didn't have a complete victory over his black adversaries. Broccoli and Saltzman also told Yaphet Kotto to not make Black Power gestures on the set, saying "political statements" weren't appropriate for Bond films--even though the whole movie makes all sorts of political statements! Oy. Too much to figure out. . .

[Blue Eyes]

Originally posted by Xenobia
As for the Baron riding on the engine at the end of the movie, I always thought that was a curious ending.  It was almost as if the audience was being told, "Bond has stopped this man, but the evil he repsents goes on.  Nothing has changed."   That is the first time, and I believe the last time, that message was sent.  Why it appears in LALD, I have no idea.

That's interesting Xen. I have to go with the notion of Voodoo for that scene. I always believed it was Voodoo that kept Baron alive and that it was a message about the power of the supernatural vs the power of a very physical Bond.

[neversaynever]

Originally posted by Hardyboy
I know that Broccoli and Saltzman were very worried about how both blacks and whites would feel about LALD, and they bent over backwards to try to please all sides.  Broccoli made a statement that "true equality" means that blacks should be shown as villains as well as heroes;

That's all well and good, but correct me if I'm wrong (I may be, I haven't watched LALD for a while), but isn't it the case that EVERY black person in this movie turns out to be evil? Oh, apart from the guy on the boat who Rosie points a gun at... I just remember being struck by the fact that in LALD the black people were all the bad guys and the whites were the good guys. Why did Rosie have to betray Bond? They could have kept her as a "good guy", couldn't they? There's nothing wrong with balance, but I don't think this film was balanced, and I agree with the blaxploitation comments made earlier in the forum. You say that this film is unique and marks a departure in the style of Bond, I say that this film sticks out like a sore thumb. There are elements I like (I'm a fan of Pepper and the boat chase) but overall I think the "Bond does Blaxploitation" formula doesn't work. (Similar to how some people - I am not one of them - don't like the "Bond does eastern martial arts" in TND.)

[Mister Asterix]

Originally posted by neversaynever (edited)
That's all well and good, but correct me if I'm wrong (I may be, I haven't watched LALD for a while), but isn't it the case that EVERY black person in this movie turns out to be evil?...

Strutter--in addition to Quarrel Jr.--is not evil. There are also many minor parts that it is never made clear whether they are involved in Kananga's scheme or not.

[Blue Eyes]

Also, I think the film works both ways. While most of the black leads work for Mr Big (the majority probably don't even realise he is Kananga) and in that terms are evil, the 'white man' isn't always portrayed as something better either. Sherrif JW Pepper does enough to prove my point

[Blofeld's Cat]

Yep, "Jay Dubbiya" does enough to compensate the negative aspect of blackspoitation in Live And Let Die all by himself. And probably done on purpose for that very reason, I think.

[PaulZ108]

Originally posted by Blofeld's Cat
Yep, "Jay Dubbiya" does enough to compensate the negative aspect of blackspoitation in Live And Let Die all by himself. And probably done on purpose for that very reason, I think.

Tom Mankiewicz said he was added for exactly that reason in the DVD documentary.

[Blofeld's Cat]

Originally posted by PaulZ108



Tom Mankiewicz said he was added for exactly that reason in the DVD documentary.

Damn! I'm looking forward to the new releases of the Bond DVDs so I can get them (for the first time) and enjoy all that extra info.

[DLibrasnow]

I actually kinda like the voodoo elements of LALD because I like something that is apart from the norm (probably the reason I love the excellent NSNA so much - because its different and shakes up the formula).
I know a lot of people however are opposed to the whole voodoo aspect to the movie.
BTW, Tom Manckiewicz commentary on the DVD I thought was pretty good except for that really obvious yawn during the main titles.

[BONDFINESSE 007]

i thought the voodoo gave the film a kick (a little spice if you will) and it did shake it up somewhat, not the same ole same ole

[DLibrasnow]

I have a fondness for LALD, its kinda middle of the road Moore Bond for me, not as remarkable as some of his other entries (AVTAK, TSWLM and FYEO) and not as bad as TMWTGG.

[BONDFINESSE 007]

Originally posted by DLibrasnow
I have a fondness for LALD, its kinda middle of the road Moore Bond for me, not as remarkable as some of his other entries (AVTAK, TSWLM and FYEO) and not as bad as TMWTGG.

but we will take tmwgg over ltk and tld anyday

[4 Ur Eyez Only]

Originally posted by BONDFINESSE 007
i thought the voodoo gave the film a kick (a little spice if you will) and it did shake it up somewhat, not the same ole same ole

I agree... I think this is why I love this movie so much because it is sooo different.. The Voodoo was very different! Plus they have a sorta "Blacks-potation" vibe to it.. which was very popular back in the early 70's!!

I think they were going for a more "real" feel to Bond.. and not have him look/feel old fashion

[DLibrasnow]

Originally posted by BONDFINESSE 007
but we will take tmwgg over ltk and tld anyday

Absolutely.