27 replies to this topic

[Sunny_on_SM]

Hi all!

Maybe this has been discussed before here....Anyway, I watched Goldfinger again last night and couldn't understand a few things in the movie:

1. The Aston Martin was a super fancy car with lots of gadgets, but how come Q didn't install something as basic as bulletproof windshied? There were so many holes in it when Bond was being chased that it was amazing he didn't get hurt.

2. Why did Goldfinger decide to reveal his plans to the group of hoods if he was going to kill them all anyway?

3. Why waste time and resourses on driving Mr. Solo to the airport and killing him off, taking the car to the junk yard, pressing it into one metal box and then separating the gold from it, when he could have killed him together with the other hoods?

4. Why did James Bond choose to place the note to the CIA into Mr. Solo's pocket with the homing device, when the guy could have easily checked his pocket and thrown the note away. Why would he want to help the CIA if he was as bad as the other hoods?

Got an opinion on this?

[I Like Sharks]

1. I think Q does say that the windscreen is bulletproof. It dosn't smash during the car chase anyway si it does stop bullets

2.I've always thought that Goldfingers the type who likes the sound of his own voice. He wants to impress people. Note that he tells Bond he enjoyed his briefing to the hoods. Why not show them he's a bigger criminal than them and then kill them to advoid paying them and so they won't tell anyone

3. I guess it's because Oddjob can't really drive round with a dead body in the back of his car. It saves having a dead body and a car presumably with Mr Solo's blood all over the floor. Besides, if someone comes looking for Solo theres no evidence Goldfinger killed him

4. Can't think of anything for this one...any ideas?

[DamnCoffee]

4. Can't think of anything for this one...any ideas?

Probably because Solos Pocket was the easiest place to put it

[Johnboy007]

For #4: Bond obviously does not know that Solo is going to his death. He stealthily puts the note in his pocket with the hope the CIA would intercept Solo (as they do indeed follow the beacon), take Solo into custody (he is a mobster afterall), and discover the note while searching him.

[Santa]

Clearly the plot has more holes than a hooker's fishnets after a hard night, but it's what makes the film. Without those scenes it'd be a lot shorter and missing one of the best scenes in the series (the car crush. Completely freaked me out as a child, when it seemed so original and utterly cold).

[bernsmartin007]

The windows are all bulletproof, he says that when explaining it's features to Bond.

Goldfinger enjoys explaining his diabolical plan to the hoods to see their reaction and boost his ego before killing them so he is safe in the knowledge that they won't talk.

No real reason for him to kill solo like that other than pure evil. He doesn't care about the extra effort of having to remove the gold from the wreck, he can easily have people do that, he does it all the time with his rolls. he just is feeling evil and wants to give this Solo a horrible death.

He puts the note in Solo's pocket because he is leaving the ranch. he needs the note to go out of the ranch so that Felix/CIA can intercept it.

[Sunny_on_SM]

The windows are all bulletproof, he says that when explaining it's features to Bond.

Goldfinger enjoys explaining his diabolical plan to the hoods to see their reaction and boost his ego before killing them so he is safe in the knowledge that they won't talk.

No real reason for him to kill solo like that other than pure evil. He doesn't care about the extra effort of having to remove the gold from the wreck, he can easily have people do that, he does it all the time with his rolls. he just is feeling evil and wants to give this Solo a horrible death.

He puts the note in Solo's pocket because he is leaving the ranch. he needs the note to go out of the ranch so that Felix/CIA can intercept it.

These are pretty good explanations, bernsmartin007 I actually thought the same thing on question #2, though of course to me that whole explanation would have been a waste of time, but Goldfinger enjoyed the powers he had over the other hoods. Then, naturally, without that scene, Bond wouldn't have learned what Goldfinger was planning to do.

IMHO, Felix was acting for a while there like Bond had everything under control, so "why not go back to Kentucky Fried Chicken for another bite."

[Scottlee]

The 1-4pts are very explainable to me.

YOLT is the worst Bond film for plot-holes.

[erniecureo]

The "explanation" scene is a triumph of pacing over rationality. I remember that I must have seen the film five or six times before it ocurred to me that it made no sense, if was going to kill the hoods anyway (and for that matter, who keeps canisters of nerve gas in a pop up rack in the rec room?)

Rather that Goldfinger's meglomania or ego gratification, it's my opinion that this scene seemed the best way to the screenwriters to have Bond find out the details of Goldfinger's plot--and incidentally, to show Pussy's skill at judo, which sets up the barn scene nicely.

Pure exposition, in other words. But because the film moves so quickly, you don't have time to think about it until much later.

By the way, I thought changing the movie to include a "dirty bomb" instead of having Goldfinger actually steal the gold was brilliant--an improvement on the original novel.

[Byron]

The 1-4pts are very explainable to me.

YOLT is the worst Bond film for plot-holes.

Care to explain?

[Scottlee]

The 1-4pts are very explainable to me.

YOLT is the worst Bond film for plot-holes.

Care to explain?

1 - If you're going to fake your own death, getting a bed that flips itself into the wall seems a rather bizarre and needless way of doing it. Also, Connery seems strangely unaware of what's about to happen to him. I think I've seen this sequence about 20 times and it's never sat comfortable with me.

2 - Connery tells Moneypenny he got a First in Oriental Languages at Cambridge, yet he still needs Tiger to translate every single word for him later on in the film.

3 - How did Bond know he would need to take some safe-cracking equipment with him to Henderson's apartment? Answer - he couldn't have done.

4 - The Japanese public seem strangely uninterested (we presume) in the sight of a giant magnet dumping cars with people inside them into the sea. Furthermore, who is filming this act? Would Tiger really bother to have a second heliocopter fly alongside the magnet chopper just for the sake of being able to provide film coverage for Bond?

5 - When Aki shows up to give Bond his massage, a remarkable jump has been made in their relationship. From a distinct lack of trust culminating in a chase through the tube station, to Bond's sudden "Aki!", and instant kissing/sex.

6 - It's about a 1/1,000,000 chance that Bond's arms could get perfectly held in place by Helga's horizontally sliding wooden board. Why did she even bother letting things get that far?

7 - Kissy Suzuki (Whose name is not mentioned in the script *sigh*) pipes up to remember something important ONLY when Tiger announces that the date of the launch has been brought forward.

8 - Where on earth does Blofeld vanish to at the end? A glimpse of his escape would have been nice.

[Sunny_on_SM]

1 - If you're going to fake your own death, getting a bed that flips itself into the wall seems a rather bizarre and needless way of doing it. Also, Connery seems strangely unaware of what's about to happen to him. I think I've seen this sequence about 20 times and it's never sat comfortable with me

Scottlee, have to agree with you there completely. I didn't get that whole scene either. Not only that it was bizarre, it didn't look real at all, unless I missed something. Like, at the risk of appearing stupid, lol, Bond looked pretty dead to me. It always puzzled me how they managed to fake it.

[DaveBond21]

Just a quick note about point 2.

Goldfinger and others like Drax, Stromberg, Dr No, Trevelyan and Carver all love telling Bond their schemes. They need an audience, and Goldfinger loves it even more when Bond tells him just how "brilliant" his plan is.

Their mantra is:- There is no point having a great plan, unless someone is going to hear it before it happens.

[Bond Maniac]

1 - If you're going to fake your own death, getting a bed that flips itself into the wall seems a rather bizarre and needless way of doing it. Also, Connery seems strangely unaware of what's about to happen to him. I think I've seen this sequence about 20 times and it's never sat comfortable with me

Well, this scene has two purposes. One is to mess up with the audience mind and trick them into thinking that Bond may be dead. Second, this is how i think it worked. Someone leaked to the underworld Bond

Edited by Bond Maniac, 28 August 2006 - 04:13 AM.

[DaveBond21]

2 - Connery tells Moneypenny he got a First in Oriental Languages at Cambridge, yet he still needs Tiger to translate every single word for him later on in the film.

Another movie device.Tiger is translating to us viewers and not to Bond.

This is often seen as Bond simply showing off to Moneypenny.


This is backed up by the fact that he can't use a Chinese keyboard in TND.

[Mister Asterix]

2 - Connery tells Moneypenny he got a First in Oriental Languages at Cambridge, yet he still needs Tiger to translate every single word for him later on in the film.

Another movie device.Tiger is translating to us viewers and not to Bond.

This is often seen as Bond simply showing off to Moneypenny.


This is backed up by the fact that he can't use a Chinese keyboard in TND.

[mra]Nobody ever takes in to account that people lie. I suspect that Bond

[Sunny_on_SM]

2 - Connery tells Moneypenny he got a First in Oriental Languages at Cambridge, yet he still needs Tiger to translate every single word for him later on in the film.

Another movie device.Tiger is translating to us viewers and not to Bond.

If that's the case, it should have been translated through subtitles. Less confusion.

[Bond Maniac]

QUOTE(Bond Maniac @ 28 August 2006 - 02:56) *


2 - Connery tells Moneypenny he got a First in Oriental Languages at Cambridge, yet he still needs Tiger to translate every single word for him later on in the film.

Another movie device.Tiger is translating to us viewers and not to Bond.


If that's the case, it should have been translated through subtitles. Less confusion.

Yeah...i made a mistake. Never tought that Bond could be just showing off. But you know, this about using subtitles wouldn

[Mister Asterix]

2 - Connery tells Moneypenny he got a First in Oriental Languages at Cambridge, yet he still needs Tiger to translate every single word for him later on in the film.

Another movie device.Tiger is translating to us viewers and not to Bond.

If that's the case, it should have been translated through subtitles. Less confusion.

[mra]Really? Trying to read along the bottom of an action film is confusing? I don

[Sunny_on_SM]

[quote name='Mister Asterix' post='595483' date='28 August 2006 - 13:52']
[quote name='Sunny_on_SM' post='595476' date='28 August 2006 - 08:45']
[quote name='Bond Maniac' post='595282' date='28 August 2006 - 02:56']

2 - Connery tells Moneypenny he got a First in Oriental Languages at Cambridge, yet he still needs Tiger to translate every single word for him later on in the film.

Another movie device.Tiger is translating to us viewers and not to Bond.
[/quote]

If that's the case, it should have been translated through subtitles. Less confusion.
[/quote]


Really? Trying to read along the bottom of an action film is confusing? I don’t think so. And why wouldn’t Tiger translate for him? It was Moneypenny he told about his oriental language skills. Not Tiger.
[/quote]

I realize that he told Moneypenny and not Tiger. I was making a comment about the thought that it was 'another movie device'. Trying to read along the bottom of an action film would be confuding during an action scene - yes. In a regular scene subtitles would be more realistic, may not be convenient, but nevertheless realistic.


[quote name='Bond Maniac' post='595480' date='28 August 2006 - 13:51']

Yeah...i made a mistake. Never tought that Bond could be just showing off. But you know, this about using subtitles wouldn

[Mister Asterix]

[quote name='Sunny_on_SM' post='595529' date='28 August 2006 - 10:04']
[quote name='Mister Asterix' post='595483' date='28 August 2006 - 13:52']
[quote name='Sunny_on_SM' post='595476' date='28 August 2006 - 08:45']
[quote name='Bond Maniac' post='595282' date='28 August 2006 - 02:56']

2 - Connery tells Moneypenny he got a First in Oriental Languages at Cambridge, yet he still needs Tiger to translate every single word for him later on in the film.

Another movie device.Tiger is translating to us viewers and not to Bond.
[/quote]

If that's the case, it should have been translated through subtitles. Less confusion.
[/quote]


[mra]Really? Trying to read along the bottom of an action film is confusing? I don

[Sunny_on_SM]

Letters magically forming words in the air is more realistic than someone translating to a person whom he is not sure of their knowledge of language.

Okay.

I have to believe that you and I got our wires crossed somehow with this argument. There was a question whether or not Bond could speak the language or not. If Bond couldn't and his statement to Moneypenny was showing off, then there was absolutely nothing wrong with Tiger translating for him WITHOUT subtitles. If, as it was mentioned above, this was done strictly for the audience, subtitles would have been more realistic. Since we already established that Bond really couldn't speak the language or that Tiger wasn't sure whether or not Bond could and was translating for him, then everything is in place and nothing to argue about.

[delfloria]

Regarding YOLT:

What about the suction cups when 007 is out posing as a fisherman? Maybe he wants to impress an octopus.

If Spectre sends two assassins to kill 007 at the ninja training camp then the entire disguise and wedding are compromised from the start. One that kills Aki and another with the hidden knife in the staff.

How does 007 fit into the space suit and what does he plan to do once he is in orbit?

Blofeld: "Only one person we know uses a PPK"??????? M in Dr. No said the CIA swear by them.

Do they get shaken not stirred wrong or is 007 just being polite?

Why waste a plane just to kill 007?

Why send attack helicopters after little Nellie unless you are advetising your secret volcanic base to the world?

Continuity is all over the place. 1. Aki and 007 pull up outside Henderson's and in each shot the Toyota is facing a different direction 2. The speedometer in the Toyota regesters 0 MPH during the chases and the car goes in different directions than the steering wheel 3. 007's black and white "assassins" shoes change from low to high tops.

Do all of Tanaka's guests arrive by shute?

As mentioned before: Why does 007 have a safe cracking device on him when he is visiting Henderson? Why kill the guys by dropping them in the ocean instead of interrogating them? A wood board in the plane, how convenient.

Cambridge or Eton, which is it guys?

I'm sure there is more but that's it off the top of my head.

It seems from Connery's performance he doesn't know what to make of any of this as well.

(Don't get me wrong, I still like YOLT as a classic Connery film despite it's problems, like the miniature men bouncing around as the volcano blows up.)

[dunmall]

Good points all of them, although when it comes to the "stirred not shaken" bit check out Connery's face, Bond is being polite.

[Jim]

Some fun points, there.

Regarding YOLT:

Cambridge or Eton, which is it guys?

Eton is a (the) school. Cambridge is a university (allegedly). After finishing at the former, one may (recklessly) go to the latter.

[TortillaFactory]

Eton is a (the) school. Cambridge is a university (allegedly). After finishing at the former, one may (recklessly) go to the latter.

Was going to point this out if someone else didn't. Also, in Fleming's timeline I can't work out when Bond would have had time to attend university at all, having (IIRC) lied about his age to enter the Navy. Interesting how that was thrown in the films.

[dunmall]

Well Fleming's Bond probably wouldn't have attended University...but then the movie Bond probably did, since I doubt Connery's Bond managed to lie about his age and enter WW2...He would have been what between 10 and 15 years old during the war?

[Robert Watts]

Give him the birthdate of 1921, and have him (briefly) go to University in the late 30s, before transferring (briefly) to the University of Geneva so the Hans Oberhauser teaching him to ski works, then right at the end of that have him lie about his age to enter the RNVR (Naturally, to be passed on to 'other services' while maintaining a navy rank)

I'm not sure if they did it back then (or whether they would do it at Eton either), but usually there are some exceptions where a student enters school a year younger then their classmates, so it could be possible that Bond attended University for a semester at 17.