Jump to content


This is a read only archive of the old forums
The new CBn forums are located at https://quarterdeck.commanderbond.net/

 
Photo

Ending


54 replies to this topic

#1 triviachamp

triviachamp

    Lt. Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPip
  • 1400 posts
  • Location:Toronto

Posted 09 January 2006 - 12:32 AM

I wonder how they will handle the ending. After the torture scene the rest of the book seems a bit longwinded for a film.

I hope they have no other Bond girl. Or at least no "Good Bond Girl" for the ending clinch.

And I guess this means that the final scene will be Bond discovering Vesper's body. Will there be a suicide note? I suppose we could hear her voiceover for this scene and show some clips of what really happened, etc.

But is the betrayal part a bit overused? What with Electra and Miranda? But then again this will be suicide, not what people expect for a Bond movie. Oh and no ending clincher, hopefully. Very strange for a Bond movie. There hasn't been something like this since OHMSS!

Since the final line is there I hope it is the final line of the film. He will call up London or something like that and say the line. Fade to black. Credits will roll. Presumably the Bond theme will start playing lowly and then become louder.

Thoughts?

#2 Agent 76

Agent 76

    Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 7080 posts
  • Location:Portugal

Posted 09 January 2006 - 12:39 AM

It should end like the book.

"The bitch is dead!"

Dito.

#3 Harmsway

Harmsway

    Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 13293 posts

Posted 09 January 2006 - 12:45 AM

It's been reported that the last line of the book is intact and ends the film.

#4 Qwerty

Qwerty

    Commander RNVR

  • Commanding Officers
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 85605 posts
  • Location:New York / Pennsylvania

Posted 09 January 2006 - 06:00 AM

It's been reported that the last line of the book is intact and ends the film.

View Post


I really wonder if it will stay throughout the shoot or if an eventual change / new idea etc. causes it to be deleted or altered.

#5 Agent Spriggan Ominae

Agent Spriggan Ominae

    Lt. Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPip
  • 1068 posts
  • Location:Aiea,Hawaii

Posted 09 January 2006 - 06:24 AM

It's been reported that the last line of the book is intact and ends the film.

View Post


I really wonder if it will stay throughout the shoot or if an eventual change / new idea etc. causes it to be deleted or altered.

View Post


If I'm not mistaken, Pruvis and Wade never said that the line would end the film but just that they did have it in the screenplay. I hope they keep the line because IMO its a defining moment for Bond. God forbid they turn it into something along the lines of Elektra King's or Miss Frost's deaths from the last 2 films.

#6 tdalton

tdalton

    Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 11680 posts

Posted 09 January 2006 - 06:06 PM

I think that the final line of the novel will be the true test of how far EON is willing to go in order to bring Bond closer to Fleming's Bond. If they cut that line out, then it will really weaken the film, IMO, as there are really 3 strong moments in the CR novel that hold the whole thing together (the card game, the torture sequence, and the final line of the novel). Without one of those three, it just isn't Casino Royale.

And, I really hope that they use it to close out the film rather than just trying to stick it in the middle of the film just so they can say that they used it.

#7 Johnboy007

Johnboy007

    Commander CMG

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 6990 posts
  • Location:Washington, D.C.

Posted 09 January 2006 - 06:14 PM

I would assume it would end the film, or they wouldn't use it at all. It can't fit anywhere else and still be effective.

#8 Judo chop

Judo chop

    Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 7461 posts
  • Location:the bottle to the belly!

Posted 09 January 2006 - 07:14 PM

please end the film with it.

PLEEEEASE!!!

#9 Gobi-1

Gobi-1

    Lt. Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPip
  • 1529 posts
  • Location:East Texas

Posted 10 January 2006 - 07:18 AM

I think that the final line of the novel will be the true test of how far EON is willing to go in order to bring Bond closer to Fleming's Bond.  If they cut that line out, then it will really weaken the film, IMO, as there are really 3 strong moments in the CR novel that hold the whole thing together (the card game, the torture sequence, and the final line of the novel).  Without one of those three, it just isn't Casino Royale

And, I really hope that they use it to close out the film rather than just trying to stick it in the middle of the film just so they can say that they used it.

View Post


Strongly agree with you. On all three points.

#10 tdalton

tdalton

    Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 11680 posts

Posted 12 January 2006 - 06:15 AM

I also think that the last line could be a very good thing for the Bond franchise. I think that it will be very shocking when it is said, because, really, when was the last time Bond has said anything like it? The Bond character has been so politically correct for the past decade and a half or so that I think the audience will be absolutely stunned if Bond were to use a profanity like that.

#11 Double-Oh Agent

Double-Oh Agent

    Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 4325 posts

Posted 12 January 2006 - 06:28 AM

I think that the final line of the novel will be the true test of how far EON is willing to go in order to bring Bond closer to Fleming's Bond.  If they cut that line out, then it will really weaken the film, IMO, as there are really 3 strong moments in the CR novel that hold the whole thing together (the card game, the torture sequence, and the final line of the novel).  Without one of those three, it just isn't Casino Royale

And, I really hope that they use it to close out the film rather than just trying to stick it in the middle of the film just so they can say that they used it.

View Post


You're right that without that line, the film will be seriously weakened. It does wrap up the story and the romance well and sets the stage for Bond's later encounters and emotional interactions with women. I do believe, however, that the line will remain as is and be kept at the end of the film. The producers didn't shy away from a similar downbeat ending in OHMSS and I don't expect them to do it now. If the line were to be moved or not used, EON will have some mighty ticked off Bond fans on their hands.

This film has a chance to go down as the new On Her Majesty's Secret Service both in quality and in overall impact on the series. And that final line would go a long way toward that. It would rank right up there with OHMSS's "We have all the time in the world."

#12 Stax

Stax

    Sub-Lieutenant

  • Crew
  • Pip
  • 334 posts

Posted 15 January 2006 - 07:37 AM

I'm sure he'll say the line but I wonder if she will still commit suicide. I see a TWINE moment instead. (Vesper, meet Elektra.) That or Bond gives her the "honorable" way out, a la Octopussy's father. Either way, he can still say the line in the end.

Edited by Stax, 15 January 2006 - 07:38 AM.


#13 Double-Oh Agent

Double-Oh Agent

    Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 4325 posts

Posted 15 January 2006 - 07:48 AM

I'm sure he'll say the line but I wonder if she will still commit suicide. I see a TWINE moment instead. (Vesper, meet Elektra.) That or Bond gives her the "honorable" way out, a la Octopussy's father. Either way, he can still say the line in the end.

View Post


Interesting possibilities you put there Stax. Personally, I don't think we'll see an Elektra moment. It would be too close to TWINE and take a little of the edge off her death. The honorable way out, however, is another story. That one is intriguing and would be possible to do without the need for a letter explaining everything. In that scenario, you could see her emotionally confess and Bond getting hurt only to eventually regain control of his emotions and coldly give Vesper the honorable way out. However, I still think we'll get the book's ending. I think that is the best way to go.

#14 Dalton

Dalton

    Sub-Lieutenant

  • Crew
  • Pip
  • 196 posts
  • Location:England

Posted 15 January 2006 - 11:00 AM

I'd like to see the ending as in the book. We get the "The bitch is dead now" line, then in comes the Bond theme blaring (As in TWINE) with the "James Bond Will Return In..."

#15 Agent Spriggan Ominae

Agent Spriggan Ominae

    Lt. Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPip
  • 1068 posts
  • Location:Aiea,Hawaii

Posted 16 January 2006 - 04:57 AM

I'd like to see the ending as in the book. We get the "The bitch is dead now" line, then in comes the Bond theme blaring (As in TWINE) with the "James Bond Will Return In..."

View Post


Yeah, that's what I was thinking. The movie ends on a down note then all of a sudden a big, brassy, rendition of the Bond theme starts up with the James Bond will return line. Kind of like what they did in OHMSS. Its the only way to do it and reminds the audience that this is a Bond film you just saw. Another idea I had was if they were to change the Gun-Barrel scene around and instead of it opening the film it's at his closing seeing that Bond isn't the Bond we know until the end. I didn't like the idea at first but it grew on me. Have the last scene with a closeup Bond in the Phonebooth saying the line "Yes dammit, I said was! The Bitch is dead now." Then fade to black with no music and you see the white dot moving across the screen like the way it opens to to the gun-barrel at the beginning of the films. Like the Dr. No gun-barrel you don't hear the Bond theme until after Bond fires the shot. Then have the Bond will return bit and then straight into the end credits. That's just one way to do it.

#16 Harmsway

Harmsway

    Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 13293 posts

Posted 16 January 2006 - 05:00 AM

I would do the ending in a nice hotel room with a balcony overlooking the ocean, the sheer curtains blowing in the wind. Vesper's body, of course, would be lying in the bed, motionless.

Bond would read the letter, do his thing, say the great ending line, and then we'd pull out through the window outside. We fade out, and then the blaring Bond theme kicks in, ala OHMSS, as "JAMES BOND WILL RETURN" appears onscreen.

What I'd really love at the end is not just the end credits, but a nice end credits title sequence like we used to get, complete with the "JAMES BOND WILL RETURN IN *INSERT TITLE HERE*". That's not going to happen, though.

#17 Double-Oh Agent

Double-Oh Agent

    Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 4325 posts

Posted 16 January 2006 - 07:59 AM

I would do the ending in a nice hotel room with a balcony overlooking the ocean, the sheer curtains blowing in the wind. Vesper's body, of course, would be lying in the bed, motionless.

Bond would read the letter, do his thing, say the great ending line, and then we'd pull out through the window outside. We fade out, and then the blaring Bond theme kicks in, ala OHMSS, as "JAMES BOND WILL RETURN" appears onscreen.

What I'd really love at the end is not just the end credits, but a nice end credits title sequence like we used to get, complete with the "JAMES BOND WILL RETURN IN *INSERT TITLE HERE*". That's not going to happen, though.

View Post


I like that ending Harmsway. That would be a good way to go. And yes it would be nice to get the title of the next Bond film but the only way that would happen is if EON suddenly decided to film the continuation novels which, unfortunately, is highly unlikely to happen.

#18 Harmsway

Harmsway

    Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 13293 posts

Posted 16 January 2006 - 08:05 AM

I would do the ending in a nice hotel room with a balcony overlooking the ocean, the sheer curtains blowing in the wind. Vesper's body, of course, would be lying in the bed, motionless.

Bond would read the letter, do his thing, say the great ending line, and then we'd pull out through the window outside. We fade out, and then the blaring Bond theme kicks in, ala OHMSS, as "JAMES BOND WILL RETURN" appears onscreen.

What I'd really love at the end is not just the end credits, but a nice end credits title sequence like we used to get, complete with the "JAMES BOND WILL RETURN IN *INSERT TITLE HERE*". That's not going to happen, though.

View Post


I like that ending Harmsway. That would be a good way to go. And yes it would be nice to get the title of the next Bond film but the only way that would happen is if EON suddenly decided to film the continuation novels which, unfortunately, is highly unlikely to happen.

View Post

Well they are having P&W write the next film as we speak, so it's *possible* they'd have a fresh title ready for us. It certainly would be nice.

#19 Tinfinger

Tinfinger

    Sub-Lieutenant

  • Crew
  • Pip
  • 384 posts

Posted 16 January 2006 - 08:12 AM

James Bond will return in Live and Let Die


Fandom will never be the same again

#20 Harmsway

Harmsway

    Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 13293 posts

Posted 16 January 2006 - 08:16 AM

James Bond will return in Live and Let Die


Fandom will never be the same again

View Post

We've been told there will be no remakes. Whether or not that holds true, we'll have yet to see, but I doubt they will go there. I'm sure from CASINO ROYALE onwards, we'll probably get a series of original films or stories inspired by the untouched Fleming material (of which there are loads).

#21 Agent Spriggan Ominae

Agent Spriggan Ominae

    Lt. Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPip
  • 1068 posts
  • Location:Aiea,Hawaii

Posted 18 January 2006 - 10:53 AM

James Bond will return in Live and Let Die


Fandom will never be the same again

View Post

We've been told there will be no remakes. Whether or not that holds true, we'll have yet to see, but I doubt they will go there. I'm sure from CASINO ROYALE onwards, we'll probably get a series of original films or stories inspired by the untouched Fleming material (of which there are loads).

View Post


James Bond will return in "The Quantum of Solace"

and then

James Bond will return in "Risico"

#22 hcmv007

hcmv007

    Lt. Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPip
  • 2310 posts
  • Location:United States, Baton Rouge, LA

Posted 18 January 2006 - 03:12 PM

"The bitch is dead"

Que credits and music

James Bond will return in Death Warrant

#23 Red Barchetta

Red Barchetta

    Lt. Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPip
  • 1161 posts
  • Location:Seattle, WA, USA

Posted 03 February 2006 - 06:32 PM

"The bitch is dead"

Bring up Bond theme slowly as he says the line, fade to black, and show...

James Bond will return in Ice Breaker

#24 Auric64

Auric64

    Sub-Lieutenant

  • Crew
  • Pip
  • 362 posts

Posted 03 February 2006 - 06:59 PM

As has been stated, Purvis and Wade have confirmed that the line, "The Bitch is Dead" is in the script, but does it involve Vesper?

We know her character is supposed to work for the British Treasury, and that she has to decide whether to give Bond more finance at the card table, but there has been no confirmation from Campbell, or anybody else from EON that Vesper dies at the end of the film. If they do go down the road of killing her off at the end of the movie, (a la OHMSS) is it not possible that this could alienate the audience? Would Broccoli and Wilson have the balls to do it, as Peter Hunt did? I doubt it, not with their usual attitude of 'play it safe'. They haven`t taken a risk with the Bond franchise ever since Brosnan made GoldenEye a success.

Perhaps the line refers to the Bond femme fatale, (if there is one) and not Vesper. On the other hand, if the film does end with Vesper`s death, it would be nice to see the next film`s title at the end credits, (instead of JAMES BOND WILL RETURN), and in so doing, make the next film`s title have something in it that suggests revenge (or something like it), then maybe the at least that way the audience may pick up that a sequel is in the offing.

Then the sequel comes out next year, (2007) and, like Golden Gun did for Moore, helps to cement Craig`s portrayal of Bond for the audience.

Any thoughts?

Andy

#25 Andrew

Andrew

    Lt. Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPip
  • 1274 posts

Posted 03 February 2006 - 08:16 PM

Well Campbell and others have said that the second half of the novel is pretty much intact which makes me hopeful that Vespers suicide will still be included. If it's not, it's not Casino Royale.

I have some faith though.

Edited by Andrew, 03 February 2006 - 08:16 PM.


#26 MarcAngeDraco

MarcAngeDraco

    Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 3312 posts
  • Location:Oxford, Michigan

Posted 03 February 2006 - 10:18 PM

Hopefully the last line will be intact and still the last line.

And as many others have stated, I hope see "James Bond Will Return in -----"!!

#27 Auric64

Auric64

    Sub-Lieutenant

  • Crew
  • Pip
  • 362 posts

Posted 06 February 2006 - 09:47 AM

Well Campbell and others have said that the second half of the novel is pretty much intact which makes me hopeful that Vespers suicide will still be included. If it's not, it's not Casino Royale.

I have some faith though.


The second half of the CR novel, (after the torture sequence) really just has Bond recouperating and falling in love with Vesper. This type of situation can work well in a novel because a skilled enough author can make the reader interested in the characters and how they deal with events that unfold before them.

It doesn`t always work for film though. Look how much Richard Maibaum edited the first 10 chapters of the From Russia With Love novel, and condensed those number of pages into about 7-10 minutes in the film. Nothing was really lost, but the salient points were put before the cinema goer and the plot was explained simply and effectively. Had the film been padded out longer, (as in taking more information from the book) it wouldn`t have worked as well, and the audience wanting to see Bond would have got restless.

It`s possible that Purvis and Wade have done the same for the CR film, condensing all that happens between Bond and Vesper from the novel into say, the last 20 minutes of the film. If that is the case, will that be enough to please the hardcore Fleming fans, who may bemoan the loss of other elements from those final chapters because of the need to keep the film`s length to just over 2 hours?

Wilson has stated, (at the Daniel Craig press conference) that this film has "a lot of action". Does that mean that CR will end with a big action/stunt sequence, (as has happened with every Bond film since Dr. No) and if so, this would mean that the producers/director will not be sticking faithfully to the end of the novel as has been stated.

I`m not saying that the actual end of the film won`t end with the famous line, but it just means that the lead up to it may be entirely different from the lead up in the book. If that is the case, then the producers/directors will not be then keeping their promise of keeping faithfully to the book.

In an ideal world (for me) it would be great if the film ended with the death of Vesper and then, before the end credits rolled, (preferably with a powerful version of the Bond theme, a la OHMSS) the audience got to see a short but quick action/dialogue trailer of the next film, (the sequel) showing Bond trying to avenge Vesper`s death. This would immediately grab the attention of the cinema goers and make them realise that although the film had ended on a downer, CR was just the beginning of a longer two-part (hopefully a trilogy) story.

What do others think?

Best

Andy

#28 Tinfinger

Tinfinger

    Sub-Lieutenant

  • Crew
  • Pip
  • 384 posts

Posted 06 February 2006 - 09:52 AM

If you end the movie like the book, the audience will walk out of the theater feeling as if they had been punched in the stomach and want to throw up. Yeah, the purists will love it, sure. But the audience as a large group? I have my doubts.

#29 Skudor

Skudor

    Commander

  • Veterans
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 9286 posts
  • Location:Buckinghamshire

Posted 06 February 2006 - 10:06 AM

If you end the movie like the book, the audience will walk out of the theater feeling as if they had been punched in the stomach and want to throw up. Yeah, the purists will love it, sure. But the audience as a large group? I have my doubts.


I'd imagine the line is in it, but it's not the final line.

#30 Hitchcock Bond

Hitchcock Bond

    Sub-Lieutenant

  • Crew
  • Pip
  • 152 posts

Posted 06 February 2006 - 11:07 AM

I think that the ending perhaps should be changed a little at least to make it surprising for those who have read the book. An ending that may work is making Vesper an agent of a SPECTRE-like organisation, posing as a MI6 operative. She was in fact the agent that saved Bond from torture by killing Le Chiffre. Bond, realising the betrayal, I would imagine would be incensed and practically beg M to send him after "the Bitch". Ultimately he could catch up with Vesper. Once caught Vesper could then give some idea of how this new organisation works, and that she was investigating Le Chiffre and had no orders to kill Bond. It could be played in such a manner that they both realise they really do have feelings for each other, and she gives herself up. The next thing they hear is the sound of glass breaking, Bond turns and sees a small hole in a window, he turns back to see Vesper falling over dead. Bond sees the assassin (I think it would be a good idea if it was a fairly innocuous character seen earlier in the film) but he gets away. The scene can cut to a debriefing with M where he is being congratulated for killing a traitor. This would give Bond the chance to say the "Bitch is dead" line, but perhaps with a little more poignancy than described in the book.