57 replies to this topic

[hrabb04]

Oh, yeah? Well, I think that Paris Carver should have been Tula from For Your Eyes Only! THAT would have been interesting, wouldn't it?

[Bon-san]

"What's the matter, James? Did I get too close?"/"Yes" (with Bond looking as though he's about to start crying) would have been absolutely ludicrous with Sylvia Trench (fair enough, it's a pretty awful, embarrassing and unintentionally comical scene as it is, though, thanks largely to horrible dialogue and acting).

This from the man who cites Sylvester Stallone as one of the two "most outstanding actors".

And for the record, no, he doesn't look like he's about to start crying. If you're going to take shots at Brosnan, at least make them based in some kind of observable reality, k? For Christ's sake, I tire of that kind of lazy, cheap criticism. If you're going to critique him, do it with class, man. Saying "he looks like he's going to cry", well, that's on par with the needling an insecure 10-year old boy lays on the new kid in school. Bottom line, Brozza may not be your idealized Bond, but he is not coming back for CR so no need to keep turning the screw.

Also, "horrible dialogue"? Is it really on a level so far below, say, the Bond/Goodnight exchanges in your beloved TMWTGG, or the Bond/Pam exchanges in LTK?

Sorry if this comes off as overly caustic. I wasn't even cranky before I read your post. It just irked.

Venting finished.

[Loomis]

[quote name='Bon-san' date='22 May 2005 - 04:33']This from the man who cites Sylvester Stallone as one of the two "most outstanding actors".

[/quote]

Yes, one of the most outstanding actors for me. Sorry for failing to make it crystal clear in the thread in question that I was citing Stallone and Pacino as my favourite actors rather than "the best".

[quote name='Bon-san' date='22 May 2005 - 04:33']And for the record, no, he doesn't look like he's about to start crying.

[Bon-san]

Just because I disagree that TND would have benefitted from Sylvia Trench, it doesn't mean I'm on a mission to spew venom at every single aspect of the Brosnan Bond films, y'know (see my ecstatic ravings over DIE ANOTHER DAY).

I'm not supporting the "It should have been Trench in TND" notion, either, btw.

And I know you rave about DAD. But you do spew venom over quite a few things Brosnan. You're prerogative, I suppose. And I don't disagree with all your points. Just some of them, and especially the rather mean-spirited manner in which they are sometimes presented.

End of the day, I respect your right, as a passionate Bond fan, to your opinions.

Please do your best to tolerate my reflexive rantings.

[Qwerty]

Oh, yeah?  Well, I think that Paris Carver should have been Tula from For Your Eyes Only!  THAT would have been interesting, wouldn't it?

To say the least.

[hrabb04]

God, listening to you guys here...where's William Shatner when you need him?

[Blofeld's Cat]

He's dead, Jimbo!

[PrinceKamalKhan]

This topic reminds me when I was very young way back in the dark ages for Bond fans. The days before a VCR was commonplace in every home and the internet hadn't even been heard of yet. The only time we could catch a Bond film was when it was newly released to the cinemas or being run on ABC every few months. I had just started reading the Bond books and realized that the blond Mary Goodnight in The Man With The Golden Gun had appeared in earlier Bond books as Bond's brunette secretary. And I noticed that unlike most other Bond girls, Bond had met Goodnight before she drove up in her MG in Hong Kong in The Man With The Golden Gun. So at one time, when I watched From Russia With Love on tv, I initially thought Miss Trench and Miss Goodnight were one and the same. This was of course, long before I had gotten to see Dr. No and read Stephen Jay Rubin's The James Bond Films book.

[licensetostudy]

Wouldn't it have been cool if Paris Carver in TND was Sylvia Carver, aka Sylvia Trench! You know, Bond's "regular" girlfriend from DR. NO and FROM RUSSIA WITH LOVE. I always liked the idea of Silvia and think this would have been a very clever way to tie into the earlier films. After all, Sylvia was Bond's first onscreen conquest, and remember how mad Silvia would get when Bond had to jet off on a mission? Seems to justify that slap in TND and her line about Bond saying, "I'll be right back." I don't know, I just think this would have been nifty. But I'm a geek.

It would have been cool for us Bond geeks, but it would be weird for two 30 something adults to have a love afair in the early 1960s, and still be fairly young at around 30 or 40 something by the late 1990s when having their final go-around at love. 34 years between FRWL and TND would look bizarre. Plus, teenagers make up an enormous number of audience members and they probably have never heard of Sylvia Trench and would not know the story between her and Bond. I doubt Dr. No and From Russia With Love are big among High Schoolers, with the exception of a small group who have declared themselves Bond fans like Qwerty. My sister just graduated, and looking into her yearbooks and reading her high school newspaper I see photos and articles about many movies from the past and present like Star Wars. I still have yet to open up a high school yearbook and see a picture of Kronsteen.

Edited by licensetostudy, 18 June 2005 - 09:55 PM.

[bryonalston]

You do know that the James Bond series transcends time, right? Basically, the series is split up into two major eras: Connery/Lazenby/Moore and Dalton/Brosnan. All of the events that took place between DN and AVTAK took place in real time (1962-1985,) however, when Dalton/Brosnan started, all of the missions from DN to AVTAK were taken out of their original years, and the audience is supposed to assume that they took place sometime between the early 80's and 1987.

Edited by bryonalston, 25 June 2005 - 03:59 AM.

[Blofeld's Cat]

Basically, the series is split up into two major errors: Connery/Lazenby/Moore and Dalton/Brosnan.

LOL!

[Qwerty]

God, listening to you guys here...where's William Shatner when you need him?

Off playing Denny Krane.

[bryonalston]

Do you think it would be possible to bring Sylvia back for a future cameo appearance? Maybe in CR perhaps?

[Blofeld's Cat]

Do you think it would be possible to bring Sylvia back for a future cameo appearance? Maybe in CR perhaps?

Nice touch if it happens. Certainly would add to the "new start" idea.

[licensetostudy]

You do know that the James Bond series transcends time, right? Basically, the series is split up into two major eras: Connery/Lazenby/Moore and Dalton/Brosnan. All of the events that took place between DN and AVTAK took place in real time (1962-1985,) however, when Dalton/Brosnan started, all of the missions from DN to AVTAK were taken out of their original years, and the audience is supposed to assume that they took place sometime between the early 80's and 1987.

Maybe Chris Rock could give you a few gigs at a comedy club.

[k13oharts]

Do you think it would be possible to bring Sylvia back for a future cameo appearance? Maybe in CR perhaps?

Nice touch if it happens. Certainly would add to the "new start" idea.

Hmmm... some of us do miss her lolz.
(oki me included)
Doing CR would be akin to doing the casino scene in DN over again and having Sylvia Trench 'participate' is not a bad idea at all.

[OFFICER OF WATCH]

Wouldn't it have been cool if Paris Carver in TND was Sylvia Carver, aka Sylvia Trench! You know, Bond's "regular" girlfriend from DR. NO and FROM RUSSIA WITH LOVE. I always liked the idea of Silvia and think this would have been a very clever way to tie into the earlier films. After all, Sylvia was Bond's first onscreen conquest, and remember how mad Silvia would get when Bond had to jet off on a mission? Seems to justify that slap in TND and her line about Bond saying, "I'll be right back." I don't know, I just think this would have been nifty. But I'm a geek.

So many excellent ideas like that has been missed by EON ! Hugh Jackman for 007 NOW!

[TortillaFactory]

Wow...interesting idea. But, I agree that Bond and Sylvia's relationship never had much depth at all. Merely having known each other for a long time does not mean they were in love, and it doesn't mean that Bond would care if he saw her again.

And no, I don't think there's much in Terri's performance to suggest a woman that he would have loved. But I can't help but think of the new Honeychile in Pearson's bio, and wondering if Paris wasn't very, very different when Bond loved her. She seems rather caustic, sarcastic, and annoying - almost like a bad actress - maybe because she really IS playing a part. She doesn't love her husband and she doesn't really love Bond either, but she can't let him go.

[Scottlee]

The Sylvia Trench character is not someone I could see marrying Elliot Carver and in doing so putting one foot into the world of espionage and deceit.

Sylvia Trench for me is the type to have nothing else but a large idealistic family down in a posh area of 60's London with a husband working a respectable job down at the bank who says "Honey I'm home" whenever he gets in on a night. Bond wasn't the type for that so he got shot of her.

[Strangways]

The Sylvia Trench character is not someone I could see marrying Elliot Carver and in doing so putting one foot into the world of espionage and deceit.

Sylvia Trench for me is the type to have nothing else but a large idealistic family down in a posh area of 60's London with a husband working a respectable job down at the bank who says "Honey I'm home" whenever he gets in on a night. Bond wasn't the type for that so he got shot of her.

I don't know... Sylvia was a social climber, not a homebody. She was at the casino alone, playing high stakes baccarat, gets herself into Bond's flat (and his shirt)... The next time we see her is not as glamorous a locale, a riverside picnic spot, but she is still quite demanding, with triumph in her eye when she gets her way, using sex as a weapon. When done with Bond, why not Carver?

[zencat]

I'm always amazed to see this thread pop back up. This was one of the first threads I ever posted on CBn...in 2001!

And I still think Paris should have been Sylvia.

[Jaws0178]

I think the "Sylvia Trench making a cameo in Casino Royale" idea might be a good one for the simple fact that it all depends on when the CR mission took place. If it was after the Dr. No, but before FRWL, then yes, it would make for good continuity. If not, no. Yes, I am one of those " small groups who have declared themselves Bond fans like Qwerty." and guess what, you're wrong. At least in my case because the first 007 movie that I watched was Goldfinger (which for those of you who don't quite know, Goldfinger was the 007 movie right after From Russia with Love), and I also enjoyed Dr. No very much and From Russia with Love. Sorry if this seems like I am harping on your post, but I am getting very tired of hearing people say that you have to be old to really enjoy James Bond. Us young guns (23) can enjoy an older movie or two. We don't only watch movies with stoners (which I absolutely hate) or CGI every 3 scenes (:: coughs:: Matrix) Ya'll have a good day, now.

Todd

Edited by Jaws0178, 08 July 2005 - 09:47 PM.

[Scottlee]

I think it would symbolic and cool to have a 75year old Eunice Gayson get a couple of lines as a casino table passer-by or something. I love that kinda stuff.

[Donovan]

I think it would symbolic and cool to have a 75year old Eunice Gayson get a couple of lines as a casino table passer-by or something. I love that kinda stuff.

Well, her daughter was an extra in the casino scene in "GoldenEye".

But I agree that an old flame from Bond's past that the audience has already met would be good...that way the audience can better identify with Bond's emotions instead of solely relying on the actor to convey them. Same with the "old friend who is now a villain" routine. I'm not going so far as to suggest Felix Leiter turn up with a scheme to take over the world, but it'd be nice to see some of the old buddies who didn't get killed, like Tiger, Quarrel Jr (hehe), Commander Carter, Draco, Luigi Ferrara...oh wait, Luigi bought it, didn't he? Okay, no Luigi. The "Star Trek" films were good at bringing back characters from the original series.

[Jaws0178]

Very true. and some not quite buddies :: coughs:: Khan!!!!!! (No, not Kamal)

As to my last post, I still stand by what I said, however, I feel as I should apologize Licensetostudy. I was not feeling well that day. Normally, I am not that confrontational. (Well, normally.)

Todd

[James Boldman]

Hey I'd never thought of this...it would have been awesome! A return to the film series' roots in a way.

[Jaws0178]

Egg-zachary! (Joke)

But, as I said before, I think it would depend on where in the "Bond Dossier" if you will, the Casrino Royale mission is placed. If it is before the "Dr. NO" mission, then it wouldn't work because he didn't appear to know Ms.(?) Trench. Now, if it were like one of those he was on duty and saw her in CR, and then again in Dr. No, it would be feasible. If it were between Dr. No, and From Russia with Love, however, it would be easier to explain. Still not perfect, due to the line "Last time you said that, you went off to Jamaica" and unless they (being EON) can put a "Casino Royale" in Jamaica, won't work. Now, we move on to the point between From Russia with Love and Goldfinger. Here would be better becauseyou could place a "throw-away enemy", such as retaining SMERSH for one movie since Goldfinger may or may not have worked for SPECTRE, unless someone knows something I don't. Also, in Goldfinger, we never see Ms(?) Trench, so either for Casino Royale, Bond could leave one more time, and Sylvia finally gets tired of being just a "some other time" type of girl, and leaves him, or it turns out she is more than she appears (Oh Gods, It's Jinx again. Ahhhh!!!!!!!) Just kidding. They could turn her into the Bond girl for it (never read the book and bad memory.)

Also, Scottlee, you mean like "I admire your luck"?

Edited by Jaws0178, 11 July 2005 - 05:03 PM.

[SportzStooge007]

I always thought that Paris should've been Sylvia. I don't know why they didn't make that call.